# Making Lox a picture guide.



## bbally

The name Lox?

Well many different theories are around about its beginning name. Most come back to the fact German’s made the cured fish in New York in the early 19th Century and so many feel it was the German name for Salmon that led to it being called lox Basically the word may have been derived from the Yiddish lox (”salmon”)-which is a cognate of Icelandic (lax), Swedish (lax), Danish/Norwegian (laks), German (Lachs), and Old English (l�x) so you can take your pick of where you think it came from, but it always means cured salmon.

Types of Lox?

To smoke or not to smoke? First one must realize why smoking of meats was done. In the early part of the 19th century refridgeration was none existant. Smoke is a natural fly repellant and so many many meats were smoked to keep flies off them during the holding times through the summer. Because so much additional flavor is imparted on the product when it is smoked, smoking also became part of the flavor profile for particular foods. Bacon, Ham, sausage and Salmon being the most common to carry a smoke flavor component. In the end lox can be smoked or not, depends on the appetizing-store you grew up visiting with Mom!

Belly Lox: Dry cured in Salt or Cure Salt, and sugar, then lightly cold smoked, this is a heavy salt salmon

Nova or Nova Scotia Lox: Brine cured either Scot’s style (dry brine) or wet cured then cold smoked, not nearly as salty as the belly lox and preferred by many of the next generation Jewish people.

Gravad Lax: Scandinavian, rub cured and will contain spices in the mixture, usually associated with the presents of dill weed as a spice. You will hear this referred to as gravlax and is perhaps one of the oldest methods for curing the salmon.

Last Cure salt, I use cure salt with contains sodium nitrite to chemically cook the fish. This method was preferred in the area I grew up in because it will handle pathogens and parasites with vigor. Rendering a safe product everytime. 

For the recipe and the steps to making lox. Lox recipes that do not include the step instructions are incomplete, the steps and times are as important as the spicing used. First a word on lox recipes, there are as many recipes for lox as there are colors in the world. So if yours does not match this one go forward knowing, “it’s ok” you will still make lox. I am following a recipe and method I learned from a German butcher in Pennsylvania, I have inturn also changed that a little to suit my taste. I am using the methodology I learned as a kid helping the butchers and have also modified that to take into account how I want the salmon to taste. Along the way I am going to explain how to adjust the methods to help you understand how to adjust the taste.

So on with the ingredients:

1 tsp cure salt (pink salt 6.25 percent sodium nitrite)
1/2 cup kosher salt
1 tbsp white pepper
1/2 cup white sugar (some use brown sugar for the extra molassas flavor)
mix the above into a dry ingredient rub.











2 salmon fillets, *Skinned* , chilled, and clean.





Pro Tip: Porosity; all meats have porosity, for consistant products we like to know that the porosity is the same everytime. So I always brine my salmon fillets in ice cold salt water for 30 minutes to insure I start with the same porosity every time. Fail to do so at your own peril! (one gallon warm water, stir in all the salt it will take, (til salt lay on the bottom) and then ice it down to 32 F) 





Zest an orange and a lemon and reserve the zest.
Dredge the salmon through the mixture. Spread half of the remaining cured mixture on the area where the salmon fillets will lay. Then spread half the orange and lemon zest under the area you will place the salmon. Now lay the fillets flat in a plastic box on top of the zested cure area. After fillet placement spread the remaining mixture over the salmon evenly, then use the remaining zest to coat the top of the fillets.










Place a nice size maple board ontop of the fillets in the plastic box and apply 3 pounds of weight to the top of the board. I am using ice in a ziplock freezer bag for the weight. Because I want things cold and ice is a safe food to use as a weight.










Now you will allow this to sit in the reefer for 48 hours. This requires a modification of my beer refridgerator in the garage. I must remove the beer from my shelf to make room for the salmon box.





After the 48 hour curing time you will pull the salmon and wash it off. Then we start the step that most books and people leave out.
Pro Tip: Desalinization is important in all curing and smoking. And it is the most unspoken of the curing secrets. People offer their recipes, they offer their smoking methods, but almost none speak of the desalinization step. Even in the most well written books you will see this step skipped. It is the “black art” of curing that remains a secret insuring your cure will never turn out as well as the Pros! Bacon, hams, sausages, all need to be desalinated to achieve the correct taste. 





Here I am going into the ice water desalinization step. I will allow the lox to sit in the ice water for 90 minutes. In my younger days of curing I would collect the water sample every 15 minutes and use a specific gravity bulb to measure the amount of salt removed from the product. Now I am to the point where I can just taste the water and know how much I have removed. I use ice water so I know the removal rate is the same. 
Once the freshening step is complete it is into the reefer to dry. I use a large cake cooling rack with paper towel under it to dry the fillets. I dry for 36 hours.





Once dry we are ready to smoke. The thing that makes lox is the mouth feel. So lox must be cold smoked. That is to say we take steps to insure the product never goes above 90 F while smoking. This is referred to as cold smoking. The nitrite has “cooked” the salmon and is rendered harmless as a nitrate. So all we are looking for here is: water removal, shrink the protien enough to tighten it up and during the tightening to have the protien pull in some smoke! I am smoking here under light smoke for 4 hours.















Once the smoking is complete I return the lox to the reefer for chilling. I chill for 24 hours.





I will separate the belly from the dorsal for the first fillet so you can see the difference in belly lox and what is commonly referred to as Nova. But realize most Nova was the complete fillet. However in the early days of commercial food the Dorsal was worth more money to the restaurants than the belly, so the restos got the dorsal fillets for meals and the delis got the bellies for lox.










Now that we have preppped we slice and package!















The use of lox is for many purposes, the most common I have included below. A New York water bagel, schmeared with Phila. Brand cream cheese, topped with lox and a thin slice of onion, cut in half!










�Til we speak again, purchase a little lox and some bagels, it is a very nice way to start the day. And a little more at noon will get you through the day with energy to spare!

Chef Bob Ballantyne
The Cowboy and The Rose Catering
Grand Junction, Colorado, USA


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## smokebuzz

Oh my!!, THAT looks GREAT!!!


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## the dude abides

for the most wonderful tutorial!


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## nickelmore

I have been wanting to smoke some fish.   Never thought about LOX.

Thanks for the class.

It is truly amazing how much a guy can learn sitting in his EZ chair drinking a bud light, and watching Pit-masters.


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## pokey

Thanks for the tutorial. It looks great. I have a question, though. I was of the understanding that it's critical to use the precise correct amount of cure for the amount of meat, especially with dry rubs. How many pounds of fish is your cure recipe for?

Thanks in advance.


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## tyotrain




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## venture

Pokey, I can understand your question and it is a good one.  I have a good idea of what is going on here, but I will not post it up for fear it could be mis-read or misinterpreted by someone.

I would recommend you PM bbally to get the answer straight from the source.  The "trusted authority" in his title is well earned in my opinion.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## rdknb

I love LOX and cream cheese on a bagel


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## moikel

I make gravalax every year for xmas.I do a salmon & a kingfish for contrasting colours on the plate. I learnt a lot from your tutorial,thanks a lot. The desalination tip is particularly valueable.


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## venture

I make gravlox a few times a year.  We love it at my house.

We do it differently from how bbally does it too. His original post made it clear that there were many different ways of making "lox".

I would like to see the differing ideas on this.  I would especially like to see what bbally says on this, because I respect his knowledge of food safety so much!

Good luck and good smoking.


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## moikel

Swedish people showed me how to do gravalax,if I  do whats sold down here as Atlantic salmon or ocean trout its all farmed fish from Tasmania. Thats why I  tried out kingfish. Tuna might work but fillet thickness might give you trouble. Tuna season in full swing here bluefin to 130 kg,yellowfin to 90kg if your geared up to go fish out wide.


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## wildflower

nice


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## alaskanbear

My sincere compliments on a most informative and well wriiten tutorial. As one who does many pounds of salmon a year, I picked up on some great Pro steps and I thank you for that.  The amount of #1 cure is the only question I also have. The actual ratio of cure to product.

Beautifully done sir.

Rich


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## vikingboy6956

This tutorial is simply awesome.

I am also wondering on the ratio of cure......and if I were to just do 1 fillet could I just cut the recipe in half??


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## mballi3011

Thor the tuturial and my wife loves lux to but then she says it's a New York thing. She just eats it there on Jewish Bialys (bagels) from a shop that has been making them for 120 some years. You never know maybe I can make some for her and she will eat it.


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## sunman76

WOW what a post great info.  thank you for your time and work to post this up for us.


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## elkmaster101

going to give I a try on my next batch of salmon.

THE BATCH ABOVE WAS DONE WITHOUT  Desalinization

but it is still yummy...

this batch is all but history now......


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## chef jimmyj

vikingboy6956 said:


> This tutorial is simply awesome.
> 
> I am also wondering on the ratio of cure......and if I were to just do 1 fillet could I just cut the recipe in half??


The recommended amount of Cure #1 for any meat is 1 level teaspoon for each 5 pounds of meat being cured with a Dry Rub...Same would apply here. In terms of smaller amounts Mr. Bally's recipe is good for 1 or 2 fillets and then can be multiplied by the number of additional fillets and then spread evenly if larger quantities of Salmon fillets are to be prepared. Although I can't tell for sure, the Salmon pictured looks like about 5 pounds worth so similarly the Recipe can be multiplied by each additional 5 pounds of Salmon...JJ

From "The Sausage Maker" website: Insta Cure[emoji]8482[/emoji] No. 1, a basic cure used to cure all meats that require cooking, smoking, or canning. This includes poultry, fish, ham, bacon, luncheon meats, corned beef, pates and other products too numerous to mention. Formerly Prague Powder #1. Insta Cure[emoji]8482[/emoji] #1 contains salt and sodium nitrite (6.25%). Use 1 level teaspoon per 5 lbs. of meat. 8 oz. of Insta Cure[emoji]8482[/emoji] will process approximately 240 lbs. of meat.


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## johnn9

HI Chef Jimmy http://www.sausagemania.com/loxmania.html  is another great site for making lox. They don't call for using the insta-cure but I know your stance on that matter so I will be adding it in, in addition to following the recipe and method they provide.

Johnn9


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## hickory larry

Very Nice job! Definitly going to give it a shot> Thank You and all the others like you that take the time to break it all down.


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## stubshaft

Great job!  I got a 5 lb filet curing in the fridge.


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## sprky

Totally awesome post. this needs to be a sticky it is so well written.


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## moikel

sprky said:


> Totally awesome post. this needs to be a sticky it is so well written.


Amen to that. We get farmed Atlantic salmon from Tasmania & now what is called King Salmon from New Zealand. Its on the list of things to do around here.


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## elohel

So, can the cure used in this recipe be replaced with Morton's Quick Tender (or is it Tender Quick? hah)


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## chef jimmyj

elohel said:


> So, can the cure used in this recipe be replaced with Morton's Quick Tender (or is it Tender Quick? hah)


Those that use Tender Quick say Use 1Tbs per Pound of Meat. So instead of the Cure #1 in this Recipe, use...

5Tbs Tender Quick

3Tbs Kosher Salt

1Tbs White Pepper

1/2Cup White or Brown Sugar

For approx. 5Lbs of Salmon.

Good Luck...JJ


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## peter bernstein

To anyone who's tried this recipe, I could use some clarification.  he makes a saline solution that is maximum concentration, then cools it down with ice to 32 deg F, but that would change the salt concentration.  But then either way, all he does is "dredge" the salmon in the solution.  I gather that in this case "dredge" means a quick dip?

Some clarification on this step would be useful.

-Thanks!


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## bbqnuts

Thanks for that tutorial!  You did a great job.  And now I have another project to add to my list.


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## chef jimmyj

Originally Posted by *Peter Bernstein* 
 

"To anyone who's tried this recipe, I could use some clarification. he makes a saline solution that is maximum concentration, then cools it down with ice to 32 deg F, but that would change the salt concentration. But then either way, all he does is "dredge" the salmon in the solution. I gather that in this case "dredge" means a quick dip?

Some clarification on this step would be useful.

-Thanks!"

*From the original Recipe...*

Pro Tip: Porosity; all meats have porosity, for consistant products we like to know that the porosity is the same everytime. So I always brine my salmon fillets in ice cold salt water for 30 minutes to insure I start with the same porosity every time. Fail to do so at your own peril! (one gallon warm water, stir in all the salt it will take, (til salt lay on the bottom) and then ice it down to 32

*In this step the muscle pores are evened out with the Cold Saline solution over a" 30 minute "soak...Icing Down, a Pro Chef term, refers to putting the" Pot "on Ice water to Cool the Solution...You are NOT adding Ice to the Solution!*

Zest an orange and a lemon and reserve the zest.
Dredge the salmon through the mixture. Spread half of the remaining cured mixture on the area where the salmon fillets will lay. Then spread half the orange and lemon zest under the area you will place the salmon. Now lay the fillets flat in a plastic box on top of the zested cure area. After fillet placement spread the remaining mixture over the salmon evenly, then use the remaining zest to coat the top of the fillets.
 

*In this step the Fillets are " Dredged " through the " Mixture "...This is the Salt, Wht Pepper, Sugar and Cure #1 Mixture... *

*A bed of half the remaining cure mixture is spread out with some Zest, the fillets placed on top, then the remaining half of the cure mixture and zest goes on top of the Fish...*

*I hope this helps, Peter...JJ*


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## moikel

Moikel said:


> Amen to that. We get farmed Atlantic salmon from Tasmania & now what is called King Salmon from New Zealand. Its on the list of things to do around here.


I now have this underway,1x King Salmon from NZ 1x Atlantic from Tasmania.Followed recipe to the letter,getting ready for ice water soak after cure. But now need to know how long will this stuff keep? I assume I can freeze it but fresh its good for what 5 days?

I will leave it in fridge for 24 hours to dry,need to smoke tomorrow night.


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## moikel

Follow the recipe,let the experts guide you through it and you get the real deal at the end.Thanks for the great tutorial.


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## mds51

This is another great tutorial for making Lox or Smoked Salmon. I now feel confident with this information that I can do this at home. My only question is that you state in the first part of this tutorial that you let the salmon dry in the refridgerator for 36 hours. That seems like a long time compared to other recipes that call for over night or 12 hours.Is this extra time necessary and make a difference in the texture of the end product? Thank You again for this excellent information.


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## moikel

I am one from one so no expert but I  went 24 hours for that last stage & got a great result.Got a pretty good reception from my Scottish friends & from some transplanted New Yorkers both people who know smoked salmon. I had to go 24 hours so I  could get to my friends butcher shop to use his vacuum sealer.

It really is a great tutorial.


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## toby bryant

What a great thread.  I will definitely put this on the "future projects" list.  Thank you for such a detailed tutorial!


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## bbally

Toby Bryant said:


> What a great thread.  I will definitely put this on the "future projects" list.  Thank you for such a detailed tutorial!


Wow how you dig this up?  It is a great product when you do it.  Now I have been using a glaze of 1/2 Cup Honey, 1/4 Cup real maple syrup, and 1/4 of black strap Molassas.  Mix it and warm it a little.  Then paint it on the side as it comes out of the smoker.  Should be a thin layer when it cools.


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## toby bryant

bbally said:


> Wow how you dig this up?  It is a great product when you do it.  Now I have been using a glaze of 1/2 Cup Honey, 1/4 Cup real maple syrup, and 1/4 of black strap Molassas.  Mix it and warm it a little.  Then paint it on the side as it comes out of the smoker.  Should be a thin layer when it cools.


Dave Omak referenced it in a more recent thread.  I did my first smoked salmon earlier this week using AKhap's recipe and it turned out great.  Have been wanting to try Lox and I really respect Dave's opinion.  So when he referenced your recipe that was good enough for me.  Thanks for responding.


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## twocubdad

Just finished packaging six pounds of salmon made with the above process.  EXCELLENT!  Good and salty and the texture is like butter.  Only issue I had (other than my family will devour six pounds of lox in half the time it took to prepare) is that I really couldn't get the smoke on as much as I would have liked.  Couldn't generate the smoke and still keep the fish temperature under 90d.  I've been reading up on AMNPS and will have one before I make another run.


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## dirtsailor2003

TwoCubDad said:


> Just finished packaging six pounds of salmon made with the above process.  EXCELLENT!  Good and salty and the texture is like butter.  Only issue I had (other than my family will devour six pounds of lox in half the time it took to prepare) is that I really couldn't get the smoke on as much as I would have liked.  Couldn't generate the smoke and still keep the fish temperature under 90d.  I've been reading up on AMNPS and will have one before I make another run.


What kind of smoker do you have? There are a bunch of mods one can do for cold smoking. The Amaze-N-Smoker products are great!


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## twocubdad

A 41" Smoke Hollow two door (actually one door, one drawer).  Overall, I've been very pleased with the smoker.  When I get it up and running, put the burner on low then let everything even out, it will settle in at about 220-225.    Hard to complain about that.  But it just doesn't work for the lox.


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## dirtsailor2003

TwoCubDad said:


> A 41" Smoke Hollow two door (actually one door, one drawer).  Overall, I've been very pleased with the smoker.  When I get it up and running, put the burner on low then let everything even out, it will settle in at about 220-225.    Hard to complain about that.  But it just doesn't work for the lox.


Look at getting a AMNTS, either the 18" or 12" (depending on the size of the interior of your smoker). I use mine all the time in my GOSM (Great Outdoor Smokey Mountain) for lox, cheese, butter, bacon, anything that needs cold smoke. During the fall and winter with just the AMNTS running and all vents open I rarely get above 70* in the smoke chamber. During the summer months I put the AMNTS in a mailbox that I have piped into the smoker. The temp of the smoke chamber then is whatever the outdoor temp is. I only cold smoke at night during the summer.

http://www.amazenproducts.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=AMNTS


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## dwaytkus

What kind of knife is that?


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## scraper

Love it, I used this exact recipe except that i substituted lake trout.  Lakers are actually a char and are quite oily which makes them perfect for smoking. 

My only question is will it keep if frozen?  I would like to vacuum seal some and save it.


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## dtsobel

Is cure actually needed?  I have a family of Migraine sufferers and we are trying to stay away from Sodium Nitrates which is why I am looking at doing my own lox.


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## pokey

Lox keeps fine vacuum sealed and frozen for months. We do it all the time.

Cure is not necessary. Salt alone is enough. We've found the cure changes the texture of the fish in a way we don't like, so as of today's batch, I've gone back to only salt.

Enjoy.


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## man0fsteel

Just finished reading this great tutorial. Thanks again for sharing and taking the time to show us newbs at cold smoking! Now if I can just find the time...


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## daves1811

I am going to try this recipe next week.  I have a buddy in a deployed location.  After I follow this recipe and vacuum seal it, is it safe to send unrefrigerated in the USPS or will it arrive ruined and unfit for consumption???


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## daveomak

daves1811 said:


> I am going to try this recipe next week. I have a buddy in a deployed location. After I follow this recipe and vacuum seal it, is it safe to send unrefrigerated in the USPS or will it arrive ruined and unfit for consumption???


It needs refrigeration......   read this about smoking fish......   http://seafood.ucdavis.edu/haccp/compendium/chapt07.htm   ....  Lots of good info on food safety in that link.....

Dave


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## leah elisheva

That's so very beautiful! Cheers! - Leah


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## daves1811

In your drying stage, do you leave the lid to the container off it sealed for the 36 hr???


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## twocubdad

So salmon was on sale last week and I have about 8 pounds in the fridge about half-way through drying.

This is my second run with this method and the first one was great.  My two sons, just home from college, went through the whole 10-pound batch in about four days.  Yeah, it was that good.

My only drawback was I didn't feel like I got much smoke on.  Could not get my 44" Smoke Hollow down low enough.  The temps kept spiking and I was afraid I would cook the fish.  I finally left the cabinet door open and just let it smoke free-style.

So for this run I bought an AMNTS.  Came home from the store with the fish, immediately ordered the tube and it arrived before the fish finished curing -- thanks Todd!  Here's my question.  With only the tube burning, do I need to worry about the temps at all?  Can I just light it, chuck it in the smoker and come back a few hours later or do I need to gear up with all the thermos and keep an eye on it?  I usually run with three thermos -- one in the cabinet and another one or two in the meat (depending on how much I'm smoking.)

Thoughts?


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## daveomak

TwoCubDad said:


> So salmon was on sale last week and I have about 8 pounds in the fridge about half-way through drying.
> 
> This is my second run with this method and the first one was great.  My two sons, just home from college, went through the whole 10-pound batch in about four days.  Yeah, it was that good.
> 
> My only drawback was I didn't feel like I got much smoke on.  Could not get my 44" Smoke Hollow down low enough.  The temps kept spiking and I was afraid I would cook the fish.  I finally left the cabinet door open and just let it smoke free-style.
> 
> So for this run I bought an AMNTS.  Came home from the store with the fish, immediately ordered the tube and it arrived before the fish finished curing -- thanks Todd!  Here's my question.  With only the tube burning, do I need to worry about the temps at all?  Can I just light it, chuck it in the smoker and come back a few hours later or do I need to gear up with all the thermos and keep an eye on it?  I usually run with three thermos -- one in the cabinet and another one or two in the meat (depending on how much I'm smoking.)
> 
> Thoughts?


Lox is not cooked..... Don't use heat.....   It is chemically cooked with salt and cure and sugar..... If you have the AMNTS running, keep the temp below 70 deg F.......

_From bbally's recipe in post #1_

_Once dry we are ready to smoke. The thing that makes lox is the mouth feel. So lox must be cold smoked. That is to say we take steps to insure the product never goes above 90 F while smoking. This is referred to as cold smoking. The nitrite has “cooked” the salmon and is rendered harmless as a nitrate. So all we are looking for here is: water removal, shrink the protien enough to tighten it up and during the tightening to have the protien pull in some smoke! I am smoking here under light smoke for 4 hours._


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## pokey

You can let it get close to 80* without cooking the fish. You only need to monitor the temp in the cabinet. I use the AMNPS and place a tray of ice above the AMNPS and below the fish to cool the rising smoke. Enjoy!


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## dan - firecraft

I am making some of this ASAP


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## twocubdad

Thanks.   So the second batch is in the ziplocs. Very, very good.  I love this recipe!  Two slight modifications -- first batch was a bit too salty for my tastes, so I bumped the desalinization time to two hours.  Using the AMNTS was the other.  As I said, the first batch didn't have much smoke at all.  So bumped smoke time to 5 hours.  I suppose I under estimated the amount of smoke the AMNTS puts out.  The smoke on this batch is a bit much -- not bad or bitter, just overpowers the flavor of the fish.  With the AMNTS I'll drop back to the recommended three hours.

As far as my question about monitoring the temps, I  just lit the AMNTS, put it on the bottom rack and forgot about it.  It was a cool day and every time I looked at the built-in thermo (which is way off anyway) it was never above 100.   The one thing I do like about the longer smoke time is the fish is much drier and firmer.

Next question -- now that I'm getting this method under my belt, can anyone give me some pointers on buying salmon?  I got this from the grocery at about $7/lbs. and have no idea what type of salmon it is.  There seems to be a fair bit of variation between pieces in terms of "grain" and texture.   This also seems to have a very thick strip of "dark meat" on the bone side.  What do you guys look for in good salmon?


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## daveomak

TCD, morning.....    Look for wild caught sockeye....  It's pricey but......  makes the absolute best lox there is..... second choice, wild caught anything....   IMHO, farm raised salmon is a poor choice...   bland flavor....   they artificially color the meat...      I would use it if there was no other choice...   add garlic, onion, dill and white pepper to help the flavor out...  

Dave


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## daves1811

I agree with the wild caught sockeye as the protein of choice.  I used farm raised Atlantic the first time and while it did take the smoke and it worked okay, I was a bit disappointed.  

I used wild sockeye the second time and it was 10X better, tasted amazing and it really took in the smoke, the Atlantic tasted like smokey sushi, the wild sockeye tastes like the lox that I was hoping for.


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## mds51

Has anyone ever used a light coating of Olive Oil or any other cooking oil on your Salmon before you cold smoke it for Lox? The last batch i smoked had a little harder coating on the tops of the fillets than I normally get  when cold smoking. It was a cool day and the smoker temperature never got even close to 100 degrees. Because of the cool temperature i did not put a frozen bottle of water inthe drip pan and this was the only difference in smoking this batch. Any advice or comments are appreciated.

mds51


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## daveomak

mds51 said:


> Has anyone ever used a light coating of Olive Oil or any other cooking oil on your Salmon before you cold smoke it for Lox? The last batch i smoked had a little harder coating on the tops of the fillets than I normally get when cold smoking. It was a cool day and the smoker temperature never got even close to 100 degrees. Because of the cool temperature i did not put a frozen bottle of water inthe drip pan and this was the only difference in smoking this batch. Any advice or comments are appreciated.
> 
> mds51


after you smoke it, coat if you must....   Your pellicle was too dry and formed too much...   a light pellicle is recommended.....   after the rinse and dry, maybe an hour under the fan and straight into the smoke....   the meat should be "tacky dry" and not "dry dry and shiny" like I do for kippered salmon to lock the moisture in....


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## mds51

Thanks Dave and what you said makes sense. I put the fillest in the refrigerator the night before to form the pellical and this must have been too much for this delicate flesh. I will cut down the drying time and see what happens.
Thanks 
mds51


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## thepackerbacker

I gave this a whirl, followed everything to the "T" and not sure where I went wrong. Prepared 5lbs of salmon which I caught about a month ago.

There are 2 things that I don't like, and I'm sure it's something I did so hoping someone out there can help me discover the issues.

#1 - Its super salty. In fact all I really taste is the salt. I soaked in saturated salt water for 30 min as was recommended and went through all the steps, desalination was done, soaking for 90 min as described at the end before drying in the fridge.

#2 - It's super smoky - maybe almost creosote smelling? I'm not entirely sure what creosote smells like but this fish doesn't have nice light smoky flavor/aroma like the other salmon I have smoked at higher temps. It almost "stings" your nose when you take a good whiff, if you know what I mean. The aroma has mellowed out since last night but I wonder if the smoke was hanging out in the smoker to long before exiting up the chimney? I let them in the smoker for 4 hours, cabinet temp was 56 degrees when i started and 76 degrees when i pulled them. I am using an AMNPS in a 1/2 size holding cabinet smoker.  My AMNPS burned fine the whole time and smoke was coming out the chimney. I have had over smoked food but this takes it to a whole new level. I checked the salmon at 2 hours and There did not appear to be much of any smoke aroma at that point.

I cant get past how salty this is...and if I was able to get over the saltiness then i would have trouble getting past the "smoky aroma" that is present. 

Please help, what did I do?













photo_1.jpg



__ thepackerbacker
__ Nov 18, 2013


















photo.jpg



__ thepackerbacker
__ Nov 18, 2013


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## daveomak

thepackerbacker said:


> I gave this a whirl, followed everything to the "T" and not sure where I went wrong. Prepared 5lbs of salmon which I caught about a month ago.
> 
> There are 2 things that I don't like, and I'm sure it's something I did so hoping someone out there can help me discover the issues.
> 
> #1 - Its super salty. In fact all I really taste is the salt. I soaked in saturated salt water for 30 min as was recommended and went through all the steps, desalination was done, soaking for 90 min as described at the end before drying in the fridge.
> 
> #2 - It's super smoky - maybe almost creosote smelling? I'm not entirely sure what creosote smells like but this fish doesn't have nice light smoky flavor/aroma like the other salmon I have smoked at higher temps. It almost "stings" your nose when you take a good whiff, if you know what I mean. The aroma has mellowed out since last night but I wonder if the smoke was hanging out in the smoker to long before exiting up the chimney? I let them in the smoker for 4 hours, cabinet temp was 56 degrees when i started and 76 degrees when i pulled them. I am using an AMNPS in a 1/2 size holding cabinet smoker.  My AMNPS burned fine the whole time and smoke was coming out the chimney. I have had over smoked food but this takes it to a whole new level. I checked the salmon at 2 hours and There did not appear to be much of any smoke aroma at that point.
> 
> I cant get past how salty this is...and if I was able to get over the saltiness then i would have trouble getting past the "smoky aroma" that is present.
> 
> Please help, what did I do?


PB, evening......   If have used this exact recipe... the fish came out perfect...  

I looked at all your pictures.....  I don't see any vents in the smoker.... 

When smoking any meat, you need lots of air flow to remove moisture from the meat and not have a lingering smoke to sour the fish.....  That causes a tingling taste on the tongue.... creosote.... 

I have seen too many manufacturers try and make an "oven" type smoker with no or inadequate venting....  Personally I don't care for their products...   they are trying to reinvent the wheel forgetting how to properly smoke food...  food that was smoked in a wooden shack that leaked air worse than the Titanic leaked water.....   You can't improve upon perfect.....

Your fish should be more translucent and all the blood should have been removed in the soaking/brining process ....  Did you process your fish frozen or partially frozen or in a refer that was set to 32-36 degrees...  When processing/curing meats, too cold of a temp will slow or stop the process...

Next time, please start a new thread when you are trying to get feed back .....  It really helps for you to get help....  this post of yours will get lost in the shuffle... 

Dave


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## mds51

Since I have taken a big interest in making Lox since i have joined the forum and have learned a lot I am going to give you my two cents as well. I Have done several batches of Lox and the results have all been very good. I do NOT do th salinating or brining step and still get quality and consistant results. I also use a lot of fresh lemon and orange zest and fresh dill and wrap two whole fillets up in plastic wrap and weigh them down for three days with turning them once during this time. The only mistake I made as you can see in the above threads is that I let the last batch sit in the fridge to form the pellical too long and had a litte too much form making a little skin on this batch. Dave came through with his usual good advice and I will cut the pellical time down considerablly.  As far as the smoking it is done in a MES and i only cold smoke with the AMNPS using Alder wood dust. If it is warm outside I use an ice bottle in the drip tray to keep it well below 100 degrees. We only smoke for threee hours and let the fillets sit under the kitchen exhaust hood to cool and mellow for an hour before slicing and vacuum bagging. The texture is perfect and the taste is rich and buttery. THe citrus zest and dill are there and soem fresh zest and dill can be put in the vacuum bag fo added flavor. Thanks to the forum and Todd Johnson and his products this is one of the best things my brother and I smoke and I have not bought Lox at the store since we have started this process. Also the results have been great from Salmon that has the skin on or off and from different  sources. Good Luck and the work to do it right is well worth it!!!

mds51


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## gamedemon

AWESOME Recipe... I unfortunately use cheap Sockeye from Costco... and our friends and Family scoop it faster than I can vacuum seal it ! I also use the AMNPS and follow the recipe to a T. Thank you !


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## bregent

FYI... Bay Area COSTCO's just got fresh wild copper river sockeye in stock - $13.99/lb. 

Picked up a 3lb pack and will be making this recipe this weekend.


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## bregent

Thanks to bbally and everyone else that contributed to this thread! The lox I made last weekend with the Copper River salmon turned out better than I ever imagined. It's at least as good as the Nova I had on a trip back home to NYC a few months ago. I followed the recipe almost exactly except for the drying stage - I reduced the drying time from 36 to 4 hours to avoid over-drying as some others had reported. I only freshened for 60 minutes because a taste test after cure had very little salt. I think it might not have picked up as much salt as expected because of the skin. I scored the skin but next time I think I will remove it completely before brining. Here are some pics.













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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


















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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


















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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


















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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


















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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


















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__ bregent
__ Jun 7, 2014


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## daveomak

Looks mighty good......    I love the flavor of "raw cooked" salmon....  so much better than "temp cooked"......   Nice job on the fish.....     
Sockeye makes the best lox.....  and Copper River is tops.....


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## leah elisheva

How delicious looking! Here's to yummy Copper River indeed! Cheers! - Leah


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## mark66

You are right about removing skin. Had mine in a fridge for 48 hrs and i had to take the skin and back in the fridge for at least 24 more hrs.The skin on this salmon is like bottom of my shoes.


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## mark66

3 days in the fridge. 3 hours of refresh and 6 hrs in the fridge with fan on. Turned out great and tastes good. One question I do have, when I buy lox at Sams club I don't need to slice it. It comes apart in layers like pealing an onion. Nice little sheets to put cream cheese on it , roll it and eat without bagel.Any suggestions? Maybe next batch just use belly part and cure it between 2 boards with lot of weight on it or use 2 clamps?


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## mdboatbum

This is a guess, bit I'd assume the stuff you get at SAMs is sliced on a slicer before its packaged. Every time I've bought lox that has been the case. Just slice yours with a VERY sharp thin bladed knife and you can get pretty close to the machine sliced.


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## mark66

I follow what you are saying but it's not sliced. Sliced would have straight cuts. this is like peeling an onion. When you bake a piece of salmon then press on it it falls apart with grain. I am having hard time explaining. Next time at sams I will take a closer look.

Thanks


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## mdboatbum

Ok I follow. I don't know what to tell you though. Not sure about the stuff you get at Sam's as I've never bought it there, but all the lox I've ever made doesn't flake apart as it's not cooked. Are you referring to the smoked salmon that comes in the foil pouch? If it's labeled as smoked salmon it'll usually be cooked and will flake apart. If it's labeled as Lox, Gravlax or Nova Lox it's usually sliced. Wish I had better answers for you but I'm at a loss as to how to get salmon as prepared following Bbally's method in this thread to flake like cooked salmon.


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## rgautheir20420

Mark66 said:


> I follow what you are saying but it's not sliced. Sliced would have straight cuts. this is like peeling an onion. When you bake a piece of salmon then press on it it falls apart with grain. I am having hard time explaining. Next time at sams I will take a closer look.
> 
> Thanks


Mark, I know exactly what you're talking about. The slices are of similar thickness but differing sizes and shapes. My only guess would be that when they make the slices for sam's style packaging, they don't trim up the salmon piece and they slice the whole filet from end to end very thinly. Doing it this way, you'd get differing sized pieces with a similar thickness because of how the filet it shaped.

Then they lay the piece together and shrink wrap very tightly. I have a feeling this process effects the way the slices meld together and makes it like peeling an onion as you're saying. 

Thoughts?


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## gibsorz

Safety question

Now, salmon is a frequent carrier of both roundworm and tapeworm...as are most fish. I see a lot of people making lox from 'fresh' Salmon from Costco or Sams club. The two ways I know to kill these parasites are
A) cook to IT of 145 (not an option)
B) Freeze the fish to -35 Celsius (-31 Farenheit) for 15 hours (as per my local CDC authorities). 

Nitrites are considered an insufficient method for parasite destruction. So is everyone just playing Russian roulette, or does Costco/SAMs club properly process the salmon ahead of time to properly destroy all parasites.


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## mbogo

Complete, total, Food Porn. I am so in!!!!!!


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## daveomak

gibsorz said:


> Safety question
> 
> Now, salmon is a frequent carrier of both roundworm and tapeworm...as are most fish. I see a lot of people making lox from 'fresh' Salmon from Costco or Sams club. The two ways I know to kill these parasites are
> A) cook to IT of 145 (not an option)
> B) Freeze the fish to -35 Celsius (-31 Farenheit) for 15 hours (as per my local CDC authorities).
> 
> Nitrites are considered an insufficient method for parasite destruction. So is everyone just playing Russian roulette, or does Costco/SAMs club properly process the salmon ahead of time to properly destroy all parasites.





http://seafoodhealthfacts.org/seafood_safety/patients/parasites.php

Parasites become a concern when consumers eat raw or lightly preserved fish such as sashimi, sushi, ceviche, and gravlax. When preparing these products, use commercially frozen fish. Alternatively, freeze the fish to an internal temperature of -4°F for at least 7 days to kill any parasites that may be present. Home freezers are usually between 0°F and 10°F and may not be cold enough to kill the parasites.

You can adjust your freezer to -4 F....

http://seafood.oregonstate.edu/.pdf Links/Parasites-FDA-Hazards-Guide-FDA.pdf


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## gibsorz

DaveOmak said:


> Alternatively, freeze the fish to an internal temperature of -4°F for at least 7 days to kill any parasites that may be present.



Thanks Dave! Yea I knew there were safe ways to do it at higher temp, just didn't know what the specifics were. But, unless I missed it in the OP and subsequent posts, it is not mentioned in this thread at all. People always mention "use cure #1 at this ratio" in all their recipes...the "make sure to freeze it to -4f for 7 days", is along the same lines and should be mentioned no?


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## daveomak

gibsorz said:


> Thanks Dave! Yea I knew there were safe ways to do it at higher temp, just didn't know what the specifics were. But, unless I missed it in the OP and subsequent posts, it is not mentioned in this thread at all. People always mention "use cure #1 at this ratio" in all their recipes...the "make sure to freeze it to -4f for 7 days", is along the same lines and should be mentioned no?



That's -4 for 30  7 days I think....  Wild pig recommends 30 days I think...

Most folks can't get "Fresh fish".... Those folks that are fortunate enough to get fresh fish, usually have some idea of worms, bacteria and botulism possibilities....  
Frozen fish, from a processor is "Blast Frozen" at around -35, or something like that, to maintain the cellular integrity of the meat, and the fish is as close to fresh as you can get...  

On the other hand, being the devil's advocate, consumers have some responsibility to verify recipes using reputable sources before preparing meats....

On this forum, members do their best to provide accurate recipes that, for the most part, will provide meat that is safe for human consumption...   We can't anticipate every condition that may arise....  such as gluten, peanut or red dye allergies...  

We DO anticipate things like botulism possibilities, routine bacteria and pathogens when smoking and cooking temperatures of products...  The disclaimers may not appear in EVERY thread or recipe, but, reading many threads will provide a wealth of information.. most everything has been covered, in this forum, at least once....   The search bar at the top of the page, is a valuable resource for searching out "obscure" questions.....  

This thread has some good info.....  I did a search....  http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/newsearch?search=worms+in+fish&=Search

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/110203/hot-smoked-salmon-and-worms

I am making pickled salmon as I type...  It was in pure, dry pickling salt for 4 months in the fridge....  Now it is in vinegar/sugar/water...  spices etc...  Hopefully the Water Activity, then the Acidic environment did all the nasties in....   I'm not looking at the fish...  It goes on a cracker and "DOWN THE HATCH".....  I love it, and parasites are the least of my problems...  Dave loves pickled sockeye....   here piggy piggy  piggy...  don't get between the pickled sockeye jar and Dave... 

Did I digress.....   OK....  I think anyone that eats "raw" stuff has a good idea of what's going on with their food, like you do...  and me....  and most raw food eaters....   

We try to anticipate problems....  we ask questions....  we can't catch or intercept every situation.....

OUR MEMBERS DO A PRETTY DARN GOOD JOB.....  IMO.....  OK FOLKS....  PAT YOURSELVES ON THE BACK.....


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## daveomak

The statement below has me confused......  


Freezing and storing at an ambient temperature of -4°F (-20°C) or below for 7 days (total time), or freezing at an ambient temperature of -31°F (-35°C) or below until solid and storing at an ambient temperature of -31°F (-35°C) or below for 15 hours, or freezing at an ambient temperature of -31°F (-35°C) or below until solid and storing at an ambient temperature of -4°F (-20°C) or below for 24 hours are sufficient to kill parasites. Note that these conditions may not be suitable for freezing particularly large fish (e.g., thicker than 6 inches).


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## gibsorz

i think basically
Freeze to -4f and hold at -4f = 7 days
Blast freeze then hold at -4f = 24 hours
Blast freeze and kept at that temp (-31f) = 15 hours. 

Pig is longer...same with bear...Trich roundworm is quite cold resistant...but then I sometimes just get the tongue tested instead then don't worry about it if it comes back negative (never had a bear come back positive for trich yet)

A little extra time doesn't hurt and blast frozen is probably best case scenario because as you said, it maintains the integrity of the meat better. 

Also Dave, I deal with the bottom 5% of the population 95% of the time with work...and people are lazy. This is an open forum, not members only to view this. There are enough people out there who would read 1 thread (or even just the OP) go to Wally world, buy almost expired fish and make Lox. But I guess that falls in the natural selection side of things.  

With the amount that you cured/salted that salmon there would be no concern. As you stated, parasites are a concern only with raw or lightly preserved products...you preserve the crap out of that pickled salmon. Have you done a post about your pickled salmon (off to the search bar I go, sounds very good)


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## daveomak

I think I did in a "lox and pickled salmon" thread....  I'll check....   I didn't take any pics of this process...  but here's the product waiting a few weeks in the pickle....  been in 12 days now .... another weeks or so and ...........


The container was too big and too much pickle left over so, I had to throw in more white onions.....  














Pickled Sockeye 2014-10-11.JPG



__ daveomak
__ Oct 11, 2014








http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/132447/sockeye-lox-and-pickled-bballys-lox-recipe


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## bregent

>Then they lay the piece together and shrink wrap very tightly. I have a feeling this process effects the way

>the slices meld together and makes it like peeling an onion as you're saying. 

Yeah, I agree that's probably what's happening. I slice mine thin - then vacuum seal and freeze. I'm not careful about getting all of the pieces lined up so they get all smooshed together in a random arrangement. After opening it looks like one solid piece of fish, and you need to hunt around a bit to find the edges to peel away. But it won't peel apart in layers unless it's been sliced.

BTW, since my post back in March I made a few more batches. On those, I did remove the skin and got better results.  I was also very careful to trim away all of the grey flesh as I don't like the strong flavor it has. Alas, I only have about 1lb left in the freezer :(


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## mike w

Bumping this excellent recipe. I've got two fillets drying in the fridge at the moment. Smoking Wednesday morning with a bunch of ice under the fish. Hopefully it'll be nice and cold enough to keep the temp below 90


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## mdboatbum

Good idea to bump it. This is the best Lox recipe/method I've ever tried.


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## mike w

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__ mike w
__ Dec 16, 2014


















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__ mike w
__ Dec 16, 2014






Two hours smoking so far, I don't think I'll make it to the 4 hour mark with the amount of ice I've been using to keep it cool. The traeger runs a bit too hot. I'm shooting for three hours of smoke and will pull it. Turned out that today was colder than tomorrow's forecast. The salmon felt tacky to the touch when I checked it. Fingers crossed!


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## mike w

KINDLE_CAMERA_1417598139000.jpg



__ mike w
__ Dec 17, 2014





Taste test is simply amazing. Although the capers and spring onions overpowered the salmon a bit. Vacuum packed the rest and will be serving some for Christmas and a work party this Saturday.


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## roygbiv14

Sorry if this has been asked before, but I am new to this exciting world of cured meats. I have followed Bbally's lox recipe exactly so far, except I only used 1 filet instead of 2. I am concerned that 1 tsp of cure #1 will be too much (the salt and sugar mix at 1/2 cup I'm sure is fine) for just 1 filet of salmon. Does anyone have any insight on this? Do I need to throw out and start over with 1/2 tsp of cure #1? Thanks in advance for your help.


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## la122685

roygbiv14 said:


> Sorry if this has been asked before, but I am new to this exciting world of cured meats. I have followed Bbally's lox recipe exactly so far, except I only used 1 filet instead of 2. I am concerned that 1 tsp of cure #1 will be too much (the salt and sugar mix at 1/2 cup I'm sure is fine) for just 1 filet of salmon. Does anyone have any insight on this? Do I need to throw out and start over with 1/2 tsp of cure #1? Thanks in advance for your help.


The first time I used this recipe I only used on filet that was about 2.5 lbs and it came out great!  I have another filet (this time 3.5 lbs) that will be going on the smoker early morning today.


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## gibsorz

Starting this today, have had the salmon in my chest freezer for a week on low to kill all the nasty critters.


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## cmayna

Cold smoked lox = yum!   Per some of the previous replies, I do not remove the skin.  Instead, I slit it in different places to help allow the brine to enter into the meat.

Apple is a wonderful wood to use when cold smoking Lox.


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## oscuba

That is what I have been looking for. Thank you so much! Yes, the desalination step is not in any of my many recipes.

I use a  [if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings>  <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]A-MAZE-N-TUBE-SMOKER for cold smoking and adding smoke in other cooking. Give it a look.

Cowboy? like Cowboy Music? Here is a wonderful voice and highly professional recordings, Paul Larson Cowboy Music. Great band, silky voice. I grew up with Paul in a farming town town with no cowboys. Great guy who became a true cowboy. Enjoy!

http://www.plcowboymusic.com/

Bob in Minneapolis


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## threemuch

Doing this with a side of spring chinook caught yesterday.













20150404_131418.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Apr 5, 2015


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## daveomak

threemuch said:


> Doing this with a side of spring chinook caught yesterday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 20150404_131418.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ threemuch
> __ Apr 5, 2015




Looks like you are fishing on the Cowlitz River....     Nice king....


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## gibsorz

threemuch said:


> Doing this with a side of spring chinook caught yesterday.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 20150404_131418.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ threemuch
> __ Apr 5, 2015



Springs already? They probably aren't going to run here until June, and I cant fish for them until July 1st at the earliest. Jealous.


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## threemuch

gibsorz said:


> Springs already? They probably aren't going to run here until June, and I cant fish for them until July 1st at the earliest. Jealous.



We have a limited hatchery retention  only fishery for spring run and can start as early as February.   We have separate summer and fall fish runs.  Springers live in the river until fall spawning without feeding so they have an incredible fat content and loads of oil.  Commercially,the fish go for 20 to 25 a pound.  I am smart,first try at a recipe with a 100 dollar slab of fish I spent 100s or 1000s to obtain.  Why not?

This was on the Columbia near the downriver end of caterpillar island. On the hook sardine wrapped mag lip 5 in double trouble. Hooked 5 landed this one in two days of fishing.


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## threemuch

I am following this recipe, but I decided to leave skin on and pin bones in until the end. Right now, I have the fillet normalized for porosity, dry rubbed and brining under a weighted tub.  Should be ready for cold smoke tomorrow night.  Should be cool and raining, so I should be able to load the smoker up with ice and get my cold smoke on.

It's my first crack at this, hope I don't trash a bunch of super-prime fish.

Does anyone know the actual purpose of the weight?


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## daveomak

To press the moisture from the fish....    Intensifies the flavor...   a little goes a long ways...  


When loading ice, be sure it is in the form of "ice in a bottle" so you aren't adding humidity.... only cold air....


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## threemuch

To the music? of LMFAO's "Shots"...LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX LOX...EVERYBODY!













LOX.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Apr 9, 2015






It really exceeded my expectations. Silky smooth, just the right amount of smoking flavor, and the citrus from the zest comes through and gives you a clean pallet, with just enough smokey flavor and aroma lingering on your tongue and fingers.

Interestingly, I expected alot of oil to be coming out and there is NONE. Not sure I understand why, but I like it. I sliced up enough for everyone for breakfast, and saw not a drip of oil.

I think the color is not ideal, but when you start with a nook, it's not going to look like a red. 

Of course the fish are biting now, and I am triple booked.  Ugh.


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## daveomak

For a chinook, it looks pretty darn good to me....    Some of the "cheaters" add beet juice for color... just to get a higher price....


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## threemuch

Doing this again.  Spring Chinook, this time doing the dry cure in a vacuum bag with a weight on it.  Is there any need for air while I brine?  I have a chamber packer, so I do alot of brining in vacuum bags.  So far no issue, but this is only my second attempt at lox.













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__ threemuch
__ Apr 30, 2015






Key ingredient, one nice little fishy.













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__ threemuch
__ Apr 30, 2015






Hot smoked the bones and collar while I dry brine the lox.













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__ threemuch
__ Apr 30, 2015






These yielded about 2 pounds of hot smoked salmon meat.  I put some seasoning salt and brown sugar on them and slapped them on the weber with indirect heat and an AMNPS for an hour.  Picked with a fork and whipped into some cream cheese and spread on crackers, it disappears pretty fast.


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## threemuch

Finished.   













20150503_123059.jpg



__ threemuch
__ May 3, 2015





I like the texture of the air brine better.


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## leah elisheva

BEAUTIFUL!!!!! Cheers! - Leah


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## jerseyhunter

Just thought I give this a bump.


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## threemuch

Finishing up the 4 day process to make nova lox. It's cool enough to cold smoke now, and I have been patiently waiting.  I nearly blew the whole batch. I woke up and fired up the smoke generator and put it in the smoker. Cool, crisp, no chance of having any temp problems. Nice breeze too, that should help. I was going to split the batch but conditions are good for cold smoking, I can do it all in one. It's my third try, I'm an expert now!













20150927_090529.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015






Firing up the smoker!

I load the fish. It's beautiful. Two days dry brine, 2 hour desal, 36 hours air dry. Only four hours of cold smoke to go.













20150927_091903.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015






The smoker is running fine, everything is great. I check it every 15 min or so. An hour goes by.  Hey, does that temp display say 90? Who changed that to Farenheit? And how did it get so hot? Whoa. That's not F. it's C!

The breeze has created a bit of venturi on some of my air outlets, and there was WAY too much airflow. Not a big deal, until the pellets in the smoke generator burst into flames.  I felt like the Martian (which is a great book by the way, can't wait to see the movie!)

I had no idea how long this had been going on. I grab the grill grate and yank it out, getting some nice 2nd degree burns on my fingers in the process.  Nice. Blisters make good souveniers.  

The fish looks OK, but is sweating a bit. Thin edges look cooked. Dangit!













20150927_131321.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015






I pulled the smallest, thinnest piece off and attempted to cut it. It crumbled. It tasted OK, but nobody wants to do a 4 day cooking process and get something that just tastes OK. It wasn't what I wanted. I went off to be by myself for a while.













20150927_120948.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015






Dear god...no...

Eventually, I set the smoker back up, sealed the vents better and finished the cold smoke.

In the end, the thicker pieces are ok. The thinner coho was a bit crumbly, but only on the edges and still had good texture and flavor.

Near miss.













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__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015


















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__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015


















20150927_134323.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 27, 2015






There's the finished product ready for gifting.


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## threemuch

One more thing, anyone have any ideas on long term storage of the product of this recipe?  Refridgerator or freezer?  Shelf life in each?


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## threemuch

And here's my lightly fried fingies.  













20150928_093325.jpg



__ threemuch
__ Sep 28, 2015


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## bregent

Ouch. Had a similar thing happen recently with bacon. I was cold smoking in my GOSM with mailbox mod. As there's not much draft with a cold smoke, I hung a little muffin fan outside the mailbox to keep airflow going. Seem to work well. An hour later I looked out the window and saw huge amounts of smoke. Ran out and found flames shooting outside the mailbox, and the muffin fan blades were starting to melt! Luckily with bacon, higher temps are not that critical. 

The crumbly pieces of salmon may not be lox, but probably still tasted great. Hope your fingers heal up quickly.


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## jay1340

I ended up with what looks and feels like Salmon Jerky?

WTH????

Haven't even thought of smoking it yet.

Wild caught Coho.


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## daveomak

Jay1340 said:


> I ended up with what looks and feels like Salmon Jerky?
> WTH????
> Haven't even thought of smoking it yet.
> Wild caught Coho.




I'm going to take a guess....  You put too much weight on the fish....   I did the same thing first batch...    Very hard fish...   Other that that, I followed the recipe EXACTLY....


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## daveomak

threemuch said:


> One more thing, anyone have any ideas on long term storage of the product of this recipe?  Refridgerator or freezer?  Shelf life in each?



I wrap the fish is saran, freeze solid, then vac pack....  Be sure to cut open the vac-bag before you thaw the fish, or the fish will be crushed...


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## jay1340

DaveOmak said:


> I'm going to take a guess.... You put too much weight on the fish.... I did the same thing first batch... Very hard fish... Other that that, I followed the recipe EXACTLY....


Thanks.


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## lil tom

It looks like this thread has been around for a long time. Which is great because, to me, it seems like a great method that works and its longevity is a testament to its success. I am trying it this week and cant wait until its done on Sunday. I am sure you have heard it before but thanks for posting this. Its going into my smoker recipe box.


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## tropics

This is a great post I followed it pretty close, I left the skin on and did not use Orange. I used Dill on the fillet when I cured them and added some while they smoked.Just pulled out of the smoker.

Richie


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## dstar26t

I prepped some wild caught Sockeye last night.  3 fillets weighing 1460 g total after skinning.  I followed the 1 tsp cure #1 to 5 lbs of meat recommendation (156 ppm) which was 3.64 g of cure #1.  I also scaled the salt and sugar back 36% since the fillets bbally used are guessed to be 2.5 lbs each or 5 lbs (2268 g) total.  What I noticed was that after dredging the 3 fillets through the dry cure (both sides of the fillets), there was really no cure left so I applied the zest and the weight and they are sitting cold now.  Should I add more salt & sugar or reduce the desalinating time?  Maybe I'm an aggressive dredger or the surface area to weight ratio being higher matters...I have 3 fillets that weigh less than the OP's 2. 

Thanks,

Nate













Sockeye.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 17, 2016


















Sockeye skinned.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 17, 2016


















Sockeye cure.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 17, 2016


















Sockeye weighted.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 17, 2016


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## daveomak

I think you are fine....  Bob's recipe calls for keeping the meat cold so the porosity of the meat is consistent from batch to batch....  I would think, doing that the salt adsorption will be regulated by the cold temp of the meat...     Desalination using ice cold water will regulate the salt removal also...   During the ice water desalination, he recommends tasting the water to get a feel for how much is removed....   Since Bob is a professional cook and in his catering business he probably does lox at least once a month, he can probably tell pretty close what's been removed.....

I have made lox probably30-40 times using a different recipe...  In my experience, the 50-50 salt/sugar will very much help with the saltiness...   Follow Bob's steps, made really accurate notes for the next batch...   This batch should be close to perfect but you will still be able to adjust...


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## SmokinAl

dstar26t said:


> I prepped some wild caught Sockeye last night.  3 fillets weighing 1460 g total after skinning.  I followed the 1 tsp cure #1 to 5 lbs of meat recommendation (156 ppm) which was 3.64 g of cure #1.  I also scaled the salt and sugar back 36% since the fillets bbally used are guessed to be 2.5 lbs each or 5 lbs (2268 g) total.  What I noticed was that after dredging the 3 fillets through the dry cure (both sides of the fillets), there was really no cure left so I applied the zest and the weight and they are sitting cold now.  Should I add more salt & sugar or reduce the desalinating time?  Maybe I'm an aggressive dredger or the surface area to weight ratio being higher matters...I have 3 fillets that weigh less than the OP's 2.
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I have had the same problem using Bob's recipe. I just increased the salt & sugar keeping it 50-50. Then I had plenty of cure for the dredge.

Al


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## dstar26t

DaveOmak said:


> During the ice water desalination, he recommends tasting the water to get a feel for how much is removed....   Since Bob is a professional cook and in his catering business he probably does lox at least once a month, he can probably tell pretty close what's been removed..


Thanks Dave & Al.

Bob mentions, "In my younger days of curing I would collect the water sample every 15 minutes and use a specific gravity bulb to measure the amount of salt removed from the product."

I have the tools to do this.  I assume the residual salt level in the fish is a personal preference thing but maybe there's a % w/w rough guideline?  I know how much salt I put in and I can measure how much is in the volume of water I use to desalinate as the process progresses.


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## SmokinAl

That's way over my head, but I can say that I have used this recipe many times and have never had lox that was too salty. Some times I have overdone the smoke part. The fish takes on smoke real fast so that's the part I would be careful with.

Al


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## bregent

Determining the salt level in the fish by tasting the water probably takes a lot of experience to master.  And testing with a hydrometer is probably difficult as well. Remember you'll have both salt and sugar in the solution and they migrate in and out of meat at different rates. Just taste some of the salmon before you smoke. If too salty, then desalinate and keep tasting every 30 minutes or so. Last time I made this, I rinsed and tasted after curing and salt level was perfect so I did not desalinate at all.


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## dstar26t

bregent said:


> Determining the salt level in the fish by tasting the water probably takes a lot of experience to master.  And testing with a hydrometer is probably difficult as well. Remember you'll have both salt and sugar in the solution and they migrate in and out of meat at different rates. Just taste some of the salmon before you smoke. If too salty, then desalinate and keep tasting every 30 minutes or so. Last time I made this, I rinsed and tasted after curing and salt level was perfect so I did not desalinate at all.


Oh, I forgot about the sugar that will be in solution.  There's no way I could estimate how much salt is in the fish with a hydrometer then.  Thanks for the reminder.  I guess after doing the recipe many times the same way, Bob figured out a target hydrometer reading that equates to a finished flavor profile.  Then did it by taste memory eventually.

I'll taste the salmon before desalinating tonight, thanks for the guidance.  I'll err on the side of less salt since it's easy to add later.


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## dstar26t

I rinsed the salmon last night and tasted it.  A little too salty.  It tasted good after a 30 minute ice water soak so I removed them and they're set up drying.  The side the skin was on is a little tough compared to the rest but it tasted really great, excited to get some smoke on them.  Cut up one filet and it's pickling using DaveOmak's recipe.













Sockeye drying.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 19, 2016


















Sockeye pickled.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 19, 2016


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## daveomak

dstar, morning....  I guess I neglected to mention to layer the fish with the onions...  that keeps a pathway for the brine to wiggle through the pieces...    It's not too late to do that.....     

Sorry.....

Dave


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## dstar26t

Ah, ok.  I thought you were using the onions to help keep the fish submerged.


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## gbudd

New to the forum, and this is terrific! Thank you for sharing such great knowledge


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## dstar26t

Cold smoked the Salmon yesterday morning for 4 hours and served some at a dinner party last night on freshly made mini bagels with cream cheese and onion...big hit.  This recipe/process is awesome.













Lox mini bagels.JPG



__ dstar26t
__ Feb 21, 2016






Nate


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## daveomak

Excellent.....   Looks awesome.....  I'd for sure eat it....   all of it.....   

Dave


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## hoity toit

DaveOmak said:


> I wrap the fish is saran, freeze solid, then vac pack.... Be sure to cut open the vac-bag before you thaw the fish, or the fish will be crushed...


Very good point, never thought about that Dave. I'll try to remember that even f my memory fails me. Thanks.

HT


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## jakester

Pro Tip: Porosity; all meats have porosity, for consistant products we like to know that the porosity is the same everytime. So I always brine my salmon fillets in ice cold salt water for 30 minutes to insure I start with the same porosity every time. Fail to do so at your own peril! (one gallon warm water, stir in all the salt it will take, (til salt lay on the bottom) and then ice it down to 32 F)






Zest an orange and a lemon and reserve the zest.
Dredge the salmon through the mixture. Spread half of the remaining cured mixture on the area where the salmon fillets will lay. Then spread half the orange and lemon zest under the area you will place the salmon. Now lay the fillets flat in a plastic box on top of the zested cure area. After fillet placement spread the remaining mixture over the salmon evenly, then use the remaining zest to coat the top of the fillets.

I have a few questions about this recipe. 

1. about how much salt is needed in the 1 gallon or warm water to cold the salmon in? 

2. does the zest from the orange and lemon give it a citrusy flavor? What would I lose if i don't do this or is this necessary?


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## SmokinAl

jakester said:


> Pro Tip: Porosity; all meats have porosity, for consistant products we like to know that the porosity is the same everytime. So I always brine my salmon fillets in ice cold salt water for 30 minutes to insure I start with the same porosity every time. Fail to do so at your own peril! (one gallon warm water, stir in all the salt it will take, (til salt lay on the bottom) and then ice it down to 32 F)
> 
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> Dredge the salmon through the mixture. Spread half of the remaining cured mixture on the area where the salmon fillets will lay. Then spread half the orange and lemon zest under the area you will place the salmon. Now lay the fillets flat in a plastic box on top of the zested cure area. After fillet placement spread the remaining mixture over the salmon evenly, then use the remaining zest to coat the top of the fillets.
> 
> I have a few questions about this recipe.
> 
> 1. about how much salt is needed in the 1 gallon or warm water to cold the salmon in?
> 
> 2. does the zest from the orange and lemon give it a citrusy flavor? What would I lose if i don't do this or is this necessary?


I answered this in my lox thread.

Al


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## jakester

Just came upon this article, sounds like cold smoking is more dangerous than what most people think. 

http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/cold_smoking.html


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## daveomak

jakester said:


> Just came upon this article, sounds like cold smoking is more dangerous than what most people think.
> 
> http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/cold_smoking.html


Jakester, morning....  Don't believe everything Meathead puts in print...


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## jakester

Good Morning Dave! (afternoon here in PA) I just posted the article to remind everyone to be extremely careful with cured / smoked meats. I know a lot of people don't believe in using cure #1 and i was debating about it too but after reading the article i will be using cure #1 for sure. 

Another thing to remind people is to be careful where you get your salmon from and how it is handled.


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## daveomak

Your right about folks not understanding the necessity of using nitrites...   take the time to read the ingredients on vac packed meats at the market... they all have nitrite listed as the last ingredient...

Meathead could have explained the necessity for using cure #1 without the scare tactics...    I cold smoke stuff below 70 deg. F .. cure #1 is a must have.....

I add cure #1 to ALL fish I smoke...  I learned that here....   for years that never happened...  Just lucky I guess...  I hate trusting my life and loved ones lives to luck...    Reason being, I never smoke fish in a smoker above 160....  the meat is too delicate and can be overcooked so easy...


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## jakester

hot smoked salmon is good but cold smoked salmon is amazing, I could eat it all day, everyday.


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## jakester

One of our local supermarkets has a special this week for Alaskan Wild Sockeye Salmon fresh, never frozen for $9.99 a pound. I thought about buying some and cold smoking it but I am thinking previously frozen Salmon is probably a lot safer for cold smoking, right?


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## hardwoodalchemy

I am hoping to do some nova lox in the not too distant future.

With regard to the brining / curing process (air + weight vs. foodsaver vacuum bag), is there a consensus on the "best way"? All other things being equal, I would _prefer_ to use a vacuum bag because of limited fridge space. I noticed that *threemuch indicated that he liked the texture of the air brined better* -- does anyone else have opinions about this?

I would prefer the end product to be relatively firm -- neither mushy nor flaky -- something that can be sliced paper thin and still hold together...


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## calgaryhhr

Made some smoked salmon for Christmas, which I've done in previous years as well, but this year I used Pink Salmon instead of Sockeye. I sliced some of the salmon and I noticed that in the thickest portion, where the greyish meat tends to be, the meat is a really deep red, almost purple, color. I've never seen this before with smoked salmon but I've never used Pink Salmon so I'm not sure if that is characteristic of that species. Is the color abnormal and something I should be worried about? Did something go wrong in my process possibly?


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## daveomak

The meat and fat on wild salmon, picks up the color of the food they are eating...  The greyish meat, next to the skin, is a layer of fat that is high in Omega fatty acids...   I'd eat it..  
[h3]Feeding Ecology[/h3]
Since young pink salmon migrate immediately to the ocean, they generally do not eat as they leave freshwater. For the few populations that spawn much further up large rivers, young pink salmon may eat aquatic insects as they travel to saltwater. In the ocean, pink salmon feed on plankton, other smaller fish, squid, and the occasional aquatic insect. The tiny marine crustaceans pink salmon eat are what give their flesh its pink color. As with all members of the salmon family, when they return to freshwater to spawn, they stop eating.

*So why is wild salmon a deeper red than farmed salmon?*

Unlike beef, which acquires its distinct red hue from contact with oxygen in the air, salmon meat gains its color through the fish’s diet. Out in the ocean, salmon eat lots of small free-floating crustaceans, such as tiny shrimp. These crustaceans are filled with molecules called carotenoids, which show up as pigments all over the tree of life. In fact, if you’ve ever known a kid who turned orange from eating too many carrots, you’ve seen carotenoids in action. It’s these carotenoids that account for the reddish color of the salmon, as well as the pink color of flamingoes and the red of a boiled lobster.

Farmed salmon, however, aren’t fed crustaceans. Instead, they eat dry pellets that look like dog food. According to the Atlantic Canada Fish Farmers Association, salmon chow includes ingredients such as “soybean meal, corn gluten meal, canola meal, wheat gluten and poultry by-products.” Carotenoids, which are also essential for regular growth, can also be added to help give the fish its distinctive color.


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## atomicsmoke

"soybean meal, corn gluten meal, canola meal, wheat gluten and poultry by-products"
____
They eat ready to eat boxed stuff from the grocery store?


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## daveomak

Atomic, morning.....   Pink salmon aren't farm raised...  They are a 2 year cycle wild fish...  

I agree that farm raised "salmon" eat the same thing you and I eat...  BLAH !!!!!!


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## atomicsmoke

DaveOmak said:


> Atomic, morning.....   Pink salmon aren't farm raised...  They are a 2 year cycle wild fish...
> 
> I agree that farm raised "salmon" eat the same thing you and I eat...  BLAH !!!!!!


They got a good gig going...Until their last day.


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## meatsweats86

Maybe a dumb question maybe not.......Can you cold smoke salmon caught in Lake Michigan which are considered "fresh water" and would it be safe even if using cure?  I know you cant or at least shouldn't eat any fresh water fish raw for sushi, so I wasn't sure if cold smoking or curing would be any different. I have had hot smoked fresh water salmon which is great, but never heard or seen fresh water lox??


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## daveomak

I don't know why not...   Follow this recipe to a "T" and you should be good to go....   I've used this recipe and it is very good.....


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## SmokinAl

The other thing I do when I make lox is to freeze it after it's made for 30 days at -10 degrees.

This will kill any parasites in the fish that the cure won't.

It's probably overkill, but I do it anyway.

Al


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## jakester

My lox would never make it to the freezer before it's all gone.


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## pitbulmom

Love the instructions! Saved in my "Smoker Recipes" file. Just sad the pics are not coming thru! Gonna have to try this!


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## bahfotl

I too am wondering why the original images on the op aren't coming through. Could it be the Photo bucket fiasco?


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## ryan141

Made this over the past few days!  Turned out fantastic.


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