# Is a nice Bark possible with an Old Smokey?!?!



## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

I've been searching around trying to find some source of information on this topic. I have been unsuccessful, so here I am posting for help from this great community.

This Saturday morning, I'm looking to do a 5 lb-ish pork butt on my Old Smokey and I'm trying to see how, if at all possible, to get that signature burnt bark on there. I've only done 1 butt in the past and it was sliced and not pulled. I didn't research or read anything on how to cook it, so it came out just OK. Definitely no bark.

Please help!


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## jbills5 (Jun 25, 2014)

Don't wrap it.  Just let the meat go all the way to the internal temp.  This should give you plenty of bark.


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## bobank03 (Jun 25, 2014)

jbills5 said:


> Don't wrap it.  Just let the meat go all the way to the internal temp.  This should give you plenty of bark.


exactly what jbills5 said!


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

Thanks! Speaking from experience with the Old Smokey? If so, any idea on temp/time for a butt?


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## jbills5 (Jun 25, 2014)

I don't use an old smokey.  But if you keep your smoker temp at 225-250 you should be at about 1.5-2 hours per pound.  Without wrapping you may end up going a little longer as not wrapping can sometimes cause the stall to last a bit longer.


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

Ok. So the deal with the Old Smokey is that it's practically an enclosed chamber. It get's VERY moist in the smoker because your not supposed to open it. Regardless if it's not wrapped, with all that moisture, it's not going to get a bark. EVERYTHING I've read about people using this smoker has them saying this exact same thing.

My thought process for it is this: Smoke at the low/med setting (around 225 F) until the IT is 165. Then I'll kick up the temp to med (250 F...maybe higher?) and partially open the lid. At this point, I will put the butt in a foil boat filled partially with apple juice (and maybe bourbon?) and in a pan. I'm hoping that by partially opening the lid and allowing some of the moisture to escape, it gives an opportunity for a bark to form.

Anyone with experience with this specific smoker able to chime in or am I the only one that's jump the gun and got this thing on here?


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## bobank03 (Jun 25, 2014)

I just did a search and there are over 1600 threads about Old Smokey smokers. I'm sure that someone else has covered this before?

I think if you crack the lid a bit it should work. Is there no vent in the lid of those? I would probably use a small wedge of wood or a wood shingle to keep the lid open a bit. I have an ECB which is similar in shape, but with a domed lid and I sealed around the lid and then put a vent in the top of the dome for the smoke and all to flow through. 

View media item 241962


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

bobank03 said:


> I just did a search and there are over 1600 threads about Old Smokey smokers. I'm sure that someone else has covered this before?
> 
> I think if you crack the lid a bit it should work. Is there no vent in the lid of those? I would probably use a small wedge of wood or a wood shingle to keep the lid open a bit. I have an ECB which is similar in shape, but with a domed lid and I sealed around the lid and then put a vent in the top of the dome for the smoke and all to flow through.
> 
> View media item 241962


Ha 1600 threads? 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






My google search showed plenty of results of people cooking with it, but none showing a proven way to get that bark. Maybe I'll give it another try.

No there is no vent. Part of the design of it actually. There isn't even a door to get to the wood chips in case they need to be re-filled. The theory is that since it's an enclosed space, the smoke isn't able to dissipate and get's into the meat that way. Sort of like an oven/pressure cooker/smoker. 

I'll do more searching, but I'll be sure to start a new thread once it's complete with the results and nice big self explanatory title!

Any others please feel free to comment on the plans or if you've had any experience with this guy. Thanks so far for your replies.


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## bobank03 (Jun 25, 2014)

I was just thinking if a lid from another smoker with a domed lid might fit on the top of yours?

Also, most of the threads I found say that the whole premise behind the Old Smokey is that the sealed unit keeps the meat very moist and never dries it out. Good luck, lol


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

bobank03 said:


> I was just thinking if a lid from another smoker with a domed lid might fit on the top of yours?
> 
> Also, most of the threads I found say that the whole premise behind the Old Smokey is that the sealed unit keeps the meat very moist and never dries it out. Good luck, lol


I had that exact thought the second I hit the submit button and saw your smoker.

It's almost like the makers of the Smokey decided to pick 1 great thing about smoking and forgo the rest. That's the purpose of the foil boat and pan (hopefully). If I crack the lid, I'll loose the moisture, but hopefully it'll be made up for with the juices.

We shall see.


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## bobank03 (Jun 25, 2014)

rgautheir20420 said:


> I had that exact thought the second I hit the submit button and saw your smoker.
> 
> It's almost like the makers of the Smokey decided to pick 1 great thing about smoking and forgo the rest. That's the purpose of the foil boat and pan (hopefully). If I crack the lid, I'll loose the moisture, but hopefully it'll be made up for with the juices.
> 
> We shall see.


On my ECB I keep the vent wide open and no extra moisture while smoking. I actually foil over my water pan and put a foil wrapped cobble in it to help balance the temps.


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

bobank03 said:


> On my ECB I keep the vent wide open and no extra moisture while smoking. I actually foil over my water pan and put a foil wrapped cobble in it to help balance the temps.


I really need to get an AMPS (or whatever its called) smoking piece. I don't like the fact that I don't have continuous smoke with this smoker. It burns the chips on the plate then they smolder until they go out. Nor do I like having to remove 2 grates and a drip bowl to get to the chips. With the AMPS, I could use that for the smoke and the element for the heat. Maybe I'll get it this weekend.

I like the idea of the stone in there to help with temp swings.


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## bobank03 (Jun 25, 2014)

there is a tube and a tray smoker. I actually just won the 12 inch AMNTS in a contest they had here on SMFhttp://www.amazenproducts.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=AMNTS

Unfortunately I haven't had the chance to try it out yet. On my smoker, the charcoal pan sits on a couple of paver and I can lift the whole unit off of the pan so I can add more charcoal or chunks of wood. I think that the AMNTS might be a good option for you. I plan to try mine out as soon as I can, but it won't be till next week at least.


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

Congrats on winning that contest. I'm planning on picking up one of the dented versions of the AMNPS on Friday I think. It's listed as "minor scratches" and sells for half off. Plus I'll get a bag of pitmasters choice pellets for it.


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## kc5tpy (Jun 25, 2014)

Hello.  You are spot on with your ideas on the Smokey.  Offset the lid to control temp and create bark.  Folks dismiss this smoker as a cheap piece of cr**.  These smokers have been used in Texas since the late 20's. I believe.  My Dad has used one for years and I shipped one to England 10 years ago and it is still going.  Have fed 6 people prime rib and potatoes on the 18".  Mighty fine smoker once you learn the tricks.  Keep Smokin!

Danny













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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 25, 2014)

Thanks Danny! That definitely helps. Although I have the electric model, I still hopeful my plan works. I'll report back.


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## foamheart (Jun 27, 2014)

So your Old Smokey looks more like this?













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This is the predecessor to the Old Smokey. Analog smoker, 7 speeds ( I think yours has 3), non-vented, with 2 grates, a drip pan, a chip plate, and an element ?

Its is not built to be a dry smoker, but you are realizing that. Its not built to use more than one charge of chips. Its not built to have the lid opened. Its not built so that you can use an aux. smoke generator with out modifying the smoker as there is no air draft possible to allow the chips or pellets to smolder.

Although it is an excellent smoker once mastered, its not going to give you a bark anymore than it will give you a smoke ring.

As to the smoke, you start the unit on high for 15 to 45 mins. Depending upon your smoke type (I use pecan shells), Then you turn the controller back to your choice of settings. You're done. No more chips, no more opening, no basing no mopping no spritzing, completely no lifting the lid. The smoke is captured within the smoker and will continue to allow the meat to absorb it while cooking. The magic smoke meat temp is 100 to 140 IT. if you are cooking to a 165 then foiling to the oven its plenty. If you leave it for the whole ride, your still fine.  You don't need 20 hours of smoke for a butt, only maybe 3 hours or four tops! I don't know this but I assume this is the reason for the soaking of the chips. It retards the smolder a bit longer to start, remember the magic IT for smoke is 100 to 140 IT. There are other possible reasons but it makes the most sense to me. Don't get carried away with the chips thinking you'll get longer smoke, you'll only get too much smoke which will make your meat bitter. This is the easiest smoker I ever used for over smoking.

Here is a digital copy of the manual if you don't have one.  http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0261/0379/t/2/assets/OSEScurrent.pdf?9958

I have a couple of the Redi Smok manuals around here somewhere...... I'll look but I am not sure where to even start.

Hope it helps.

You have got to realize this type electric predates nearly any other electric smoker discussed here on the boards. They are excellent for what they were intended, a small apartment type unit. I got my first one, someone left at my camp long ago on 'Possum Kingdom. I came to the camp and they had tried to build a charcoal fire on the chip tray.....LOL I have worn two more out since them.

You have to realize, its not a fire breather and it wasn't made to compete with them. Its a completely different animal.


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 27, 2014)

I do in fact have the more recent version of that unit. I've read endless posts that this is a great smoker, and believe me I don't disagree. With that said, why can't I make changes to try and get what I want out of it? I don't like being stuck or having a piece of equipment tell me what I can or can't do.

So, I've got a few pieces of equipment around the house that I think might be able to help creating this "draft" that's needed to keep an AMNPS lit. I've already drilled a hole in the lower side of the unit and I have random brass fittings around the house. Would if I rigged up an inlet tube to an air pump and pumped air into the unit while having a slight crack in the lid? I would think this would be enough from oxygen to keep the AMNPS lit no? Someone please confirm or deny this!!! I want to buy my AMNPS now ;)

I know it would be easier just to go out and get what I want from another unit, but I'd like to make this one work if possible since I've already got it. 

Not sure I've seem anyone make mods to an Old Smokey before....


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## yotzee (Jun 27, 2014)

rgautheir20420 said:


> I do in fact have the more recent version of that unit. I've read endless posts that this is a great smoker, and believe me I don't disagree. With that said, why can't I make changes to try and get what I want out of it? I don't like being stuck or having a piece of equipment tell me what I can or can't do.
> 
> So, I've got a few pieces of equipment around the house that I think might be able to help creating this "draft" that's needed to keep an AMNPS lit. I've already drilled a hole in the lower side of the unit and I have random brass fittings around the house. Would if I rigged up an inlet tube to an air pump and pumped air into the unit while having a slight crack in the lid? I would think this would be enough from oxygen to keep the AMNPS lit no? Someone please confirm or deny this!!! I want to buy my AMNPS now ;)
> 
> ...


I don't thing you could do anything like that with an electric device.  The air stokes the fuel combustion fuel source.  Doing that with an electric device would only burn your chips faster and that's not what you want.


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 27, 2014)

Yotzee said:


> I don't thing you could do anything like that with an electric device.  The air stokes the fuel combustion fuel source.  Doing that with an electric device would only burn your chips faster and that's not what you want.


If pumping air through it would be too much, how about just leaving the hole open? I imagine other smokers have an in draft for the fire towards the bottom and a place for the smoke to escape up top right?


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## kc5tpy (Jun 27, 2014)

Hello.  I MUST agree with my friend Foamheart on this one.  You didn't say it was electric in the OP.  That electric, is as stated, a totally different animal.  I doubt the changes you plan will give you the results you want ( just my opinion ).  Electrics like those are meant to operate in a certain way.  NOW, I did read somewhere about putting kitty litter or similar in the bottom of the Electric Old Smokey to absorb moisture but I dismissed it as I thought that would be a horrible taste to your final product.  I can't remember where I read it but you could start on the Old Smokey website and the Google if you want to read what folks say about that.  Good luck.  Keep Smokin!

Danny


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## rgautheir20420 (Jun 27, 2014)

The kitty litter is to suck up moisture, but it's main purpose is to catch any falling grease and stuff like that to help keep the bottom of the smoker clean. You use the odorless kind, so it doesn't effect anything. 

I'm going to try it the way I described. I'll smoke closed for 3-4 hours depending on how the temp goes, and then I'll crack the lid and let it ride to finish with it foiled (open top though) and in a pan to attempt a bark. If it doesn't work, I'm still sure to have a good piece of smoked meat regardless.


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## foamheart (Jun 27, 2014)

KC5TPY said:


> NOW, I did read somewhere about putting kitty litter or similar in the bottom of the Electric Old Smokey to absorb moisture but I dismissed it as I thought that would be a horrible taste to your final product.
> 
> Danny


Its a grease absorbent;  http://www.oldsmokey.com/products/grease-absorbent-for-electric-smoker.

With the electric the unit is so tight that the moisture has no where to escape. I have used the absorbent on one of the three I had/have and saw no really note worthy change in the meat or the rust. All three completely rusted the bottom out . Only had to change one heating element, but.........  The bottom trusting out is the weakest spot. I have one in the barn, one on the porch, and one on the front porch, none have a bottom.....LOL

Back to the post. I see no reason that you could not adapt a mod to make the Old Smokey work as you want. You will not be able to use it again as intended after your mod. though. Modding will be a bit more difficult because it a round body. No flat surface. Because of that, I would look at installing adjustable vent on the bottom, and the same on the top. Then you would have to extend the screws which hold the second grate and make longer to hold the drip pan. Once you've moved the drip pan up one you could use the second grate on the drip pan screws, and set an AMPs on it. I have not done measuring, but that would be how I would approach what you want to do. AND the benefit is if done this way you could close off the vents and go back to the original configuration and use the chips again.

Remember you can steam with this smoker until you change it. BTW, if you are completely redesigning/re-engineering, why not go with a blank slate and build one large enough to suit your needs?

Anyway, that's my take on this smokers conversion. Hope it helps some. Me I'd just buy one of those MES40s I read on the thread are selling for 1/2 price and have one big enough to put whole meats in.


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