# First Cure .... Did I use too much PINK SALT?



## mrmilkman

Hello all!

So it's been 7 days in the cure, 1 day drying in the fridge and just threw it on the weber smoking at 200•degrees.

After reading about pink salt #1 here in the forums I'm worried I used too much. *Is it safe to eat?*

1.58 lbs pork belly skinned to 3/4 teaspoon pink salt #1. I read this is twice the amount of Prague powder for a belly this size.
(I know the belly is super small but it's the biggest I could get from my butcher that day)

Below are pics of the belly just before going into the smoker. Meat looks very red.













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__ mrmilkman
__ Oct 19, 2015


















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__ mrmilkman
__ Oct 19, 2015






Any advice would be great thank you!

MY CURE:

1.58 pound pork belly

1/2 cup dark brown sugar 

1 tablespoon course ground black pepper

2 tablespoons kosher salt 

1 tablespoon organic molasses 

3/4 teaspoon pink cure salt #1


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## dirtsailor2003

That's almost enough cure for 5 pounds of meat. You should really weigh your cure when doing a dry rub cure. This calculator will get you the correct amounts.

http://diggingdogfarm.com/page2.html

Posts brine is another method you can try that doesn't require weighing the meat or cure.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/110799/pops6927s-wet-curing-brine


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## daveomak

When dry rub curing a belly, 200 Ppm nitrite is allowable... 67% more than when in a brine solution..   AND since you cooked it at a high temperature, quite a lot of nitrite will have dissipated...  It should be fine to eat...

How long did you let the curing mix work on the meat...  should have been about 12-14 days in the refer....

Dirt is right on about getting a small electronic scale.....   about $10......














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__ daveomak
__ Oct 20, 2015


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## chef jimmyj

More than you need but not toxic levels and as Dave pointed out the hot smoke will help reduce what's there...JJ


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## mrmilkman

Thanks for jumping in guys....

Was super disappointed and definitely will not make that mistake again. 

Buying the scale...trying again. 

Below are pics of the belly out of the smoker and a few slices in. It looked more cooked than expected, must have been the size. 













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__ mrmilkman
__ Oct 21, 2015


















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__ mrmilkman
__ Oct 21, 2015


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## mrmilkman

One last thing @DaveOmak  you said to leave the cure for 12-14 days. Every recipe I've seen for bacon says 7 days in the fridge....Do you have a recipe you;d like to share?

thanks!


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## wade

mrmilkman said:


> 1.58 lbs pork belly skinned to 3/4 teaspoon pink salt #1. I read this is twice the amount of Prague powder for a belly this size.
> 
> (I know the belly is super small but it's the biggest I could get from my butcher that day)
> 
> Below are pics of the belly just before going into the smoker. Meat looks very red.
> 
> Any advice would be great thank you!
> 
> MY CURE:
> 
> 1.58 pound pork belly (717 g)
> 
> 1/2 cup dark brown sugar (100 g)
> 
> 1 tablespoon course ground black pepper
> 
> 2 tablespoons kosher salt (36 g)
> 
> 1 tablespoon organic molasses (20 g)
> 
> 3/4 teaspoon pink cure salt #1 (4.27 g - 4 g Salt and 0.27 g Nitrite)


From what you wrote it is not absolutely clear if you were dry curing or immersion brining. If you were immersion curing then we would need to know the amount of water used in the brine to calclulate the likely residual Nitrite but if you were dry curing then we can easily calculate the maximum.

Assuming you were dry curing - (I have added the metric weight conversions to your quote above and am making the assumption that your cure contained 6.25% Nitrite)

If you did not pour away any of the resulting brine during the curing period you would end up with a theoretical maximum of 349 Ppm Nitrite. In practice the end result will actually be less than this (~300 Ppm as not all of it is taken up). If you did pour away the brine as it was forming then this value will me considerably lower.

It is likely that the resulting Nitrite in your bacon was on the high side, however as both JJ and Dave say it is very unlikely to be toxic if eaten in normal quantities - especially after the hot smoking. You may not find it particularly pleasant to eat though as the amount of salt you added was also high (~6%). This will depend on your liking of salt in food though.


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## wade

mrmilkman said:


> One last thing @DaveOmak  you said to leave the cure for 12-14 days. Every recipe I've seen for bacon says 7 days in the fridge....Do you have a recipe you;d like to share?
> 
> thanks!


When dry curing bacon, within reason, it is not possible to over cure as the required amount of cure is calculated and added at the beginning. The length of time it takes for the cure to penetrate will depend on the thickness of the meat (belly will take less time than loin). Some on here calculate the time required in days per inch of meat thickness, however I simply leave mine in the cure for 14 days regardless of the meat cut.

I know Dave has some good bacon recipes he can share and you may also find one of my recent posts in this thread helpful http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/235995/first-attempt-at-bacon#post_1471446

Dave and Dirt mentioned the need for scales - I totally agree. It is important to weigh the ingredients accurately rather than use volume measures. The weight of a cup of coarse salt will be different to a cup of fine table salt.

Ideally the cure should really be weighed in grams to 2 decimal places, however you can get away with scales that only go to 1.


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## smokin monkey

Agree with all of the above, the only way to go is accurate measuring of ingridients.


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## daveomak

mrmilkman said:


> One last thing @DaveOmak
> you said to leave the cure for 12-14 days. Every recipe I've seen for bacon says 7 days in the fridge....Do you have a recipe you;d like to share?
> 
> thanks!



No problem.....  The way I make my bacon....  YMMV...

Dry rubbed bacon...    cure #1 at a rate of


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## smokin phil

.


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## wade

Smokin Phil said:


> Wade,
> Just curious as to why have a scale with 2 decimal places. Assuming reasonable accuracy and what we're using it for, I thought 1/10th of a gram was good enough accuracy? Even for pink salt. Now, if you're curing 4oz. Of meat at a time, yeah. Lol....


That is the reason. Sometimes you may be curing 5 kilos of bacon but other times it may be a single duck breast. Being able to weigh your cure to 2dp gives you that flexibility. For bacon though you really only need to go to 1.


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## wade

DaveOmak said:


> reduce the cure by 10% if you leave the skin on... cure doesn't absorb into skin... for that reason I skin the bellies before curing


Great looking Bacon Dave 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Yes I had heard that and assumed it to be true. It is mentioned in the USDA Processing Inspectors Calculation Handbook, although I understand that even the USDA now no longer know where some of this information originated from. When I did my bacon curing comparative tests last October I also tested this statement and cured a batch of skin in exactly the same was as I cured the bacon. When the Lab tests came back the skin had actually absorbed the cure to the same extent as the meat. OK, my tests used immersion curing and this is dry curing so there mat be a difference, though I think that is unlikely.

Like you I skin my bellies before curing too - or more precisely I get my butcher to do it for me.


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## daveomak

Wade, so you are saying the USDA's information is wrong based on your tests ???

Thanks, I'll stick with the USDA.....


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## wade

Hi Dave

No - just that some of DDFs curing circle of friends have followed up the curing methods in the handbook with the USDA and the USDA have officially confirmed that all of the people that were involved in originally creating (and also with the last updating the handbook) are no longer around and none of the supporting documentation still exists. They say that it was created over 20 years ago for the purpose of standardising inspection methods and not for use as a curing textbook. Unofficially they have also said that some of the assumptions in the book have just continued to be used without them actually having been confirmed as accurate. My lab tests appear to support that they may not be.

Anyway, by removing the skin as we both do this point is actually academic. Even if you left the skin on, by staying withing recognised limits whether you adjust by 10% or not will not affect the overall safety of the end product.

Cheers

Wade


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## mrmilkman

Thanks everyone, and yes Dave your bacon looks to be perfection. However, it's a bit more than I am willing to invest...let's see maybe one day I'll follow your footsteps. 

I've been dry curing and will try both to see if I like immersion better. If anyone has any opinions I'd love to hear this vs. that. 

Buying a 10lb slab next week so I can test some rubs and see how it goes. After all, I'll have to wait another 2 weeks for good 'ol homemade bacon!

thanks

m


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## westby

I use the amazingribs recipe with good results.  For every 1 lb of belly, it calls for:

1 1/2 t kosher salt

1/2 t cure #1

1 1/2 t ground black pepper

2 T dark brown sugar

1/4 cup distilled water.

Works like a charm.  I cure for 8-10 days.  Rinse off bellies really well, add more ground pepper and then smoke at 180 until I hit an IT of 140-145.  Let sit for a day and slice.


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## smokin phil

westby said:


> I use the amazingribs recipe with good results.  For every 1 lb of belly, it calls for:
> 1 1/2 t kosher salt
> 1/2 t cure #1
> 1 1/2 t ground black pepper
> 2 T dark brown sugar
> 1/4 cup distilled water.
> 
> Works like a charm.  I cure for 8-10 days.  Rinse off bellies really well, add more ground pepper and then smoke at 180 until I hit an IT of 140-145.  Let sit for a day and slice.



Is this basically a wet/brine cure then?


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## westby

Smokin Phil said:


> Is this basically a wet/brine cure then?


Yes.  I triple the recipe, put 3lb sections of the belly in a Ziploc bag and turn over every day or so.


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## smokin phil

.


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## westby

I understand the price issue, but it is so much better than store bought.


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## crankybuzzard

Smokin Phil said:


> I just wish I could get bellys for something resembling affordable. When I can buy Oscar Meyer bacon for about half the price of raw belly...... Well, not gonna do that. My BBB is great though!!


Where are you buying the belly at?  I've found that Asian markets tend to have good prices on belly and it's good stuff as well.  A lot of butcher shops have figured out that like brisket, we want the other "cheap" cuts and will pay for it.


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## smokin phil

.


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## chef jimmyj

Phil...Oldtime Meat and Deli should have bellies but judging from their Bundle prices, are not cheap. How about Far East Grocer and AMKO Asian Foods, they should have bellies at better prices. Is Restaurant Depot on 1030 W Division St, Chicago too far? You need a Tax ID/Business licence or KCBS Membership to get in. You may have friends that can help, my daughter's boyfriend shops there on the Tax ID of his boss' Towing Biz...JJ


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## louis gilbert

Quite happy to have stumble on this thread, as I'm second-guessing mysel for a week or so... I've made bacon before, but this time, since I had some basic dry cure not doing anything, I've decided to follow Rhulman & Polcyn instructions. 

Using the salt-box method, I've cured about 3 kg of side, cut in 4 parts (each in its own bag). I've weigted the dry cure before and after, and found that I've used about 180 g of dry cure mix for my 3 kg of meat, dredged one piece at a time in the mix. That amount to about 14 g of pink salt, to a concentration of 292 ppm... that is, if the mix was constant throught the 4 pieces.

I've found it curious at first, then thought it ok, but a voice in the back of my head keep coming back: that's too much...

I'm smoking it this afternoon... should I just throw it out?

I guess not - after all, I just followed the instructions from the book... But I'm still a bit unsure. I know that this book have some problems, but still...


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## daveomak

Louis Gilbert said:


> Quite happy to have stumble on this thread, as I'm second-guessing mysel for a week or so... I've made bacon before, but this time, since I had some basic dry cure not doing anything, I've decided to follow Rhulman & Polcyn instructions.
> 
> Using the salt-box method, I've cured about 3 kg of side, cut in 4 parts (each in its own bag). I've weigted the dry cure before and after, and found that I've used about 180 g of dry cure mix for my 3 kg of meat, dredged one piece at a time in the mix. That amount to about 14 g of pink salt, to a concentration of 292 ppm... that is, if the mix was constant throught the 4 pieces.
> 
> I've found it curious at first, then thought it ok, but a voice in the back of my head keep coming back: that's too much...
> 
> I'm smoking it this afternoon... should I just throw it out?
> 
> I guess not - after all, I just followed the instructions from the book... But I'm still a bit unsure. I know that this book have some problems, but still...


Congrats on taking the time to weigh stuff out and do the calculations...   Very scientific and the proper way to do stuff...

Louis, morning...   A bit too much...   200 Ppm nitrite max. ingoing, used in a dry rub, is for commercial applications selling to the public...    when you cook it, the nitrite level will be reduced...

Once cured, if you dry it and let it age for a week or two, in the refer on wire racks, the nitrite level will also lower a bit...  I age my belly bacon for 7 days after the cure step, and again for another 7 days, after the smoke... 28-30 days in all... 

May I suggest, next go 'round, you weigh the slab and the appropriate amount of cure for each piece....  add the required amount of salt and sugar and what ever else you will add, and cure each piece individually...  

The "BOX" method is for those curing hundreds of pounds of meat....   then all the meat is thrown into a lug or tub or rack...   it's a FAST way to process the meat... and it's not very accurate...

FWIW, I cure my bacon, with a dry rub, and usually shoot for around 150 ish Ppm...   Brined belly nitrite limits are 120 Ppm nitrite...  same deal.... that's for commercial producers selling to the public.....


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## louis gilbert

Thanks for the fast reply!

Yeah, I would normally weight everything down according to the weight of the meat. I'm not exactly sure what went throught my mind doing it this way last week. I guess it went something like "well, let's try it like they say anyway" - and then, had some doubt.

I know, yet I don't understand, that there are such - let's say - imprecisions in Charcuterie. I don't want to critic the book - I know it's been done to death, and I have to say I still love it, but it's just curious that some of the pink salt usage is inconsistent, without explanation.

Anyway, here mine after about 3hr of smoke. I've done nature and peppery bacon.













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__ louis gilbert
__ Feb 18, 2016


















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__ Feb 18, 2016


















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__ louis gilbert
__ Feb 18, 2016


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## jpgauthi79

Dave, I noticed in your pics that you smoke the bellies with the fat down. Can you give me some insight on that?


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## daveomak

jpgauthi79 said:


> Dave, I noticed in your pics that you smoke the bellies with the fat down. Can you give me some insight on that?


Never noticed ????  Guess I like the pretty side up...


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## jpgauthi79

That's good enough for me!


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