# A Short Discourse on Preburning Wood



## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

*Preburning wood chunks for the purpose of smoking meats*

Many smaller smokers use either gas, charcoal, or electricity to produce fairly low cooking temps for the meat in the smoker. Wood chips/chunks are then added for the smoke flavoring their smoke imparts to said meat.

It is my contention that wood, especially used in small chunk form should be preburnt to a black near ash condition before inserting into the firebox for smoking in these smaller units.

As wood starts to burn, most of the nasty volatile types of chemicals contained in the wood are the first to get cooked off. 
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Here is an excerpt from http://www.woodheat.org/environment/smoke.htm

_As pollutants go, the story of wood smoke is an interesting one. Chemically speaking, wood is about half carbon and the rest is mostly made up of oxygen and hydrogen. When you heat up a piece of wood, it starts to smoke and turn black at the same time. This is because the other stuff vaporizes under intense heat faster than the carbon burns, so smoking leaves much of the carbon behind until only charcoal, which is just about pure carbon, is left. The smoke that vaporizes out of the wood is a cloud of nasty, gooey little droplets of a tar-like liquid. Chemically, these droplets are actually big, gooey, complicated hydrocarbon molecules that take a number of different forms, mostly bad. If you've followed the issue, you may have seen the list of fifty or so chemicals found in wood smoke. They all sound lethal, but it turns out that only a few are actually carcinogenic. Be aware, however, that the list is bogus because these are the chemicals that result from smoldering, not burning.

When you burn wood properly in a bright, hot, turbulent fire, what you see is the tar droplets rising off the wood into a zone of extreme heat where they re-vaporize, cracking into their basic, mostly gaseous, constituents, and oxidize. That is to say, they burn. You are left with carbon dioxide, some carbon monoxide and a number of other gases, water vapor and some not quite completely oxidized hydrocarbon bits. The bits are the particulate emissions that EPA regulates. When it comes to these sooty particulate emissions, of course, the fewer the better.

The complicated hydrocarbons that spew into the air as smoke from a smoldering wood fire are inherently unstable. And they stink. Hence their formal name: polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. As soon as the tarry droplets exit the chimney their more volatile gases start to evaporate and their chemical make-up changes. In the scheme of things these are heavy molecules so they eventually fall to ground. There, they mix with water and soil, transforming again as they blend into the background as humus. The key point is that while wood smoke is unhealthy to breathe in high concentrations, it is not poisonous to the environment._
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So, by preburning our chunks of wood, we are removing the chance of having these nasties included in our smokes, and foods.

What about stickburners you say? Well, a stickburner is ALOT bigger as far as fires go, and have a very high firebox temp due to a large bed of coals.They also have the ability due to size to support flames within the firebox and not go overboard on temperature in the cooking chamber. No person using one loads it up with new wood and lights it with food on the grates. They get a bed going, then add splits to the fire. The amount of fresh wood added is small compared to the amount of heat and oxygen available to more fully combust the bad products mentioned above. And the sheer amount of airflow/smokeflow thru these bigger units minimizes problems with the bad stuff that does manage to survive into the smoking chamber.
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Burning wood reference- http://van.physics.uiuc.edu/qa/listing.php?id=1535

F_or your questions of "what does fire consist of?" There are two components to a burning wood fire: the chemical reactions in the wood itself -- you see these as "hot coals", and the flames that leap above the burning wood. Oxygen in the air combines with the starches, sugars, and cellulose and proteins in the wood to make carbon dioxide, water vapor, and a variety of other compounds, depending on what the original wood was made of. Of these remainders, those that do not burn show up after the fire has burnt out as ash and soot, or creosote (although soot is only partly burned -- it can collect in a chimney and burn later if it is not swept away). The flame is the "afterburner" of the fire -- gases released by the burning wood which are still burning continue to do so as they rise above the wood. If you extinguish the flame but leave the coals burning, often a dense cloud of smoke rises above the coals. This is the stuff that the flames are finishing off._
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The smaller units cannot develop the high temps required to do this, hence the importance of a preburn. Yes, it does lead to faster wood consumption, but remember, if you can smell smoke, you are smoking. It is human nature to expect to SEE the smoke, but it's not really required. I usually add wood after about a half hour of NOT seeing smoke.

Just some things to ponder, and all except as noted are my opinion. Any contrary or complementary evidence is cheerfully encouraged!

R.T.


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## bertjo44 (Mar 14, 2008)

So another words, smoke good, yes? (said with a broken Eastern European accent).


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## smok'n steve (Mar 14, 2008)

Rich, 

I usually loose concentration if I have to read a huge blog, but, let me TELL ALL THOSE INTERESTED IN IMPROVING THEIR BURNS!!!!   THIS IS A MUST READ.  You did a great job explaining this and even though I could not put that in words like you did, I agree with all of it! 


POINTS!!!!!,  uhm Rich, I dunno how to give points?  Cobbler?


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

LOL... the little "scale" in the upper right corner of the post you wish to "point". And thank you for your support  :{)


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## smok'n steve (Mar 14, 2008)

Done Deal!!


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## lcruzen (Mar 14, 2008)

Very interesting post and must admit to ignorance on this subject. I've always just loaded the wood box on my GOSM and let it go. So this bares the question as how to effectively pre-burn the wood. Are we talking about using a propane tourch to scorch the out side of the wood or building a small fire in some type of container? How do you know when the wood is correctly pre-burned?

Lou


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## teeotee (Mar 14, 2008)

Well guess that answers about any questions about pre-burning. 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Very well done and researched, and does explain the odd tastes on some of my earlier smokes. 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





Do have a question for Rich tho, would a couple of chunks pre burn enough if put in a chimney with lump charcoal. Or would it be a better idea to use two chimneys, one for lump the other for wood chunks ?

Definitley points worthy post


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

I suppose as long as you get flames, and the wood charred up nicely... the chimney would work. Put the wood on top of course... maximum oxidizer <oxygen> contact for more complete combustion.

And thank you  :{)


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

I use my turkey fryer with a grate or my ECB firebowl set on it. Once the wood catches well, I turn off the gas. When I see very little flame left...just kinda dancing around on top... into the pit. Of course..I have lump in there for heat too.


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## bb53chevpro (Mar 14, 2008)

Thanks for all the info. Points for sure.  I will have to check, but I think i have a book that very similar info in. "Guide to Wood Heat" I think is the name of the book I have. Will have to dig it up.

Andy


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## ddave (Mar 14, 2008)

Richtee,

Very nicely written and informative. But now some questions from the really new . . . how would you recemmend it be done? Would putting a few chunks in a charcoal chimney with a piece of newspaper in the bottom work okay? Would you extinguish the flames at a certain point or let them die out on their own?

Thanks.

Dave

Edited:  Wow, a lot of activity between the time I started typing and hit Submit Reply.  It was already answered.  Now that's fast.


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## illini (Mar 14, 2008)

Sorry to be skeptical, but was invited to dissent in Rich's first post

Reading the quoted sites, it appeared to me, that the subject was about polluting the atmosphere with wood burning as the heating source for a home.  Did not read a warning about smoking or BBQ'n on either of the sites unless I missed it.

Thoughts:    Preburn a chunk of wood to where it appears black before putting it in the smoker.  Isn't the inside still rather "raw" and still full of the quoted "nasties"?

Preburn until the inside resembles the outside and I assume you have a chunk of lump charcoal?

I never wanted to create smoke in my smoker with lump charcoal.   Guess that is why they sell chips and chunks and instruct you to toss them into a heat source (like charcoal) to burn them.   Never read a mention of preburn on the bags!

Just my slant


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

As I posted, I burn till very little flame is supported. Hence the "nasties" are pretty much gone. And no, you do not have a chunk of lump charcoal. Close...but Lump is produced by burning off "nasties" in an oxygen deficient atmosphere. Almost all of what burns is "cooked" out of lump. That's why no flame is seen from it, just pretty much heat. We need SOME of the stuff that burns for flavor. Or should I say a more INTENSE smoked flavor.


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## moselle (Mar 14, 2008)

Good read Rich. Thanks for your posts. I really enjoy reading them. 
OT I think I did the points thing. How do I know if I did it right?


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

Thanks Mo. I don't think there's a feedback mechanisim for the points thing. You just assume they get there. That's one reason I always sign my points comments.. so folks know who they came from.


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## packplantpath (Mar 14, 2008)

This is essentially what I do as well.  It almost eliminates the chance of a major taste disaster (almost).  

So, I agree, preburn all the way.  It's the way we did whole hogs when I was a kid, but we also used only wood, no charcoal.


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## ibsmoking (Mar 14, 2008)

thanks for the great info, want about lump is it not what we are talking about please help me understand


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## ddave (Mar 14, 2008)

Marvin,

With all due respect, I never read a mention of baffles, smokestack extensions, tuning plates or charcoal baskets in the documentation that came with my Smoke n Pit.  But experiences talked about here shows that it will work a hell of a lot better with those items.

Dave


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## flash (Mar 14, 2008)

Interesting info. I have never messed with this, but recently I took my charcoal GOSM and put a gas burner plate in it to attempt a conversion to propane. I used a old can from some peaches to thrown on top of the burner and put the chunks in it. They did catch on fire, so to stop that I added a old skillet on top of plate with some sand in it. This time the wood did not catch fire, but when I would check on the wood, never did get ash, but charcoal looking chunks.
 Rich, would this be what I should smoke with? If I had left that wood in the can would it have eventually turned to ash??


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

It looks like pretty much what I would toss directly onto the coals now, Flash. And you'll get nothing but a bit of flame and thin blue..never the white.


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## flash (Mar 14, 2008)

Well, I will just save that stuff for my charcoal smokes........NOW, what do I do about my propane smokes??


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## walking dude (Mar 14, 2008)

rich.......i have a turkey fryer burner also........could you go abit more indepth on how you preburn..........i will be using my NEW sfb horz. for the first time either this weekend or next...........and was wondering how i was going to get coals first.........like what type of setup would i need to preburn........your turkey fryer option is interesting.........


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

Same thing as described. Like I mentioned you'll use more wood, but you'll like the flavor better. If ya use 2-3 chunks, toast up 5-6 and into the pan/pot/whatever. 

Hmm I wonder if you can leave them a bit less "done" for gas... the high heat right around the pan may be helping the cause. I dunno... hmmm.


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

Dude, I use small splits about 6" long and chop them to about 1" square. Stack 10-12 or so right over the flame on a spare grate, then let 'em cook down till flame is almost gone. This is the point that needs experimentin' still..see the propane post I just made. How far down to take them.


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

Sooo   who's gonna try this that does not already? Illini?  C'mon... what's to lose?


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## smokinit (Mar 14, 2008)

Nice Info I will be trying it with my Backwoods this weekend I have a weedburner that I will use to preburn the wood. Better Q is the name of the game.


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## bb53chevpro (Mar 14, 2008)

I will test this weekend on Saturday or Sunday by using preburnt chunks in my gosm BB. Want to cold smoke bacon. This is my plan.

Heat up the cast iron chip box with propane, light turkey burner with cast iron frying pan on it, lay in some cherry and hickory chunks. While these are flaming, put a few pieces of charcol in the chip bin. When chunks are ready, shut off propane, leave door open a minute to cool inside, place in chunks and see what happens.

Maybe a good idea if I did this for a few hours before I put in bacon.
Andy.

P.S. this will all depend on how my father-in-law is. (had heart-attach again today)

Andy.


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

Jeez... in my prayers tonight.


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## bb53chevpro (Mar 14, 2008)

Thnx Rich,
You think this will work????


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## richtee (Mar 14, 2008)

You mean the prayers? I KNOW it will help. The wood idea? Can't hurt eh?  :{)


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## devolutionist (Mar 15, 2008)

OK, I'm in the propane smoker's union, and after reading through this I too am left wondering how this will apply to what I do.  My primary issue seems to be I have to use chips - not chunks - which don't really lend themselves to preburning imho.  They'd just go up too quick.  Chunks just won't fit into my smoke box, which is only about 2in deep.

Probaby 8 times out of 10, the wood chips I use (which are soaked for an hour or two) don't ash.  At the end of the smoke I'm left with mostly charred up little black bits.  I haven't figured out yet what makes them ash sometimes - although it's gotta be either higher heat or less water soaked into the chips.

Perhaps I could try preburning chunks, and then not putting the lid on my smokebox?  I dunno - for some reason the little voice in my head says that's a bad idea.  

I've got a big smoke coming up in two weeks for my cub scout pack so maybe I'll try a dry run tomorrow and just see how it burns.  I'm willing to give it a try, but I'm a little nerveous about deviating from my "known good" when I'm cooking for a crowd of 150 or so.  I'll try to take some pics and post some results.


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## richtee (Mar 15, 2008)

I could ask no more than that...  and no...trials are not for parties.

 "Hey..I have 25 people coming over for ribs in 6 hours..how do I smoke them?"
Toss gasoline all over the place and light a match?


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## richtee (Mar 19, 2008)

Didja give it a run Andy?


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## teeotee (Mar 19, 2008)

I tried this out on Sunday. The chimney got the chunks going good with only two sheets of newpaper. 
I'd like to try again using some larger chunks. All i had was a bag of chunks from wally world. Some are a decent size, the majority were fairly small, 1" x 3" x 1/2". Also i may of let them burn a little long.  I did have a decent, not too thick stream of smoke coming out the smoker. And the boston butt tasted excellent (thanks to meowy for that sticky post).

There is a place about an hours drive that sells all kinds of smoking wood by the pound. May have a trip that way soon and pick up a variety of woods to experiment with.


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## richtee (Mar 19, 2008)

I appreciate the effort! Any emperical data I can gather either for or against is my aim. This is based on my experience/thought/research, and I wanna know if I went askew somewhere or not. Just my nature.

Thanks!  POINTS!


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## walking dude (Mar 19, 2008)

TOT.........as has been posted here alot........if you can SMELL smoke......you are fine

i had a uncle transplanted from merry ol.
but he has passed.......LOVED his accent.....but when he got excited.....couldn't understand a single word he said......heheeh, but he was a H*LL of a pinochle player.......


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## ron50 (Mar 19, 2008)

Well Rich, my apologies for not adding to this earlier, didn't see the post.

I tried Rich's idea of preburning. If you want to read about it in detail, here is the post http://smokingmeatforums.com/forums/...threadid=15057

To summarize:

You will use more wood, you lose alot during the preburn. I would recommend using big chunks, the smaller ones are just going to get consumed during the preburn.

I wouldn't wait till the entire fire is out. It's hard to judge but when I feel the wood isn't smoking heavy anymore, I toss the chimney full out into my smoke pit and separate them so the fire goes out quicker. This worked well for me.

The results were good. Easier keeping the smoke thin and blue, great flavor, good smoke ring, although the lump of hardwood charcoal I added to the wood tray may have helped as well.


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## richtee (Mar 19, 2008)

Thank YOU Ron... Points for the testing!  Er... tomarrow...<grumble>


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## navionjim (Mar 19, 2008)

Obviously you make some strong points here Rich for which I will gladly provide your rateings with another for your research and insight. All this conjecture being a wonderful thing, in another life I used to make my own charcoal for a completely different hobby of which you are well aware. And while I will surely try your pre-burning methods on my next smoke, I have to wonder; at what point in the conflagration of my rare and sought after smoking wood have I ceased to be smoking meat with wood and will have changed over to simply cooking with charcoal? 

That is, if I drive off all those "nasty volatiles" in a fire, aren't I just making charcoal? And wastefully little of that even because I'm losing so much mass of the original wood by doing this outside of a retort in an oxygen rich environment? In a way it seems as if I'll just end up cooking with charcoal while enjoying an expensive and rare wood fed campfire.
Jimbo


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## walking dude (Mar 19, 2008)

thank you jim.............i was afraid of stepping foward...........this last weekend.......i just put splits in the fire......i had nice TBS all smoke........NO BILLOWING WHITE SMOKE AT ALL...........i am wondering if the billowing white smoke is from green/wet wood..........

i was QUITE surprised with the thin blue i got..........with just raw wood


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## ron50 (Mar 19, 2008)

Steve:

I wasn't saying that I don't get tbs with raw wood, I just said it was easier to maintain the tbs with preburned wood. I've gotten white smoke frrom well seasoned wood although I'm sure green wood could do it too.

Jim:

My finshed product had plenty of smokey taste despite the fact that the wood was preburned. Didn't taste like it was just cooked on charcoal; had an excellent smokey taste. Had a hickory/pecan/cherry mix. 

Anything I can do to make the process healthier I am all for, especially when the finished product tasted just as good or better.


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## walking dude (Mar 19, 2008)

ron.........this was my first attempt using splits.....but i did a 7 hour smoke......and this first time......(i was prob. lucky maybe)......i had tbs all the way.......i was really surprised

now watch......next smoke i will get creosote like mad.......welcome to my world......

but with a lang........SHIRLEY you lang folks don't pre-burn?
and dont call me shirley.............LOL


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## richtee (Mar 19, 2008)

Therein lies the art, Sir. I cannot define the point..I just "know" when it's time to let it touch the meat. It's a qualitive analysis, not quantitive. When the flames are waxing, to be poetic.


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## richtee (Mar 19, 2008)

With a Lang..you have MUCH more latitude in the firebox. See my stickburner disclaimer.


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## ron50 (Mar 19, 2008)

Hey when the smoke goes well, it's all skill my friend all skill!!!


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## smok'n steve (Mar 20, 2008)

I haven't read all the replies here, but i do remember the first post.

I think it depends on what smoker you are using, the size of your firebox, and the bed of coals that exist----there are variables---common sense comes into play here.

  It also is an experience thing, you know when you overload your firebox and your coals are working to hard to attack the next log, because you can see that your temp dropped and your smoke has changed for the worse.

  If you read Richtees first post carefully, you will be able to get a good feel for what he's talking about.

  It may be as simple as pre-heating a small stick on top of your firebox, or it may be that you have to pre-burn because you don't have the flow and heat to pre-vaporize the heebeejeebees------your smoker will tell you, just listen:-)

Steve


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## teeotee (Mar 20, 2008)

Just to throw another variable into Steve's equation is the wood you are using. 

We have a wood stove in our living room. Some woods will burn a lot easier than others, even pieces from the same section of tree will burn differently.

WD was using ash in his smoke. This is the same wood i got recently for our wood stove. This stuff will burn good and hot without seasoning, as long as we have a good bed of coals. Others will just sit and smolder.

Richtee's pre burning would definitely remove that element and you will be sure of having minimal nasties on your food.


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## smok'n steve (Mar 20, 2008)

I agree with Teeotee:-)

If I have a stick with ice on it, I will pre-heat it on top of my firebox.  Before I did the mods to my Baby warmer/grill, it had a small firebox(too small) that I always had to pre-burn in order to get good smoke.  Yes, different wood acts differently too---there are a lot of variables that can change your results.

  Pre-burning is the safest way to get foolproof results keeping in mind that experience and common sense can help decrease your work load(to pre-burn or not) depending on  those variables---smoker type, amount of heat/coals,moist or dry wood, type of wood, airflow, what temperature your at, etc, etc:-)


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## js0828 (Apr 21, 2008)

Hi guys,

A few quick questions:

1.) I have seen a gadget for sale that soaks wood chunks.  What does soaking do for you, and is it required if you want a good smoke?

2.) Is there much difference between using regular charcoal or something like Cowboy?

3.) I am going to install a probe thermometer.  Any suggestions on how to install it to obtain an accurate reading in my smoke chamber?

THANKS!


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## ron50 (Apr 21, 2008)

A gadget to do what a bowl of water and a cover can do? Soaking wood is a hot topic as to whether it serves a purpose. After doing both ways I came to the conclusion that it doesn't really matter.

cowboy has a less then stellar reputation as to the quality and the low amount of heat it geenrates. I would suggest Royal Oak or something like it if you want to use lump.

Can really offer advice on probe placement since we don't know waht type of smoker you have.


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## js0828 (Apr 21, 2008)

I have a brand new ECB!  

Thanks


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## mavrick813 (Jun 18, 2008)

How about Taking your chunks and putting them in an old dutch oven and cooking them over a flame until they are blackened well. That should cook out the nasties quite well I'd think.

Mike


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## richtee (Jun 18, 2008)

You would be very close to making lump charcoal.

Lump is make by heating wood in a minimally vented vessel <retort> until no visible smoke issues from the vent. Then the vent is plugged to prevent oxygen from entering until cool.


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## teeotee (Jun 18, 2008)

Rich, just wanted to say ..... my last smoke i had left my bag of wood chunks outside and they'd been rained on for a week or so. I preburned them in an old charcoal chimney sitting on top a turkey fryer burner. Worked real good, had perfect tbs. Tried throwing some chunks in the sfb from a new bag of chunks. Still had white smoke for 10 minutes when they first went in. Even with a good hot bed of coals and vents wide open on a windy day. 

So most of my chunks were pre burned that day. Just wanted to pass that on.


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## richtee (Jun 18, 2008)

Thanks Tee..I appreciate the info!  Of course you probably went thru a little more wood, but as ya have gained experience you have found you don't need to SEE the smoke all the time  :{)


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