# MES40 won't heat



## wakame

so back in December when I was smoking some meat, the smoker just quit and no heat. After waiting a few months for the parts to arrive, I finally was able to swap out the element. However, it is still not heating up. i see that both green and red lights are lit, but no heat. I checked all the wiring and it seems to be in order. What else should I check?


----------



## BurntWeenie

wakame said:


> so back in December when I was smoking some meat, the smoker just quit and no heat. After waiting a few months for the parts to arrive, I finally was able to swap out the element. However, it is still not heating up. i see that both green and red lights are lit, but no heat. I checked all the wiring and it seems to be in order. What else should I check?


Is there current to the element?


----------



## DougE

tallbm
 is the resident MES guru, If he doesn't jump right in, shoot him a PM


----------



## tallbm

wakame said:


> so back in December when I was smoking some meat, the smoker just quit and no heat. After waiting a few months for the parts to arrive, I finally was able to swap out the element. However, it is still not heating up. i see that both green and red lights are lit, but no heat. I checked all the wiring and it seems to be in order. What else should I check?


Hi there and welcome!

There is a safety rollout limit switch that often the problem for the issue that you are facing.
It is on the back of your smoker about halfway up, usually on the right hand side. If you are lucky there is a panel there to get to it. If not lucky well you will have to cut into the back of your MES or pull the back off (I suggest cutting into the back as the sheet metal is thin). I pulled this image from online to show you.







The hot wire that delivers power to the heating element connects to that switch.  Often the crappy connectors are corroded or burnt away.  Additionally the switch itself is mostly plastic and may have melted.
I bet money this is your problem because it fails most people.

If the spade connectors have corroded you can replace them and be back in business.  Just know that the safety switch is delicate and if you wiggle the connector tabs at all where they move where they connect to the back of the switch, u can count on the switch melting down within a few months.
If the switch is melted down you just clip the wire ends and slice together with a wire nut and wrap with electrical tape and that will keep you going. WARNING if u do this you no longer have the safety switch in the mix.
The switch OPENS when the temp of the smoker gets like 305F at the spot where the switch is and it cuts off power to the heating element.  This is to stop runaway heating or over heating.

You can always replace the switch if you like or like a number of us we always run backup therms in our smokers with alarms set if the smoker gets to hot.  This is up to you but as a disclaimer I have to recommend replacing the switch, if u use a ceramic one and not a plastic one then maybe it wont melt down on you.

Finally if you have to cut into the back to get to the switch you can tell where it is by looking on the inside of the smoker and finding a button/quarter size looking thing (Overtemp cuttoff snap-disk) in the back. here's another image pulled from online:






Figure out where it sits by using a measuring tape.  Then cut a rectangle around where it is.
It is usually housed in a metal box under the back sheet metal.  Remove the metal housing and u will see the switch like in the 1st image further above.

Cover the hole with another piece of sheet metal, some self tapping sheet metal screws, and some duct tape and you have a panel you can use to get back to that spot since u will be back there if you need to replace switches (Ive replaced at least 5 before I learned they were sensitive to wiggling the tabs and then melting down).

Check that switch and let us know what you find.  I hope this helps :)


----------



## wakame

Is this what you are referring to? It felt like there is no current to the heater elements .


----------



## tallbm

wakame said:


> Is this what you are referring to? It felt like there is no current to the heater elements .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 525377


Correct that is what I was referring too.  The wiring you see here leads to the heating element.  If the connectors have corroded away or the switch has melted down then you wont get power to the heating element.

Yours looks in good shape so the next issue would likely be on he "underside" of the of the MES where the circuit board is. There are 2 compartments down there. 1 is where the plug comes in and to the right of that is where the circuit board is.

The plug wiring will connect to circuit board wiring and from there power will be fed to the heating element.

It is uncommon but the circuit board connectors or the board itself has been shown to die out. If you take a look at it you will know.

One simple thing to check with an MES.  Is your timer set to 0min/sec.  If it is at 0 then it wont send power to the heating element.  It's goofy like that if I recall correclty.
Simple thing to check though before you flip over your MES and check the bottom circuit board :)


Here are some reference pictures for the bottom compartment, yours may not look exactly like this and the circuit board is often in a black plastic box in the compartment and these pics don't show every step but should give you a good idea of what you will be looking at:


----------



## wakame

Seem like this is my problem. Is this fixable? Looks like the connection is burnt.


----------



## tallbm

wakame said:


> Seem like this is my problem. Is this fixable? Looks like the connection is burnt.
> View attachment 525388



The connectors can always be replaced.  The question is whether the black square component (the relay switch) is fried.  If it is fried then you are probably out of luck on fixing that specific issue, because people have not been able to get replacement circuit boards since the pandemic started.  Be sure and check but reports here on the forum have not been good.

You do have an amazing option though if that board is fried.  

You can do a simple rewire (cut ends of the brown braided wires and the black and white smooth wires. Wire nut splice a brown with the black and other brown with the white).
The rewire would make it so that your plug feeds power directly to the heating element.

You then buy Auber PID controller.
The MES plugs into the Auber PID and the Auber plugs into the wall outlet.
You take the thermometer probe from the Auber and drop it down your vent and clip to the underside of the bottom smoker rack so it measures smoker temp.

Now you punch in the temp setting you want to smoke at and the Auber will take power from the wall and feed it to the rewired MES to hit and hold the set temp you entered.
The Auber controller should hold temp dead on or within 1-2 degrees of the set temp.

This turns your smoker into a super precise beast!!! It would be 20x better than any smoker Masterbuilt produces even when brand new!!!

I always tell people it would be like turning a golf cart into a Ferrari. That is what you would be doing and for less money than buying a new smoker.
The only sticking point is the Auber PID controller will run you $150 before shipping and tax, BUT that is way cheaper than a new smoker AND your smoker will be better than any electric smoker you could buy until you get around $1k+ and even then it would perform just as good or better than those.

Here's the PID controller I am talking about:





						Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - $159.95 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry
					

Auber Instruments, Inc. Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - The WS-1510ELPM is a versatile temperature controller to have in your home. It can be used for various applications such as Sous Vide cooking, controlling an electric smoker, making yogurt, dough proofing, controlling the...



					www.auberins.com
				




They make other fancier ones with wifi and phone apps, etc. but the one I posted is the bare bones one that would do the job. Anything less expensive may not cover your heating element power needs as well.

Ask any and all questions you have about the rewire and using an Auber PID controller.  I have a post that has a great amount of detail walking people through the process.

Finally, all of us rewired MES PID controller users wonder why we even debated it.  The performance of the smoker once doing this simply cannot be beat!

I hope this helps :)


----------



## BrianGSDTexoma

Deleted.  Thought I had part for him.


----------



## mr_whipple

Can't remember if I tossed the one out of mine. I'll look when I get home.


----------



## Brokenhandle

I have an analog mes 30 that I added the auber to and have loved it ever since!  You definitely won't be disappointed!

Ryan


----------



## BrianGSDTexoma

Brokenhandle said:


> I have an analog mes 30 that I added the auber to and have loved it ever since!  You definitely won't be disappointed!
> 
> Ryan


My auber arrives today.


----------



## Brokenhandle

BrianGSDTexoma said:


> My auber arrives today.


You'll love it! My mes will hold temps within 2 degrees now instead of at least 25 degree temp swings. 

Ryan


----------



## wakame

tallbm said:


> The connectors can always be replaced.  The question is whether the black square component (the relay switch) is fried.  If it is fried then you are probably out of luck on fixing that specific issue, because people have not been able to get replacement circuit boards since the pandemic started.  Be sure and check but reports here on the forum have not been good.
> 
> You do have an amazing option though if that board is fried.
> 
> You can do a simple rewire (cut ends of the brown braided wires and the black and white smooth wires. Wire nut splice a brown with the black and other brown with the white).
> The rewire would make it so that your plug feeds power directly to the heating element.
> 
> You then buy Auber PID controller.
> The MES plugs into the Auber PID and the Auber plugs into the wall outlet.
> You take the thermometer probe from the Auber and drop it down your vent and clip to the underside of the bottom smoker rack so it measures smoker temp.
> 
> Now you punch in the temp setting you want to smoke at and the Auber will take power from the wall and feed it to the rewired MES to hit and hold the set temp you entered.
> The Auber controller should hold temp dead on or within 1-2 degrees of the set temp.
> 
> This turns your smoker into a super precise beast!!! It would be 20x better than any smoker Masterbuilt produces even when brand new!!!
> 
> I always tell people it would be like turning a golf cart into a Ferrari. That is what you would be doing and for less money than buying a new smoker.
> The only sticking point is the Auber PID controller will run you $150 before shipping and tax, BUT that is way cheaper than a new smoker AND your smoker will be better than any electric smoker you could buy until you get around $1k+ and even then it would perform just as good or better than those.
> 
> Here's the PID controller I am talking about:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - $159.95 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry
> 
> 
> Auber Instruments, Inc. Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - The WS-1510ELPM is a versatile temperature controller to have in your home. It can be used for various applications such as Sous Vide cooking, controlling an electric smoker, making yogurt, dough proofing, controlling the...
> 
> 
> 
> www.auberins.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They make other fancier ones with wifi and phone apps, etc. but the one I posted is the bare bones one that would do the job. Anything less expensive may not cover your heating element power needs as well.
> 
> Ask any and all questions you have about the rewire and using an Auber PID controller.  I have a post that has a great amount of detail walking people through the process.
> 
> Finally, all of us rewired MES PID controller users wonder why we even debated it.  The performance of the smoker once doing this simply cannot be beat!
> 
> I hope this helps :)



looks like one of the resistor is fried, so I bet the relay will be gone too. I put a new spade on the wire, but still no current. Looks like a new board is out of the question, they don't make them anymore. 

Which Auber PID do I need? are there any guide on what to do?


----------



## mr_whipple

You can start here but I'm sure 

 tallbm
 will be along shortly. That and I might still have my old board.  https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/mes-rewire-simple-guide-no-back-removal-needed.267069/


----------



## tallbm

wakame said:


> looks like one of the resistor is fried, so I bet the relay will be gone too. I put a new spade on the wire, but still no current. Looks like a new board is out of the question, they don't make them anymore.
> 
> Which Auber PID do I need? are there any guide on what to do?



Yeah, no real luck with replacement boards unless someone here comes through with one and even then who knows if it will be fully compatible.  I think it would but you never know.

Here is a link to the lowest level Auber PID you could use:






						Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - $159.95 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry
					

Auber Instruments, Inc. Multi Purpose Controller [WS-1510ELPM] - The WS-1510ELPM is a versatile temperature controller to have in your home. It can be used for various applications such as Sous Vide cooking, controlling an electric smoker, making yogurt, dough proofing, controlling the...



					www.auberins.com
				




It will get the job done no problem. I always state that the instruction manual seems to have been written by a drunk 2nd grader but once you figure out what they are getting at (we can help) it's really just a few button presses to set temp and get going.

Others have gone with the Wifi version because it has easier interfaces to work with and they just set everything in the phone App instead of punching the button combos on the device. It's all up to you and what you want.



 mr_whipple
 has you covered with the link to the walk through for the rewire. Here it is again:
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/mes-rewire-simple-guide-no-back-removal-needed.267069/

Every detail and image you could ever want is in that post and lots of Q&A in the entire thread where people were rewiring due to situations similar to yours.

After reading that if 

 mr_whipple
 or anyone else has a board that may work you can that route but honestly, once you rewire for a PID you will never look back AND you can keep your smoker running through anything short of it being hit by a train :D
Also other benefits of using a PID is that you can do sausage and bacon smokes without ever worrying about temp swings.  You have precise control and hold over your smokers temp.  It's amazing!

Keep the questions coming and let us know how u plan to proceed :)


----------



## BurntWeenie

Well I guess I owned one of these at least I would now know that spending $150 is really a way to upgrade a less than robust design


----------



## tallbm

jliddil said:


> Well I guess I owned one of these at least I would now know that spending $150 is really a way to upgrade a less than robust design


Yeah that's basically the way to look at it.

The MES is very very strong when it comes to it's physical design, insulation, and ability.
They cut the corners on electrical connectors, switches, and electronics.
So rewiring and going with a PID controller keeps all of the superior aspects and then brings the control and electronics up to that same level. All for less than what a new smoker cost!

Yeah $150 is not cheap but it puts your MES operating in the category of $1k+ smokers that likely will not outperform the rewired MES with a PID.  The $1k+ smokers may have some more bells and whistles but they are add on's, not core features so they don't likely produce better bbq or performance.  Just maybe ease of use or things that "delight the customer".


----------



## mr_whipple

For what it's worth, I have the same board and it worked when I removed it. There's a pic in one of the MES PID threads..... but I'm lazy on a friday.  It's in great physical condition. The board shows no signs of heat etc.  Thought I tossed it a few weeks back. 

 wakame
 let me know if you want it, or if you're doing the PID thing it's a moot point.  I still have not completed my MES 40 project, but it's purely an issue with my external smoke generator, thread to follow in a few days.. The temp control from the Auber PID is ridiculously accurate.


----------



## mr_whipple

tallbm said:


> After reading that if
> 
> mr_whipple
> 
> 
> mr_whipple
> or anyone else has a board that may work you can that route but honestly, once you rewire for a PID you will never look back AND you can keep your smoker running through anything short of it being hit by a train :D


 Or hit by a 450 Bushmaster!!


----------



## tallbm

mr_whipple said:


> Or hit by a 450 Bushmaster!!


Hahah that might do it as well :D


----------



## Winterrider

I will start the chant. . . PID  PID  PID  
They are awesome with these MES units


----------



## tallbm

Winterrider said:


> I will start the chant. . . PID  PID  PID
> They are awesome with these MES units


Hahaha, our numbers continue to grow!!! :D


----------



## wakame

mr_whipple said:


> For what it's worth, I have the same board and it worked when I removed it. There's a pic in one of the MES PID threads..... but I'm lazy on a friday.  It's in great physical condition. The board shows no signs of heat etc.  Thought I tossed it a few weeks back.
> 
> wakame
> let me know if you want it, or if you're doing the PID thing it's a moot point.  I still have not completed my MES 40 project, but it's purely an issue with my external smoke generator, thread to follow in a few days.. The temp control from the Auber PID is ridiculously accurate.


I’m working through some testing. If I fail, I’ll reach out to you for sure.


----------



## wakame

Based on the DIY thread, does this look like the correct wires to connect to?


----------



## Ringer

wakame said:


> Based on the DIY thread, does this look like the correct wires to connect to?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 525577


If you are bypassing the controller then yes. Black to brown/red and white to brown/red.

This will give the element power when the smoker is plugged in. If you are using a pid then the pid will regulate the power.


----------



## wakame

Ringer said:


> If you are bypassing the controller then yes. Black to brown/red and white to brown/red.
> 
> This will give the element power when the smoker is plugged in. If you are using a pid then the pid will regulate the power.


Cool, it fires right up. Here come a new Aubrey PID controller.


----------



## wakame

Looking at the PID, is the multi purposes sufficient? Are there others that would be better?


----------



## Ringer

I got this one. It is their top of the line wifi model. I like it because I can use my phone to program and monitor it.






						WIFI Electric Smoker Controller, 1800 Watts [AW-1520H] - $219.99 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry
					

Auber Instruments, Inc. WIFI Electric Smoker Controller, 1800 Watts [AW-1520H] - Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! Holiday sale ends on 1/1/2023! This plug-and-play PID controller regulates the temperature of the electric smokers, such as Smokin-it®, Smokin Tex and Masterbuilt Smoker. This...



					www.auberins.com


----------



## wakame

Ringer said:


> I got this one. It is their top of the line wifi model. I like it because I can use my phone to program and monitor it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WIFI Electric Smoker Controller, 1800 Watts [AW-1520H] - $219.99 : Auber Instruments, Inc., Temperature control solutions for home and industry
> 
> 
> Auber Instruments, Inc. WIFI Electric Smoker Controller, 1800 Watts [AW-1520H] - Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! Holiday sale ends on 1/1/2023! This plug-and-play PID controller regulates the temperature of the electric smokers, such as Smokin-it®, Smokin Tex and Masterbuilt Smoker. This...
> 
> 
> 
> www.auberins.com


What’s the different between the probe? What the wall mount sensor?


----------



## Ringer

wakame said:


> What’s the different between the probe? What the wall mount sensor?


One is a longer probe for meat and the other is a shorter probe for cabinet temp but it comes with a rack mount. The wall mount isn't necessary it's just another probe that mounts in the cabinet wall.


----------



## tallbm

wakame said:


> Cool, it fires right up. Here come a new Aubrey PID controller.


Nice!  Glad u got it rewired and heating!

Yeah the multi purpose probe is the one to get with that less expensive unit. I didn't bother with installing a wall mount one. I like being able to move my probe (via a clip) to any rack level I am using, cannot do that with a fixed smoker probe :)

To me being able to move to rack level will always guarantee you the most accurate reading and best performance for holding temps since its always reading from meat level.

This is exciting! :D


----------

