# New Element...not heating any at all now?!?



## notoriousgt350 (Apr 13, 2017)

New member, but I've been smoking on my MES 40" 20070311 for over 2 years.I have enjoyed it and enjoy looking through all the threads here for advice over the last couple of years. BUT, I need some help with a few things which I've searched and look through out the forums for information.

Problem, element stop heating pass 190*. Call MB and got a new 1200W element kit yesterday. Replace my heating element and it does not even warm up anymore. Called MB and they want to sell me a "body kit" for $200+ dollars. I said NO and they are sending me a complementary control panel just incase that's the problem. SO, a couple things I've notice I lost my original grounding bolt and replaced it. But I can't tell where in relation to the heating element and housing where should I place the grounding spade at? I figure it's not grounding somewhere and tried different ways.Any suggestions?

I didn't replace my crimps with the new ones as they look good. I'll see if I can post some pics shortly. Thank you!

J.R.


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## notoriousgt350 (Apr 13, 2017)

Some pics













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I don't know how many times in the last 5 hours I have tried to change the positioning of where to mount the ground wire, check the crimps, mount the ground bolt....where in relation to the heating element and unit do I put the ground wire. Before, my old element would only heat to 190*. Put this one in and nothing. Put my old one back in and nothing as well.


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## nopigleftbehind (Apr 13, 2017)

I am convinced now after receiving multiple parts from the manufacturer that these units aren't  worth the money and don't function consistently or at all.  Sad because the concept is really good.


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## tallbm (Apr 13, 2017)

Hi there.  Here is an image I found online of the wiring.  The green one is the ground:













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Do you have a multimeter?  You can check for continuity see that there are no breaks in your wiring from the circuit board to the heating element.  

If you are already fooling with your wiring, you dont fix the issue by checking the wiring, and the new controller doesn't fix the issue you have two options:

1) Abandon this MES 

2) Rewire the MES and use an after market (better than MES) controller

The Physical construction of the MES seems to be great.  The controller/electronics seem to be the weak point.

It may seem like a difficult idea to rewire but it is really much simpler than you might imagine.

I hope this info helps :)


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## old sarge (Apr 13, 2017)

Wish I had an answer to help you out. Might be time to dump the old and get a new smoker.  Since you won the smoker, tossing it out is not really a loss. For an electric I recommend the Smokin-it and the CookShack units, both of which I have owned and used.  I still use the Smokin-it and my son has the Cookshack which I use when visiting. Never a problem. SmokeHollow seems somewhat popular.  Then there are the pellet smokers. Shop around.  Lots of smokers in all price ranges available.  But hopefully someone with a lot of MasterBuilt knowledge will see your posts and lend a hand.  Good luck.


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## notoriousgt350 (Apr 13, 2017)

TallBM, my ground is between the outside and inside housing.I do have a multimeter laying around somewhere, I may give that a try while I'm waiting on the control panel to arrive. If not works, I'll take off the rear panel and inspect to see if it's something minor. But, I may look into something else if I can't get it fixed.


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## tallbm (Apr 13, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> TallBM, my ground is between the outside and inside housing.I do have a multimeter laying around somewhere, I may give that a try while I'm waiting on the control panel to arrive. If not works, I'll take off the rear panel and inspect to see if it's something minor. But, I may look into something else if I can't get it fixed.


I just looked at your images again and you sure are right about the ground being between the two layers.  It is all frayed up, that is crazy.

Just a word to the wise, if you pull off the back your MES you will find that the wires are all buried deep under heavy spray foam and MES decided to go with black insulation for both the hot and neutral wire once it comes out of the circuit board located at the bottom of the smoker.  This is why I mention the multimeter and the continuity setting.  If you use the multimeter you won't have to go digging up a bunch of foam insulation to track one end of a wire to the other (continuity).  Provided your multimeter probes are long enough to check you should be able to find out some good stuff.

I'll be doing the same thing with my multimeter to rewire my MES40 Gen1 here soon.  I'm still building my new HeaterMeter PID controller and housing box so I will rewire the MES after the controller is completed.  I can only do this work on the weekends and they have all been booked up with other commitments so it's been slooooow going.

A rewire job basically consists of cutting out the MES circuit board at the bottom and making the plug wiring and splicing/connecting the MES chord ground, hot, and neutral to the ground, hot, neutral wiring that goes to the element there in your image.  Actually simple once you can identify the wiring properly and splice it.  

This rewiring means electricity will run to the heating element with no controller involved so you basically have ON and no OFF unless you unplug.

You basically plug the MES plug into a controller (PID, or Dial Style controller like DaveOmak's example) and the controller will manage the juice on/off to the plug to maintain the temp.  Simple :)

I hope all this info is helpful and gives you an idea of what your rewire options are if things aren't easily fixed.


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## jp61 (Apr 13, 2017)

Whatever the problem may be not allowing the element to heat up, it is not the ground wire.


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## johnnyb54 (Apr 14, 2017)

JP61 said:


> Whatever the problem may be not allowing the element to heat up, it is not the ground wire.



Notorious, like JP61 said a ground will not cause your element not to heat up, the ground is there for safety. If the hot leg should touch metal and there is no ground you will get shocked as your body can complete the circuit. Like TallBM mentioned all the wires are deep in a thick foam insulation. I recently rewired mine and found frayed wires. I used a dremel to just cut out the back panel where the wires were to make repairs. If you look at my post on the rewireing (http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/260975/its-alive-the-auber-masterbuilt-hybrid-the-frankenbuilt) look at the 7th picture. My ground wire is yellow with a green stripe, its attached on the left side of the heater connections. The 1st & 2nd pics show the cuts I made with a dremel. Good luck


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## daveomak (Apr 14, 2017)

Remove the heat shrink and check the terminals...


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## daricksta (Apr 14, 2017)

NoPigLeftBehind said:


> I am convinced now after receiving multiple parts from the manufacturer that these units are worth the money and don't function consistently or at all.  Sad because the concept is really good.


That's rather harsh and you didn't provide any specific details to support your criticism. I've owned a MES 30 Gen 1 for 5 years and it continues to work great. Only had to replace the controller. Its the best electric smoker out there at its price points. I've read that the new Bluetool models are excellent.


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## notoriousgt350 (Apr 14, 2017)

It will definitely give everything into consideration. I love this unit and it was worked great! The only other problem I had when I first got it til the last smoke, my control panel would go on a chirping sound and turn off. After multiple attempts it would finally turn on. Sometimes within 1 hour into smoking, I would have to always check the smoker, as the control panel would just shut off. Keep in mind, I always use the wireless remote and my remote would read like it's on, but the control panel would turn off. I hate electrical gremlins and I will do what I can to see if I can get it up and running.


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## notoriousgt350 (May 3, 2017)

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So I used my multimeter for continuity to check the prongs connected to the heating element to the black braided wire on the pic located top-left corner and it beeped. Then I tried the other black braided wire with the clear cover removed from the female connector and nothing. The heating element tested good for continuity. What other wires and such can I check without taking the back panel off?


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## daveomak (May 3, 2017)

This is the panel I was thinking of to check the heating element...     I have no idea where the panel you are checking is located....













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## notoriousgt350 (May 3, 2017)

I did check that panel and the element seems to be fine. Just don't know which other wires to check and where? And I did put new connectors for the heating element.


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## johnnyb54 (May 3, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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NotoriousGT250, what was the reading you got on the heating element? If I'm not mistaken the ohmage should be around 18 OHMS. Hopefully someone will chime in with their element reading.


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## tallbm (May 3, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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For continuity checks you may want to do 3 of them:

First unplug the wires from the heating element.

Then wrap a piece of masking tape or mark at least one of the black braided wires in your picture and then take a picture or memorize where the marked wire is connected.  After unplug those two black braided wires from the circuit board in your picture.  Now on to the 3 checks:

Check continuity by putting multimeter probes on both poles of your heating element, you should hear a beep.  Also as johnnyb54 mentions you can do an additional ohms check on the element to see what it reads to see if your element is problematic.  Do all of this with wires disconnected!
Check continuity of a single black braided wire by touching a multimeter probe to the end of the wire in your picture and the other multimeter probe to the wire that was disconnected to the heating element.  You may have to probe both wire ends that are disconnected to the heating element to find the proper wire and hear the beep. Again do all of this with wires completely disconnected from heating element and circuit board
Repeat step two for the 2nd braided wire until you hear it beep.  Again, again, do all of this with the wires completely disconnected from the heating element and circuit board
If you fail to hear some beeps then you know it is the element or one of the wires that has a break in continuity.

I repeatedly mention to check with the wires disconnected because if you don't you will simply be testing a complete continuous loop from one point to any other point.  When the wires are connected the circuit continuously goes:

Black braided Circuitboard wire -> heating element pole1 -> heating element pole2 -> other black braided circuit board wire

You have to disconnect to find the problem wire or if the heating element is the problem.  

After these checks you will have enough info to know if that half of the MES wiring/continuity is good or not.  If that half is good then you have to continue to trouble shoot backwards.

That would include testing the plug and if the plug is good then it looks like the MES electrics or electronics wiring are screwy.  

Let me know if this helps :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 3, 2017)

Sounds good! I'll give it a try tomorrow with a little more light and see what happens.


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## daveomak (May 3, 2017)

If all else fails, disconnect all the control garbage and put this SCR in line of the heating element...   Then you can control the heat like it was a gas burner on your stove top....    I did that about 6 years ago to my MES 30....    the element never turns off when smoking...  I adjust the heat up and down with a dimmer...   These SCR's are cheaper and do the same thing....














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## tallbm (May 3, 2017)

DaveOmak said:


> If all else fails, disconnect all the control garbage and put this SCR in line of the heating element...   Then you can control the heat like it was a gas burner on your stove top....    I did that about 6 years ago to my MES 30....    the element never turns off when smoking...  I adjust the heat up and down with a dimmer...   These SCR's are cheaper and do the same thing....
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I've heard you mention it but never seen the pics.  That's an great and simple mod Dave!


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

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^^^^I put a small piece of blue tape on one of the black braided wires on the circuit board and the other black braided wire _is not_  taped.













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^^^^Unplugged both the wires on the circuit board













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^^^^On the heating element end, I labeled one black braided line with a large piece of blue tape and the other with a small. ON both terminals of my heating element, it does have continuity and ohms measuring 12.3 just like my old heating element.













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^^^^Here I tested the big tape braided line on the element side to the tape braided line on the circuit board side. No sound, no measurement.













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^^^^I tested the small blue tape braided line on the element side to the taped braided line on the circuit board side. I had continuity with the audible beep and measuring no resistance.

NOW, I did test both braided lines on element side to the non taped braided line on the circuit board side and there was no continuity at all.

*TEST PICS BELOW are when I left both braided lines plugged into the heating element terminals. I did not get pics when I did the same thing to the NON taped braided line on the circuit board side because there was no continuity. *













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## tallbm (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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Great info, details, and pics!

I only included info and images from your last post in the quote above that may pertain to what I mention now.

So what I pulled from your tests is the following:


NO Continuity  -small taped element -> no tape board

YES Continuity -small tape element -> taped board 

 

NO Continuity -big tape element -> taped board

NO Continuity -big tape element -> no tape board
[EDIT: correcting info that was erroneous so others only have correct info to follow]

Having just rewired my MES Gen1 (that looks just like your images) last week I believe that you have continuity on the neutral side of your wiring but not on the hot side.  In the image below you can see my neutral power plug wire going to the braided wire that goes up (which is the same as your non tapped circuit board braided wire that goes up).  As long as I didn't get my wires crossed then I think your neutral side is probably good for continuity :)













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Be sure to double check that your wire nut is splicing properly and is not the issue on that one wire that is not showing continuity.

You can undo the splice and check both unspliced wires for continuity to get more info like: both wires apart show continuity but not spliced.  This would be an easy fix to use a different nut or a butt connector. 

Alternatively you may find one of the two spliced wires is bad and go from there and maybe actually get a chance to use properly colored wires to identify hot vs neutral from the circuit board to the element :)

Other simple checks are to see that your spade connectors are actually crimped wire to connector metal and no wire insulation is getting in the way of the connector crimp.

How does this sound? :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

Are you referring to the wire nut big tape element side? And do I need to do the same thing on your first pic with the neutral power plug wire into non tape circuit side?


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

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Tested the big tape element side and got continuity without any resistance. 

All the spade connectors are good and some I had to use needle nose pliers to get them off


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## tallbm (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> Are you referring to the wire nut big tape element side? And do I need to do the same thing on your first pic with the neutral power plug wire into non tape circuit side?


Yeah the wire nut on the big tape element side.  I should have been more specific on that :)

I would hold off on doing what I have done in my pic.   What I did in my pic was to rewire my MES to bypass all of the MES controller and electronics so I could use a PID controller instead.   I don't believe you are trying to rewire to eliminate the MES controller. 

My understanding is you are simply trying to fix your MES so it heats/works again :)


NotoriousGT350 said:


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Ok so the little wire you spliced in is good.

Did you check from the splice point (where your red probe is) back to the disconnected non taped braided wires at the circuit board?

If you do that last check I mentioned and you get no continuity then that portion of the wire is the problem :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

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So I tested the spliced end of big tape element side to non tape circuit side and no continuity. And yes, just trying to fix my MES to heat again. So if the wire was good, it's exactly one wire which in my pics is the big tape element side to non tape circuit side? Guessing I will have to take off the back panel then.

So the big tape element side doesn't actually lead up to the thermostat part(top right of back panel) does it?


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## tallbm (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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According to the info and pics you provided, it seems the big tape element side to the non tape circuit side wire has a continuity issue.

[EDIT: changing erroneous info so it's not out there for others to try and utilize :) ]

Chances are you need to pull the back off your smoker because you want to be 100% certain of the wire and it would be nice to know why/where it failed.

Pulling the back off is the safest and surest way to go and would be what I would suggest to ensure you figure out everything else you need to know. 

You can also visually confirm your continuity checks as well which is always nice :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

Think I will give it a shot sometime then. Going to relax for the rest of the day. Thanks for all the help and assistance. I will update my post once I get going again.


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## tallbm (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> Think I will give it a shot sometime then. Going to relax for the rest of the day. Thanks for all the help and assistance. I will update my post once I get going again.


No problem I'm glad to help.  It will be very rewarding when you fix things and you will know a TON about your smoker should it ever die on you and you want to rewire for PID controller.  The physical construction of the MES is great.  The controller and electronics less so :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

I couldn't help and wife is taking a nap. Drilled the rivers out and exposed some of the wiring.












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I found the nut hold down the ground wire on element and green power cord wire was totally lose and about to come off.


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

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Found the problem. The spade connector to the thermostat is broken off. You can see the other end of the wire on the ground is the spliced end of the big tape element side. So where could I get a new thermostat? Direct from Masterbuilt or other source? I will have to get some hi temp spade connectors too.


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

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Found the problem. The spade connector to the thermostat is broken off. You can see the other end of the wire on the ground is the spliced end of the big tape element side. So where could I get a new thermostat? Direct from Masterbuilt or other source? I will have to get some hi temp spade connectors too.


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## daveomak (May 4, 2017)

I think what you have there is the over-temp snap switch....   Keeps the smoker from going over 275....    and burning up the electronics... 

Below are a couple I found that might work..  Make sure they auto reset..   The lower number "may" be where they come on at...  That's why my MES will not start in cold weather...   Limits on both ends of the snap switch...


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

Says they are 6x6x6 inches, which I doubt it. So maybe the L270/40 will work.


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## daveomak (May 4, 2017)

Maybe that's the size of the bag or they come on a card... 

There are other snaps you can look at...   The MES snaps are probably designated in Celcius... 

The 270 - 40 probably means you will have to heat it up if the smoker is below 40 F...  I have to do that at 30 F. with my smoker..


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## dr k (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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I just found that my light wasn't working in my gen 1 40. Which is trivial because you have to clean the glass lense covering the light bulb like the window to see the light. It's good at night. After I set my multimeter to any Ohm setting I found continuity testing the bulb so it was good. I unplugged the Mes, removed the two bulb socket housing screws and found both wire screw terminals to the socket  loose, which I tightened that fixed the problem. Next time I'll strip and terminate but not much lead/space to work with. The manual says the Mes handles 15-25 watt bulbs but MB puts in 15. This is my second fix, including the high temp heating element connectors. The damn light bulb lasts longer than the wire terminals. My smoker just turned 2 years old and has been outdoors 100% of the time, covered out of direct rain. Heating and cooling, inferior crimped termials vs. Solder, oxidizing terminals in the outdoor elements is certain failure. I haven't heard of wire insulation failure just the joint where it's terminated. 
-Kurt


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## dr k (May 4, 2017)

DaveOmak said:


> Maybe that's the size of the bag or they come on a card...
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> There are other snaps you can look at...   The MES snaps are probably designated in Celcius...
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> The 270 - 40 probably means you will have to heat it up if the smoker is below 40 F...  I have to do that at 30 F. with my smoker..


The Mes snap disc says 150*C so 302*F. Do stock Mes snap discs auto reset after cooling down for 10 minutes or so like other overheated appliances or have to be repaced. I never got a reply on that over the years. 
-Kurt


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## notoriousgt350 (May 4, 2017)

That reminds me I do need to change the light bulb in mine. Have you ever changed out your snap disc Kurt on your MES?


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## tallbm (May 4, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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As Dave pointed out what you have in your hand is the safety rollout limit switch.  As Dave mentions it is there to trip should your smoker reach the switch temp limit and cut power to the heating element.  This way if something fails you don't heat until you burn down your smoker.

I am 100% positive that the "Goodman Amana B1370154 Flame Rollout Switch 350° OEM" will fit and work for you, I use them and they run anywhere from $7-$10. Ebay has them cheaper than amazon. 

I have a feeling that the MES one is a 1 time trip and replace switch because those are super cheap and would keep manufacturing costs down.

In my two rewire jobs I replaced the stock MES rollout switch with the one above because I wanted a resetable switch should it ever trip.  Also I wanted a higher limit (350F) so when I ran my PID autotuning feature there would be some temperature room for it to do it's thing without tripping the switch at 302F.  Finally, I wanted to be able to push a little over 300F just for chicken smokes so I could get edible skin 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Some high temp spade connectors on a new rollout switch and you are back in business.

Also if you have a dremel with a cutting wheel and a little piece of aluminum or sheet steel I would suggest you cut a hole and make a panel so you can access that switch again should it trip and you need to reset it without taking the whole back off.  Here is my homemade panel for the rollout switch













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I don't have a picture of it but I even cut out a square on the rollout switch cover so I could pull the rubber sheet out and access the rollout switch without having to unscrew it as well lol.

Finally, i am going to double check my wiring to double check that my neutral and hot plug wires are going to the proper braided wires.  Your experience proves that being 100% certain is worth the effort of me looking again before i test this weekend lol


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## dr k (May 5, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> That reminds me I do need to change the light bulb in mine. Have you ever changed out your snap disc Kurt on your MES?


Mine hasnt failed so it's the original snap disc. If anyone has had one trip I'd like to know if it reset itself or needed to be replaced. If it does fail I'll solder on new  high temp flag quick disconnects to the wires when installing the new snap disc. If the controller fails and I go with a PID I believe I'll go with 14 guage wires from the snap disc to the element on the outside of the smoker along the back. Those high temp quick disconnects are tight and holding the snap disc in your hand and pushing them on is easier than the tight space it's  mounted in. Then shrink tube the two wires together from the snap disc down to the heating element access and fasten the wires to the back of the smoker. Cut the power cord off the smoker and terminate the new wiring with solder and shink tubing at the heating element access. Now all wiring is more substantial and all troubleshooting in the future is at a glance after the covers are removed. I like the clean look TallBM gets with using the Mes wires and just making a snap disc access but after all the failed connectors and frayed wires that comes in the Mes I want a heavier guage wire and I have 16 high temp T1113 Supco quick disconnects to use on 16-14 guage wire. The pic on Amazon where I bought these shows a fold tab instead of the barrels they sent in the pic below. I wanted to crimp and solder but the barrels are not crimpable. The black one is the one I replaced before it failed. The one that failed disintegrated. 












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-Kurt


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## daveomak (May 5, 2017)

I'm positive they automatically reset....   because they do not say "one time use" like other temp. limits...  like a fusible link....  

I have had my MES overheat, when the chips caught fire, and no reset was necessary...

EDIT:...  It is called a "switch"...  switches open and close..


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## dr k (May 5, 2017)

DaveOmak said:


> I'm positive they automatically reset....   because they do not say "one time use" like other temp. limits...  like a fusible link....
> I have had my MES overheat, when the chips caught fire, and no reset was necessary...
> 
> EDIT:...  It is called a "switch"...  switches open and close..


Thanks Dave. I suspected it reset itself after cooling since there's no access panel in the back of the Gen 1 40".  Lots of hair dryers, small 800 watt vacuum cleaners and space heaters etc. Reset themselves. 
-Kurt


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## tallbm (May 6, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


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By the way, Fry's electronics was the only place I could find steel high temp connectors.  Online I could not find a variety pack and I had to order large quantities for like 100-1000 of them :(
I discovered Fry's had them at the store.

Also I edited my posts in this thread to correct the hot vs neutral assumptions I was making based on my rewire.  I went back and checked and yep I had my wires crossed hahaha.  All fixed now and I updated the pics in the past threads to show the correct hot vs neutral for my Gen1 rewire :)


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## dr k (May 6, 2017)

TallBM said:


> By the way, Fry's electronics was the only place I could find steel high temp connectors.  Online I could not find a variety pack and I had to order large quantities for like 100-1000 of them :(
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Supco T1113  (14-16 gauge)  T1114  (14-12 gauge).. Amazon $10. The pic shows a fold over tab but they are round barrels the wire slides into. Either way they come they should be soldered to the wire. 
-Kurt


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## notoriousgt350 (May 7, 2017)

Busy weekend working. So, should I try to salvage my current disc or get a new one? Now if I understand correctly, if I get the *  B13701-54 L350F Flame Rollout Switch *with temp limit of 350*, it will cut the power to the heating element at that temp? So then I have the potential of over cooking the meats and what not even if I slow cook for example at 225*. Will the control panel regulate the heat element temp anyways if I have it set at the desired temp?

Kurt, I'm going to purchase those high temp connectors off amazon. Great quality and safety insurance!


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## tallbm (May 8, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> Busy weekend working. So, should I try to salvage my current disc or get a new one? Now if I understand correctly, if I get the *  B13701-54 L350F Flame Rollout Switch *with temp limit of 350*, it will cut the power to the heating element at that temp? So then I have the potential of over cooking the meats and what not even if I slow cook for example at 225*. Will the control panel regulate the heat element temp anyways if I have it set at the desired temp?
> 
> Kurt, I'm going to purchase those high temp connectors off amazon. Great quality and safety insurance!


Q: So, should I try to salvage my current disc or get a new one?

*A: No, I don't think you can salvage your current rollout switch.  From the image it seems the tab has corroded or melted off.  Best to go with a new rollout switch.*

Here is an image I pulled from online for visual context.  The image refers to the Rollout Switch as an "Overtemp Cutoff/Snap-Disk", and the smoker temp probe as a "Controller Sensor":













3cf4fb2a_p596535581.jpeg



__ tallbm
__ May 8, 2017






As you can see in the image above the Rollout switch (left) is separate from the smoker temp probe (right).  The smoker temp probe works with your electronic controller unit (digital display and buttons on top of smoker) to keep the smoker temperature at the set temperature you enter in.

The rollout limit switch is independent of the controller and smoker temp probe.  The rollout switch will cut power to the heating element to prevent the smoker from getting too hot in an unsafe situation.  This is a safety mechanism should the electronics and/or wiring fail in your smoker causing a situation where the heating element is constantly getting electricity and the controller cannot stop it.

*For example*:  The electronic board at the bottom of your smoker has an electronic switch that the controller unit uses to switch electricity on/off to the heating element to manage your set temperature.  If that switch shorts out in the ON position then electricity will continuously run to the heating element no matter what the controller is telling the switch to do.  You then end up with a smoker that may burn down.

The rollout switch will save you in this situation.  Should the smoker temp hit the rollout switch limit (302F for the original, 350F for the one mentioned above) then the rollout switch will trip and cut power to the heating element thereby preventing a potential overheating and fire issue.

After that explanation I can better answer the rest of your questions:

Q: if I get the *  B13701-54 L350F Flame Rollout Switch *with temp limit of 350*, it will cut the power to the heating element at that temp?

*A:  Yes, which should ONLY happen in bad circumstances.  You would only hit the rollout switch limit in unusual or unsafe circumstances and the rollout switch would cut the power to the heating element.*

Statement: So then I have the potential of over cooking the meats and what not even if I slow cook for example at 225*.

*A: No, the rollout switch is not used to control the smoker set temperature, that is a separate smoker probe that the controller uses.  Again the rollout switch is independent and only trips if the roll out switch limit is hit causing it to then cut power to the heating element.  The rollout switch is not involved with temp management for controlling your cooking :)*

Q: Will the control panel regulate the heat element temp anyways if I have it set at the desired temp?

*A: Yes.  Temp control is managed with a separate smoker probe that is not tied to the rollout switch.*

The high temp connectors are a really good idea as the other little thin ones used by Masterbuilt seem to wear out quickly.

*IMPORTANT:*   Also make sure the connectors are NOT loose at all.  You don't want any looseness or noticable wiggle in the connector.  This will likely result in resistance and resistance will turn into heat which will then turn into melting or burning up anything at the connection and possibly starting a fire.  I have already melted one rollout switch in the past because i thought the connector was secure enough but was wrong.  It melted the plastic on rollout switch where the tab connects and then kept causing the switch to overheat and cut power.

With that lesson learned I started putting the spades on the rollout switch tabs first and then fastening the wires to the spade.  Those rollout switch tabs bend easily and make it difficult for the very very tight steel high temp spades to be placed on the tabs. 

*My solution?*

I put a spade on each tab of the rollout switch.  Stood the rollout up on one of the spades on a piece of 2 x 4 wood and started tapping the opposing spade (on the other tab) with a hammer.  This forced both spades to start pressing onto the tabs without bending either tab.  I would then flip the rollout switch to the other spade and continue tapping to push down the spade onto other tab.  Flip and repeat until the spades are all the way on.  You will get spades that are forced all the way on, are as snug as can be, and avoid bending tabs and damaging the rollout :)

I hope this info helps you out some :)


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## notoriousgt350 (May 8, 2017)

That's a lot of help! Just ordered the high temp connectors and a package of 5 of the KSD 301 Switch exactly like the MES one for over $7. One review had a guy replace his on an MES with the new one and working perfect, plus I'll have 4 spares too.


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## tallbm (May 8, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> That's a lot of help! Just ordered the high temp connectors and a package of 5 of the KSD 301 Switch exactly like the MES one for over $7. One review had a guy replace his on an MES with the new one and working perfect, plus I'll have 4 spares too.


You'll be in business soon!

It's good you have a pack of 5 of the rollouts.  They are easy to damage at the tab sites and you don't want to install one with a wiggling/loose tab or connector.  It will just melt down on you and trip constantly causing you to replace it anyhow... a little birdy told me :P

Just follow the info I gave on how to best add those tight high temp spades to the rollout tabs and you will be fine.  You have a few you can practice with :)

Just make sure all wires are fastened well, all spades are tight with no wiggle, and I think you will be smoking again in no time!


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## notoriousgt350 (May 10, 2017)

IMG_7944.JPG



__ notoriousgt350
__ May 10, 2017






^^^Parts came in early today! Just compare the old to new.













IMG_7945.JPG



__ notoriousgt350
__ May 10, 2017






^^^*It's ALIVE!!!!!!!(view from top)*













IMG_7947.JPG



__ notoriousgt350
__ May 10, 2017






^^^Got to 202 in 10 minutes from 78*. 

   So I place the high temp connectors on the new switch and tighten all the spade connectors throughout the MES electronics. Also since I had drilled out the rivets with a #8 drill bit, I bought some #10 x 1/2" tapping screws and sealed up the unit. Spent about $35 all together to finally get it up and running, Now I have many spare high temp connectors, 4 extra snap disc switches, extra heating element and extra control panel.

   Thank you all for the advice and guidance on getting this MES going! Couldn't have done it without the pics and suggestions!

-J.R.


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## old sarge (May 10, 2017)

You haven't put meat in that smoker yet? What are you waiting for???


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## tallbm (May 10, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> So I place the high temp connectors on the new switch and tighten all the spade connectors throughout the MES electronics. Also since I had drilled out the rivets with a #8 drill bit, I bought some #10 x 1/2" tapping screws and sealed up the unit. Spent about $35 all together to finally get it up and running, Now I have many spare high temp connectors, 4 extra snap disc switches, extra heating element and extra control panel.
> 
> Thank you all for the advice and guidance on getting this MES going! Couldn't have done it without the pics and suggestions!
> 
> -J.R.


J.R. It's good to see you are back up and running!  You have basically learned everything you need to know about your MES. Physically the MES is built well.  It just seems to be lacking a little in the electronics and wiring department. 

Should anything go wrong with your MES (other than burning down) I'm pretty sure you can resolve the issue.  Congrats!!!


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## notoriousgt350 (May 10, 2017)

old sarge, wife already has me getting ready to do some ribs tomorrow for dinner. I had to at least put some soak mesquite chips in and get it smoking again. I told the wife I was wearing Mesquite by Men
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






TallBM, you are absolutely right! Once I got into looking at all the wire and troubleshooting, it was more clear about how and where everything goes and works.


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## tallbm (May 10, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> TallBM, you are absolutely right! Once I got into looking at all the wire and troubleshooting, it was more clear about how and where everything goes and works.


Yep, no more mystery aye, lol.


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## stephan28 (Jun 26, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> IMG_7944.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Great info! I was curious if you have links to the products you purchased as I'm having a little difficulty finding them on Amazon. Thanks!


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## notoriousgt350 (Jun 26, 2017)




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## stephan28 (Jun 26, 2017)

NotoriousGT350 said:


> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0071NCA48/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007Q81K0S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1



Thank you. Looks like they are currently out of the over temp switch and the picture of the spade connector appears to be wrong. It should be a barrel according to the Google search I did for Supco T1113. 

Did you solder yours on?


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## dr k (Jun 26, 2017)

Stephan28 said:


> Thank you. Looks like they are currently out of the over temp switch and the picture of the spade connector appears to be wrong. It should be a barrel according to the Google search I did for Supco T1113.
> 
> Did you solder yours on?


The pic is wrong. When I ordered the Supco T1113 on Amazon they showed the tab but when they arrived they were the barrels I sodered on. 
-Kury


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## stephan28 (Jun 26, 2017)

Thank you


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