# Meat grinder questions



## newbrian (Dec 1, 2022)

I currently use a Kitchen aide with the grinder attachement to grind meat for sausage.  I have noticed that the more meat I grind in a session, I will start to get a black color coming on some of the meat, like grease?  Once i'm done i can see that the color is concentrated in the center of the grinder plates.  I'm not sure if this is metal wearing off of the plates and blades durning grinding, or if is grease from the gears of the motor (but highly doubtful as i don't really see any grease leaking anywhere)

So my question is, has anyone experienced this problem and is it only with Kitchen aide?  Should I consider buying like an LEM grinder or something like that?

Thank you for your help, I always get good advice from this forum.


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## smokerjim (Dec 1, 2022)

I think fat gets wrapped around the end of the worm and blade and is breaking down from being rotated agaist the plate so much which makes like a dark colored slime in the middle if plate like you describe. Maybe try cleaning worm,knife and plate when this starts and see if it goes away then you'll know if that is where your problem is. Hope this makes sense to you.


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## newbrian (Dec 1, 2022)

smokerjim said:


> I think fat gets wrapped around the end of the worm and blade and is breaking down from being rotated agaist the plate so much which makes like a dark colored slime in the middle if plate like you describe. Maybe try cleaning worm,knife and plate when this starts and see if it goes away then you'll know if that is where your problem is. Hope this makes sense to you.


that's a good idea, thank you


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## tbern (Dec 1, 2022)

newbrian said:


> I currently use a Kitchen aide with the grinder attachement to grind meat for sausage.  I have noticed that the more meat I grind in a session, I will start to get a black color coming on some of the meat, like grease?  Once i'm done i can see that the color is concentrated in the center of the grinder plates.  I'm not sure if this is metal wearing off of the plates and blades durning grinding, or if is grease from the gears of the motor (but highly doubtful as i don't really see any grease leaking anywhere)
> 
> So my question is, has anyone experienced this problem and is it only with Kitchen aide?  Should I consider buying like an LEM grinder or something like that?
> 
> Thank you for your help, I always get good advice from this forum.


if you are doing a lot of grinding, it wouldn't hurt to consider getting a better grinder for yourself to use.


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## newbrian (Dec 1, 2022)

tbern said:


> if you are doing a lot of grinding, it wouldn't hurt to consider getting a better grinder for yourself to use.


I usually do about 12-15lbs in a batch.  I would like a bigger one but not sure it is worth it for me as i make sausage only 3 or 4 times a year.


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## halleoneagain (Dec 1, 2022)

newbrian said:


> Should I consider buying like an LEM grinder


I use my KA occasionally if I just want to grind up a single pork patty for dinner, it's lighter and easier to use for such a small job.  For my very small-scale sausage making I haul out the LEM #5 (which weighs something like 30 pounds).  It's their smallest one, but it does everything I want/need it to, and I am very happy with it.


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## chopsaw (Dec 1, 2022)

newbrian said:


> I have noticed that the more meat I grind in a session, I will start to get a black color coming on some of the meat, like grease?




 smokerjim
 has good advice . I have a manual crank no. 8 that does the same thing . It's cast iron with the cheaper coating on it ( not shiny ) . 
I think in my case it's from the friction of the parts rubbing together .


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## poacherjoe (Dec 1, 2022)

Try semi freezing the meat first . And keep watching Marketplace for a deal on a bigger grinder .


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## sandyut (Dec 1, 2022)

I picked up a Kitchener #8 I think a few years back.  It’s worked good for me.  They ahve since upgraded the united to all stainless from plastic it look like and the $$ has increased.  I go the old plastic version for about $100.


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## newbrian (Dec 1, 2022)

Thank you guys for the information.


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## indaswamp (Dec 1, 2022)

Don't over tighten the head of the grinder. You want it snug, but too much pressure leads to too much friction which created heat and melts the fat. The melted fat picks up the metal from the friction and turns grey (or black ir using cast iron plate and knives). Also be sure your fat is 30-32*F before grinding, this is very important for a good grind.


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## indaswamp (Dec 1, 2022)

for 15# with a kitchenade....I suggest grinding in 2 batches. leave 1/2 the meat in the freezer while you grind the first half since a kitchenade is slow.


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## SmokinEdge (Dec 1, 2022)

^^^^^^^^^^I agree with Inda, I have a LEM Big Bite grinder and every time I grind meat for burger and am in a hurry and don’t par freeze the meat I get that black stuff in the center of the plate From the fat being to warm. When I make sausage or salami I always par freeze the meat and never see the black stuff. I’ve seen the black stuff with other grinders as well but always when the meat was cold but not par froze, I believe this to be a very important step to a quality grind. Plus the slightly frozen meat keeps the knife, plate and auger very cold this is important for a premium grind and particle definition.


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## sandyut (Dec 1, 2022)

I too agree with 

 indaswamp
 .  If you overtighten the head it will cause all kinds of issues.  On my kitchener I can hear the motor strain Before adding the meat.  Very bad.


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## slavikborisov (Dec 1, 2022)

I have the lem #32 grinder and brand new out the box I did 80+lb of meat and it’s due to not having the meat cold enough and the fat and friction turning it that color..
Things that helped was lubricanting all parts with like a Pam spray and making sure meat was partial Frozen I made a post about it thinking it was metal shavings but it happens to a lot of people and it’s not a big deal just lube your parts and keep the meat cold


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## Dave in AZ (Dec 1, 2022)

newbrian
 the black is metal wearing that gets mixed into fat at shaft.  Usually it is aluminum oxide on those KA grinders, which almost immediately forms on all exposed aluminum as a protective oxide.  When rubbed off in fat, it is black.  On steel ones such as LEM, it is black rust:
Iron (II)oxide – Fe3O4 (limited oxygen)​Rust from Iron (III) oxides with limited oxygen and low moisture results in black rust.
While there are 20 KA grinders on Amazon all claiming to be stainless, virtually NONE of them are, if you read the 1 star reviews they all are other metals in one part or another.  After days of reading reviews for every KA grinder on Amazon, I have found only one single place that actually sells a 100% stainless product.
Smokehousechef.com has it on their front page, on sale for $159.  If you don't buy a dedicated grinder, that is the one I would get.


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## slavikborisov (Dec 1, 2022)

Dave in AZ said:


> newbrian
> the black is metal wearing that gets mixed into fat at shaft.  Usually it is aluminum oxide on those KA grinders, which almost immediately forms on all exposed aluminum as a protective oxide.  When rubbed off in fat, it is black.  On steel ones such as LEM, it is black rust:
> Iron (II)oxide – Fe3O4 (limited oxygen)​Rust from Iron (III) oxides with limited oxygen and low moisture results in black rust.
> While there are 20 KA grinders on Amazon all claiming to be stainless, virtually NONE of them are, if you read the 1 star reviews they all are other metals in one part or another.  After days of reading reviews for every KA grinder on Amazon, I have found only one single place that actually sells a 100% stainless product.
> Smokehousechef.com has it on their front page, on sale for $159.  If you don't buy a dedicated grinder, that is the one I would get.



D
 Dave in AZ
 mine has an upgrade stainless plate and knife and I would still get it are you saying it should be eliminated if everything is stainless?


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## Dave in AZ (Dec 1, 2022)

slavikborisov said:


> D
> Dave in AZ
> mine has an upgrade stainless plate and knife and I would still get it are you saying it should be eliminated if everything is stainless?


No not at all ;) If you're happy with it, and it works, then great!
However, you will see the same story again and again from many here-- an initial equipment purchase going for lowest entry cost, rapidly followed by purchasing higher quality equipment.  Most folks will therefore say to buy once, cry once, and get the highest quality you can afford.

This thread was about the black residue that comes off grinders.  There is a little from all of them, but much less from stainless steel than anything else, and a LOT from cheap metal KA grinders from China.  My point was just that IF someone decided to stick with a KA grinder, then the best one to get is a 100% stainless.  And I did the 20 hours of research reading all reviews to find the best one-- use that info as you will.  Some folks will find it helpful.

I bought a $65 "top end" KA grinder that had best reviews on Amazon... it was manufactured wrong and was 2 thousandths too large, and would not fit any of my Kitchenaids, 4.5 qt, 6 qt, or 4 qt.  Supposedly it was stainless... but no, the insides weren't. Had I known about this 100% stainless one, I would STILL be using it instead of my $500 #22 grinder, probably.  They are nice for smaller batches.


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## slavikborisov (Dec 1, 2022)

Dave in AZ said:


> No not at all ;) If you're happy with it, and it works, then great!
> However, you will see the same story again and again from many here-- an initial equipment purchase going for lowest entry cost, rapidly followed by purchasing higher quality equipment.  Most folks will therefore say to buy once, cry once, and get the highest quality you can afford.
> 
> This thread was about the black residue that comes off grinders.  There is a little from all of them, but much less from stainless steel than anything else, and a LOT from cheap metal KA grinders from China.  My point was just that IF someone decided to stick with a KA grinder, then the best one to get is a 100% stainless.  And I did the 20 hours of research reading all reviews to find the best one-- use that info as you will.  Some folks will find it helpful.
> ...



D
 Dave in AZ
 i got ya! Yeah I was gonna ask
what would be my next options if my stainless knives and plates will give me the same issues because I automatically bought the extra stainless stuff due to reviews saying rusting of parts on the OEM stuff


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## Dave in AZ (Dec 1, 2022)

S
 slavikborisov
 I just wouldn't worry about it, everything makes a bit of that black.  Follow procedures folks gave above to minimize it, so well frozen chilled meat and fat, grinder not too tight, lube knife/plate before use.


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## newbrian (Dec 2, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> ^^^^^^^^^^I agree with Inda, I have a LEM Big Bite grinder and every time I grind meat for burger and am in a hurry and don’t par freeze the meat I get that black stuff in the center of the plate From the fat being to warm. When I make sausage or salami I always par freeze the meat and never see the black stuff. I’ve seen the black stuff with other grinders as well but always when the meat was cold but not par froze, I believe this to be a very important step to a quality grind. Plus the slightly frozen meat keeps the knife, plate and auger very cold this is important for a premium grind and particle definition.


Ok that's good info, I didn't realize i needed to have the meat as cold as possible.  Thank you so much!


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## indaswamp (Dec 2, 2022)

newbrian said:


> I didn't realize i needed to have the meat as cold as possible.


Actually, you can have the meat TOO cold... 28-32*F is the range you are shooting for, any colder than that and it will be too hard. Also, it helps to cut the fat chunks so that they will easily fit in the space of your auger head...takes a lot of pressure off your grinder.


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## old sarge (Dec 2, 2022)

It never hurts to keep the metal lubed with a food grade lube. I use petro gel on my equipment.  Lightly!  Someone on the forum recommended it. Cannot remember who.


			https://www.amazon.com/Pack-Petrol-Grade-Equipment-LubricantNSF/dp/B00X4N3SLI/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=food+grade+grease&qid=1670032789&sr=8-3


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## boykjo (Dec 3, 2022)

newbrian said:


> I currently use a Kitchen aide with the grinder attachement to grind meat for sausage.  I have noticed that the more meat I grind in a session, I will start to get a black color coming on some of the meat, like grease?


Ive seen this with my hand crank grinder for years. It comes from the center nub of the screw where it goes through the plate. Just wipe it away as you go along....... I no longer see it with my all stainless steel grinder.  

Boykjo


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## Bigtank (Dec 3, 2022)

I lube the parts that come into contact with food with a little Crisco before I start.  It works for me and I'm not eating anything I don't know what is.


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## old sarge (Dec 3, 2022)

I hadn't thought about Crisco. That make a ton of sense!


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