# “Cutting Meat, Meat Cutters Exchange and local places to buy your meat”



## thomasyoung (Jul 18, 2009)

Hello everyone,
It was suggested from *ShooterRick* that if I wished to do a thread on *“**Cutting Meat, Meat Cutters Exchange and local places to buy your meat”* that Itoss it under General and he felt sure it will be found. So I will take him up on his idea and place it here. I also think that it warrants it’s own segment here on this site as it’s all related in my own opinion. 
Coming here to your site was a real find. I spent more then 20 years as a Journeyman Meat Cutter. How about a section on: Cutting Meat, Meat Cutters Exchange (Meat cutters talking to other Meat Cutters and their resources), and above all where one can go in their own area to purchase meat other then going to the grocery store, and buying it at wholesale prices. I think it would be a great section and we can share with others how to look for good meat from not so good meat. At any rate that’s my two cents. 

Thanks,
Thomas


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## travcoman45 (Jul 18, 2009)

Got my vote.


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## alblancher (Jul 18, 2009)

Ok, good idea.  I would like to place the first question.

A couple of months ago I bought a large chuck roast from Sams.  My nephew worked at Sams for years as a meat cutter and he tried to show me where the chuck steak roast included a large portion of "ribeye" in it.  I think that's what he was trying to say.  Sometimes he talks faster then a chain saw. 

He said that if you know how to look at these large cuts you can basically buy higher quality cuts for the lower quality price.   Can you tell me a bit more about what to look for at the meat counter to get the best cuts at the best prices.

Thanks 

All


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## alblancher (Jul 18, 2009)

Something else he said was that the packs of ground meat in the display case are just the large chub packs run through the grinder again to bring out the nice red color.  So you are buying older meat in the display packs.  That's why they only leave it out for a day because it expires within 24 hours once the original seal is broken.

Thanks again

Al


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## thomasyoung (Jul 18, 2009)

Hello Al and everyone else who might be interested,
I hope that I have answered all of your questions below!

Let me answer your first question first. You asked: _“A couple of months ago I bought a large chuck roast from Sam’s. My nephew worked at Sam’s for years as a meat cutter and he tried to show me where the chuck steak roast included a large portion of "ribeye" in it. I think that's what he was trying to say. Sometimes he talks faster then a chain saw.”_


Right where the chuck begins from the rib section. 



There is about two inches of smaller Rib Eye still there.




Sometimes in cutting and separating the Rib portion from the Chuck portion you will find a more appealing Rib Eye in the chuck section that looks just like the Rib section. That is not always the case as the Rib Eye do tend to get smaller at the beginning of the Chuck section. Please see Beef Cuts Image diagram. The Rib Eye is often called a Delmonico Steak when it is Boneless and a Rib Steak when it has the bone still attached. You can cut out the portion of the Rib Eye and cook it as a Delmonico Steak, Leaving the rest for a roast or you can cut it up in cubes for Beef Stew. The Chuck section also makes good ground beef, providing you get rid of the excess fat. 
“_He said that if you know how to look at these large cuts you can basically buy higher quality cuts for the lower quality price. Can you tell me a bit more about what to look for at the meat counter to get the best cuts at the best prices?”_

Things have changed since I was a Meat Cutter. In my day every thing came in on rails hanging from a meat hook. You would have your Front Section (Chuck, arm, rib and plate still connected) and your Hind Section (The Round with Shank, Sirloin tip, Sirloin, Flank and your Short Loin which consisted your Porterhouse and T-Bone Steaks. If you took off the Tenderloin from the Porterhouse you would have a Tenderloin Roast or steaks. The rest of the Porterhouse and t-bone minus the tenderloin would be called Strip Steaks) Now days every thing comes in boxes and are wrapped in Cryovac food packaging. No longer are the days where you had to know at what angle to cut out the Sirloin Tip to get the right cut for the Sirloin. It’s a good thing however the art is gone now in knowing how to separate the different cuts of meat. Now days you can find the larger sections of beef still whole. I believe this is what your nephew was speaking about. Those cuts are usually cheaper when you buy it at the bulk price and you can go from there and make it into steaks or roast. I’ve seen that they have the Sirloin Tip, Top Sirloin, Rib Eye, Brisket and boneless Chuck. 


_Something else he said was that the packs of ground meat in the display case are just the large chub packs run through the grinder again to bring out the nice red color. So you are buying older meat in the display packs. That's why they only leave it out for a day because it expires within 24 hours once the original seal is broken._

The large chubs of Ground meat that you see are usually ground in a course cut and then it’s wrapped in Cryovac food packaging to stop it from coming into the air. Once it’s open to the air it will begin to turn red. That’s when the meat Department would grind it into a finer cut. The meat then takes on a beautiful red color. It only stays red for so long before turning a gray- brownish color. If they take the meat again and re-grind it, the meat will be a pale looking color that’s does not look good. That’s why they grind there meat at different times of the day and only when they need it. Other wise it gets tossed! What would you buy a nice rosy color of ground meat or something that looks like you should bury it. Here is one more thing for your information and even before my time as a Meat Cutter. The Butchers at one time would sprinkle sugar over their ground meat and the different cuts of Beef to keep the red color longer. Now days that is against the law.

Thomas


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## werdwolf (Jul 18, 2009)

What a great thread!  thanks for the insight, Thomasyoung.


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## thomasyoung (Jul 18, 2009)

Thanks Werdwolf,
I'm hoping that this thread becomes a topic all by itself for other Meat Cutters to talk to each other across the US. Plus being able to help those who are interested in the topic by helping them. I now have in the works a large smoker/Grill being made for me. I sure would like to know where everybody else gets their meat supply. Or to be able to get my meat from a Meat Packing Plants to cut the cost. 
Thomas
P.S.
Since you live in Northern Ohio... Have you ever heard of a Grocery Store Chain that was in Michigan and part of Ohio called "Farmer Jack"? Thats one of the chains I use to work for and the one while working as a meat cutter.


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## shooterrick (Jul 18, 2009)

I think this is an idea worth discussion so lets see how all this goes.  I for one find it a topic worth at least knowing in a general sense.  As lovers of the low and slow we have learned to take what many consider less desirable cuts of meat and turn them into wonderful tender fair.  I have to kick myself into remembering that a Ribeye steak smoked with pecan and then seared on a grill is also a wonderful thing indeed.  

To buy larger bulk cuts and break them down myself for a savings is certainly worth my time and effort so all you meat cutters come one and all.  Share your knowledge with us and we will share ours with you.


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## smokingohiobutcher (Jul 18, 2009)

"Sometimes in cutting and separating the Rib portion from the Chuck portion you will find a more appealing Rib Eye in the chuck section that looks just like the Rib section."


At the Meat Dept I work at we call the first 3-4 cuts Off of the Chuck "Chuck-eye steaks". 
Attachment 21965
We remove the tougher bottom portion ,to be cut into stew, and you are left with a nice tender steak that we charge $4.99lb Instead of $10.99lb that we charge for the ribeye steak. since we pay less for the chuck we pass that savings on to the smart and informed customer,which is now you!!!! So come on over and buy some meat!


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## scubadoo97 (Jul 18, 2009)

Great thread

I wanted to post this site again.  Obviously some pictures have come from this site


http://bovine.unl.edu/bovine3D/eng/intro.jsp


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## alblancher (Jul 18, 2009)

Thanks for the explanation Thomas

My nephew claims that every once in a while you can find a pretty large protion of the demonical steak still attached to the chuck.  These are not large pieces of meat we ar talking about.  Please correct me if I'm wrong but it's buying a 5-8  lb chuck and cutting of a 12 oz ribeye for your lunch.   You are buying the chuck to grind up for burgers or put in the slow cooker so may as well pull out the steak.

Any other of these  hints?  It's tough finding a real butcher shop down here that gets good primal cuts of meat.  Most of the country butchers buy local beef and we just don't get the same quality as the corn states produce.

Al


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## werdwolf (Jul 18, 2009)

Those were up closer to Toledo.  If I remember correct that store closed, or was it the whole chain?


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## alblancher (Jul 18, 2009)

Scuba,

First time I have seen that link.  Looks like with all the cross-sections available I should be able to see exactly what you all are talking about.  I have a hard time looking at a piece of meat and relating that to the postion in the carcass.

Al


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## smokingohiobutcher (Jul 18, 2009)

The few stores They opened in toledo have closed. I don't know if the entire chain went  under or not?. What area of n. ohio are you from wolf?


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## werdwolf (Jul 18, 2009)

And what part of Ohio are you in?


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## smokingohiobutcher (Jul 18, 2009)

I live in OakHarbor  about 5 Miles From the northshore of Ohio on Lake Erie.  30 mins east of toledo. I work at an Independant Grocery store Millers markets.   4 stores in Ohio  3 in indiana and @ in michigan.
I'm the meat dept manager at the Genoa Ohio store.


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## werdwolf (Jul 19, 2009)

Bellevue

I have been to the Miller's in Clyde for a couple of there meat sales.


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## davenh (Jul 19, 2009)

Cool thread Thomas! Thanks for posting it 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





. I like the info.


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Hello SmokingOhioButcher,
If you're talking about the chain I use to work for, Yes Farmer Jack, owned by the Borman Family is no more.  I first started to work for them in the mid 60's and at that time they were calling their stores "Food Fair".  Around 1966, as best as I can remember they changed the name to "Farmer Jack". They became Borman's Inc. and in the late 80's A&P bought them out. I retired from them at that time before the take over. IMO A&P never did do a great business in the Detroit area, I feel that FJ was doomed from that point on. Like I said IMO.

Anyway it's great to be a part of this SMF and to meet such wonderful people. I'm sure we all have our stories to tell too.

Thanks,
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

We use to do the same till we had enough that was needed to fill the counter. Other then that we would cut the blade portion into steaks or roast. At times we even de-boned the chuck and took the part of meat under the blade bone and made them into Chuck Fillets Steaks or rost. the part above we would either make stew, pepper steaks (sliced thin) or make cube steaks.  

Thanks,
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Thanks for your compliment DaveNH!
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Hello scubadoo97,
I thank you for your kind words and providing us with that great link!  
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





Thanks,
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Hello ShooterRick,
Thanks for the suggestion of placing this topic here and for your support too. I hope that it warrants its own place in the topic section here at SMF- Smoking Meat Forum!!

Thomas


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## pops6927 (Jul 19, 2009)

Just cut the dead meat, not the live meat!  (lost a few parts of fingers over the years,  a few stray Cimeters into knees and thighs, etc. lol!).

Pops §§


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Hey Pops,
I know exactly what you mean when you say "Just cut the dead meat, not the live meat!".  I have a few scars myself on my hands and remember what I was doing at looking at each scar. I was lucky that they were all in my fingers and not into any other body parts!

By the way how do you like the meat grinder and sausage stuffer you have??

Thanks,
Thomas


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## shooterrick (Jul 19, 2009)

I am sure moderators are watching this thread.  If enough interest is displayed by the membership in meat cutting I am sure it will find a home here.  Good luck and good smokes
Rick


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## chisoxjim (Jul 19, 2009)

I have 3 places I can recommend for folks in the CHicagoland area for picking up meat, allowing you to stay away from the mega chain markets, and their meat.

#1
Peoria Packing
1300 W. Lake
Chicago, IL.

pork is there thing,  spares, BB ribs, rib tips, shoulders, butts, sides of pork, whole hogs, heads, snouts, feet, etc.  Beef and chicken alos offered, but their strength is pork for sure.  

# 2
Polancics Meat Market
412 W. Norris
Ottawa, IL.

Beef, they have the best beef of any place I have been to.  Steaks cut to order, prime beef available.  

#3
Brookhaven Markets
locations in Burr Ridge, Darien, and Mokena

a newer find for me, I go to the darien location on my home on Fridays, and like their trimmed spares, bone in pork loins, bb ribs, beef roasts, and chickens.


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## erain (Jul 19, 2009)

never did it for money but been around it since a child. my father in law turned out to be a butcher by trade. go figure. i remember my dad had this little book with all the cuts. probably a 1920's edition of the meat buyers guide lol. but he was a stickler on how to exact cut up the beef and the hogs. 

by the way i know the ribeye is a devil of a steak but not demonical. how about delmonico.

this could be a very interesting thread.


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## wanbli (Jul 19, 2009)

When I worked in the grocery business I hung out with the meat cutters. An old timer told me instead of buying "rib eye" steaks most butchers and cutters took "chuck eyes". He said the only thing seperating the chuck and rib sections was a fine line of fat/gristle and they cost half of the price of rib eyes, I have been buying them ever since. If you live in an area that has farms raising beef cattle, there should be a local meat processor. We have one here that not only gets beef and pork but buffalo and other farm raised "game animals". You can order custom cuts, half a beef uncut, whole hogs etc... And the pricing is better than the stores charge. Or you can order a 1/4, 1/2 or whole animal cut/ground to your specifications. Ours will even do sausages and hot dogs to your specs. You can even find organically raised/feed critters through him. It's all locally grown, unfrozen and aged before being sold. Awesome meats and store bought does not compare. They also have a regular meat counter that you can purchase smaller amounts out of instead of buying the 1/4 to whole animal. It's priced a little higher than buying "bulk" but is every bit as fresh as the bulk purchased meat.


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## thomasyoung (Jul 19, 2009)

Hello Erain,
Thanks for pointing me out to my spelling error. Correction has been made! Thanks,
Thomas


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## pops6927 (Jul 19, 2009)

Good, very good for the amounts I do (5-20lbs at a time).  If I were continually processing half or whole hogs or quarters of beef, I'd want to go with a 25-40 lb. motorized stuffer, a 40lb. or more mixer and the 1¾ hp. grinder or larger; but I'm just processing for the home for my wife and I and occasionally for our two sons.  I am thinking about acquiring the patty maker for sausage patties tho; wife prefers them pattied vs. linked (don't think she can bear to bite into the intestinal lining of Ba Ba Black Sheep... lol!).

Pops §§


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## morkdach (Jul 19, 2009)

very interesting thread as i know absolutly nothing about meat cutting but wish i did. 
thanks Thomas


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## alx (Jul 19, 2009)

Great Idea.It could point some of the same questions to a place with pictures and descriptions...

Always nice to have a place to look for meat supply if people are unfamiliar with an area etc..


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## erain (Jul 20, 2009)

just out of curiousity... how many here do there own home processing??? have a meat saw etc??? i dont mean a little sausage or buying a whole primal cut and taking it down by hand. but buying beef by the quarter minimum or pork by the halves or whole, big game processing... who is really into it???


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## oneshot (Jul 20, 2009)

If you're counting butchering deer, I do. My taxidermist friend is a retired butcher and we do everything from shooting them, to steaks, roasts and grind. Due to Chronic Wasting Disease we do not cut the bones with a saw but rather bone everything out to avoid any possilbe contamination.

For the record, I also agree that this is a fantastic idea and should have it's own spot. So many good questions and answers. And many thanks to our butcher friends for the valuable knowledge that they are sharing.


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## thomasyoung (Jul 20, 2009)

Thanks ALX, I plan on trying to expand on the many kinds of cuts of meat from each section of the cattle. I'm hoping that SMF makes it own place in the menu for this topic! I also would like to know now more then ever since I'm going full guns ahead with Smoking Meat where to get my meat in my area or close by. Also it would help other smokers here to know where to go for their meat other then the grocery chains!
Thanks again,
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 20, 2009)

Hi Erain,
Well I did at one time. In Michigan and I think it was the same all over the country too. They made us get rid of using wood sawdust on the floors and get rid of the wooden butcher block tables. They were just going to throw them into the garbage! So I took a large butcher block table complete with wooden shelf’s to hold the different sizes of meat trays. I put it into my garage to go along with my Biro Meat saw, Hobart Meat Grinder and my hand meat saw. I had the whole setup in my garage to use during deer hunting season. I had some meat hooks that I used to hang deer with and made this rail from the garage to the outside to take the hide off the deer. It was a sweet setup. 

Then there came a time that I was in the mist of a divorce and the ex had a Garage sale without my knowledge. One day I had a complete setup and then it was gone. That was the day that I came home from work and found some guy walking out with my Lazyboy chair! I asked him what the H*## he was doing with my chair and he told me that he just bought it. She did one heck of a number on me. All that the judge told her was not to do it again. No problem for her, she did such a great job the first time there was hardly anything left that belonged to me. I guess when I got married I should have only gotten the 5 year license. 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





 Where I live now there’s not much of a call for it to use for wild game. Too dang hot too! I would like to get my hands on a good meat grinder and sausage stuffer though.   Further down the road I like to get a large deep freeze to hold all of my cuts. If I had that I probably would like to get my hands on a meat saw made by Biro, or Hobart and Butcher Boy! 

Thanks,
Thomas


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## thomasyoung (Jul 20, 2009)

Hello Oneshot,
Thanks, in looking at everything that this website provides it's great. I did feel the need that there should be a section in Meat Cutting, Meat Cutters talking to the members here and giving their expertise  and a list of Meat Plants where the members can get their meat at whole sale prices! I’m hoping that with the interest that has been given here is a good indication for them to make it own place in the main menu!
Thanks,
Thomas


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## pops6927 (Jul 20, 2009)

As it is now, we have different sections for different meats; i.e. Beef, Pork, Chicken, and so on, and meat-related questions and information is posted into each section as requested and needed.  I make quite a few posts myself.  In creating one section for all meats separate from the catagories could get confusing, esp. for newcomers and those unfamiliar with different cuts from different animals, jumbling a post on lamb breast right after chicken breast and short ribs beef then spare ribs pork, etc.  

However, I could see within each section having a Sticky concerning meat-related information, such as "Beef Cuts", "Pork Cuts", Poultry Cuts", etc., then in General Discussion have a sticky for "Meat Wholesalers/Retailers", with each post's subject line has to include the city/state for search purposes; that way if you live in Denver Colorado you can pull up all posts for that city or for that state, etc.  FYI, Stickys stay at the top and don't move down the listings like regular threads, so they're there all the time and accessible.

Pops §§


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## pops6927 (Jul 20, 2009)

I have the ability and the basic tools necessary to be able to process a quarter of beef, a hog, a deer, etc. with owning a knife and a hand saw, grinder and stuffer, just don't have the need to do so. Don't hunt and with just me and momma and a over-top freezer section, no room for a quarter or half an animal. What with meat sales in several different retailers, not much savings either. 

There's probably relatively few who have need for meat-cutting knowledge for practical use in their own lives, but can benefit by knowing where each cut comes from for a broader understanding of animal carcasses and how to cook them. The most basic relative knowledge is understanding what that particular muscle group does. For example, a leg supports the animal and is used constantly. The backbone is uses relatively little when the animal stands on all fours. The shoulders are used more than the belly, the legs more than the shoulders, etc. etc. just like us in the human body. Males are more sinewy than females in most cases (women bodybuilders are a good exception!) - likewise tougher, stronger muscle groups. Age plays a factor, such as a young tom turkey vs. an old hen (I'd much rather have an 16lb. tom than a 16lb. hen for Thanksgiving dinner!). How the muscle is used, it's age, it's chemistry (testosterone), etc. all play an important part on knowing how tender or tough it's going to be and the right cooking method to get the best FAT yield out of it (Flavor And Tenderness). Why do we low-and-slow a brisket but high-heat grill a NY Strip? Brisket comes from the underarm of the fore of the animal supporting a majority of the animal's weight whereas a NY strip comes from the backbone area that provides little support, that muscle is not weight-bearing. And so on.

A sticky on 'Cuts' in each section would do well to help inform and enlighten members of these differences I would think.


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## mgwerks (Jul 20, 2009)

I'm all for it!  Let's make the section.  I hope to pick up some smarts about this topic.  As it is, I am looking for someone nearby that butchers their own animals so that I can learn the ins and outs and rights and wrongs of doing it.  And figuring out what to do with all of the offal...

Mark


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## bmudd14474 (Jul 21, 2009)

The Mod staff is working on this request. Give us some time and we will announce what the outcome will be.


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## mgwerks (Jul 21, 2009)

Thanks, Brian - you are da bomb!


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## the dude abides (Jul 21, 2009)

Yikes!  My head is swimming with too much information.  This would be a great idea to have this in it's own section.  It might also keep some of you who are more knowledgeable in meat cuts from being killed with Private Messages.  

As a weekend warrior, I know that I almost always end up at the local grocery store paying way too much for meat that I really don't even know what it is or the best way to prepare it.

Thanks for this awesome idea.  Tons of people will benefit from it and it will give the SMF another reason for people to join.


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