# Well, fiddlestix. Crockpot...



## SonnyE (Mar 2, 2018)

So I asked to use the crockpot today.
"What for."
"To heat water!"
"Use the little one, I don't use it anymore."

So doing the dogs dinner, and my lunch in the small crock pot, Sous Vide.
Mostly just another of my goofy experiments in culinary clowning.
But it sure seems to be coming up slowly.

I have a controller on order. But trying to avoid using my bullet lube crock pot from the shop. A $4.99 unit from the Goodwill store. But might if 'hers' doesn't get it's fanny hot.
I decided on a controller so I can use it for electric Sous Vide, and my electric smoker. ;)

Any idea how long a small crock pot takes to get moving? Or how hot one gets?
Well, 3 hours later it's approaching 165°, chicken cooking temperature. Probably be able to feed my little buddy on time. ;)
Ah, the experiments of a retired Sr. Electrical Mechanic... LOL! :D


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## dr k (Mar 2, 2018)

I took the handle off the glass crockpot lid and threadt the sensor through the hole and held it in place with a spring clothes pin.


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## SonnyE (Mar 2, 2018)

dr k said:


> I took the handle off the glass crockpot lid and threadt the sensor through the hole and held it in place with a spring clothes pin.



Uhh, well... This one is cute, pinky with swirlies and flower lookin things. :oops:
I might have to wrap it in duct tape to de-feminize it if I continue using it.
The lid is plastic, no holes. So I just slip the probe over the side.








Or just get my own stinky brown one from the shop... Can you Sous Vied in melted bullet lube?
Not sure the dog would eat anything that smells that bad....


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## dr k (Mar 2, 2018)

SonnyE said:


> Uhh, well... This one is cute, pinky with swirlies and flower lookin things. :oops:
> I might have to wrap it in duct tape to de-feminize it if I continue using it.
> The lid is plastic, no holes. So I just slip the probe over the side.
> 
> ...


We got that exact 3.5 qt. crockpot with mauve ceramic insert and plastic lid you can barely see through anymore, as a wedding gift in 1992.  We got divorced in 2007 and its looked like this ever since. 
	

		
			
		

		
	






Had to write settings on the handles.


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## SonnyE (Mar 2, 2018)

dr k said:


> We got that exact 3.5 qt. crockpot with mauve ceramic insert and plastic lid you can barely see through anymore, as a wedding gift in 1992.  We got divorced in 2007 and its looked like this ever since.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Is that BBQ Black?
Ah, the spoils of war.


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## johnmeyer (Mar 3, 2018)

My "sous vide" machine is made from the cheapest slow cooker I could find (you need one _without _electronic controls) and an external temp controller I built (I'd just buy one the next time; I've posted links before to the controller I'd recommend).

To get the water to temp, I *never *wait for the crock pot to get the water to temperature because that would take hours. Instead I put the hottest water from my tap into the removable crock. I then measure the temp with my Thermapen and slowly add boiling water until I get it near or slightly above the set temperature (the food will instantly bring down the temperature as soon as it is dunked).

This way I can start my cooking timer right away.

The crock pot can easily hold just about any temperature, almost up to boiling, but getting it *up *to higher sous vide temps (150-170) can take hours and hours if you don't preheat the water as I describe.


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## dr k (Mar 3, 2018)

johnmeyer said:


> My "sous vide" machine is made from the cheapest slow cooker I could find (you need one _without _electronic controls) and an external temp controller I built (I'd just buy one the next time; I've posted links before to the controller I'd recommend).
> 
> To get the water to temp, I *never *wait for the crock pot to get the water to temperature because that would take hours. Instead I put the hottest water from my tap into the removable crock. I then measure the temp with my Thermapen and slowly add boiling water until I get it near or slightly above the set temperature (the food will instantly bring down the temperature as soon as it is dunked).
> 
> ...


Yes! Start with med/high temp water. For the Auber WS-1510ELPM I set the PID to 4-0-40 from their sou vide slow cooker chart.  Their chart is better than the auto tune.


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## johnmeyer (Mar 3, 2018)

The Auber is a $150 PID controller. Given the long thermal constant of a big slow cooker filled with water, I don't think you'll need it. This is because, when heating a gallon or two of water with a really small heating element (which is what you have in a slow cooker), once the energy is removed from the heating coil in the slow cooker, during the normal on/off cycle as the controller tries to maintain temperature, there is so little residual heat in the slow cooker coils that the water will instantly stop going up in temperature. In technical terms, the thermal capacity of the water is several orders of magnitude higher than the heat capacity of a typical slow cooker's heating material.

Thus, you have virtually no overshoot and therefore no need for the anticipatory trickery that is the key to a PID controller.

So, I think you can instead use the much, much cheaper controller that I've linked to before ($30, shipped, via Prime), if you want to make your own sous vide from a crock pot:

WILLHI WH1436A Temperature Controller 110V Digital Thermostat Switch Sous Vide Controller NTC 10K Sensor, Improved Version

If you buy this, remember two things: 1. You need to use a slow cooker with no digital circuitry; 2. You will need to manually stir the water every so often.

The "real" sous vide controllers have a circulating pump to keep the water moving so the energy is transferred more quickly and more uniformly to the food. I've always thought this was guiding the lily because once the food is at the sous vide set temperature, it will stay there whether the water is circulating or not because, at that point, _everything _in the pot -- the food, the water, the crock itself -- is at the same temperature. Thus, stirring the water is simply a way to get the food to that set point more quickly. So, I just stir it every 3-5 minutes during the first 30 minutes, and then just let it sit.


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## dr k (Mar 3, 2018)

Well right.  You need something. Whether it's like yours or sonny's it needs controlling to a specific temp.  I just mentioned my model for my smoker so others that have it can use it on their slow cookers with the no over shoot setting I mentioned.


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## johnmeyer (Mar 3, 2018)

Wasn't trying to be critical; just trying to point out that there might be a much cheaper alternative that would work almost as well in this application.


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## mosparky (Mar 3, 2018)

Thanks for your input, John. That might be something I will look into for waterbath finishes on sausages.


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## SonnyE (Mar 3, 2018)

My new controller will be here today.
I really considered 2 different ones for my use.  The Willhi John has, and the one I finally globbed onto, the Inkbird.
I just felt the Inkbird better suited my intended use, a simple temperature control I could use for my pot crock, but also for my 800 watt MES 30.
My little Lady Crock Pot has a 75 watt, and a 150 elements in it (Low and High settings). Completely analog control. Yesterday I observed 145-150 on low, and 165-170 on high. But to split red hairs, the Inkbird hopefully will do.

So how will I use it with my MES 30? My plan is to install a Bypass Switch to run the element with the standard MES 30 control, or click, and it is cord controlled. Where the birdturd can come into play.
I doubt my Inkbird has any programmable time step modes. I expect it to be a simple programmable temperature set-it and forget it tool that is plug connected.
I are a simple man with simple needs.


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## johnmeyer (Mar 3, 2018)

The item you got really is not appropriate for the MES. Even if you put the probe down the exhaust, fastened it inside, and then plugged the MES into it, if you try to control the MES with it, that won't work because this controller works by completely turning the power to the device off and then on again, in order to maintain a temperature. However, the controller on the MES resets to "off" each time the power is turned off (i.e., when you pull the plug, which is essentially what this device does). When it comes back on, you have to manually go to the controller and re-set the time and temperature settings.

Even if that weren't the case, it also won't work because the max temperature for the probe 210 degrees, and most MES hot smokes are done between 225 and 275.

So, this should work great for the crock pot, but not for the MES.

And, just for the record, as I stated above, I personally do NOT own the Willhi but instead designed my own controller (a one-of-a-kind) and then built it. It is really simple and uses an ancient analog design based on the old, obsolete RCA CA3059 zero voltage switch chip. It is actually a PID. It has no digital readout but it works for me.


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## SonnyE (Mar 4, 2018)

johnmeyer said:


> The item you got really is not appropriate for the MES. Even if you put the probe down the exhaust, fastened it inside, and then plugged the MES into it, if you try to control the MES with it, that won't work because this controller works by completely turning the power to the device off and then on again, in order to maintain a temperature. However, the controller on the MES resets to "off" each time the power is turned off (i.e., when you pull the plug, which is essentially what this device does). When it comes back on, you have to manually go to the controller and re-set the time and temperature settings.
> 
> Even if that weren't the case, it also won't work because the max temperature for the probe 210 degrees, and most MES hot smokes are done between 225 and 275.
> 
> ...



I guess you missed the bypass switch part John. A hybrid if you follow.
I know the limitations of the MES controller, and I don't do much hot smoking. Though I did do a killer 3,2,1 rack of Baby Backs, at 225°.
That's not to say I won't in the future. But my plan is to be able to switch.

My mistake, you do NOT own a Willhi, just brought it to the party. You also stated you wouldn't build your own again.
I wasn't interested in building my own to begin with. I considered the Willhi, but for my money I like the one I chose for my application. I found it more robust, and frankly, much less "Suzy Homemaker" than the Willhi.

I'm interested in better control, and +/- 1 degree is close enough for me, and in the control range I want it for. Cold smoking, Ambient, up to 160-165°. Or on a cooler day, the Ink Bird can give me a small controlled heat at 50-60-70-80°. Just enough to create draw.
A range the MES control is terrible in. And where the MES can't even get it's chips smoking.
It is my opinion, based on my experience, that the MES smokers are really designed for 225-275° work. An area I don't need, routinely. Because not everybody wants to do a 15 pound slab of beef.
I smoked Salmon and followed a 200° recipe. It worked, but cooked my Salmon as it smoked it. And it was so amoebic at making smoke, I had a hard time telling if any smoke was venting.
That is the reason most do modifications. Not everything wants a 50° window in the mid-200's.

But the real reason I chose the Ink Bird is for dual uses, with modifications I can do myself to the MES 30.
Which you missed, or ignored, so you _could_ be argumentative, it appears.
With the MES controls by-passable, it will become dual mode. Normal - 100-275 degree oven. Bypassed Control - now it can be easily controlled by an outside device of choosing, and at a level the user chooses.

Dr K likes his Auber PID. A nice control that many employ here. Very versatile, very programmable. Very nice. But at a price comparable for what it offers. Which is a lot, highly programable.
I, on the other hand, only want to operate in ranges lacking in the MES controls. But remain able to >click< choose the normal mode as my MES came from the factory. I don't feel I need an Auber PID to do what I plan to do.
Which at this point is make chicken for my dog Sous Vide, and correct deficiencies in my sm00kers low temperature performance.
Simply put. (And my little old dog loves his Sous Vide chicken!)

So please don't tell me what I can't do, because you really have no idea what I can, or have been able to accomplish.
Just like there are a lot of different ways to do a "Mailbox Mod". Or no mod at all, just put an AMNPS in your smoker/oven and there you go.
But Thank You for your input. ;)


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