# Lang 36 poor quality welding?



## chipotleq

After writing my review of the Lang Hybrid 36 Patio:

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/153338/my-lang-hybrid-36-patio-thanksgiving-review

I decided to also talk about some issues I am having with temperature across the chamber and hopefully I can get some pointers on how to make it more even, as it was designed to be. I will also point out some imperfections I found with grill.

First is the major issue regarding the temperature across the chamber. The day I got the smoker I seasoned and was excited about testing out the tel tru and checking the accuracy of the thermometer. I was probably an hour in the seasoning when I got the tel tru to come down to 250 from 320. I popped my maverick thermometer in and checked in four different spots. I was getting differences of about +30 degrees. So I let it go and figured it was just user error and maybe the smoker needed a "break in" period.

After a four smokes, I decided to photo document my thanksgiving smoke and recorded temperatures. The link to the above review will show my fire management. This is what I got:

1st reading at 20 minutes into the smoking(actually about 1 hour 20 minutes in since I started the timer when I put the rib roast in)

Probe: Bottom left shelf close to edge of griddle plate.

Tel Tru:     265F

Maverick: 227F

DIff:           -38













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__ chipotleq
__ Nov 30, 2013






2nd reading 29 minutes in Probe is closest to this position making it somewhat accurate

Probe: Top Left shelf above first reading.

Tel Tru:     255F

Maverick:  265F

Diff:           +10













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__ chipotleq
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3rd reading 54 minutes in

 Probe: top right closest to the fire stack exit.

Tel Tru:    236F

Maverick: 265F

Diff:          +29













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__ chipotleq
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4th reading 1 hour in

Probe: bottom right shelf closest to firebox

Tel Tru:     225F

Actual:      320F

Diff:          +95













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__ chipotleq
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1st reading 2nd trial 1 hour 16 minutes in

Probe: Bottom left shelf close to edge of griddle plate.

Tel Tru:     250F

Maverick: 189F

DIff:           -61













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__ chipotleq
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2nd reading 2nd Trial 1 hour 20 minutes in

Probe: Top Left shelf above first reading.

Tel Tru:     250F

Maverick:  260F

Diff:           +10













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__ chipotleq
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3rd reading 2nd trial 1hour 22 minutes in

 Probe: top right closest to the fire stack exit.

Tel Tru:    250F

Maverick: 288F

Diff:          +38













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__ chipotleq
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4th  2nd trial reading 1 hour 26 minutes in

Probe: bottom right shelf closest to firebox

Tel Tru:     250F

Actual:      351F

Diff:          +101













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__ chipotleq
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Average differences from the reading of the tel tru are:

Bottom left (-38+-61)/2=   -49.5 degrees

top left(10+10)/2=              10 degrees

top right (29+38)/2=           33.5 degrees

bottom right(95+101)/2=    98 degrees.

My fire consisted mainly of a bed of red and white oak sticks broken down to coals and embers. One Pin wheel closed and other opened 1/3 to bring down tel tru to 250 stable temp within an hour. The smoker was on a downward slope from firebox to chargrill end. I added a couble of hickory/pecan sticks every 30-40 minutes with a an average length of 10 in by 2-3 inches in diameter.

While this is no major problem for me since I am used to rotating meat and also kinda like feature of having different zones. For example on my thanksgiving smoke, I had the rib roast sitting in the lower left side of the grill while the turkey was closest to the firebox. Being hotter I guess I was satisfied by having the turkey skin crisp up nicely. But yet I find that a 100 degree difference from one end to the opposite is just too much. Maybe I am doing something wrong but can anyone share their temperature experiences with the langs. I will do a video review soon by smoking some white bread and finding confirming the hot spots. I will also do a mod to see if there is a difference in the temperature. Basically the mod consist of lowering the smoke stack exit a few inches down to allow the heat to escape from the middle of the chamber. Like this:(photo taken from the Lang forum site http://lang.myfreeforum.org/Mods_To_Lang_36_about421.html)













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__ chipotleq
__ Nov 30, 2013


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## chipotleq

Here are the imperfections I found:

Messy welds and maybe the bead welds should go all around. Here the firebox bottom is only welded form the inside. No leaks but still looks like it couls haven been done all around.













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The bead welds do not continue all aroun the bottom of the chamber and the firebox.













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__ chipotleq
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Doors are stitched welded and have visible gaps from the flanges and doors. They leak smoke. I know all welded smokers, leak from the doors and is no issue with the langs. Since you cook with heat and not smoke. Only smoke leaks out when the chamber is full of smoke. I can not feel any heat leaks and therefor I see no performance issue. However I would like to see fully welded flanges like the gator pits or klose pits.













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flanges are not fully welded and you can see the gap between the door and flanges













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Smoke leaks with smoke stack closed 3/4 choking white smoke off the logs and leaking out the doors.













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__ chipotleq
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I had to modify the top grill grate on the chargriller side because when I was closing the door The tip of the tel tru was hitting the chargriller and I believe it actually got damaged because I have found it to be less accurate than the dial on the smoke chamber. I had to cut a hole in the grill grate to allow the tip to freely close with out hitting the grate. No big deal since I find it is unnecessary for me to be accurate for the chargrill.













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I have read that the hardest part of building a smoker is getting the door to fully close flushed on the chamber. Here is my door on the smoker side. You can see the bottom sticks out a bit. No problem also since I even find it convenient because it allows me to run a thermometer wire without pinching it. No need to drill holes lol.













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__ chipotleq
__ Nov 30, 2013






Last imperfection and the worst one is the leak in the grease drain pipe. There is a leak in the weld where the V channel meets the drain pipe. Grease runs down from the side visible through firebox and runs down yet on another leak down the outside of the pipe running down by the valve. These are easy fixes but really bother me. My fear is that on a long multi pork butt cook I will collect enough grease in the bottom chamber that it will catch fire and warp everything. I have to keep a fire extinguisher handy.













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While I do get excited every time I want to turn her on to smoke some meat, I feel there are quality control issues down in the Lang production. Maybe the fact that they are now on TV with pitmasters and have high demand that they get some untrained welders. Still a fan of the langs. But next time I call Ben to order my future Lang 60 or 84, I know what to tell him to look out for before my smoker ships out. I am already saving for the next one, or maybe not, I got to check out a jambo or a klose.


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## daveomak

Q, morning..... Uneven temps have long been an issue....  A few notes....   I saw where your frying pan temp was 450 ish in your other thread...   the high temps in the FB are the cause of inadequate air flow to move the heat from the FB to the CC.....  This can be remedied easily enough with an additional air inlet in the FB.......   Place the inlet directly across from the FB/CC opening ..  It would be nice to see the FB door configuration....  An inlet of about 4 sq in will do...  fab some sort of adjuster for it....   slide damper type thing.....    With the dual air inlets, you can adjust the air to the bed of charcoal for heat generating....   the upper air inlet will move the heat to the CC without having to open the lower inlet to accomplish that adjustment....    results are an even heat distribution inside the CC due to increased air/heat/smoke flow and a reduction in consumed fuel...  Your FB will run cooler and not waste heat.....    The smoker must be sealed tight.... no air leaks per se....  the exhaust stack should be operated in the wide open position....  all air entering the smoke needs to be controlled through the 2 air inlets for optimum control...

It's sad to see the quality of workmanship you have experienced.....  I'd bet the smokers, that represent Lang at competitions, are finished in a much finer detail than your thread depicts...   Anyway, with a little tweaking, your smoker will give you years of great food and service...

Dave


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## chipotleq

Hi Dave

It makes a lot of sense to me what you wrote. Now that I think back, the hottest zone zone which is 100 degrees hotter than the rest is located closest to the firebox. Someone else also pointed out not to stack the logs towards the back of the firebox, and it is how I had it. It makes total sense that that heat needs to move quicker out the firebox and into the stack. I will try building a smaller fire and splitting smaller logs. I will also get the nose of the grill to point up a bit to have the heat move naturally "up the hill" because the way I had it, it was moving down. And I guess heat settles in the bottom closest to the firebox and moves slower out. I am still trying to figure her out. I am sure this is a common problem, I hope it can also help other new lang owners figure the fire management out, its not as easy as they say at first.

Regarding the quality of workmanship, I would like to get input from other new lang owners to see if they have the same. So far I've read that in general, lang pits are generally less appealing when it comes to the quality of the welds compared to say a jambo, gator or klose. But it does not take away from the performance. And I know the langs are cheapers than the ones mentioned.


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## pig-a-liscious

ChipolteQ,

I was a bit humored by what Dave was mentioning about the adjustment of the FB pinwheels as I was thinking about the very same thing as I was reading your summary results.

Also, you are absolutely right about moving the front end of the smoker up a bit. This does force the smoke and heat to move under and up and out of the stack and you will see better heat distribution internally. Finally, you are right on about not stacking to much wood to high into the rear of the firebox and that will create a much hotter heat source that you don't need or want.

Now as for the welding imperfections that you have discovered, I was clearly disappointed to read what you had found as well as the pictures that took showing everything.

I would like to make a suggestion to you for your consideration. That is, I think that you need to ask to speak to Ben Lang directly about what you have discovered concerning the quality of the smoker build you received, get an email address from him, send him the pictures you took and set up a follow-up call back with him a day or so later to get his comments regarding the smoker build workmanship.

My guess would be that he will not be very happy to see what went out the door with his name on it. I can tell you straight up that this is what I would do regardless of whether this was a Lang, Cadillac, Klous, etc. Given my extensive sales experience with several Fortune 100 companies I can tell you that companies both big and small that don't pay attention continuously to the quality of their manufacturing processes will soon loose their marketing presence and quickly spiral into a state of failure if they release inferior products.

If you decide to do this, I would very much appreciate hearing about what you are told.

Harv


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## chipotleq

I did another smoke today and made some adjustments...

I  leveled the grill to point the nose up a bit and have the smoke move "up the hill". Big difference in temperature from how I had it originally. Now I have the temps at the top rack about 2-5 degree difference from tel tru thermometer and the bottom left only about -5degree colder. But still the right bottom closest to firebox is about 25-30 degree hotter. Better than 100 degree difference i had before. I have decided to mod the firebox fire grate. I will weld a slide out basket from expanded framed on 3/16 angles and will also do a slide out ash pan underneath the firebox grate. Hopefully I can complete the project in the next couple of weeks. Will post pics.


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## boykjo

Did you call lang and voice your concerns. Would like to know what there response was......


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## chipotleq

boykjo said:


> Did you call lang and voice your concerns. Would like to know what there response was......


I don't know if I should call them... What would they do? these are easy fixes for me. But I guess I should point out to them their QC. After much research, there seems to be no QC at Lang. Reason why they leave their welds so messy might be that they have low skilled or even student welders do the work. That may be how they keep their prices relatively cheap compared to say the Houston area custom pit makers. I have found out I am not the only one with these issues regarding the welds, heck, I've seen worse ones on other forums. Its still a solid smoker to me, the finish might not be as pretty, but she gets the job done.

Regarding the second leak(the one that is by the drain pipe on the chamber and leaks down to the drain valve) I pointed out, that is how is "designed" according to what Ben has responded other owners with same issue. Is to prevent rust from forming on the bottom of the chamber by draining the water that is left from a steam clean.


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## boykjo

I personally would call them and let them know your problems with the smoker. uneven temps that bad!!!!! I do understand its hotter by the firebox but looking at that door it is unacceptable to me. The smoker should be sealed fairly well with very little leakage and you shouldn't have to modify or fix anything.....JMHO


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## chipotleq

You are right. I sent them some pics right now, i'll wait for a response or call them next week. That door should not be like that, maybe that isncausing the high temp spike in that area


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## ice daddy

These comments are based on almost 20 years experience using a Lang 60.  I can relate to a lot of what is being said here.  For years i struggled with uneven and inconsistent temps.  Here are some of my observations.  

Things that most often affect temps

smoker leveling,  I now use a cheap bubble level  mounted on the smoker so I know exactly whether I'm high or low on the reverse smoke end.  It definitely makes a difference when smoke is going up or down hill.
Didn't look to see if you had a butterfly valve in the exhaust but if you do it should always be completely open.  You want to adjust air flow with the draft controls in the FB.
Know your true temp thermometers,  pull them off the smoker and do the boiling water test to make sure they are all reading the same.  They will some times vary for one to another.
Fire temperatures will vary depending on the wood your burning, seasoned vs green
I try to make sure I have an established bed of wood coals going before I start smoking the meat.  A freshly started fire is hard to cook on.
Once my temps are in an acceptable range I try not to open the door on either the fire box or the pit unless I need to spritz or add wood.  Its the hardest thing for me to keep my friends from opening the doors to take a look or over react to temp drop and add wood.
My Lang is an older smoker and the welds are really good, but that being said I did have modifications  done at the plant, I don't live to far from them,  and some of the work was substandard.  It was easily fixed by my local metal fab shop.

I once had to replace some of the steel under the grate near the FB.  In the welding process it heated up the metal to the point that the door to the pit warped.  It was easily adjusted to fit properly with a 3 lb hammer.

I had a second grease drain installed up near the firebox awhile back and it has a gape similar to what I saw in your photo.  The difference in mine is that where the pipe is welded to the angle iron in the plate, the weld is good and does not leak.  I think that is where your leak is and not the bottom of the tank.

My temperature adjustments while cooking drove me crazy for years.  I noticed at one of the N Fla gatherings that my smoking friends use something called a BBQ Guru II.  I bite the hook and bought one and I have to say my temps are much more manageable.  I also use the IGrill which I really like to monitor my meat temps.  

Sorry for the length.  I hope this helps you.  

ed


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## pig-a-liscious

ChipotleQ,

I agree with the comments from Boykjo as I previously suggested to you. Ben Lang can't address and fix product quality control issues if he doesn't get any feed back from clients that purchase his smokers and find problems.

I think that your sending the pictures to Ben was the right move. I would very much like to hear what his response is.

Harv


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## ice daddy

Pig-A-Liscious said:


> ChipotleQ,
> 
> I agree with the comments from Boykjo as I previously suggested to you. Ben Lang can't address and fix product quality control issues if he doesn't get any feed back from clients that purchase his smokers and find problems.
> 
> I think that your sending the pictures to Ben was the right move. I would very much like to hear what his response is.
> 
> Harv


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## chipotleq

I called lang over the phone a couple of times with no answer. Left message, no response. Pretty much the same when I tried to get them to take my order. I left a facebook message and e-mailed, no response...


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## boykjo

The feedback your giving us from langs customer service will be helpful  to someone making their decisions on what smoker to buy. I hope they respond and in a timley manner. If you sell a product you should stand behind your product with customer service and satisfaction. I know you cant make everyone happy but at least you can acknowlege their presence.


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## hopmeister

This is one of the reason I decided on Yoder after trying do deal with Horizon....Byron from Yoder wanted to make sure I was 110% Pleased with my Yoder.


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## pig-a-liscious

Boykjo,

I agree completely with your comments. Customer service is and has always been extremely important to me. I have been in the corporate sales world for more than 19 years and customer satisfaction has always been my most important principle. The old car sales model of....get the sale/money and don't worry if your client has problems is a sure road to failure.

As long as Lang has been in business and the successes that have been achieved in the Competition BBQ World and strong client testimonials doesn't add up well here.

I am hoping that Lang will get back to ChipotleQ and provide some positive feedback.

Harv


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## 64driver

I am still on the fence between a Lang and a PCC. I was leaning towards a Lang, from what I have heard/read about them, coupled with a few people I talked to who have them. Me personally, I have gotten great customer service from Peoria, even though I was just inquiring about their cookers. It took days to respond to my emails from Lang, and even then it was only a 1 sentence response, with no signature as to who sent it. My only excuse to go with Lang is that I might be down in Alabama for 6 weeks early next year, which would save on shipping a cooker from GA to MN (~$650) for a 48 mobile unit. I can still go pick up a PCC, but they are still more expensive (about 1k more with the options I want). With seeing the craftsmanship of a Lang, I am not sure now. The extra money on a PCC might be worth it, if anyone has seen them (ALL welds are an A+, no skimping on any part). Guess you get what you pay for...

Aaaaaannd now I am on the fence even more. Thanks for posting the pics for all to see.


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## chipotleq

peorias cooker, looking at them I like their double smoke stack design and how the stacks are welded in the middle of the chamber end. That is how it should be made with all regular flow off set burners. Have you looked at Jambo pits? They have a 48  size called the backyard jambo, roughly than the lang 48 and the peoria 24x48. But they have insulated firebox. Looks like same price as the preoria or a little more than the lang 48.

If I had the opportunity to do it again, I think I would still buy the lang. They are excellent cookers, and the craftsmanship might not be as pretty as the other high end smokers, but it gets the job done just as good if not better.


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## 64driver

I emailed Mr. Geer today to see how much a backyard model on a trailer would be. I'm guessing it won't be as cheap as a Lang, and probably around the same price as a PCC, if not more. The PCC I want has the insulated firebox (+$567) wood bin (+$325), and trailer itself (+$850), on top of the $1753 for the 24x48 cooker. So that's a total of $3495....if I pick it up at the shop, which I would. The Lang is exactly 1k less than that if I picked it up, so I would still be Okay with the slight imperfections like you pointed out. I'm sure it would still get the job done with great results, and live up to the reputation it has. Basically, for the best bang for your buck, the Lang is still at the top. I grew up in Illinois, so I wanted to go with PCC because of supporting a small, home town business. That is why I am on the fence between the two. Don't get me wrong, I would love Jambo, but I think they are out of my price range (wife set a $3500 hard limit). We'll see when I get a response from them on the price though.


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## chipotleq

The lang is the best bang for the buck. I know big poppa smorkers has the "baby j" jambo smoker. Its basically their backyard on a trailer with chrome stack but it is $3500. Plus the freight.


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## 64driver

Yeah, that baby J is pretty sweet! That's exactly what I would want from Jambo, thanks for pointing that out. Too bad shipping from TX to MN would put it over 4k bucks, and there is absolutely no way my wife would go for that. It was like pulling teeth just to get her to go to a 3500 (she makes a lot more money than me, so it's tough to argue). She knows a Lang is 2500 if picked up, and 3200 if shipped to the front door, so spending 1k more to have that baby J shipped wouldn't fly with her. It is nice though...

Like you just stated, Lang is still just the best bang for your buck.


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## 64driver

I just looked at that baby J some more. There is a $700 crating fee on top of the shipping (which I'm guessing would be ~$700), so that baby J just became a 5k cooker. Well that make that decision easier to say no to...


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## chipotleq

Pretty expensive at 5k for a 48 size smoker. At the end of the day you will enjoy the lang just as much as you would a jambo, klose or any other stick burner. There is a learning curve to experience with stick burners, but it will be fun on a lang. Good luck


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## chipotleq

Finally got a response from Lang, but took a while;


> Hi Angel, thanks for taking the time to make us aware of the issues that you're having. We apologize for inconvenience they may have caused. Ben is aware of the situation and is working to remedy the problems. He will be in contact. Thank you.
> 
> Sara
> Lang BBQ Grills


This was received December 10. Will post a follow up once Ben gets in contact, if he gets in contact...


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## boykjo

Thats good........


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## 64driver

Even if he doesn't get back to you (I think he will), I have full confidence Sara definitely showed those pic to Ben, and that he made it a point to "have a talk" with his welders.


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## pig-a-liscious

BAMB !! Angel, as Emeril Lagasse would say !!

Sounds to me like perhaps your efforts to provide Ben Lang with some first hand manufacturing product quality issues that you incurred have been not been lost or ignored.

The proof, however, as you have said is whether Ben Lang himself gets back in touch with you.

I am glad that you took mine and others suggestions to send your findings to Lang.

As I mentioned to you in one of my previous posts, Ben Lang can't address product quality issues if he is not made aware of them from his customer base.

I look forward to hopefully hearing back from you the gist of what Ben has to say.

Harv


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## waterboy12

I'll be picking my 36 deluxe up on Friday, I asked for Ben to be present when I pick the 36 up. He said he would go over operation and methods and I intend to thoroughly look it over and if I see anything questionable or out of the order I will ask questions. Look for a new thread the end of next week.


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## pig-a-liscious

I think that's a good move Waterboy12 and I hope that everything goes well. I am going to order a Lang 48 Patio probably in the February timeline and pick it up myself as well.

I have smoked on a Lang 60 and a 108 numerous times and have outstanding results with turkeys, buts, chicken and briskets. The smokers were easy to use, held the temps well and didn't require a truck load of wood, just a nice relaxing chair and a couple of cold beers.

Please let us all know how you make out. Safe travels.

Harv


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## chipotleq

have not recieved a call form the man himself yet. But I got a brand new thermometer for the one that I told them got possibly damaged by having the tip hit the top grate on the chargriller.


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## pig-a-liscious

Glad to here that they sent you a new thermometer. I hope that you here something soon from Ben.


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## twodrinkminimum

I was so set on a Lang until I read this thread. Now I really don't know. Did you ever actually hear back form the big man himself? It's been over a year now.


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## twodrinkminimum

Actually...not a year, just a few months.


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## 64driver

TwoDrink-

I was just about to pull the trigger on a Lang 48 mobile, and then found out about Shirley Fabrication. They are very similar to Langs but better construction, more customization options, cook just as well, and best of all Cheaper!! I get mine in 1 month! (being built)


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## chipotleq

Mr Ben Lang never got back to me. They only sent a replacement thermometer for the damaged one. But I have been enjoying it just about every weekend that I have forgotten about the temp, difference, welds etc... Know I just get her hot, throw some meet in her and all comes out good all the time. I have bough since a primo grill, which is like a big green egg. I will sell the primo grill, there is no comparison between the flavor the reverse sear plate provides along with the oak and pecan sticks vs the charcoal and chips on a ceramic cooker.


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## yoda3647

I had a smilar issued with the welding at the bottom of FB on my "36" Hybrid Deluxe Run-About BBQ Trailer Smoker Cooker w Deluxe Warmer Box Chargrill Mobile Trailer Frame" that I got February 25, 2014 They asked me to explain. I told them how the drain pipe and the FB was not welded properly. there response was (quote from email)

"Drain valve purposely no welded where it passes through bottom of cylinder.

Can you send pictures showing other issue."

The other issue being FB weld here is Pictures and Video I took to show them













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Their response (Quote from email)

"Best we can tell, The weld on the firebox to the belly was missed. is there any way you can have it welded to we can reimburse you?Hate it happen on you unit. let me know"

Took my Lang down to wielder $110.00 later Firebox is fixed not sure how to fix drain pipe leak any help??


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## chipotleq

where in the drain pipe do you have a leak? If you have it in the bottom towards the exit on the belly of the chamber, then I would not worry about it. Reason why the leave it like that is because of the "steam clean process where some water might make it to the bottom and settle there. They figured it would cause corrosion and decided to leave an opening for water to drain down the side.

If you have a leak where the V channel of the baffle plate meets the drain opening, then I would email lang again and ask if that was also intentional. Which is not, and have them reimburse again for another weld repair. Good luck, I have learned to live with mine as is, and have enjoyed the final product off the smoker that I dont mind the imperfections. Next time I buy one, hopefully the Lang 60, I will drive down there to pick it up and this time I will know what to look for before I drive away with it.


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## yoda3647

I have not looked thru the FB but standing at the door while steam cleaning is when I notice that water was come out of the drain pipe from the pipe like it should and also from the outside of the pipe where it goes up into pit.

Did that mod you did help any??? The one where you extened the stack down? your first post last picture?

I am thinking about using some "Grill Greats" () in my FB I read on the Lang forum that it helps with heating, less lost more into chambers equal less wood to cook with. for 18 dollar will try


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## chipotleq

Yes the mod where you extend the stack to be at grate level does help. But I found that making the pit pitch up bit from the nose opposite the FB helps more. It makes the heat move naturally "up the hill" as heat rises and has more faster heat flow out the FB to stack . Still have hot spots but not as much as I had before. I just rotate the meat in the chamber to deal with hot spots, or not if I am cooking different types of meat like I would have chicken wings cook in the hotter part of the chamber to achieve crispy skin.

I have some of those ceramic briquettes somewhere, would like to follow up on your mod, I may also give a try since I do feed about a stick every 40-60 minutes... If I could give it one every 90-120 minutes it would be great.


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## yoda3647

yeah here is the the quote from the post:

"I hope all you Lang smokers are having a nice Thanksgiving!! My birds on the smoker and cooking.

To recap, I added thin UNGLAZED porcelain tiles to my fire box and covered them with shinney side up alum foil and then took readings with my heat gun. The Lang gauge registerd 300F and the chimney gauge read 295F. The front of the fire box read 536F, the back read 483F, the top read 568F and the door read 399F

A couple of weeks ago the bottom, with only alum foil, read 313F. Today, with the combination of the tiles and the alum foil, the bottom read 125f!! Obviously, I'm not losing much heat through the bottom as most of it's going where it's suppose to go -- into the cook chamber. The mate that added the fire bricks had a good idea.

Don G"

Link (http://lang.myfreeforum.org/ftopic538-0-asc-10.php)

with just the bottom got the temp down to 125 that is a lot more heat going to meat I am thinking about doing the bottom and the sides with the Grill Greats being only 1/4 in I will not loose much space just need to figure out how to put them on the sides.


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## chipotleq

I will give a try with some firebricks lined in the bottom. The trick is to get the most efficiency by moving the heat as quickly as possible horizontally across the chamber and back to the stack. I can see why the vertical smokers have an advantage. But I just love to hear the sizzle of fat drippings on the reverse plate and the aromas that accompany it. I have been seriously contemplating adding a bbq guru to aid the air flow out the fire box. I got the guru, just need to figure how to install a DYI adapter to move the air with out having to drill a hole.


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## ice daddy

Here is what I did.  Took a cheap stainless dog bowl, drilled a hole in the center and used a piece of wire to hook to the pin wheel.  Didn't have to do any modification to the fire box at all.  Also drilled a hole on the left bottom side for the guru to attach, used metal duck tape to secure the adapter.  It works just fine, have been using it for over a 

year now and no problems.  













IMG_0024_1861.JPG



__ ice daddy
__ Mar 24, 2014


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## pig-a-liscious

I don't want rain on anybody's parade but I find all of you guys awfully gracious and forgiving for what I am hearing is just plain BAD QUALITY WORKMANSHIP.

I am just BLOWN away if Ben Lang is aware of the poor quality of product that his company is putting out. To me there is NO excuse for this to happen if you have good manufacturing/fabrication/welding processes in place.  There has to be a total lack of quality control and inspection of the finished product prior to shipping/customer pick up or an attitude that this is a less than quality product that we produce and you can either accept it or look at someone else.

From the smoker research that I have done over the past 18 months or so, you won't hear any of these types of complaints from clients who have purchased Jambo, Cadillac, Myron Mixon, Klose, Southern Pride and a host of others.

Now having said that, the aforementioned smokers are more expensive than Langs and perhaps therein lies the answer but I don't think so.

Enough said, and you guys have the patience of an owl .


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## ribwizzard

Sounds like a product of cheap labor and / or high employee turn over....

It's not like they are coming up with new and more complicated designs everyday....


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## pig-a-liscious

Rib,

You may well be right on that. Cheep labor in the fabrication/welding business would well seem to me that you are NOT going to get a top of the line end product manufactured. It's a little like the old saying, "You get what you pay for". If you buy cheep then you are more than likely to get a product that is not going to be made very well. Conversely, if you invest in experienced/trained labor and have a good quality control process in place your going to produce a much better end product.

That by no means is saying that you can't have some inexperienced labor as a part of your team but you then have to have a stronger oversight by some very experienced fabricators/welders as you move through all the various stages of production and most certainly you still need to have someone with a strong skill set inspecting every smoker coming out the door before it is sold. And the aforementioned doesn't necessarily equate to ......now it's got to be a high priced smoker.

Now that's my take on it  from the "Pig"


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## wood river bbq

I have a Lang 36, which I purchased about 8 months ago. I learned to smoke on a Char Broil Smoking Pro, which I highly modified but no matter what changes I made heat and smoke leaked all over the place. It cooked OK but I wanted a better unit and I reviewed a number of manufacturers (Horizon, Meadow Creek etc). I wish I had unlimited funds but I'm just a retired stiff with a limited budget and I wanted the REVERSE FLOW flow feature so I settled on a Lang. I'm not a welder but I noticed some of the weld discrepancies ChipotleQ pointed out. Unfortunately, when you purchase something "sight unseen" you get an "Oklahoma Guarantee", which means when it's delivered to you home you own it as is.

What caught my attention to this topic was a video I viewed yesterday on the Meadow Creek Smoker and their attention to the welding and fit details. They produce a quality product but at a higher price. I've got a few heat/smoke leaks on my Lang, which bug me, but they're so small I can't get material thin enough to seal the space. The fact of the matter is I've given up on fixing the leaks and I overlook the weld cosmetic problems. I've concentrated on mastering the Lang, which I have, and it's one wonderful cooking machine. Could I get BETTER cooking results with a Meadow Creek or other very expensive smoker -- I doubt it.

My career was sales/marketing so I know the importance of quality and Lang should pay more attention to the quality of their product. How hard could it be to do a better welding job? Also, their customer response to emails stinks - all you get is one line cryptic answers, if they even respond at all.

With all that being said, would I purchase another Lang -- I would in a heartbeat but I'd be specific in what I expect when arrives at my door step.


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## like2que

Oh'boy! I know this thread is old but... Now I'm scared recently ordered a Lang 36' stretch deluxe trailer unit..  I will be picking mine up thankfully know what to look for.. fingers crossed!!


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## neumsky1

I thought Langs had all this stuff figured out...I hope your not TOO far away to get service from them. If you are...what then?


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## neumsky1

Wood River BBQ said:


> I have a Lang 36, which I purchased about 8 months ago. I learned to smoke on a Char Broil Smoking Pro, which I highly modified but no matter what changes I made heat and smoke leaked all over the place. It cooked OK but I wanted a better unit and I reviewed a number of manufacturers (Horizon, Meadow Creek etc). I wish I had unlimited funds but I'm just a retired stiff with a limited budget and I wanted the REVERSE FLOW flow feature so I settled on a Lang. I'm not a welder but I noticed some of the weld discrepancies ChipotleQ pointed out. Unfortunately, when you purchase something "sight unseen" you get an "Oklahoma Guarantee", which means when it's delivered to you home you own it as is.
> 
> What caught my attention to this topic was a video I viewed yesterday on the Meadow Creek Smoker and their attention to the welding and fit details. They produce a quality product but at a higher price. I've got a few heat/smoke leaks on my Lang, which bug me, but they're so small I can't get material thin enough to seal the space. The fact of the matter is I've given up on fixing the leaks and I overlook the weld cosmetic problems. I've concentrated on mastering the Lang, which I have, and it's one wonderful cooking machine. Could I get BETTER cooking results with a Meadow Creek or other very expensive smoker -- I doubt it.
> 
> My career was sales/marketing so I know the importance of quality and Lang should pay more attention to the quality of their product. How hard could it be to do a better welding job? Also, their customer response to emails stinks - all you get is one line cryptic answers, if they even respond at all.
> 
> With all that being said, would I purchase another Lang -- I would in a heartbeat but I'd be specific in what I expect when arrives at my door step.



Oklahoma guarantee?


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## pig-a-liscious

Like2que,

I am glad that you are aware of some of the reported product quality issues that seem to keep surfacing concerning Lang Smokers.

ChiptoleQ had several welding issues with his Lang 36 which he posted several photographs of. Further, he called and spoke to people at Lang and sent them photo's of his product concerns which were supposedly reported directly to Ben Lang. As I recall, Ben Lang was supposed to get back to ChiptoleQ regarding the issues but never did so.

To me that is a bad way to treat your customers and directly is a bad reflection on Lang Smokers as a company. Further it tells me that Ben Lang is not very customer service oriented which I believe is going to catch up with him in the near future.

I see that Wood River BBQ also bought a Lang 36 and had similar issues to ChiptoleQ upon delivery of his smoker.

I can only say that I hope that upon your arriving at Lang to pick up your smoker that you inspect it well for quality workmanship and if there are obvious issues hope you will demand to see Ben Lang personally and show him. Additionally, if you feel comfortable you might share with him that you are personally aware of two other Lang clients that have had a product quality issues that have never been addressed and for the most part totally ignored when brought to Lang staff attention.

This alone in my opinion is inexcusable and I am very disappointed to hear of the product quality problems and the lack of top quality customer service to address them. I personally have smoked on a Lang 60 Deluxe and a Lang 108 Deluxe and have had outstanding results and I enjoyed the ease of use. What I didn't see in either product, however, is any poor visible welding problems or other product issues. I certainly hope that these smokers weren't a part of an exception production group and that the greater majority have poor product quality, but  haven't a clue.

Take your time with your inspection my friend and please let us all know what you observed and what you did if you observed poor product quality issues.

Pig


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## neumsky1

Hey Pig...great name choice...this is a great idea for those who CAN pick them up...can you imagine for the ones who have them shipped.?


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## like2que

Thanks pig..  I indeed will report back with my experience at Lang .. Still very unsure bout my purchase. Read so many great reviews of Lang and was within my bbudget. Wish I would of found Shirley fabs sooner! .


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## wood river bbq

like2que: I would buy another Lang in a heart beat. It will cook as good as any unit on the market regardless of what a person pays. I don't have any smoke/heat leaks and that's the most important element. I don't even look at the welds anymore -- they're cosmetic. The main thing is everything fits tight

I look at it this way "nuts & bolts don't know if they are being taken off by a Snap-On or Sears socket". Same with meat on a smoker -- the product I cooked on my modified smoking Pro is as good as the stuff I cook on my Weber 22.5 or my Lang  or units costing thousand of dollors more.

Lang will build the unit with any modifications you want and you could probably tell them how you want it welded.


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## like2que

Wood river BBQ, I know Lang will modify smoker's . I'm into mine for close 3grand the moment I discovered Lang I was hooked. Seeing  those pics really made me say Whoa!! ..   3 grand  is not chump change to Me, luckily I have awesome wife who let me splurge.. originally was just ordering a 36' patio and ended up 36' stretch deluxe w/ mod fire/warmer box on.trailer.. Lol  boy n his toys!


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## wood river bbq

Well, you only live once!! I couldn't get a 36 stretch deluxe through my side yard gate!! I barely made it with the 700 lbs patio. It was a rainy day when it was delivered and I had the trucker place it in my garage. I unpacked it and then tried, alone, to move it down the driveway to my side yard gate. It darn near ran me over. At one point I thought I'll just let it run out into the street. A friend saw my situation and offered to help me move it to the back yard  --- that was the last time he's offered to help me with anything!!


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## neumsky1

Wood River BBQ said:


> like2que: I would buy another Lang in a heart beat. It will cook as good as any unit on the market regardless of what a person pays. I don't have any smoke/heat leaks and that's the most important element. I don't even look at the welds anymore -- they're cosmetic. The main thing is everything fits tight
> 
> I look at it this way "nuts & bolts don't know if they are being taken off by a Snap-On or Sears socket". Same with meat on a smoker -- the product I cooked on my modified smoking Pro is as good as the stuff I cook on my Weber 22.5 or my Lang  or units costing thousand of dollors more.
> 
> Lang will build the unit with any modifications you want and you could probably tell them how you want it welded.



Those nuts and bolts do to know....haha


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## pig-a-liscious

Neumsky1,

Yes and that's what worries me !!


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## pig-a-liscious

Like2que,

Let me add a comment here that may make you feel a little better about your choice of a Lang smoker.

As I mentioned in my previous post I have smoked a ton of butts, chicken spare ribs, turkeys and sausage on both a Lang 60 Deluxe  and a Lang 108 Deluxe and the end results have been nothing other than fantastic.

Maintaining the temp on the Lang's was not an issue and very easy to do with the pin wheels. Also, the amount of wood needed to do the smoking often for 10+ hours was NOT a truck load. I was very pleased at how easy it was to learn how the smokers worked and what I had to do to get some wonderful tasting "Q".

Now having said all of that, I am one who comes from the Corporate World of both Retail Sales and computer hardware, software and a host of services where I was addressing the Public Sector Vertical Market. More specifically, the local, state and federal law enforcement community.

I learned very on in my career that if you don't deliver or due what you said you would do with your products and services then you risk having your legs cut off at the knees. One of the most important requirements here for a successful company to learn is (a) *uncompromised customer service*, (b) *make sure that your products and services if there are any will do what you said they will do and solve a clients problem(s) and (c) ABOVE ALL: listen to your customers about there likes, dislikes and suggestions for product improvement.*   Other than your employees your customers are your most valuable asset.

Having said all of the above, I have a real personal sensitivity to the quality of a company's products or services and what their commitment is to customer service/client satisfaction.

I think I have probably said enough.

Pig


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## chipotleq

Like2que, I am sure you will love the lang. And best is that you can actually be there to inspect your smoker before handing out your final payment. I am planning an RV trip with the family from Southern California to NY by taking the bbq trail from austin all along the south to Georgia and up north to NY. My plan is to purchase a Lang 60(possibly 84 since I will do competition this summe I hope to get an idea of what size is best for comps) and pick it up in person. There I can have a talk with lang and you bet I will bring my original experience up. Good luck with yours and you will enjoy the sound she makes when you hear the fat drippings sizzling off the reverse plate, along with the smells and aromas, it will be a culinary symphony.


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## like2que

Thank you chipotleQ .. Sounds like one heck of a road trip.. I'm looking forward to my Lang. Your thread did open my eyes & gives me idea of what to look for..Happy Smoking my friend..


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## chipotleq

Post some pictures for us when you get it, I would like to see a moded lang from factory. What exactly did you request from them to do on firebox? I am thinking of asking them on my future lang for an insulated firebox if possible or 1/2 inch steel instead. Did you get the idea of the stretch model from the youtube video?


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## like2que

Yes, I did get it from YouTube. Did order 36' hybrid deluxe patio.then changed to wagon wheel cart. By chance,asked about the stretch model and for couple hundred more I could get stretch w/trailer. As far as mod had extra dampers added to crank up the warmer box.


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## like2que

chipotleQ said:


> Post some pictures for us when you get it, I would like to see a moded lang from factory. What exactly did you request from them to do on firebox? I am thinking of asking them on my future lang for an insulated firebox if possible or 1/2 inch steel instead. Did you get the idea of the stretch model from the youtube video?


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## like2que

Here she is. 36' stretch deluxe 













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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


















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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


















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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


















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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


















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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


















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__ like2que
__ Jun 10, 2014


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## glocksrock

That is gorgeous! Be sure to post more pics when you start cooking on it. I'd love to have that model, but my 48 patio suits me just fine.


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## pig-a-liscious

Like2que,

Your new Lang looks great. It appears to me based on your pictures that the welding quality and workmanship was done well. Did you by chance speak to Ben Lang or one of the staff members prior to your smoker being built that when you came to pick it up that you would be looking closely at the welding work and finish?

 I have not seen a 36" stretch model listed on their website. What is the difference in a 36" stretch and a 48" hybrid deluxe on a trailer? Your 36 looks like it is a 48.

I like your idea of adding extra dampers to the warmer box.

I hope that you will share some pics of the food when you start smoking and let us all know how you like the smoker.

Pig


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## like2que

@pig all the main welds are nice some of secondary welds are a bit sloppy in my opinion.No i didnt really speak to Lang prior to ordering/picking up.Did speak to Mr Lang, he was the first to greet us when we arrived. He himself did notice a couple minor things and had his staff fix on the spot. 36' stretch is same size chamber as 36' hybrid but all smoker. Diameter is smaller then 48 or 60, the length is I believe pretty close to 60 model.


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## pig-a-liscious

Like2que,

Thank your response and glad to hear that you sound pleased with your smoker.

I look forward to hearing about how you think the smoker works after you get the chance to fire it up a few times and try an assortment of food.

My very best of luck to you.

Pig


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