# WSM running too hot...  [update]



## manman (Aug 11, 2012)

I have never seen this before... Maybe I put too much feul this time as I'm only doing 1 pork butt vs doing 2 last time.  But I thought I was doing everything right- almost full ring unlit with a hole in the center, only about 20 lit coals.  Shut down the vents to 25% at around 215-220.  Temp looked stable for a while then slowly crept up..then started creeping up faster.  I shut down all the vents and it STILL kept going up.  once it got over 270 I thought this is going to take more drastic measures, so I actually disassembled and shoveled out a healthy amount of lit coals, and some flaming wood.  Closed it back up...shot RIGHT back up to 270...what!?  Am I making it worse by shoveling things around when I remove the coals?  At this point I'm thinking I'm going to have to take a lot out and maybe restart this fire...or add more unlit?  I have no idea.  I know I can cook at higher temps, but don't want the food to be done that quick (and dont' really want to cook at the higher temp).  How can I get back down to 225?? :(


----------



## manman (Aug 11, 2012)

welp, after they got above 270 again I went ahead and did the same thing again, removed even more lit coals to the point where I definitely thought the temp would be lower- there were really no more large concentration of lit coals although some of the unlit might have had some under them.

Closed it back up- whaddya know- temp shoots right back up.  Well... hit 268 and has slowly crept back down to 262 so maybe I'll get lucky and eventually it will drop back down.  I know I'm still a noob, but I at least thought I'd had enough experiences now to know how it would react to various situations.  This one is really throwing me for a loop!  It's only about 1.5 hours into the cook on a 7 lb butt though, so hopefully I get things under control early enough...


----------



## nwdave (Aug 11, 2012)

I'm sure this is too late to help out your pork butt, but maybe for the future:  20 lit?  I usually do only about 10.  How complete was your unlit coal ring?  I usually go only about 270* around and when placing the lit on the unlit, I start the lit pile in that gap, with just 5 or so touching the unlit edge.  That usually gets me off to a safe start.  When I started out learning the WSM, last year this time as a matter of fact, there were times when I thought I'd bought a forge, not a smoker. When the temps jumped on me, I'd do a temp dump by lifting the lid up on one edge until the temp dropped. 

One other thing I found that helps is I use temperature probes inserted for each grid level, which could be as much as 3 Mavericks running at the same time.  I don't rely on the dome gauge because it only reflects the temp at the top of the smoker, not at the grid levels. 

Another trick that helps me is:  remember that gap in the 270 charcoal laydown, that is positioned on the right side of the door opening, so if I need to add more charcoal, the area to the left is usually cold enough to lay fresh charcoal to close the gap.  The temp loss while doing this is minimal and usually recovers quickly.

I'm sure you're not, but just in case:  You're not using lump, right?  Lump burns too hot for the WSM unless you plan on working in the 350+ levels.  Also, how much wood for smoke flavor do you add?  Too much wood will kick the temperature up quite high. 

Bottom vents once up to temp:  2 completely shut, and the last one just a crack (not much more than a 1/4 opening).

There is a definite learning curve associated with the WSM and any other smoker, as far as that goes.  It's definitely a smoking machine that will serve you well, once you get it wired.

~Dave


----------



## manman (Aug 11, 2012)

Thanks for the response, I'll give your methods a try some time.  I could definitely have some holes in my method, but the thing that was most crazy to me is that I use the same method every time and have never really had a problem with the temps getting away from me.  Once or twice I've started to rise faster than expected and got hotter than I wanted, but shutting down vents usually solved it.  This time it seemed like the smoker was still getting hotter at a good pace with all vents closed!  I could understand that if I thew in a whole bunch of lit, but... oh well I guess I can't argue with reality, haha.

Just to answer your question though, I do it a little bit different.  I've always used the 'coffee can' method, where there's a full ring around the outside and a hole on the inside.  One thing I did differently though was that I didn't start out with the can (I just use my chimney starter) in the middle and pour the coals around it this time, I poured an almost full ring and removed coals from the center.  That probably left me with a much smaller hole than I should have had and maybe got more coals started faster.  in that situation fewer number of lit coals probably would have been a better idea like you say.

Anyway I got it under control, the only drawbacks now are that I wasted fuel, and had to refil with more unlit 20 min or so ago since what I had left in there was getting spent.


----------



## manman (Aug 11, 2012)

EDIT:

removed this post and moved to a new thread as the issue was solved and this is not really the section for qview / meat specific questions.  ​


----------



## manman (Aug 18, 2012)

Just an update still seeing some strange behavior

Doing a pork butt again for family bbq (last weekend was kind of a practice run).  Followed the above advice and that worked pretty well overall in the beginning.  Instead of 25 coals in the middle of a ring of unlit (hole in the middle), this time I made a ring with a gap and only put 10 lit touching one side of the gap.  Temp raised pretty slowly and was easy to control for the most part.  It was holding pretty good so I didn't want to mess with it too much, but very slowly creeping higher.  Around 240, I decided to shut down all vents and bring the temp down closer to 225 again... but with over an hour of fully closed vents, the temp went UP by 4 degrees.  Not really a big deal, the advice definitely helped me keep this cook under control a LOT better, but it just seems so strange to me that I could deprive the fire of oxygen for THAT long and the temp not only doesn't go down, but actually goes up??

Decided to shut the top vent by 50%, hopefully not for too long... Just wondering 1) does the temp raise with shut vents seem weird to anyone else?  No air leaks or anything.  2) Should I have any issues with creosote or bitter taste from closing the top vent just partially like that?  It appears to be working, temp is already down to 235; i'll probably open it soon.  But if it goes back up, I'm not sure whether leaving at 50% will be a problem for the taste.

I know 240 isn't bad, but i'm trying to time this so it will be done within 1-2 hours of our picnic tomorrow; don't want it to finish too quickly.  I know you can hold them up to 5-6 hours, but don't really want to hold that long...

Thanks


----------



## manman (Aug 18, 2012)

going on 3 hours now with bottom vents fully closed,only using top vent between 50-100% to push temp back down when it starts to rise...  Only other temp changes came when opening the lid to keep the water pan full, hoping that would also help.  Temp has been fully under control (between 225-240), but I've just never seen it like this before (outside of the last time, but I definitely didn't start too hot this time like I did then).


----------



## dward51 (Aug 18, 2012)

Are you using lump or brickette, and water pan or dry/clay pot base/etc...?  Makes a difference as any of these can affect the process.


----------



## bama bbq (Aug 18, 2012)

When I do troubleshooting, I go back to when the equip was working properly and ask myself what changed.  All else being equal, the issue is in the change.

Have you possibly somehow canged the condition of the cooker between thee last successful cook and the ones where your temps take off on you?  In other words, have you dropped one of the sections or door that may have caused an air leak? 

...or have you stopped using water and started some other method of thermal mass (terra cota or sand or something)?

...or have you cleaned the insides removing the carbonized grease (aka "gunk")?

If you had successful cooks and now don't, there has to be a difference.


----------



## rowdyrawhide (Aug 18, 2012)

Some good advice above.

When I am coming up to temp I usually have two vents fully closed by the time I get up to 200*, and the third is only open about 10-25% (depending on weather) by the time I get too 215*, upper vent is always open all the way.  Usually following this the WSM will cruise up to approx 230*.  You can use lump in a WSM, it is all I use in mine.  I have found it is much easier to raise temp in these than to lower it, so start out low and work your way up, I would suggest trying to aim at 210-215* for your target starting temp.  Also, it does not take much adjustment on the intake vents to make a noticeable difference in raising the temp.  Also your water pan is critical in maintaining temp, if it evaporates down then your temp will start shooting up.  Yes you will prob get a small temp spike when opening the lid, but it shoudl only be temporary.  As stated, it is better start with a little bit of lit coals instead of too many, if you start with too many, it is virtually impossible to get the temps back down.  The amount of wood you use can also have an effect too.

Hope this helps

Aaron


----------



## manman (Aug 18, 2012)

Thanks for the advice guys.  Only changes were the ones I mentioned (changed start up method to use the advice given earlier).  Also it's summer so it's a lot warmer than the last time I did pork butts which was winter.  I figured that was the reason I used to need to use 20+ lit to start, and now it was a better idea to use 10.  But other than that I'm pretty much sticking to the same program, no changes to my wsm or anything.  To answer the questions from before, using kingsford blue + water in pan.

It's not so much that this cook isn't successful compared to my past ones, just more that I never saw a situation before where I needed to run with all bottom vents totally shut for very long (when I did, the temp usually came right down as expected).  Seeing it rise or hold for 3+ hours with bottom vents shut seems crazy to me, especially since it seemed like the fire was under pretty good control when coming to temp.

Anyway eventually things did get back to normal, and I'm still chugging along.  One strange thing is that the meat temp (using maverick therm) was at about 192, then dropped to 190.  I opened the cooker to put the baked beans on, and changed the position of the probe to test a different part of the butt, and the temp is reading 180 now!  Tried another spot and saw the same.  Not sure if the mav is bugging out on me, or there really was that big of a temp difference/drop.  I saw the temp drop a few times during the cook by 2-3 degrees, but I figured that was just the meat breaking down etc.  12 degrees seems like a big difference though.  Well, I have 3 more hours before we plan to leave, so hopefully I can get it back up in the high 190's by then :)

Thanks again!

EDIT:

hmm ok tested with the thermapen and I guess it's right, few spots tested between high 170's up to mid 180's.


----------



## dward51 (Aug 18, 2012)

May have been touching a bone when you got the higher temp reading and the multiple readings at 180 are in the meat only.


----------



## manman (Aug 18, 2012)

no bone in my case.  I do need to start getting my butts somewhere they have bone-in though...  Creeping up on completion of hour 16 and @ 194 now, should be ready soon


----------

