# Costco bellies....  THANKS for the lead on that..... Dry brined bacon Aug. 2015... 8/23 money update



## daveomak

After reading about Costco having pork belly, and doing my yearly shopping trip yesterday, I found them and they are gorgeous....  perfectly skinned about 4000% better than I can do.... only thing is we won't have cracklins...

These dry-brined bellies are rubbed with a commercial cure blend of 85% salt, 0.75% nitrite and the rest, I assume, is maple sugar of some sort and anti caking agents etc.....  The manufacturer recommends a 2% addition of the cure to the meat.....

The bellies all weighed in at 8#'s give or take....   Soooo,  8# x 454 x 0.02 = about 7.5 grams of cure added to each belly....   divided up between each side and rubbed into the meat....  and stacked on plastic screens for liquid movement and uniform distribution of cure etc. during the curing time....   screens bottom, top and in between the slabs with a weight on top...

Curing time will be about 14 days +/- .....  I prefer the longer curing time so equalization of stuff into the meat will happen...  more uniform distribution...  thorough distribution....  etc....   I will rotate/turn the bellies every few days...

The bellies fit perfectly into my curing tubs...  so I decided to do a dry brine this time....   I've still got about 40#'s of sliced bacon from my last batch....   OH WELL !!!!   

Not only were bellies on my to look at list, but Chuck Primal was also....    Picked up a beautiful 19# primal...   No pics sorry....   but I sliced it up into 2 small roasts and 10 steaks...   vac-packed and in the freeze box....   A good deal at $3.29 for Choice chuck....  I'm thinking I'll smoke the roasts and slice / vac-pack for sammies....   Also did that to a pork loin...  2 roasts will be cured for American/Canadian bacon....  bunch of steaks....  all the meat was pre seasoned with Montreal Steak, because I did pork loin steaks like that last month, and they were the best loin steaks we have had..


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## bmudd14474

Looks like a great start. I thought they looked great too when I saw them. There will be some in my cart next payday.


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## pc farmer

Watching this


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## daveomak

bmudd14474 said:


> Looks like a great start. I thought they looked great too when I saw them. There will be some in my cart next payday.



Morning Brian....     They are beauties....   all trimmed up and skinned...  I think the price is equal to or better than bellies at $1.79...   having to skin and trim.... although the trimmed meat is awesome in Char Sui...   We will miss that...   belly meat is soooo good...  anyway you fix it...


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## daveomak

c farmer said:


> Watching this



I'll be back....    BUT....   don't hold your breath....    gonna be awhile...


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## hoity toit

I'll be watching this thread as well..,funny ...I went to restaurant Depot this morning and bought a case of bellies myself.I get back home and see Dave beat me to the punch already..  Dave do make your bacon sweet or regular ???? Just wondering..?

HT


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## daveomak

HT, Afternoon.....  I use this commercial Maple Sugar cure, I got it from my meat dude....  85% salt, 0.75% nitrite and ~14% other stuff....  I think it's maple sugar stuff and maybe some "cure accelerator" like ascorbate or erthorbate at around .5 - .7 grams per Kg....  commercial folks usually add that stuff but I don't have a label for the cure....  My meat dude just "GAVE" me about 10#'s of the cure in a plastic bag...   maybe even some phosphates, for water retention, to increase the products retail profit..    

I just turned the meat...  considering there's 24#'s of belly, there is only "MAYBE" 3 TBS of liquid that has been sucked out of the meat...

I definitely know these bellies are not enhanced....     "That's a good thing"...   

 I tried the "sweet" cure by adding more sugar etc. but it burned in the fry pan....    don't care for that......   

What I do like is, when bride bakes the rashers on a cooling rack on a sheet pan, she spread some fresh maple syrup, I just made, on them...    after about  3/4 cooking time so it doesn't burn...  it caramelizes into a crispy maple glaze...  knock your socks off...  now that's sweet bacon to die for....


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## mneeley490

Dave, 

Glad you were able to take advantage of the Costco belly. I bought some myself, but they're in the freezer, waiting for some cooler weather, as I like to air dry in the garage after curing. They would render all over the floor out there now.

Looking forward to seeing how yours turn out.


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## daveomak

I usually do them in the fall or winter....  BUT I thought it would be nice to do fresh bellies.....     I may not be able to "cold" smoke these...  Temps been running 100's to 70's at night....   maybe I'll get lucky....   right now it's 85 at 8:30.....    I suppose I could freeze them for a month or so....   I'll have to play it by "weather" I guess....    I really like the "below 70" cold smoke on the bacon....


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## hoity toit

DaveOmak said:


> HT, Afternoon..... I use this commercial Maple Sugar cure, I got it from my meat dude.... 85% salt, 0.75% nitrite and ~14% other stuff.... I think it's maple sugar stuff and maybe some "cure accelerator" like ascorbate or erthorbate at around .5 - .7 grams per Kg.... commercial folks usually add that stuff but I don't have a label for the cure.... My meat dude just "GAVE" me about 10#'s of the cure in a plastic bag... maybe even some phosphates, for water retention, to increase the products retail profit..
> 
> I just turned the meat... considering there's 24#'s of belly, there is only "MAYBE" 3 TBS of liquid that has been sucked out of the meat...
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> I definitely know these bellies are not enhanced.... "That's a good thing"...
> 
> I tried the "sweet" cure by adding more sugar etc. but it burned in the fry pan.... don't care for that......
> 
> What I do like is, when bride bakes the rashers on a cooling rack on a sheet pan, she spread some fresh maple syrup, I just made, on them... after about 3/4 cooking time so it doesn't burn... it caramelizes into a crispy maple glaze... knock your socks off... now that's sweet bacon to die for....


Yeah,I used too much last time and thought I rinsed it off enough bu tit too burned a little in the pan.Im going to try 1/2TBS per pound brown sugar this time..Going to prep it tonight. Thanks.

Dexter


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## daveomak

Dexter......  You starting a thread so we can all learn about the sugar addition....


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## gary s

Hey Dave, Nice,  I wish I could find bellies around here, scarcer than buggy whips. I did get a local market to order me one, It was fresh because they had to wait till they were processing pigs.

It's in the fridge curing.  Wish I could go to the store and pick one up like you guys.

I'll be watching

Gary


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## hoity toit

DaveOmak said:


> Dexter...... You starting a thread so we can all learn about the sugar addition....


They say the sugar "hides the salt"...*LOL*.., I actually saw some *coconut sugar* on the shelf at the store yesterday,what the heck would you use that for other than putting in a pina colada ?? I suppose there are many kinds of sweeteners both sucrose and frutose.


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## daveomak

As old as I'm getting......  I'm_ leaning _toward _cane_ sugar......   LOL


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## daveomak

Turned the bacon again.....  all the moisture has been sucked back into the meat...   Don't know what that means but I think it's good.....


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## hoity toit

should be tender then.


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## dave17a

Man that does it. Been itchin' to get my bellies. Everybody ask at least once a week." got any bacon". My closest guy for bellies is closing. Got couple leads though. Waiting for results Dave. You put screens between bellies stacked straight up?


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## daveomak

_ You put screens between bellies stacked straight up?_


Yep.....   so any liquid that emerges can be sucked back up in the same area or spot...


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## daveomak

Bellies rinsed and put back into refer for a few days....   At least until the weather cools down....   101 today...  103+ tomorrow...  nighttime temps until Saturday around 70...    Sat./ Sun./Mon. night temps around 56 deg. F...   That will have to do....  

Spacers between the slabs to allow for liquid drainage...     













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## bregent

Looking good Dave. I smoked my Costco belly last night. Cold smoked for 2.5 hours (65F ambient) in GOSM with hickory and cherry, then at 180-190 until 145 IT.













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## daveomak

bregent said:


> Looking good Dave. I smoked my Costco belly last night. Cold smoked for 2.5 hours (65F ambient) in GOSM with hickory and cherry, then at 180-190 until 145 IT.
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Looks awesome.....   I'm gonna try and cold smoke my bellies around or below 70 deg. F...     That will be touch and go....


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## bregent

>Looks awesome..... I'm gonna try and cold smoke my bellies

>around or below 70 deg. F... That will be touch and go....

Dave, do you do just a long cold smoke, or do you also hot/warm smoke?


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## daveomak

bregent said:


> >Looks awesome..... I'm gonna try and cold smoke my bellies
> >around or below 70 deg. F... That will be touch and go....
> 
> Dave, do you do just a long cold smoke, or do you also hot/warm smoke?




I've tried warm smoking them...  don't care for the texture....  sooooo, I cold smoke for up to 12 hours....   depends...  Bride likes a small amount of smoke flavor that won't interfere or mask the pig flavor...  sometime I just ignore her requests...   :head-wall: ...  stupid....

Cold smoked belly slabs is what I grew up eating....  slice your own...  marvelous stuff...

Below is a link to cold smoking....

http://www.meatsandsausages.com/meat-smoking/cold-smoking


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## bregent

Thanks Dave. Think I'll try a 12 hour cold smoke next time and see how it compares.


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## tatts4life

Oh man the pictures are making me hungry for bacon. I wish I had the right kind of smoker to be able to make my own.


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## daveomak

Tatts4Life said:


> Oh man the pictures are making me hungry for bacon. I wish I had the right kind of smoker to be able to make my own.



A cardboard box and the AMNPS and you are in business.....    No fancy smoker needed....


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## bregent

DaveOmak said:


> A cardboard box and the AMNPS and you are in business..... No fancy smoker needed....


 Yep, was thinking the same thing:  http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/newsearch?search=cardboard+box+smoker


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## daveomak

Take pictures of your project....


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## tatts4life

Duh that's right. I remember awhile ago somebody posted a cold smoker using a wardrobe box for a larger space.


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## jtsales

I just use Morton tender quick, brown sugar, black pepper corns. Dry cure for ten days. Originally used pink salt and had trouble keeping the salt levels equal from the thick side to the thin side of my bellies. Found that with this homemade bacon, it needs to be cooked a little slower had a tenancy to burn easily. Just new to the site, love it already!


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## daveomak

jtsales said:


> I just use Morton tender quick, brown sugar, black pepper corns. Dry cure for ten days. Originally used pink salt and had trouble keeping the salt levels equal from the thick side to the thin side of my bellies. Found that with this homemade bacon, it needs to be cooked a little slower had a tenancy to burn easily. Just new to the site, love it already!




Sugar will burn for sure...   If you leave the bacon curing for 12-15 days, the cure, salt, sugar and stuff will equilibrate so you have no problems....   FWIW, the USDA does not allow nitrate in bacon...  TQ has nitrate in it....   :dunno


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## daveomak

I was gonna smoke the bacon today BUT....   dust storms are a blowing now.....   fires are growing...    maybe tomorrow....


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## mneeley490

DaveOmak said:


> I was gonna smoke the bacon today BUT.... dust storms are a blowing now..... fires are growing... maybe tomorrow....


Yikes, not again.

Thunderstorms and rain on this side of the mountains today. No good for smoking, either.


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## chilefarmer

Very nice indeed. Love the color. CF


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## daveomak

Bellies are in the warm smoker so they will warm up to about70 degrees F...  they were just removed from the refer....   They need to warm to stop condensate from forming on them... condensate and smoke taste acrid...  acid rain...   

Full flow air through the smoker to evaporate any moisture....    Bellies trimmed and laying on Todd's Q-Matz...  those matz are soo handy....














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Pellets were dried at 275 ish for 1.5 hours...   they sure light easy...    100% hickory from Todd at Amazing Products...

Nice thin blue smoke...    should be about 6 hours worth...














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Since Bride likes "light" smoke flavor... this stuff will be done in the AM....   refered for a day or 2...  lightly frozen and
sliced...... 


Thanks for looking.....   Dave


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## daveomak

*.......FLASH.......*



The bacon cooled off the smoker to 59 degrees.....    That caused a cold dam and the air in the smoker started flowing out of the MB mod....    that's no good.......  had to turn the heat on to get the smoke flowing the correct way and to warm up the bacon....

Meat needs to be above ambient air temps and so does the smoker for cold smoking to work.....


I knew that.......     just screwed up today....   Oh well.....   saved it.....


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## pc farmer

Glad you saved it.


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## daveomak

Thanks .....     me too......


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## doctord1955

What is everyone paying for there bellies?


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## bregent

doctord1955 said:


> What is everyone paying for there bellies?


$2.29/lb


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## pc farmer

Let's start a new thread on price of bellies and not hi jack this thread please.


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## mneeley490

Sorry didn't see the last post.


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## daveomak

Finished the smoke.... about 10 hours in all...  5 Sat. evening and 5 Sun. morning... with about a 7 hours break in between the smoke sessions...
I've seen some folks cook BIG hunks of bacon or belly... thought I'd give the trim pieces a try at that...  Not sure what recipe yet...   Maybe deep fry a 2" chunk of the trim...   

Any suggestions on cooking up the trim pieces.....     Thanks.......    Dave













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## nosuchreality

Our costco got them last week I picked one up.  Mine has done something none have done before.  I dry cured like Dave the OP. Put in fridge zip locked in trays.  The cure and salt immediately pulled a beautiful layer of liquidity out dissolving all the cure.  At 2.5 days, I flipped the bellies and then went out for the weekend.  Returned 3 days later, went to flip but all of the liquid has be reabsorbed.

Bellies smell fine, look good.

Is this a good sign, bad sign?

Thanks

(Sorry, missed note 15, I see yours did the same and look great.  Hopefully you'll post the ultimate use toon update.  How they tasting?)


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## daveomak

That's a good sign....    Meat has liquid in it....   salt and sugar suck it out....  then it gets readsorbed pulling the salt and sugar back in...     Now that the meat has 2 hygroscopic chemicals inside, it will stay there until the heat from cooking pushes it out...   the chemicals stay......   nitrite, as I have read somewhere, starts to breakdown around 140 ish....  only a small amount stays in the meat after cooking.....

My bellies are still in the refer for one last equilibration....  maybe tomorrow they will go in the freezer for 2-3 hours to firm up, then slice.....

BBL.....


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## butchdon

How log before you slice and cook? What do they taste like? Do you slice them by hand or machine?

I don;t have the right kind of smoker to do them, but I'm sure I can learn something from the techniques.


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## daveomak

I leave the bellies a couple days in the refer after smoking... _ This batch sat for 7 days in the refer to mellow and dry....   _slice on an electric meat slicer, or knife....   Tastes like bacon used to back in the 1950's....    
For a smoker, you need an AMNPS and cardboard box fitted with wire racks, or hung with string from the top...  

Dave


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## daveomak

Sliced with Granddaughters help....  stacked conveniently.....  Weighed in 1 1/2# piles.....   wrap in stretch tite....   packed in vac bags, 2-3 bunches per bag....













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In the oven to cook......  AWESOME....   Bride says the dry brined is the best ever....  no curling...   no dilution of the flavor...    WE HAVE A WINNER !!!!     

She says it's the closest thing to real bacon I've ever made....    Of course, we both grew up when bacon was slab bacon, and dry brined.....













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## mneeley490

Looks good, Dave!

I remember getting bacon that was rind-on when I was a kid in the 60's. Added a little extra crunch.


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## butchdon

When my family would bring home smoked bacon back to NY when they had visited the South in the 50's, at first I did not like it, but it grew on you. Then we ran out. Same when my mom made pear preserves with pears costing $0.25 per bushel from a horse drawn cart in NYC. Was the only jam we had for sandwiches and pancakes for 9 kids for 4-6 years or so. Then we ran out and had to go back to store bought stuff. Didn't know how good we had it. Back then even Welch's made jam wit the grape skins still on that was pretty good. especially by today's standards.

Sorry to get off topic, but I think that's why people smoke their own foods, bake their own bread, etc. You know what's in it, the taste, and smells they produce make it worth the time and effort.


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## DanMcG

Great looking bacon Dave!


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## bob g

I bought some on Saturday for $2.85/lb. Really nice looking.
Thanks for the heads up.


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## hoity toit

DaveOmak said:


> Sliced with Granddaughters help.... stacked conveniently..... Weighed in 1 1/2# piles..... wrap in stretch tite.... packed in vac bags, 2-3 bunches per bag....
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> In the oven to cook...... AWESOME.... Bride says the dry brined is the best ever.... no curling... no dilution of the flavor... WE HAVE A WINNER !!!!
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Mighty fine looking bacon, I never thought about wrapping in plastic and putting three bunches in one bag. Great idea. !


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## daveomak

Leaves room to re-seal....  you have to be cheap to think of that.....   LOL.....


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## bregent

I do similar, but use wax paper. But it's hard to handle cause it tends to unfold as you're putting it in the bags. I'm gonna switch to cling wrap next time.


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## chilefarmer

Beautiful Bacon. I love dry cure as well. Thats the way we grew up. I like your packaging idea. CF


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## mummel

Subbing.


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## bmaddox

DaveOmak said:


> Leaves room to re-seal.... you have to be cheap to think of that..... LOL.....


Thanks Dave, I am borrowing that idea. Maybe if I can save some vac bags I can buy more equipment


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## oregon smoker

bmaddox said:


> Thanks Dave, I am borrowing that idea. Maybe if I can save some vac bags I can buy more equipment


we also do this, to take it another step when we package up dawgs or sausage I individually wrap them in cling wrap then put in vac bags . then when we want some we can pull them out one at a time

keep smokin,

Tom


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## daveomak

That method works for cheese also...    darn near anything...


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## oregon smoker

Just think individual Flash Frozen concept

Tom


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## mfreel

Costco in Omaha has bellies - $2.85 lb.


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## oregon smoker

Gosh you being closer to Pork Central if you will than us way up here you would have better pricing, I am picking up some bone out pork shoulders for 1.27lb in the next few days

keep on smoking,

Tom


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## wobblehd

Thank you for the great thread Dave. Great looking bacon. "Cooking" your pellets before smoking is a great idea. I had my pellets in the same room as the swamp cooler. LOL. At least I figured out why my amazn pellet smoker "didn't work" recently. Baking them is now a must I think. I finally found a butcher that I can get pork belly from. I hope my bacon turns out half that good. And thanks for the cold smoking link too.


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## daveomak

Wobblehd said:


> Thank you for the great thread Dave. Great looking bacon. "Cooking" your pellets before smoking is a great idea. I had my pellets in the same room as the swamp cooler. LOL. At least I figured out why my amazn pellet smoker "didn't work" recently. Baking them is now a must I think. I finally found a butcher that I can get pork belly from. I hope my bacon turns out half that good. And thanks for the cold smoking link too.




Some folks need to dry them..... others find it not necessary...    I dry them because they light easier and stay lit every time I use them....    Saves on the hassle of relighting on the frequent occasion.....


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## mr t 59874

Dave, as usual, nice looking bacon.

  As you well know, you and I prepare our bacon the same other than using different dry cures and smoke times.  After reading this thread, I purchased a side at Costco and was very pleased with what I brought home.  Dry cured it for 19 days (normally 14) my how time flies, oh well.  It is drying in the cooler now for two days and then it will go in the smoker for approximately 72 hours tomorrow using my pulverized pellet method.

 Thinking this Costco bacon will be the way to go in the future.

Thanks for the fine thread.

Tom


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## daveomak

The Costco bacon is nice stuff....  they sure do skin it nicely...  a lot better than I can do...   I pulverized some pellets...  do you use them in any particular smoke generator....


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## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> The Costco bacon is nice stuff.... they sure do skin it nicely... a lot better than I can do... I pulverized some pellets... do you use them in any particular smoke generator....


I agree, they sure do a nice job.

I pulverize mine to a talc powder consistency and place it in an AMNPS. By lighting one end, I can get a 15 - 17-hour burn with a very light smoke in color and consistency, give it a break and do it again until the sides are the color I want.  It normally takes around 72 hours of smoke to obtain this.

 As you know the time involved allows for further equalization which produces the old time flavor we enjoy so much.

Tom


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## vegas flyingcub

Guys, went to costco 2day and saw some sliced pork belly for [email protected] asked the guys in the meat dept if they had any in the cryo pack. He brought out 2 bellies in cryo packs. Paid  2.75 a pound but they sure look nice..


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## daveomak

Mr T 59874 said:


> DaveOmak said:
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> The Costco bacon is nice stuff.... they sure do skin it nicely... a lot better than I can do... I pulverized some pellets... do you use them in any particular smoke generator....
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> I pulverize mine to a talc powder consistency and place it in an AMNPS. By lighting one end, I can get a 15 - 17-hour burn with a very light smoke in color and consistency, give it a break and do it again until the sides are the color I want.  It normally takes around 72 hours of smoke to obtain this.
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> As you know the time involved allows for further equalization which produces the old time flavor we enjoy so much.
> 
> Tom
Click to expand...



How full do you fill the channel...  1/2...3/4......near the top....    I've gotta try that...   I didn't grind my pellets that fine...   back to the grinding machine.......   

Dave


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## daveomak

Vegas Flyingcub said:


> Guys, went to costco 2day and saw some sliced pork belly for [email protected] asked the guys in the meat dept if they had any in the cryo pack. He brought out 2 bellies in cryo packs. Paid  2.75 a pound but they sure look nice..:drool:





You'll enjoy them bellies....    I garontee.....


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## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> How full do you fill the channel... 1/2...3/4......near the top.... I've gotta try that... I didn't grind my pellets that fine... back to the grinding machine.......
> 
> Dave


I top it right off with maybe a little extra.  It will hold approx 12 oz.  

Tom


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## oregon smoker

Mr T 59874 said:


> I top it right off with maybe a little extra.  It will hold approx 12 oz.
> 
> Tom


Guys

are you putting the pelleted in a Cuisinart? or just pulverizing? (seems like crushing them) and they would be too dense to burn?

Keep On Smokin,

Tom


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## daveomak

Blender.....   whip them up to a dust.....   might have to blend 1/4 cup at one time.....    When in dust form, they smolder, if they are dry....   drying the pellets and dust is important for a good smolder....


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## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> Blender..... whip them up to a dust..... might have to blend 1/4 cup at one time..... When in dust form, they smolder, if they are dry.... drying the pellets and dust is important for a good smolder....


Ditto Dave,  I use AMAZN pellets only, they burn better than some of the box store pellets.  You can figure 5 hours per row.  Suggest using a garage sale blender, it makes things go better in the kitchen if you know what I mean. 

Tom


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## nosuchreality

DaveOmak said:


> Leaves room to re-seal....  you have to be cheap to think of that.....   LOL.....



My kind of cheap.  I tried sealing down the middle and then putting a stack in each side but that's hassle.  I like the idea of wrapping pulling a wrap out and reseal.  Okay, I'm probably deluding myself, I'll just use it as an excuse to eat all three packs.

Passed this past week on another run of belly, looked like they just had the dregs left from a shipment.  My belly looks to have been a bit fattier than yours.   My bride likes it commercial thin cut.  I'm hoping since she likes the lardones that she'll come around.

Next up is carving the coppa out of one of the Costco boneless shoulder butt cryopaks.  Hoping I picked well, as my Southern California shopping neighbors were given me weird looks as I fondled and peered closely at every pack trying to determine where and quality of the coppa in there.  So, tomorrow , harvesting, curing and then eventually into an UMAi dry bag.  The rest will be trussed and prepped into crockpot carnitas packs and mini butts for the smoker.


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## daveomak

NSR, morning.....  Start a thread on selecting and removing the coppa....   it's time for another thread on that process......


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## dirtsailor2003

Great looking bacon Dave! I have four bellies in the freezer waiting for it to cool off long enough for me to cold smoke!


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## daveomak

Morning Dirt....    I'm totally convinced that long time curing, 2 weeks or longer, makes for a better product....    and the week in the refer for more equilibrium and drying concentrates the flavor...    Next batch I will try the "pellet dust" in the AMNPS and a longer "smoke on-off-on-off" like the old timers did, for a deeper smoke flavor in the meat...   not necessarily a stronger smoke flavor but deeper into the meat.....  
I can still remember the flavor bacon had back in the 60's....   maybe I can get there...     













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.. ..













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## dirtsailor2003

I'm going to experiment a bit with this batch. I used to dry cute all my bacon, until my scale broke. Now that I have a new scale, I can go back to it again. I have always used the smoke on off method. I typically do 18-24 hours total smoke over 3-4 days with a rest in the fridge in between. Then a rest in the fridge for 4-5 days before slicing a packing.  I like your trick for vac packing I use that trick for sausage and will give it a whirl for the bacon.


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## oregon smoker

DaveOmak said:


> Blender..... whip them up to a dust..... might have to blend 1/4 cup at one time..... When in dust form, they smolder, if they are dry.... drying the pellets and dust is important for a good smolder....


Dave Thanks, do you use the powder just like you would the pellets inside the mes? i see that the dust is used by some in the mes.

Tom


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## daveomak

Tom, afternoon...

Dust replaces the pellets in the AMNPS or can be put in the AMNS.....   burns slower for thinner smoke is my guess....   Mr. T is leaning me in the direction of longer, less intense smoke sessions...   Should improve the flavor, especially when you alternate the smoke period with no smoke...  for at least the same length of time if not 2X the smoke time...  penetration and maturing is very important in the smoke application process...  Here's an example....   Kentucky Whiskey or Scotch.....  The longer it sits in a charred oak barrel, the smoother the taste, the fewer the headaches and the more you can charge for it.....

Now, that being said, there are folks that like green whiskey, which is fine with me..... but....  I prefer mellow and aged....


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## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> Tom, afternoon...
> 
> Dust replaces the pellets in the AMNPS or can be put in the AMNS..... burns slower for thinner smoke is my guess.... Mr. T is leaning me in the direction of longer, less intense smoke sessions... Should improve the flavor, especially when you alternate the smoke period with no smoke... for at least the same length of time if not 2X the smoke time... penetration and maturing is very important in the smoke application process... Here's an example.... Kentucky Whiskey or Scotch..... The longer it sits in a charred oak barrel, the smoother the taste, the fewer the headaches and the more you can charge for it.....
> 
> Now, that being said, there are folks that like green whiskey, which is fine with me..... but.... I prefer mellow and aged....


Cheers.

T


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## oregon smoker

Mr T 59874 said:


> Cheers.
> 
> T


Mr T and Dave Good Morning,

Makes Sense, aged is always best... so for sake of discussion would you smoke at 7hrs (then rest how long ?) then second smoke another 7hrs ? or longer periods of time each time ?  i have always smoke for the duration straight thru, i must admit i am one of those that "thought" once the smoke layer is created multiple smokes would just create layers on the surface and not continue to penetrate. your above clarification was eye opening (from cold to warm)

Thanks,

Tom


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## daveomak

Original cold smoking, way back when, smoke was usually applied from a small fire in the smokehouse.. usually sawdust or small branches...   when it burned out, it was left out for a day...  then repeated for up to 30 days.....    the smoke from a small fire in a 8x8 building was pretty thin....   this was also a drying process to preserve the meat so no refrigeration was required....   between the drying and the salt, the bacon was good for a long time.....

I have done 6 hour smokes each day for 6 days...    I liked it very much.....  Bride not so much...   So, she liked this batch very much..... sooo I think this is my new method....  except for using pellet dust....   
Breaks in smoke are supposed to help with penetration and homogenous flavor....   I'm sure, resting in the refer for a week or three, after the smoke cycles does the same thing, but that is a WAG.....  (wild a$$ guess).......


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## mr t 59874

Oregon Smoker said:


> Mr T and Dave Good Morning,
> 
> Makes Sense, aged is always best... so for sake of discussion would you smoke at 7hrs (then rest how long ?) then second smoke another 7hrs ? or longer periods of time each time ?  i have always smoke for the duration straight thru, i must admit i am one of those that "thought" once the smoke layer is created multiple smokes would just create layers on the surface and not continue to penetrate. your above clarification was eye opening (from cold to warm)
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Tom


 Using a hickory powder I normally smoke bacon to the desired color and at my convenience.  At times it may be smoked continuously, at other times when the days are warm and the nights are cool, I will smoke for 12 - 15 hours overnight then place the bacon in the cooler until the next smoke.

 The smoker used for bacon will allow me to keep the internal smoker temp at or below ambient temperature not to exceed 60° - 65°. Using an AMNPS and hickory powder, a very thin, light, whitish blue smoke is being used.  It starts in a cast iron stove and then passes through a three-inch pipe for approximately 8 feet to the 23 cf. smoker.  This cools the smoke and condenses most of the creosote before it reaches the smoker itself providing, what I call, a cool smooth smoke. The bacon that I am curing now has taken me five days to apply 53 hours of smoke, it should be done after another 15 or 20 hours of smoke.

You will most likely find your own way of doing it.  The main thing to keep in mind as Dave has quoted, take your time and don't try to rush it, you will be rewarded.

Hopefully, this has answered your question.

Tom


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## oregon smoker

Mr T 59874 said:


> Using a hickory powder I normally smoke bacon to the desired color and at my convenience.  At times it may be smoked continuously, at other times when the days are warm and the nights are cool, I will smoke for 12 - 15 hours overnight then place the bacon in the cooler until the next smoke.
> 
> The smoker used for bacon will allow me to keep the internal smoker temp at or below ambient temperature not to exceed 60° - 65°. Using an AMNPS and hickory powder, a very thin, light, whitish blue smoke is being used.  It starts in a cast iron stove and then passes through a three-inch pipe for approximately 8 feet to the 23 cf. smoker.  This cools the smoke and condenses most of the creosote before it reaches the smoker itself providing, what I call, a cool smooth smoke. The bacon that I am curing now has taken me five days to apply 53 hours of smoke, it should be done after another 15 or 20 hours of smoke.
> 
> You will most likely find your own way of doing it.  The main thing to keep in mind as Dave has quoted, take your time and don't try to rush it, you will be rewarded.
> 
> Hopefully, this has answered your question.
> 
> Tom


Thanks Mr T

one thing I do not do is rush things. it will all work out. having both of Todd's smokers has always given me the choice of dust or pellets but this pulverizing the pellets is very intriguing, will be doing some testing with that method.

Thanks,

Tom


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## zombiekitty

Costco bellies were $2.79/lb here in Michigan last week. Waiting for my hooks and AMNPS to get here before I start my first bacon cold smoke. Definitely lots of great info in this thread. Thanks!


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## daveomak




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## pipelinegypsy

Hey guys great bacon thread! Can someone clarify a few things on the on/off method of cold smoking bacon... for the "off" period do you remove the bacon from the smoker and put it in the ice box to rest or leave it in the smoker? I'm guessing it might depend on ambient temps? I don't have any cold smoking mods for my MES yet so I struggle to keep my smoker <100*, would I still be able to do the on/off method or would it be too hot? I don't know why I am so curious because I have not been able to find bellies anywhere. When I ask people if they have them or can get them I only get blank stares like they have never heard of such a thing. The last place I asked was at Sam's in Douglasville GA. Anyway, I do hope this post is not considered hijacking, but if it is please smack me. Thanks!


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## ndkoze

For just a few bucks, you could have an A-MAZE-N smoker to your door by the time your bacon is done curing which would solve your cold smoking dilemma.

http://www.amazenproducts.com/category_s/12.htm


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## pipelinegypsy

NDKoze said:


> For just a few bucks, you could have an A-MAZE-N smoker to your door by the time your bacon is done curing which would solve your cold smoking dilemma.
> 
> http://www.amazenproducts.com/category_s/12.htm


Oh I have the AMNPS and I am using it right now. But even with the smoker off (I only turn it on to preheat and get things moving) I still have to put some ice in to keep the temps down.


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## ndkoze

Gotcha.

I use frozen 2-Liter Soda Bottles and it really helps, plus does not add condensation to the smoker from melting ice.


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## daveomak

PipelineGypsy said:


> NDKoze said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> For just a few bucks, you could have an A-MAZE-N smoker to your door by the time your bacon is done curing which would solve your cold smoking dilemma.
> 
> http://www.amazenproducts.com/category_s/12.htm
> 
> 
> 
> Oh I have the AMNPS and I am using it right now. But even with the smoker off (I only turn it on to preheat and get things moving) I still have to put some ice in to keep the temps down.
Click to expand...

Smoke at night....  use a mailbox modification to keep the heat out of the smoker...  pull the chip chute out and have the exhaust wide open for more air flow...













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## mneeley490

Or do Bearcarver's "warm smoke" method. That way you don't have to worry about keeping the temp under 100°.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/108099/bacon-extra-smoky


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## daveomak

If you have never had cold smoked bacon, you are missing a treat....  Bacon "used" to be cold smoked all the time when I was a kid...   It beats warm smoked bacon hands down...  IMO...


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## torp3t3d0

Dave and Mr. T:

have learnt a lot about bacon from ya.....everytime I read one of your posts I keep asking myself, "why don't you do that"?....Never had luck with the "dry" cure....first couple of time I made "salt" pork....so I went with Pop's Brine and have had good luck.....

Want to try the cold  smoke and dry cure method that you talked about in these 5 pages.......I'm not retired and have to work for a living...but I don't work every Friday and Monday so I guess I can use those days for the smoking.....

Will let you know how it goes......also using the UMAI dry materials and making all type of salami and pancetta.....

Thanks again for the info.....keep sharing

Pete


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## daveomak

torp3t3d0 said:


> Dave and Mr. T:
> 
> have learnt a lot about bacon from ya.....everytime I read one of your posts I keep asking myself, "why don't you do that"?....Never had luck with the "dry" cure....first couple of time I made "salt" pork....so I went with Pop's Brine and have had good luck.....
> 
> Want to try the cold  smoke and dry cure method that you talked about in these 5 pages.......I'm not retired and have to work for a living...but I don't work every Friday and Monday so I guess I can use those days for the smoking.....
> 
> Will let you know how it goes......also using the UMAI dry materials and making all type of salami and pancetta.....
> 
> Thanks again for the info.....keep sharing
> 
> Pete


Hey torp, morning....   are you using cure #1 or Morton's TQ....  If using TQ, switch to cure #1....   You can adjust all the parameters to your liking....


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## torp3t3d0

#1.    My Dad was a sausage maker (for fun) and left me 5# of the stuff....I have enough pink salt to satisfy all of northern va.....


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## daveomak




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## sgriff49

I have got all my bellies at Costco and they have been great.  They also carry plenty in stock and usually right at 9 - 10lbs.  This morning pick up a bellie from local butcher and looks great plus no skin!  Going to do my step by step here shortly.


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## daveomak

Going to hit Costco next week....    One more case of bellies for me...    













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__ Aug 9, 2016


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## mike w

Dave, thanks for the tutorial. I just pulled some bellies out of the cure to rest and built a cardboard cold smoker today. I only have limited time to smoke over the next week so I'm planning to give the belly about 6 hours per day of cold smoke and letting it rest in the fridge in between. This being my first true cold smoke for bacon I'm going to shoot for 18 hours of smoke. 












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__ mike w
__ Aug 10, 2016


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## daveomak

Cool....   I'm in.....    be sure to warm the bellies before adding smoke...   You never want to smoke cold food...  (quote from nepas)....


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## dirtsailor2003

DaveOmak said:


> Cool....   I'm in.....    be sure to warm the bellies before adding smoke...   You never want to smoke cold food...  (quote from nepas)....



Hmmm, I never warm mine and it's never been a problem, just saying...


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## daveomak

dirtsailor2003 said:


> DaveOmak said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cool....   I'm in.....    be sure to warm the bellies before adding smoke...   You never want to smoke cold food...  (quote from nepas)....
> 
> 
> 
> Hmmm, I never warm mine and it's never been a problem, just saying...
Click to expand...

I find condensate forms on cold meat...   I'm just posting what G-d's son, nepas posted...   makes sense to me...


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## mike w

I could warm it up in the oven or take it out of the fridge and let it set on the counter until it warms (would take a few hours to bring the IT up to 70 just because its alot cooler here) **edited because using my traeger would defeat the purpose**

Do you see any reason not to warm it with the oven? I would place it in the cold smoker when it reached around 65F IT in case there is any carryover. 

Its raining today so I wont get any smoke on this morning :/ at least the next few days ought to be nicer. I have more time to read up now at least.



DaveOmak said:


> Cool....   I'm in.....    be sure to warm the bellies before adding smoke...   You never want to smoke cold food...  (quote from nepas)....


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## daveomak

Mike W said:


> I could warm it up in the oven or take it out of the fridge and let it set on the counter until it warms (would take a few hours to bring the IT up to 70 just because its alot cooler here) **edited because using my traeger would defeat the purpose**
> 
> Do you see any reason not to warm it with the oven? I would place it in the cold smoker when it reached around 65F IT in case there is any carryover.
> 
> Its raining today so I wont get any smoke on this morning :/ at least the next few days ought to be nicer. I have more time to read up now at least.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DaveOmak said:
> 
> 
> 
> Cool....   I'm in.....    be sure to warm the bellies before adding smoke...   You never want to smoke cold food...  (quote from nepas)....
Click to expand...

Warm to close to smoker temp is all that's necessary to eliminate condensate...  a couple hours on a wire rack on an hour on a wire rack with a fan blowing on it to form a pellicle will do...   The pellicle is a necessary thing to do....


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## mike w

Thanks Dave, My current plan is on the first smoke day to take it out and allow it to warm up and form the pellicle (convection oven with the fan on) smoke for 6-8 hours. Put the belly back in the fridge to rest overnight. Day 2 back in the oven to warm, then smoke again for 6-8 hours and then back in the fridge to rest overnight. Day 3 back in the oven to warm and then smoke for the last bout of 6-8 hours. Then in the fridge to rest for a few days before slicing, bagging and vac sealing. 



DaveOmak said:


> Warm to close to smoker temp is all that's necessary to eliminate condensate...  a couple hours on a wire rack on an hour on a wire rack with a fan blowing on it to form a pellicle will do...   The pellicle is a necessary thing to do....


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## daveomak

That should work....  don't get the belly too warm or the fat will start to melt..  do you have a proofing oven for bread ??  an hour or 2 should do...


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## mike w

I have proofed bread and dough in it quite a few times. I just pop a digital thermometer in to keep an eye on the ambient temperature while it proofs. I always keep it at the lowest heat setting and can keep the fan on only fortunately. 





DaveOmak said:


> That should work....  don't get the belly too warm or the fat will start to melt..  do you have a proofing oven for bread ??  an hour or 2 should do...


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## mike w

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__ mike w
__ Aug 12, 2016





I let the bellies rest and warm up to form the pellicle. I got 7.5 hours of smoke, temp was 84-86 inside the cardboard box. The AMNPS is a rockstar once I propped it up underneath for more airflow.

I was using a rib rack to hold the bellies upright in the smoker and thats why they are drooping some. I think I'm going to cut two more holes and put more dowel rods in to let them rest on some cookie racks.

They are in the fridge, unwrapped, to rest overnight. Thoughts on the color? Does it look pretty typical for that length of smoke?

I don't think I will get any smoke on it tomorrow. We've got friends coming with a bunch of young kids around so I can't do it safely. Maybe Sunday if the weather holds.


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## daveomak

As the representation shows, cold smoke penetrates the meat rather than collecting more on the surface..   Sooooo, the color is deceiving....  BUT...  the flavor is still there....  You can let the belly smoke overnight....  just a thought...  that's what I do.....













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__ Mar 17, 2016


















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__ daveomak
__ Mar 17, 2016


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## mike w

Thanks Dave,
I thought about it but at one point the wind was getting enough draft into the AMNPS that it ignited the pellets and i had a wee fire in the box. I have to get up at 0400 to get a brisket started so I may pop it back on then. The temp is going to drop to 58 tonight so we'll see.


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## smokeymose

The main reason I got a Costco membership was to get bellies.


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## mike w

Finished product. Thanks Dave!












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__ mike w
__ Aug 28, 2016


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## radioguy

Pipeline,

When I cold smoke bacon, I slide them into brown paper lunch bags.  The bags allow them to breathe
absorb moisture.  Then into the refer for a rest. You may have to change bags as the bacon dries out.
I'll cold smoke 4-6 hours a session over a few days until it gets the right amount of color. 

You may want to try a local Mexican or Asian market, they usually have belly or can obtain it.

Good Luck!

RG


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## daveomak

Mike W said:


> Finished product. Thanks Dave!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FB_IMG_1472310532719.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ mike w
> __ Aug 28, 2016


Looks MY-T-FINE to me....  

How did you like the flavor ??  I think "open" curing and aging adds flavor like you would to a dry aged steak...   Really a good depth of flavor.....


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## mike w

She who must be obeyed says the flavor is right on the money. I really like the curing and aging part. Its much easier than using the traeger. I've got a ton of projects started for cold smoking and aging now. I'm running out of room haha. 

I picked up the four pork bellies I ordered for $1.27/lb from the commisary. Got two curing and I'll get the others started tomorrow. I'm hoping to have the smokehouse ordered and cured before they are ready to be smoked. Fun times!



DaveOmak said:


> Looks MY-T-FINE to me....
> 
> How did you like the flavor ??  I think "open" curing and aging adds flavor like you would to a dry aged steak...   Really a good depth of flavor.....


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## daveomak

...
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






.....  Good price on the bellies...  I just paid $2.79 or something like that at Costco....   I'm glad SWMBO liked it....


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## mike w

I'm taking advantage of the prices and getting my freezer stocked up!



DaveOmak said:


> ...Thumbs Up .....  Good price on the bellies...  I just paid $2.79 or something like that at Costco....   I'm glad SWMBO liked it....


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