# Brisket in Cooler & Food Safety



## nutt

So now that I have my first Brisket under my belt I have a question that maybe I should have thought of before cooking.

And I apologize if this is an ignorant question, but I feel it is an important one because I do not want anyone to get sick from my cooking.

Once the meat is in the cooler, what is the lowest temp it can go down to before bacteria start growing??? I am new to all of this but I do realize cooked food can not sit out all day and still be eaten and be considered "healthy". 

It went into the cooler at a IT of 200*, I wrapped my brisket in 2 towels and put it in a medium cooler at 10pm and left it there until 7am, then I put it in the fridge. It was hot and steamy when I transfered it to the fridge. I did not think to take its temperature at that time. 

A sticky said keep above 140*, I guess that's the minimum? About how long do people think is "safe" in a cooler? Maybe depends on the ice chest, if it's a yeti it could go significantly longer than a cheap Wally World???

Was what I did ok? Did I play with danger?


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## SmokinAl

If it was hot & steamy when you put it in the fridge your fine.

Actually I would have let it cool down a little before putting it in the fridge.

It's not good for the other food in the fridge to introduce something hot & steamy.

Instead of using a cooler I just put it in a 170 degree oven.

It will stay hot indefinitely wrapped in foil.

Al


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## chef jimmyj

The USDA guideline of keeping hot food at or above 140 has a wide margin of error making it fool proof, especially with food sitting on a serving line or buffet. Bacteria in the air and coming from people handling the food has no opportunity to grow or even survive as long as 140 is maintained... Now the reality...The cooked brisket is sterile. You seal 190+ degree meat in foil. Even if you coughed all over it first, the surface temp instantly killed any bacteria. Now you take that sealed package, wrap it in clean towels and seal it in a clean cooler. At what point before, during or after all that can bacteria come in contact with and survive on that meat? Even if the lT went down to an ambient 70 degree because you had to rush out for an emergency that took you away 18 hours, the meat was sterile, continues to be sterile and sitting in a sealed environment, will stay sterile for many hours more. Now we are not talking pressure canned beef here. Even all packaged up, bacteria will eventually work it's way on to the meat but that's likely some days away, not that you would completely forget about it.. Hold your meat at or above 140 for guaranteed safety and 140 is a nice hot serving temp. But don't sweat it if for whatever reason the meat temp drops below 140 for a few hours...JJ


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## daveomak

Everyone remember the botulism from cheese in a California roadside eatery ??   Well, I read in the safety report, "It is acceptable to hold hot foods, like in a chow line water table or whatever it is, for three days"...  AS LONG AS no new cheese was added...   When the cheese got low, the container should be removed and thoroughly cleaned, and new cheese added...  

It seems, but not clear, cheese was added regularly...  and never cleaned out...  It wasn't clear if the cheese container was refrigerated overnight and replaced in the steam table in the AM...  

Sooooo, I take from the FSIS report, 3 days is safe if the steam table temp was not compromised and NO NEW food was added to the container..

JJ..... What's your take on this ???   Did I understand it correctly ???    I going to look for that report now.....


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## gary s

Good Info

Gary


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## daveomak

From the article below....  In some cases the product may only be held above 135 degrees F for 4 to 6 days.  Leads me to understand, in some situations, longer is OK..  Evidently, each type of product must be tested for "Acceptable" holding time and temperature...

The article.....

http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2017/...penser-caused-botulism-outbreak/#.WcpWm-RDGUk

*Health department guidance*
Though it has not yet completed its outbreak investigation report, the California Department of Public Health has developed new guidance for retailers regarding self-serve cheese dispensers:

“Management and employees should follow the instructions for each type of machine and product they use.”

The department developed that advice from reviewing inspection reports from early May, which included the observation that gas station customers themselves apply cheese sauce to their chips and other food “from a counter-top, self-service warming and dispensing unit.”

During the inspection, health officials also discovered several violations involving the gas station’s handling of the cheese sauce. Inspectors found the gas station employees were not following directions on dispensing unit, which was supplied by the cheese sauce manufacturer.








Specific problems cited by inspectors included:

A 5-pound bag of nacho cheese collected at the retail location on May 5 was being used past the “best by” date;
Records were not being maintained by the gas station employees indicating when bags of nacho cheese were originally added to the warming unit; and
The plastic tool designed to open the bags of cheese, provided with the nacho cheese warming and dispensing unit, was not being used by employees.
“Management and employees should follow the instructions for each type of machine and product they use,” the department’s Sept. 6 guidance letter said. “These directions may include pre-heating and the length of time a product can remain at elevated holding temperatures. In some cases the product may only be held above 135 degrees F for 4 to 6 days.

“… Leftover nacho cheese sauce collected from the gas station yielded C. botulinum toxin type A bacteria and toxin. Due to the extensive distribution of the same lot code of nacho cheese throughout the United States without additional botulism cases, internal testing conducted by the Wisconsin manufacturer of the nacho cheese, and only a single bag of cheese linked to human illness, (state and local officials) suspect the nacho cheese was likely contaminated at the retail location.”

In addition to following directions on the cheese and dispensers, CDPH offered these points of guidance to retailers:

Management should ensure that records are maintained indicating when bagged cheese was last changed. This may be accomplished by writing the date the product was added to the warmer on the bag itself.
Management should ensure that the warming and dispensing units are not turned off at night or plugged into a timer. These types of machines need to remain “on” at all times. This will ensure that appropriate temperatures are maintained in this ready-to-eat food.
Management and employees should ensure that any supplied tools for opening the bags of cheese are used per the product directions. These devices need to be washed, rinsed and sanitized between uses. In some cases these opening tools are only supplied with warming and dispensing unit.
Management and employees should verify on a regular basis that the internal temperature of the hot cheese product is being held at the proper temperature. The internal temperature can be measured by placing the cheese product in a cup with a thermometer to verify the product is maintaining the minimum hot holding temperature of 135 degrees F as required under the California Retail Food Code or hot holding temperature as recommended by the manufacturer.


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## MeatNeet

I hope someone still finds this to be relevant I would like to share what I know. I've had many problems with my briskets being in coolers. Been over many coolers and what not. I also happen to be on the road quite a lot. Not just for work but personal reason with my family too. I don't really tend to spend much money on coolers myself. Not that I am all that rich. I just don't feel as if I could spend a good amount of money on a simple cooler. But for the last few months, I'm happy with what I purchased. I bought myself a " Koolatron Voyager cooler" I found a review that you can check out:

 The guy has done a pretty simple review on the cooler. I found that it was quite hard to pick a cooler, so I looked at the comparisons at https://under-the-open-sky.com/best-thermoelectric-coolers/ and was quite settled on what I already had my eye on. Obviously cheap means bad, so... be prepared to replace ledges and handles, as they break easily. At the end of the day, my cooler did last a solid 5-7 months for the price. So, I can't complain. For 50 dollars it's an all right deal. But, I’ll leave you to decide, which cheap cooler you want, bud. I was just glad to share what I know.


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## daveomak.fs

52 deg. F is not adequate for storing food...  The food temp must be below 40F..


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