Looking for feedback on my ATK Brisket

[WigglesOhTree]

So I have been trying my hand at the Americas test kitchen brisket recipe for a while. I will link below. I think it turns out really well but my only complaint is that my flat can occasionally turn out dry and there is slightly less bark than I would like. I am wondering if this is just because I am getting what ever brisket I can find at Sam's club and aught to focus on getting a prime brisket with more marbleing. I follow the recipe and methods to the letter including the Weber 22 inch because that's all I have. Any suggestions on what I can do to increase the thickness of the bark and moisture in the lean? Thanks!
Video:

 

[1MoreFord]

Welcome to the SMF.

I've lost the sound on my 'puter currently, so I didn't read the CC on 16 minutes of video.

Generally if your brisket is dry and a bit tough it's undercooked. If it's dry and crumbly it's over cooked. You can't cook brisket by time or temp. They are indicators of when it's to test for probing tender in the thickest part of the flat.

 

[tallbm]

So I have been trying my hand at the Americas test kitchen brisket recipe for a while. I will link below. I think it turns out really well but my only complaint is that my flat can occasionally turn out dry and there is slightly less bark than I would like. I am wondering if this is just because I am getting what ever brisket I can find at Sam's club and aught to focus on getting a prime brisket with more marbleing. I follow the recipe and methods to the letter including the Weber 22 inch because that's all I have. Any suggestions on what I can do to increase the thickness of the bark and moisture in the lean? Thanks!
Video:

Hi there and welcome!

So I put the video on 1.75x speed and listen to it while doing some other stuff.

I am 100% sure I know your issue.

The video instructs you to put the temp probe into the thick Point muscle and this is not a good spot no matter what they say lol.
The best spot is the thickest yet center-most portion of the FLAT muscle because the FLAT takes way longer to come up to temp and get tender.

Temp probe placement in a brisket is crazy difficult to get correct AND the Point will full you more than any other part since it is hard to mess up and comes up to temp faster and gets tender faster due to the fat content where the FLAT is less fatty and takes longer to come up to temp and get tender.

So what is happening to you is that the POINT is hitting their magic number faster in some cases versus others which causes you to wrap and pull the brisket before the Flat is done AND also has you wrapping earlier which causes less bark. So two symptoms indicating that the probe temp reading is your problem.

Heads up though. I use 3 temp probes to aim for the thickest center-most portion of the FLAT from different angles because I usually only get 1 of the 3 correct. I go with the one that reads the lowest.

Now as 1MoreFord mentioned, a brisket is ONLY done when it is tender. Never by time or temp. You use the temp to tell you when to check for tenderness.
You check for tenderness by stabbing ALL OVER with a kabob skewer and when it goes in with no resistance ALL OVER then it is tender and therefore done.

So 2 things to fix your briskets.

1. Put the temp probe into the thickest center-most part of the FLAT muscle
2. Start checking for tenderness when the probe reads about 200F by stabbing all over with a kabob skewer or something like that. If it goes in ALL OVER without resistance then it is tender and ready. If resistance anywhere then let temp raise a couple of degrees and test for tenderness again. Repeat until tendr


Honorable Mention: wait to wrap at 180F degrees and you will get better flavor and bark. I do my briskets naked the whole time and if you wrap too early you get more roast beef flavor vs bbq brisket flavor. The later you wait the better the flavor.

I hop ethis help s:)

 

[WigglesOhTree]

Hi there and welcome!

So I put the video on 1.75x speed and listen to it while doing some other stuff.

I am 100% sure I know your issue.

The video instructs you to put the temp probe into the thick Point muscle and this is not a good spot no matter what they say lol.
The best spot is the thickest yet center-most portion of the FLAT muscle because the FLAT takes way longer to come up to temp and get tender.

Temp probe placement in a brisket is crazy difficult to get correct AND the Point will full you more than any other part since it is hard to mess up and comes up to temp faster and gets tender faster due to the fat content where the FLAT is less fatty and takes longer to come up to temp and get tender.

So what is happening to you is that the POINT is hitting their magic number faster in some cases versus others which causes you to wrap and pull the brisket before the Flat is done AND also has you wrapping earlier which causes less bark. So two symptoms indicating that the probe temp reading is your problem.

Heads up though. I use 3 temp probes to aim for the thickest center-most portion of the FLAT from different angles because I usually only get 1 of the 3 correct. I go with the one that reads the lowest.

Now as 1MoreFord mentioned, a brisket is ONLY done when it is tender. Never by time or temp. You use the temp to tell you when to check for tenderness.
You check for tenderness by stabbing ALL OVER with a kabob skewer and when it goes in with no resistance ALL OVER then it is tender and therefore done.

So 2 things to fix your briskets.

1. Put the temp probe into the thickest center-most part of the FLAT muscle
2. Start checking for tenderness when the probe reads about 200F by stabbing all over with a kabob skewer or something like that. If it goes in ALL OVER without resistance then it is tender and ready. If resistance anywhere then let temp raise a couple of degrees and test for tenderness again. Repeat until tendr


Honorable Mention: wait to wrap at 180F degrees and you will get better flavor and bark. I do my briskets naked the whole time and if you wrap too early you get more roast beef flavor vs bbq brisket flavor. The later you wait the better the flavor.

I hop ethis help s:)

I really appreciate all that information. And that does seem probable. I do have a couple questions however... Would cooking the brisket to all my temperature targets based off the middle of the flats temperature overcook the point? Or does it have enough fat to protect itself? I have a get together next week where I am expected to bring a brisket so I am a little afraid to make major changes like not wrapping at all since I don't have time to practice. Although I want to try everything you mentioned. What I have been doing has worked , what I think at least, well so I am afraid to tweak anything major. I have attached a photo of one of my attempts strictly following the video. Am I wishful thinking wanting thicker bark or is that about as good as it is going to get? I don't live in an area known for its brisket so I am trying all this second hand never having had 'real brisket'. Thanks so much for the detailed advice.

EDIT: I also forgot to ask about the skewering. In the video they instruct NEVER to lift the lid to check the brisket as you lose your heat. I will be skewering my brisket once I hit my initial temps before wrapping this time. Say I hit resistance with the skewer in that middle area... Does it hurt to replace the lid and continue cooking or will that lull in the cook cause an issue? Sorry for such noob questions.

 

[tallbm]

I really appreciate all that information. And that does seem probable. I do have a couple questions however... Would cooking the brisket to all my temperature targets based off the middle of the flats temperature overcook the point? Or does it have enough fat to protect itself? I have a get together next week where I am expected to bring a brisket so I am a little afraid to make major changes like not wrapping at all since I don't have time to practice. Although I want to try everything you mentioned. What I have been doing has worked , what I think at least, well so I am afraid to tweak anything major. I have attached a photo of one of my attempts strictly following the video. Am I wishful thinking wanting thicker bark or is that about as good as it is going to get? I don't live in an area known for its brisket so I am trying all this second hand never having had 'real brisket'. Thanks so much for the detailed advice.

EDIT: I also forgot to ask about the skewering. In the video they instruct NEVER to lift the lid to check the brisket as you lose your heat. I will be skewering my brisket once I hit my initial temps before wrapping this time. Say I hit resistance with the skewer in that middle area... Does it hurt to replace the lid and continue cooking or will that lull in the cook cause an issue? Sorry for such noob questions.

You asking all the right questions so don't fret one bit. Briskets are the most difficult to get right for all these reasons and more haha.

You will not overcook the Point unless you burn the brisket. Yep it has enough fat to protect itself. It will come up to temp faster and can handle higher temps and such with no problem, it's the easy part of the brisket.

For now I would only change the placement of the probe from the Point to the area of the Flat that I mention.
Later when you have more time you can roll with a naked brisket the entire smoke or gradually start moving your wrapping time out 10F degrees. This will greatly improve the flavor and the BARK using my many many briskets of experience as a reference :D

Also you generally do not want to open the smoker while cooking the brisket BUT when you are at the end and are checking for tenderness (for me 200F) the brisket is so hot that it helps regulate the heat in the smoker so as long as you have a good fire still going it won't be too long of a delay. Maybe you come back and check every 3F degrees in rise to avoid a bunch of smoker opening.
I run an electric smoker so I don't suffer much from losing and building up heat, it manages it lol. I trust you to know and mange your system best since you know how it behaves, but you get the idea.

 

[WigglesOhTree]

Gotcha, I may try to bump up my temperature before wrapping a little this time anyways but not enough to drastically alter anything. Moving forward I will be messing with different variables. I will be getting a thermometer with 4 probes this time two will be aimed where you directed and two in the location I had previously measured to see how great of a difference there is with my method. Also I will have my old thermometers in it is as well to see how different the temperatures I am measuring are hah. Six might be excessive oh well lol. I am a little worried about removing the lid because I am using the Snake method on a weber which I fear might be slow to recover the heat.

Cant thank you enough for the advice!

 

[tallbm]

Gotcha, I may try to bump up my temperature before wrapping a little this time anyways but not enough to drastically alter anything. Moving forward I will be messing with different variables. I will be getting a thermometer with 4 probes this time two will be aimed where you directed and two in the location I had previously measured to see how great of a difference there is with my method. Also I will have my old thermometers in it is as well to see how different the temperatures I am measuring are hah. Six might be excessive oh well lol. I am a little worried about removing the lid because I am using the Snake method on a weber which I fear might be slow to recover the heat.

Cant thank you enough for the advice!

Sounds like a plan that will work.
I've done a ton of probes as well to figure out all this crazy brisket Internal Temp (IT) madness haha. I even did a post about it using 5 probes :

Are You Sure You Properly Placed Your Brisket Probes????

Get ready to see how probe placement in your brisket can read very differently even when you try to aim for the best spot. When doing briskets people will give you all kinds of internal temps (IT) that a brisket can be done at and the range varies widely from 190F-212F. The best practice is that...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

Also if you ever get to like 200F or so and it's not tender yet and your fire suffers from opening you can always throw in a preheated 350F oven and finish the job for about 10-20 minutes :)

Some final tips. When you get your new thermometer in test all the probes in pot of boiling water. I put the probe in a gallon bag (to avoid getting water into the the probe) and then put the probe in the water not touching the bottom. Water boils at 212F so you should see how accurate your probes are and then note/mark down how off it may be if it is off.

Also yeah, change only 1-2 things at a time. A naked brisket smoke takes longer but like many others here come to find out, you will taste the difference. If you are going to take 12 hours to smoke a brisket whats 15-16hrs to make it the most outstanding brisket you've ever tasted lol.

I hope all this helps :)

 

[WigglesOhTree]

Sounds like a plan that will work.
I've done a ton of probes as well to figure out all this crazy brisket Internal Temp (IT) madness haha. I even did a post about it using 5 probes :

View attachment 508350

Are You Sure You Properly Placed Your Brisket Probes????

Get ready to see how probe placement in your brisket can read very differently even when you try to aim for the best spot. When doing briskets people will give you all kinds of internal temps (IT) that a brisket can be done at and the range varies widely from 190F-212F. The best practice is that...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

Also if you ever get to like 200F or so and it's not tender yet and your fire suffers from opening you can always throw in a preheated 350F oven and finish the job for about 10-20 minutes :)

Some final tips. When you get your new thermometer in test all the probes in pot of boiling water. I put the probe in a gallon bag (to avoid getting water into the the probe) and then put the probe in the water not touching the bottom. Water boils at 212F so you should see how accurate your probes are and then note/mark down how off it may be if it is off.

Also yeah, change only 1-2 things at a time. A naked brisket smoke takes longer but like many others here come to find out, you will taste the difference. If you are going to take 12 hours to smoke a brisket whats 15-16hrs to make it the most outstanding brisket you've ever tasted lol.

I hope all this helps :)

Yes! You have helped me an absolute ton.

My only issue with doing a longer 'naked' brisket is that I just have a weber 22' and I think that would require me to remove the brisket entirely from the grill and reload a snake before carrying on the cooking. I may have to rely the Texas Crutch for now until I get an offset or something like that. Also, what is the purpose of the plastic wrap there? Did you sous vide it up to the correct temperature after the wrap?

 

[tallbm]

Yes! You have helped me an absolute ton.

My only issue with doing a longer 'naked' brisket is that I just have a weber 22' and I think that would require me to remove the brisket entirely from the grill and reload a snake before carrying on the cooking. I may have to rely the Texas Crutch for now until I get an offset or something like that. Also, what is the purpose of the plastic wrap there? Did you sous vide it up to the correct temperature after the wrap?

Yeah the length of time you can go may be an issue. Just know that briskets, pork butts, and ribs don't care what temp you cook them at as long as you aren't burning them so you could up the heat temp if you like to finish earlier :)
Again, don't go changing too many things at one time and honestly it is better and cheaper to experiment with a pork butt when you want to try new things like we are discussing versus trying blind with an expensive ass brisket haha. Just cook the $0.99/lb pork butt the same way you want to try your brisket and it works as perfect substitute :)

In my pic I vac sealed that brisket whole to have it for later. It's still in my freezer and will be thawed and reheated for holiday events. Honestly I don't recommend vac sealing and reheating a whole brisket. In my experience they come out better if you slice first then vac seal and reheat. This is whole just for holiday events where the people reheating and serving can understand how to handle it better.
I'm not sure why they have such a mental block if you hand them sliced and vac sealed brisket but it is what it is haha.

 

[chopsaw]

I follow the recipe and methods to the letter including the Weber 22 inch because that's all I have. Any suggestions on what I can do to increase the thickness of the bark and moisture in the lean? Thanks!

I didn't read thru all of the thread , but I know it's good advice , because that's where I got advice from when I did my first brisket .
I also didn't watch the video , but have seen that episode more than once .
I do respect America's Test Kitchen , but I know he counts out the charcoal to the exact amount . If you want to do that , doesn't hurt I guess .
I cook all my briskets on a 26 " kettle using the snake method .
Something I do is light the snake and let it settle in to temp . Mine likes 260 or so . I light a small group of charcoal , about 10 or 12 pieces . I add that to the grill separate from the snake when I add the meat . It takes up for the cold mass , and keeps things at temp . That way you get longer cook time from your snake . I get 10 hours plus that way . When that runs out I finish in the oven . I do course salt and black pepper only on mine and get plenty of bark .

Also , figure where your kettle likes to run and what it takes to get it there .
Don't try to adjust it to a specific temp .

 

[WigglesOhTree]

Same temperature marks for the wrap and when to take it off as well? That would make life really easy if I can just practice on either hah!

 

[chopsaw]

Here's a thread where we talked about kettle snake method setup . Might help .with temps and run time .

Snake and Minion burn time and Temp data?

Hi All, I hope this post finds you ALL well and having great smokes. I was wondering if there is any data out there that tells us how long a snake or minion will burn for and at what temperatures for say a, 22" WSM or a 26" kettle? Just thought it would be interesting to know as I did a cook...

www.smokingmeatforums.com

 

[chopsaw]

Same temperature marks for the wrap and when to take it off as well?

Follow tallbm suggestions . I have a way I do mine now , but he helped me with my first one . If I wrap I go to 180 ish . Mostly because I'm not really worried about it . I have a stress free brisket zone at my house . I cook early so it's ready when I am . Last one I finished in the oven and only wrapped for the rest on the counter after the temps started to drop .

I'm mainly trying to help you with kettle set up . So like I said follow tallbm's suggestion .
If you have something that's working I would do what you know to feed your guests , then change things slowly .