# to skin or not to skin the chicken parts



## chorizodahitman (Oct 24, 2011)

I love the taste of skin on my chicken, but the thighs I smoked last weekend the skin was tough.  I enjoyed it, and all the chicken was gone in a matter of minutes, but just curious if anyone pulls the skin off before they smoke.  The meat from the brine and the smoke was AMAZING!!!!  Going to smoke some more drumsticks for the Broncos/Lions tailgate this Sunday and want to improve every time I fire it up.  Your help is much appreciated.


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## michael ark (Oct 24, 2011)

Sometimes i use a mini torch to firm up the skin .


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## chadinclw (Oct 24, 2011)

I've done skinless and didn't like the surface texture. I'd rather put rub under the skin, cook skin on, and remove the skin. That fat and the skin itself really protect the meat during a slow cook session.


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## rbranstner (Oct 24, 2011)

I leave it on. I know what you meat about getting tough skin though. Normally I was smoking my birds at around 225-250 and the skin was soft so I wanted to get it a little more crispy so I ran the smoker at around 275 and the skin was like shoe leather. What I have found works best is to run the smoker around 225-250 and then run them at around 325 for the last little bit to crisp up the skin or even just throw them on a grill to crisp the skin. Or just run them at around 325-350 the whole time to get the skin nice and crispy.


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## SmokinAl (Oct 24, 2011)

As Ross said you really have 2 choices for poultry, either low & slow (225-250), then hot at the end (350) for a few minutes or 325 the whole way. I've done it both ways & the results are very similar. The chicken is juicy with crispy skin. A little olive oil rubbed on before smoking also helps.


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## alelover (Oct 24, 2011)

I like cooking with the skin on low and slow and then removing the skin.


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## tank (Oct 24, 2011)

I have been smoking mine lately with the skin off.  I usually do quarters, legs or just thighs.  Anyways I brine them then run the smoker around 275 or so.  I did a batch with half of the legs skin on and the other with skin off.  What I found out is the smoke penetration with the skin off was almost to the bone.  The smoke penetration with the skin on was maybe halfway through the meat.  The one with the skin on were a little bit more juicy but the ones with the skin off still had plenty of juice.  So weighing the options I still go with skin off.  I say give it a try and see what happens.


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## chorizodahitman (Oct 24, 2011)

Awesome thanks for all the advice everyone.  I appreciate it!!!!


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## SmokinAl (Oct 24, 2011)

Let us know what you decide & don't forget your camera!


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## pops6927 (Oct 24, 2011)

You don't realize how unhealthy poultry skin is until you 'look under the hood' so to speak... this is pure fat!  :








Now, I've enjoyed meat and fat for most my life, but you have to pay the piper too:







http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Endarterectomy

*Endarterectomy*  is a surgical procedure  to remove the atheromatous _plaque_  material, or blockage, in the lining of an arteryconstricted by the buildup of soft/hardening deposits. It is carried out by separating the plaque from the arterial wall.  

The procedure is widely used on the carotid  artery of the neck as a way to reduce the risk of stroke, particularly when the carotid artery is narrowed by more than 70%. A carotid endarterectomy  may itself cause a stroke at the time of operation.

I've now had a total of 4 known strokes and MRI's show i've had smaller, older ones I hadn't even realized.  The stroke on 09/09 prompted the above procedure and I was totally unresponsive for 8 hours, they thought they'd lost me then.  The last one was a week ago; had severe bed spins then lost the ability to shave last Saturday; couldn't control or orientate the razor, trying to shave with the back instead of the blade of the razor, etc.  They may make me go in for another $2,000 MRI tomorrow.

My advice?  Go skinless.  Is a bit more flavor worth the money? (total bill so far this stroke: $63,000..).  

And, it's not over yet, have a 70% chance of another major stroke in 6 months.  

Please protect yourself, eat responsibly, I haven't and am paying for it.

But, there are plenty of good, wholesome recipes on here that are addressing these issues and once I (once again) recover financially, I will continue trying to find ways to make our hobby healthier!  I promise!

Sorry to the forum not to sugarcoat this (can't - I'm diabetic too!)


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## chorizodahitman (Oct 25, 2011)

Sorry for your health problems.  Thanks for the advice.


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## fpnmf (Oct 25, 2011)

chorizodahitman said:


> Please do not hijack threads. Sorry for your health problems. A simple I pull the skins off for health reasons would have worked.




Well...being rude sure makes it all ok doesn't it???

Didn't look like a hijack to me..

  Have a great day!!

Craig


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## bigfish98 (Oct 25, 2011)

rbranstner said:


> I leave it on. I know what you meat about getting tough skin though. Normally I was smoking my birds at around 225-250 and the skin was soft so I wanted to get it a little more crispy so I ran the smoker at around 275 and the skin was like shoe leather. What I have found works best is to run the smoker around 225-250 and then run them at around 325 for the last little bit to crisp up the skin or even just throw them on a grill to crisp the skin. Or just run them at around 325-350 the whole time to get the skin nice and crispy.



I am with Ross.  I throw them on the grill at the end to get everything nice and crispy.  (Who really wants to eat skinless chicken?!)

Bigfish


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## pops6927 (Oct 25, 2011)

I apologize.  


chorizodahitman said:


> Please do not hijack threads. Sorry for your health problems. A simple I pull the skins off for health reasons would have worked.


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## bigfish98 (Oct 25, 2011)

Ok, I didn't read Pops post until after I posted.  I don't feel so good.  Pops, here's to your swift recovery and an extended period of great health.  A lot of us peoplew new to smoking like me need you here to guide us.  

Bigfish


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## chorizodahitman (Oct 25, 2011)

Pops6927 said:


> I apologize.




not trying to be rude.  And like I said, I hope your health problems turn around.  Good luck today.  I just wasn't expecting to see that.


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## pops6927 (Oct 26, 2011)

I printed out this thread and gave it to the chief therapist at HealthSouth; she disagreed and said it was entirely appropriate;  as they see others like me every day with the same problems and continued health to live another day to smoke meats as well as function independently is never a hijack, it's recommended health advice and that "....I pull the skins off for health reasons would have worked.... " *definitely would not *"have worked"; her words, not mine.  That is all I was trying to give; I don't want this to happen to you my dear friend believe me; let me bear this pain so you and others who wish to heed the advice can be forewarned and live a longer, healthier life; if you don't, so be it, eat recklessly at your own risk.  What I've done to myself I can't undo, but I can help others smoke responsibly and eat responsibly for their, as well as your, benefit.  I am sure Tulsa Jeff would agree also (yes, I already asked).  We have a responsibility to others to promote our hobby with eyes open and balance the joy of the art of smoking with healthy practices and forewarnings too.  Nuff said.
 


chorizodahitman said:


> Please do not hijack threads. Sorry for your health problems. A simple I pull the skins off for health reasons would have worked.


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## alelover (Oct 26, 2011)

I thought it to be good advice. Puts it in perspective. Never thought of it as a hijack.


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## bigfish98 (Oct 26, 2011)

Pops6927 said:


> I printed out this thread and gave it to the chief therapist at HealthSouth; she disagreed and said it was entirely appropriate;  as they see others like me every day with the same problems and continued health to live another day to smoke meats as well as function independently is never a hijack, it's recommended health advice and that "....I pull the skins off for health reasons would have worked.... " *definitely would not* "have worked"; her words, not mine.  That is all I was trying to give; I don't want this to happen to you my dear friend believe me; let me bear this pain so you and others who wish to heed the advice can be forewarned and live a longer, healthier life; if you don't, so be it, eat recklessly at your own risk.  What I've done to myself I can't undo, but I can help others smoke responsibly and eat responsibly for their, as well as your, benefit.  I am sure Tulsa Jeff would agree also (yes, I already asked).  We have a responsibility to others to promote our hobby with eyes open and balance the joy of the art of smoking with healthy practices and forewarnings too.  Nuff said.



I appreciated the post.  We always need to keep in mind that there are consequences to our actions and choices.  Too many times my stomach has overuled my brain.  And I have 2 little smoking helpers to think about.  Sometimes I need a kick in the head.  Thanks pops!

Bigfish


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## nwdave (Oct 26, 2011)

You got some nerve.  You're the one being very rude. 

I gotta agree with fpnmf.  If you like the skin so much, eat away, BUT now you know the possible consequences.  Don't like being told what they are?  Then go ahead and bury your head in the sand again.  Pops has spent years keeping us on track with many aspects of this "hobby".  And you've done what?  Say:  Well you had to say was you removed the skin for health reasons or words to that effect.  I'd be inclined to say his health reasons were more life-threatening, than mere health reasons.  You, Sir, should be apologizing to Pops for being so inconsiderate.

Back on track.  I scrape as much fat as I can find off the underside of the skin, then pin the skin back on the chicken with toothpicks after putting some secret squirrel rubs on.  Takes a lot more effort, BUT I for one appreciate the consequences of not doing a careful preparation.  After the smoke is done, then I throw the skin in the trash.

Pops, you're still in our prayers for a swift recovery and return to your normal life.


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## SmokinAl (Oct 26, 2011)

chorizodahitman, I guess I have to chime in on this one too. Pops is one of the most respected members on here and it was wrong of you to attack him at any level. When you see "trusted authority" under his name, that means he is one of the goto guys for just about anything. He has helped me many times & I'm sure most of the members here have been helped by him at one time or another. Lets face it this is not the healthiest hobby you could have and as far as poultry skin goes, I eat it sometimes. Sometimes I fry it in bacon grease, but I don't do it all the time. I'm 66 years old & luckily in very good health, but I was also a vegetarian for most of my life & I think that's what has saved me. Now I can abuse my body a little without too much consequence. Pops was merely showing in a very graphic way that unhealthy eating practices can have dire consequences. I'm sure he feels that if his post saves one person it was well worth the effort!


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## chorizodahitman (Oct 26, 2011)

I was not trying to be disrespectful at all.  On other message boards stuff like that is not allowed and moderators usually delete the posts. I told Pops both times good luck with his health issues.  I'm not heartless, those pics were unexpected.  Just on here asking for help and appreciating all that everyone has given, even Pops.  So for anyone offended, my apologies.


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## michael ark (Oct 26, 2011)

I side with pops all day long on this issue He was not stealing this thread .You killed it when you were rude.He is a trusted authority and has a wealth of knowledge.Hopefully you didn't shoot yourself in the foot on this one.


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## jlmacc (Oct 26, 2011)

Wow...everytime I get a little faith in humanity,it gets knocked right back down....


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## daveomak (Oct 26, 2011)




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## fpnmf (Oct 26, 2011)

Hey fellas...

Lets take easy on the new guy ok?

We have all made mistakes here and will prolly make a few more.

This place is here to help folks learn how to do what we do.

The two concerned parties have made apologies so lets give it a rest ...please..

  Have a great day

  Craig


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## daveomak (Oct 26, 2011)

Deleted by Dave


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## forluvofsmoke (Oct 26, 2011)

...leaving it (^^^) alone...nuff said...

I go skinless and lean trimmed quite a bit lately. Getting crisp skin is not the easiest task, even though I've tried various methods, and I don't like having to fuss over something that should be so simple, so loosing the skin/fat works for me. The wife and I aren't getting any younger either, so healthier preparations when cooking is always on my mind. Showing our kids how to cook and eat healthy is one of best gifts we can give them, too.

Keep temps in check and your bird won't be dried out...165-168* in the breast and 170-173* in the thighs does a fine job. No red meat or pink juices near the thigh bone is one of my main concerns (looks do count in my house), and thighs are quite tollerable to go even higher temps if you choose to without getting dry. The breasts, now that's where you need to keep things wired tight if you want it to be juicy, but skinless won't effect it all.

You will have a slight bark on the meat, especially with dry rub containing salt (sometimes I marinade, no rub). This can be softened up with foiling for 30-40 minutes near the end. Personally, I like the texture of skinless with straight open grate smoking. One of the favorites around here regarding the lowly yard bird is boneless/skinless thighs smoked @ 205-210* to about 160* I/T with apple/pecan, then panned/foil tented until they reach 195-200*. This makes for some dandy pulled chicken, and I think everyone here who's had mine (including myself) prefers this over any other preparations and cooking methods for chicken, including chargrilled or smoked/seared, and we love about anything smoked/seared over charcoal.

BTW, (for non-electric smokers only) if you want to see what skinless can do for your smoke ring? Oh, yeah...you'll have it, if you want it. Skin/fat inhibit NO2 penetration (look at the meat under the fat-cap of a packer brisket after it's smoked), so without the skin/fat, the smoke ring and (incidentally) depth of smoke flavor in the meat can be top notch.

Never know 'til you try it...

Eric


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## rowdyrawhide (Oct 26, 2011)

I have been smoking skin on while working the rub heavily under the skin, and then I remove the skin before eating.  I have been toying heavily with the idea of doing no skin, especially looking at doing some boneless/skinless thighs in a muffin pan.  Keep us posted on the next smoke and your technique.


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## raptor700 (Oct 27, 2011)

fpnmf said:


> Hey fellas...
> 
> Lets take easy on the new guy ok? ok
> 
> ...


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## michael ark (Oct 27, 2011)

it's official.By the way how your foot
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





Thought some hummor could be used.


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## pops6927 (Oct 28, 2011)

Actually, my foot was also affected as well as my hand, all the left side of my body with numbness and weakness causing me to limp more and not be able to turn my left foot facing center, more perpendicular to my right foot, not being able to recognize objects placed into my fingers, less than 20% strength to my right hand (remember, i'm left handed), can barely grip a pen (actually had to go to WM and buy special Sharpie Fine pens that require almost no downward pressure to be able to write, i cannot write any more with a ball point pen), plus I have use CoFlex stretchy bandaging to wrap around the pen barrel to make it thick enough to grip it, otherwise it falls out of my hand when i try to pick it up... just some more consequences from my dumb actions I'm desparately trying to keep y'all from having to experience.  Thank you for asking however!  i am also using a freeware typing program to be able to increase my typing ability to more than 8 wpm - this one post is taking me almost ½ hour to do - it's called NCH touch typing if you want to google it.

Aw hell, i could, i should just give up, keep my troubles to myself and not try to change the world.  But i love you all too much to keep my trap shut (sorry bawling like a baby, anothr sign of a stroke, way over the top emotionalism) and if i can keep even one person from having to go through losing their job and their respect and encounter all the problems and defecits by being rude and crass and expousing my problems to keep y'all from having them too, then it's worth it, isn't it?  If I am an official thread hijacker then so be it, it is what it is and i am what i am and again i apologize to everyone for it.


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## chadinclw (Oct 28, 2011)

Pops, I don't know you personally and haven't been around here long enough to "know" you very well as a forum entity, however I am real active on other forums where the relationships, such as you have here, become very real and personal. 

Also, I'm a Hospice software analyst and husband of a Hospice nurse who supervises a home care team. Health issues and quality of life are very important to me.

Please don't "give up" or "keep my troubles to my self"...it's not healthy for you and the folks that care about you (dare I say love you) here on the forum would worry and we would all lose the benefit of your experience and wisdom.

OK, off my soap box.


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## pops6927 (Oct 28, 2011)

I apologize everyone, got too emotional, won't happen again.
 


ChadInClw said:


> Pops, I don't know you personally and haven't been around here long enough to "know" you very well as a forum entity, however I am real active on other forums where the relationships, such as you have here, become very real and personal.
> 
> Also, I'm a Hospice software analyst and husband of a Hospice nurse who supervises a home care team. Health issues and quality of life are very important to me.
> 
> ...


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## jrod62 (Oct 28, 2011)

Well pops I love reading all your post!!!

Now knowing how much work you have to go through to post on here makes it even more special !!!!

I have learn a lot from you on here.

Keep them coming, you got a fan here !!!!!!!!!!!


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## michael ark (Oct 28, 2011)

Sound like you should have got some duct tape with the pen's.


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