# New Curing Chamber Build...42cu.ft. stainless double door



## indaswamp

Fortune shined on me back in early December. I acquired a 42cu.ft. 304 stainless steel solid double door commercial freezer (old Masterbuilt)....for free. I just had to go pick it up. The cooling system does not work, but the box was in excellent shape. After looking into my options for cooling systems, I have decided to go the thermoelectric chiller route using peltier technology. 

 JC in GB
 has been a huge help with figuring out the components I need to buy. This will be roughly 8-10% of the cost of refurbishing the freezer with a new compressor system. I am demo'ing the old cooling system today..











The box is 42.5cu.ft. of space. Should not take much to get it up and running, but I am going to take my time and do it right the first time. No corners will be cut. I already have the humidifier and dehumidifier. Need to order the cooling system components and controllers. The unit will be inside with avg. temp. 68-70*F so only need to chill about 15*F below ambient temp.; the thermoelectric system can handle that.

I will finally have the maturing chamber I have dreamed of having. I will be able to butcher a whole hog, process it into salumi and salami, and hang it all in my new chamber. It should handle 80-100 kilos of product no problem!! This is gonna be PERFECT for what I need! And it is a freezer...so extra thick insulation! Will hold temps. VERY well!!! I am excited to start the build!


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## Sven Svensson

Holy cow! I’m in for watching this progress to its final form.


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## slavikborisov

indaswamp said:


> Fortune shined on me back in early December. I acquired a 42cu.ft. 304 stainless steel solid double door commercial freezer (old Masterbuilt)....for free. I just had to go pick it up. The cooling system does not work, but the box was in excellent shape. After looking into my options for cooling systems, I have decided to go the thermoelectric chiller route.
> 
> JC in GB
> has been a huge help with figuring out the components I need to buy. This will be roughly 8-10% of the cost of refurbishing the freezer with a new compressor system. I am demo'ing the old cooling system today..
> View attachment 529436
> 
> View attachment 529437
> 
> The box is 42.5cu.ft. of space. Should not take much to get it up and running, but I am going to take my time and do it right the first time. No corners will be cut. I already have the humidifier and dehumidifier. Need to order the cooling system components and controllers. The unit will be inside with avg. temp. 68-70*F so only need to chill about 15*F below ambient temp.; the thermoelectric system can handle that.
> 
> I will finally have the maturing chamber I have dreamed of having. I will be able to butcher a whole hog, process it into salumi and salami, and hang it all in my new chamber. It should handle 80-100 kilos of product no problem!! This is gonna be PERFECT for what I need! And it is a freezer...so extra thick insulation! Will hold temps. VERY well!!! I am excited to start the build!


Awesome find!!! Excited to see the final build!


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## sawhorseray

Geez Keith, that baby looks to be in brand new condition, clean as a whistle, congratulations! RAY!


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## chopsaw

Looks like fun . I love a good project .


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## indaswamp

Sven Svensson said:


> Holy cow! I’m in for watching this progress to its final form.


Thanks Sven. This will be a fun project!


slavikborisov said:


> Awesome find!!! Excited to see the final build!


Thanks slav! ME TOO!!! LOL!!



sawhorseray said:


> Geez Keith, that baby looks to be in brand new condition, clean as a whistle, congratulations! RAY!


I know, right!! I was NOT expecting it to be that clean on the inside. It was immaculate. Should be fairly straight forward sanitizing.



chopsaw said:


> Looks like fun . I love a good project .


Thanks chop! I am soooo looking forward to this build. A box like that....$2k easily if you had to buy it. And that is just the box! That freezer new is $8-10k.


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## tx smoker

Wow Keith,, looks like the stars aligned and you were in the right place at the right time. Great score on the freezer and with all I've seen you to the past couple years, i know fully well the chamber build will be nothing short of perfection. I'll be watching so keep us posted   

Robert


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## BGKYSmoker

Thats major production there.

Nice


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## mike243

congrats, it will take a lot of cooling capacity to cool down large cuts of meat, you might need to put in a regular fridge or freezer to get into a safe range if it is freshly butchered , keep us updated on it as most of us only dream of doing that


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## SmokinEdge

Watching this for sure.


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## indaswamp

tx smoker said:


> Wow Keith,, looks like the stars aligned and you were in the right place at the right time. Great score on the freezer and with all I've seen you to the past couple years, i know fully well the chamber build will be nothing short of perfection. I'll be watching so keep us posted
> 
> Robert


Thanks Robert. I will not deny that I am a sort of perfectionist when it comes to some things.



BGKYSmoker said:


> Thats major production there.
> 
> Nice


Thanks Rick. Always wanted to raise a hog, butcher it, make my own dry cured meat products from the whole animal...I'll be able to do that when this chamber is completed.



mike243 said:


> congrats, it will take a lot of cooling capacity to cool down large cuts of meat, you might need to put in a regular fridge or freezer to get into a safe range if it is freshly butchered , keep us updated on it as most of us only dream of doing that


Thanks mike. The meat will already be cold having been salted to cure in the refrigerator.



SmokinEdge said:


> Watching this for sure.


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## indaswamp

I will also be able to hang multiple Culatelli in succession and be able to pull a finished one out every 4-6 months....I can let them age properly and not be tempted to cut into one early. Plenty of room!!!


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## indaswamp

So, brain storming ideas...

I was considering hanging a sheet of 0.1" aluminum plate from the ceiling within 2" of the wall on all sides and mount the exchangers there with the fans pulling up, but on second thought, would be more efficient blowing down as cold air sinks. So I'm thinking of fabricating 2 baffles that will fit along the back wall in between the shelving brackets. The brackets extend 2" from the wall, and the gap between the spacing is 18" wide. The exchangers are like 3.5" wide X 11" long. so I will have to widen the baffle near the ceiling then neck it down to 2" going down the wall. I think the plate ought to stop about 12" off the floor to let the air gently move forward on the floor. Airflow will be rising under the salumi which is ideal. Next is pondering the placement of the dehumidifiers. The humidifier will sit between the two doors blowing against the wall between the doors. The rising humidity will help the airflow.


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## bauchjw

Wow! Can’t wait to see how this goes! Awesome project!


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## indaswamp

Parts List on advice of 

 JC in GB
...

The exchangers: (will need 2 of those)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001875035635.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.1f773c00HXKj2Q&mp=1

The Thermoelectric Module chillers (TEM)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003133468934.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.1f773c00HXKj2Q&mp=1

*EDIT* This is the correct chiller I used:*
Thermoelectric Cooler Semiconductor Refrigeration Water Chiller Cooling System Device (180W) For Fish Tank

12V 40amp power supply
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/33051556213.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.54a2461eUJPy9H&algo_pvid=616db470-d686-4850-9ef7-a8c5e9e3215f&aem_p4p_detail=202203181009137295786107722280008982770&algo_exp_id=616db470-d686-4850-9ef7-a8c5e9e3215f-4&pdp_ext_f={"sku_id":"12000016440247427"}&pdp_pi=-1;3.99;-1;[email protected];USD;search-mainSearch

Controller:
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Rex-c100-Thermostat-thermocouple-40DA-solid_1600463427554.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normal_offer.d_title.3a9a7125OO2dzU

Will also need a small pump and a switch for the TEM.

What else am I missing? Oh- tubing, clamps, and a reservoir for the coolant water. Maybe some piping insulation and assorted connectors and odds/ends.

I am on the fence when it comes to continuous airflow. The Italian system of drying salumi does not entail continuous airflow. Northern European, German and Hungarian Salumi does entail continuous airflow and a little lower humidity to inhibit mold growth. Also uses smoke too. I am going for Italian style salumi. The Culatello cellars have barely a whisper of airflow...0.01m/s; less than 3/4" per second with long periods of static air when the cellar windows are closed. I can always add auxiliary airflow if needed.


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## indaswamp

Will likely also need a DC PWM modulator so I can reduce the exchanger fan speed to dial it in where I need it.


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## pineywoods

Can't wait to this masterpiece when you get it up and running


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## indaswamp

bauchjw said:


> Wow! Can’t wait to see how this goes! Awesome project!


Thanks bauchjw!



pineywoods said:


> Can't wait to this masterpiece when you get it up and running


Thanks Piney!

I am also going to fabricate a carriage tray on casters to set the freezer on so I can move it. Sucker is HEAVY!! Should be able to find those at McMaster Carr or Grainger. Probably need wheels that can handle 250# each. I'd like locking casters...maybe 5" diameter??


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## indaswamp

The inside dimensions are 27" deep x 47" wide x 59" tall....Lotta hanging space!!!


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## pineywoods

That would be a really good thing to be able to move that heavy sucker when needed. I would sure want to have locking wheels. Awhile back I saw some heavy duty looking caster wheels at Tractor Supply might be worth a look. Maybe put them on before you do much else to make it easier to work on.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Will likely also need a DC PWM modulator so I can reduce the exchanger fan speed to dial it in where I need it.











						0.68US $ |Dc 1.8v-35v 2a 3a 5a 10a 30w 80w 90w Pwm Motor Speed Controller Low Voltage Motor Speed Controller Pwm Adjustable Drive Module - Integrated Circuits - AliExpress
					

Smarter Shopping, Better Living!  Aliexpress.com




					www.aliexpress.com
				




*This PWM controller will run your fans at what ever speed you need them.  It doesn't specify the PWM frequency so if the fans don't turn, put a capacitor on the PWM out and your fans will turn.  (This is if the PWM out is low frequency.)*

*JC   *


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## indaswamp

Awesome! Thanks!


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## JC in GB

Here is my design for the DC switch.  Will have it built by end of day.


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## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> 0.68US $ |Dc 1.8v-35v 2a 3a 5a 10a 30w 80w 90w Pwm Motor Speed Controller Low Voltage Motor Speed Controller Pwm Adjustable Drive Module - Integrated Circuits - AliExpress
> 
> 
> Smarter Shopping, Better Living!  Aliexpress.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.aliexpress.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *This PWM controller will run your fans at what ever speed you need them.  It doesn't specify the PWM frequency so if the fans don't turn, put a capacitor on the PWM out and your fans will turn.  (This is if the PWM out is low frequency.)
> 
> JC  *


Would a 2Amp PWM be enough? I can't imagine 4 exchanger fans being more than 2 amps...


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Would a 2Amp PWM be enough? I can't imagine 4 exchanger fans being more than 2 amps...



2 Amp should be plenty to run your fans.


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## indaswamp

I am getting excited now! I can see it coming together in my head! I think I will position the two evidry 1100 dehumidifiers one in each front corner, with the auxillary fans on each side near the front close to the ceiling blowing up at an angle to the back...should have good airflow.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> I am getting excited now! I can see it coming together in my head! I think I will position the two evidry 1100 dehumidifiers one in each front corner, with the auxillary fans on each side near the front close to the ceiling blowing up at an angle to the back...should have good airflow.



I love planning and building stuff.  Would love to be around to help.


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## indaswamp

There is also the possibility of removing the heat side of the peltier module from the the chamber by fabricating an external box with a thin aluminum wall on one side. Use a peltier module with fins and fans on the cooling side. Pipe chamber air into the box and then back into the chamber. Let the fins on the peltier unit condense moisture like a peltier dehumidifier, but without the heat being added to the chamber. I would use a small ice chest, cut it down to the size I need and fabricate an aluminum lid, Mount the peltier module in the aluminum plate. Insulate the plate around the module. Tilt the ice chest so water flows to one corner. Install a drain tube.

Cold moisture removal.....


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> There is also the possibility of removing the heat side of the peltier module from the the chamber by fabricating an external box with a thin aluminum wall on one side. Use a peltier module with fins and fans on the cooling side. Pipe chamber air into the box and then back into the chamber. Let the fins on the peltier unit condense moisture like a peltier dehumidifier, but without the heat being added to the chamber. I would use a small ice chest, cut it down to the size I need and fabricate an aluminum lid, Mount the peltier module in the aluminum plate. Insulate the plate around the module. Tilt the ice chest so water flows to one corner. Install a drain tube.
> 
> Cold moisture removal.....



*Yes, I was going to suggest that but didn't know if that was out of the realm of possibility for this build.  Also, if you are thinking of doing something like that, Aliexpress has TEM refrigeration modules that would work just fine as a dehumidifier.  I was looking into doing it this way at first but then decided that the water/radiator method would work better for my application.*
*
I was going to buy an Everdry dehumidifier for my cabinet but now I may reconsider and build my own TEM dehumidifier unit.

Now you got me thinking on another project..   
*
*JC *


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## indaswamp

I thought the idea was sound....I will see how it goes with testing first, but if I'm going to fill the chamber up then this might be the route I go. When I get the unit build, I'm going to hang a bunch of wet wash towels in the chamber and see how it responds to high water evaporation rates.


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## Steve H

Excellent score Keith! I'm sure you'll get a lot of use from it.


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## indaswamp

Steve H said:


> Excellent score Keith! I'm sure you'll get a lot of use from it.


Thanks Steve!


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## Fueling Around

My chances of making a cure cabinet are pretty low.
But it is exciting watching you go thru the build process.


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## indaswamp

JC in GB


something like this:
XD-35 Thermoelectric Plate Module Cooling System DIY Kit for Small Space Cooling

60W....should offer enough cooling for dehumidification.


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## indaswamp

Well,my excitement is tempered now... Went to place my order with aliexpress and the first two items, no problem. next two items, I get a message that the payment has been stopped by the card issuer. What the heck???? So I called the bank, funds are good...no issue there. The debit was issued and immediately returned. I'm sure hoping that this is not with Visa shutting off payments to China now. That would be a major impediment to this build. I will look into this more next monday, but as of now, I am at a stand still on the cooling system. I did pick up some heavy duty casters at Harbor Freight today. I am going to build a frame and put the casters on it so I can roll the freezer around.


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## indaswamp

Finally got all the components removed. That compressor assembly is HEAVY! I had to use two 2" x 1/4" wall x 8' aluminum square tubing I had laying around from another project to make a slide to ease the compressor to the ground. Had to make two softeners from cardboard and secure the tubing in place with straps. Once I unbolted the assembly and disconnected the high and low pressure tubing lines, It was fairly easy to slide it down to the ground. That sucker is over 100# easy!













So much space!!





I had a friend hanging out with me this morning...He's doing that head bob thing they do...looking for a mate.
	

		
			
		

		
	







Ignore the oak leaves. They are falling heavy right now. I'll vacuum then up with the leaf blower and use as mulch in the garden bed once they all fall. Been windy so they are really coming down.


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## indaswamp

Well, for some reason Aliexpress will only let me order two items at a time in one day. I'll wait and order more parts tomorrow. Anyone else ever have this issue?


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## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> That would be a really good thing to be able to move that heavy sucker when needed. I would sure want to have locking wheels. Awhile back I saw some heavy duty looking caster wheels at Tractor Supply might be worth a look. Maybe put them on before you do much else to make it easier to work on.


Thanks for the recommendation on Tractor Supply, they had exactly what I needed! Bought 4 swivel locking casters 250# load rating. Will order aluminum angle Monday from my buddy. He may have a piece of 5" channel on hand for the caster mount plates.


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## crazymoon

IDS, Nice score and great project!


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## indaswamp

I figured out what the problem was on aliexpress... I have to re-login after each purchase for security reasons. If I do that-payments go through. Small hassle, but at least I have all the parts for the cooling system ordered now....Woohoo! Now the wait for parts to arrive. I have things I can do in the mean time while I wait....


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Well, for some reason Aliexpress will only let me order two items at a time in one day. I'll wait and order more parts tomorrow. Anyone else ever have this issue?



I have never had an issue like that and I order a lot from that site.  Strange.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB
> 
> 
> something like this:
> XD-35 Thermoelectric Plate Module Cooling System DIY Kit for Small Space Cooling
> 
> 60W....should offer enough cooling for dehumidification.



Just what I was thinking for a DIY dehumidifier.


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## indaswamp

So, according to the order tracker on aliexpress, first item on order is expected April 24th. Last item May, 24th... gonna be a long wait.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> So, according to the order tracker on aliexpress, first item on order is expected April 24th. Last item May, 24th... gonna be a long wait.



*Yeah they usually don't take that long but with current global conditions, deliveries have slowed way down.  I will be waiting until the end of April for stuff I ordered in February as well.  It is a pain in the butt, however, I can find nearly any gadget I need there.*

*JC   *


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## indaswamp

So, I had a few parts and supplies arrive that I ordered. Two small pumps, 10' of 5/16" water line, rivet nuts, and I bought the locking casters.
















I cleaned the top and removed the goo from the sticky mouse trap. A scraper got 99% of it, acetone got the rest of it.





There are some rust spots on the top (galvanized sheet metal) So I am thinking of cleaning it really well, roughing the surface with steel wool and spraying the top with epoxy enamel spray paint. I may paint the sides too as one side had something corrosive spill on it and the metal is etched (outer sides are aluminum) with splatter marks. Epoxy enamel would be an inexpensive way to clean it up and make it look good. I'm leaning towards black. The front is in good shape, just needs a deep cleaning. And the inside is incredibly clean for an old unit.


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## indaswamp

Caster wheels are 4.5" diameter....


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## indaswamp

JC in GB offered to make a switch for the thermal electric module. It arrived in the mail today...





This is hands down one of the best forums I have had the pleasure to be a part of! So many helpful people here! Thanks a bunch JC!!! You are awesome!


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB offered to make a switch for the thermal electric module. It arrived in the mail today...
> View attachment 628264
> 
> This is hands down one of the best forums I have had the pleasure to be a part of! So many helpful people here! Thanks a bunch JC!!! You are awesome!



I am just happy that my skills have helped you further your craft.  

I agree that this forum is one of the friendliest and most helpful around.

Looking forward to seeing the build.  Particularly the cooling system.

JC


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## indaswamp

Drove to Pierce Aluminum Works in New Orleans today to pick up a sheet of 0.050" X 48" X 96" 5052 H32 Aluminum today. I had wanted 0.040" thick and they said they had some, but salesman called me back as I was on my way down to pick it up...all they had on the floor was 0.050". Little thicker than I need but it'll work... 

Got the aluminum angle and c channel on order from my boat building buddy, that will arrive early next week. Hope to have the caster tray fabricated next week and have the top and sides of the freezer box painted. Then I can move the unit inside for the build out.


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## indaswamp

Heat exchange/fan units arrived today! WOOHOO!!!







Now I can start designing the baffle plate on the back wall!! Yeah! Happy day today!


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Heat exchange/fan units arrived today! WOOHOO!!!
> View attachment 630151
> 
> 
> 
> Now I can start designing the baffle plate on the back wall!! Yeah! Happy day today!



Great news...  

JC


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## pineywoods

Glad your getting closer to getting everything in so you can get going on it


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## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> Glad your getting closer to getting everything in so you can get going on it


Thanks piney...this project is really giving me a lesson in patience! But now I have some real work I can start on to work towards the finish line. Waiting on the last component to arrive...the heart of the system...the TEM block. I expect it sometime this week....hopefully....


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## Sven Svensson

I love all the updates. Keep ‘em coming.


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## indaswamp

Pic. for 

 JC in GB











The heat exchanger fan plugs. The small plug has 3 wires while the larger plug only has 2. The larger plugs can be daisy chained together parallel.


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## indaswamp

I started designing the baffle plate today. First step was to move the shelving brackets up 4" so I could position the racks at 48" and 24" from the floor. This will optimize the hanging space in the unit. I had to make a jig so I could transcribe the holes and move them down 4" on the bracket. Here is a pic. of the brackets with new holes installed to test fit with the shelves...


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## indaswamp

I am going to invert the brackets so I can transcribe the holes to the back wall to install rivet nuts. I plan on using one set of holes to mount the brackets and the other set of holes to secure the baffle plate in place.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Pic. for
> 
> JC in GB
> 
> View attachment 630320
> 
> View attachment 630321
> 
> The heat exchanger fan plugs. The small plug has 3 wires while the larger plug only has 2. The larger plugs can be daisy chained together parallel.



Okay, I remember them now.  I used the large connectors to daisy chain the fans.

JC


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## Bearcarver

Won't be long now!!
And I can't think of anyone who would put it to good use any better!!
Be Back!
Like.

Bear


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## indaswamp

Another GREAT day! The TEM peltier chiller blocks arrived today! WOOHOO!!





AND...stopped by the boat shop, the C channel is ready. My buddy has expanded his business 10 fold and has gone from 12 employees 2 years ago to 50 today. They no longer fabricate small boats, all they build now are big boats...offshore push boats and a new breed of offshore high performance high speed Catamaran. The design for his Catamaran was made by the BEST boat designer in the world...been all over the world designing boats and catamarans are his specialty. Anyways, they no longer carry small gauge C channel, but have a new machine to make radius bends and fabricate all their own channel with that machine. He said he would make the channel for me....










1/4" thick plate, 8" X 3" X 31" long. I did the hole layout for the casters tonight and will start drilling holes tomorrow.

Also installed all the rivet nuts for the shelf bracket. should make headway on the roller tray and start on the layout for the aluminum baffle plate. Might get it bent tomorrow....if not then Friday. Gonna be a busy weekend....


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## indaswamp

Some pro tips if you have never installed rivet nuts...

Use the correct drill bit. Install the rivet nut with the rivetnut ON the flaring tool. You should have to FORCE the rivet nut into the hole by lightly tapping it with a hammer. Do not push it all the way flush if installing on thin plate. You need the gnarled area to grab as you tighten (so the rivetnut does not spin) and it does not go all the way to the rivet collar.






The rivet nut will pull in tight as it expands and compresses in the hole. If the rivetnut starts to spin as you tighten, stop and grab a small piece of wire. Push the wire under the collar with a flat screw driver to pull the rivetnut out slightly for the gnarled area to grab. once you make a few 1/4 turns on the wrench, pull the wire out and continue tightening the rivetnut down to seat it flush.






It does help to lubricate the bolt in the flaring tool nut.

All 16 new rivet nuts installed...






The bottom row is original and will not be used...since I am raising the brackets 4".


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## indaswamp

Bearcarver said:


> Won't be long now!!
> And I can't think of anyone who would put it to good use any better!!
> Be Back!
> Like.
> 
> Bear


Thanks Bear! Been a good week for me with all my parts arriving daily. This project is coming together nicely now that I can start doing some real work on it...but will still be another 2 weeks or so before it is totally completed. Second coat of paint goes on Saturday, then has to dry for another week.


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## JC in GB

*So nice that parts are coming in.  Your build is looking great so far.  That is going to be a spectacular cabinet.*

*JC   *


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## indaswamp

Lunch update:
got the holes drilled in the C channel for the casters. Sitting on go waiting for the aluminum angle to arrive so I can cut the pieces and fab, the tray. If that does not happen until next week, that's O.K. as second coat of paint won't be dry until next Saturday anyways.

After checking and rechecking my measurements, I went ahead and cut the baffle plate. Needed a sheet 46 7/8" wide X 49" tall. Took that over to my buddy's shop while his guys were on lunch break and used his plate bender. Took my time as thin 5052 aluminum plate has a lot of flex in it when you try to bend it. Only overshot the bend by about 1/8"...good enough...the plate will flex.











Took it home and set it up on an old sheet of plywood I had laying around for test fit with one of the radiator/fan assemblies. Perfect fit.















I grabbed a big sheet of cardboard from the shop for a pattern. Gonna make a pattern first in case I need to move some holes, then transfer to the aluminum sheet for final cutting. The plate should be installed this weekend. Then the layout on the cooling system can begin!


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## indaswamp

After lunch, I made the pattern for the cuts in baffle plate. Went to the shop for 4:30pm when his guys knocked off and used the Miter saw to cut the 45*'s on the  angle I bought. Will weld that up one afternoon next week; My buddies son will weld it for me one afternoon, I'll do the fitting. Only gonna cost me some snack sticks and beer...

So that's a wrap on today's progress. Hope to get the plate holes cut tomorrow and install, second coat of paint on the freezer box Saturday, fiddle with the cooling system components Sunday afternoon. Might have it 90% complete by end of next week.


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## indaswamp

So the thin 5052 aluminum plate has some scratches on it from sliding in and out of the bender. I am going to do a brushed finish to clean it up...but there are a few tricks to make it look nice. Will post the steps for anyone interested....


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## Fueling Around

Shaping up well.
Happy to see you are getting the major components.
You are getting a bit retentive if you need to burnish your sheet aluminum. 
Friends are so important to get it done.



indaswamp said:


> Some pro tips if you have never installed rivet nuts...


Using the correct riv-nut is the first step.  They are sized (depth) based on the thickness of the material as the anchor.  I cannot go by your photo but appears they are for thicker metal.
Gun drivers have a serrated tip to keep the nut from spinning.  Well worth the cost to rent versus the manual tools.


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## indaswamp

Fueling Around said:


> Using the correct riv-nut is the first step. They are sized (depth) based on the thickness of the material as the anchor. I cannot go by your photo but appears they are for thicker metal.


Noted... I used the size of the original installed. Heavy gauge for load bearing. I am going to add a length of 2" aluminum c channel to the bottom of the bracket to contact the floor to help with load bearing as the original installation contacted the floor.


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## indaswamp

Fueling Around said:


> You are getting a bit retentive if you need to burnish your sheet aluminum.


You are right...it's one of those small thing...I'll be looking at that sheet every time I open the door.


----------



## indaswamp

Fueling Around said:


> Well worth the cost to rent versus the manual tools.


I had no idea they rented rivetnut tools....definitely would have made it easier than a manual tool. But it got the job done.


----------



## Steve H

indaswamp said:


> Some pro tips if you have never installed rivet nuts...
> 
> Use the correct drill bit. Install the rivet nut with the rivetnut ON the flaring tool. You should have to FORCE the rivet nut into the hole by lightly tapping it with a hammer. Do not push it all the way flush if installing on thin plate. You need the gnarled area to grab as you tighten (so the rivetnut does not spin) and it does not go all the way to the rivet collar.
> View attachment 630383
> 
> The rivet nut will pull in tight as it expands and compresses in the hole. If the rivetnut starts to spin as you tighten, stop and grab a small piece of wire. Push the wire under the collar with a flat screw driver to pull the rivetnut out slightly for the gnarled area to grab. once you make a few 1/4 turns on the wrench, pull the wire out and continue tightening the rivetnut down to seat it flush.
> View attachment 630384
> 
> 
> It does help to lubricate the bolt in the flaring tool nut.
> 
> All 16 new rivet nuts installed...
> View attachment 630385
> 
> 
> The bottom row is original and will not be used...since I am raising the brackets 4".


You could have just used a thin washer to shim it out so this doesn't happen. Spent a couple years as a tin knocker apprentice. Before I decided to be an electrician.


----------



## indaswamp

Steve H said:


> You could have just used a thin washer to shim it out so this doesn't happen. Spent a couple years as a tin knocker apprentice. Before I decided to be an electrician.


Great tip... I thought the plate was thick enough to give the rivet nuts grab. Maybe I should have asked the SMF brain trust for ideas before starting!!! LOL!!!


----------



## indaswamp

My apology to all the pros for using the term "pro tips" loosely....I am no pro, as a pro would definitely have used a rivet nut gun!  LOL!


----------



## Steve H

indaswamp said:


> Great tip... I thought the plate was thick enough to give the rivet nuts grab. Maybe I should have asked the SMF brain trust for ideas before starting!!! LOL!!!


lol!  I remember the first time I used those. Did 50 of them. Shrouding for an expansion joint mold. Then got soundly corrected by the journeyman for me not seeing the problem and asking questions!


----------



## Steve H

indaswamp said:


> My apology to all the pros for using the term "pro tips" loosely....I am no pro, as a pro would definitely have used a rivet nut gun!  LOL!


Nah, I have one of those around here someplace. They're fine for occasional use. You'd have the same problem with a rivet gun. Not to mention the rivet gun would probably cost more. And no offence takin here! Because I'm not a pro. Someone that calls themself a pro worries the hell out of me!


----------



## indaswamp

Steve H said:


> Not to mention the rivet gun would probably cost more.


If money was not an issue enough to buy a rivet nut gun....hell I would have just bought a damn maturing chamber instead of refurbishing this old freezer!!!LOL!!!!


----------



## indaswamp

Just goes to show ya there are always different ways to do things, and there is always something to learn. Thanks for the discussion Steve...good stuff...


----------



## Nefarious

Ha, ha, ha.  This is the part of diy  projects that I like the most.  Learning new stuff that one might get to use in a future project.


----------



## indaswamp

Took two tries, but got the pattern made for the baffle plate. First one I taped the kraft paper in place and the tape moved as I was marking the holes. So.....second try I used some fender washers and bolts to pin the paper down in place firmly.





Also used an exacto knife to mark where the slots are for the shelves. Bingo....that did it. Wanted to have it cut today, but having to redo the pattern set me back. Will cut in the morning, then once it warms a little I will apply second coat of paint to the freezer box.


----------



## Fueling Around

Steve H said:


> You could have just used a thin washer to shim it out so this doesn't happen.


I've used backing plates to prevent pull out, too.


----------



## Fueling Around

indaswamp said:


> Took two tries, but got the pattern made for the baffle plate.


If the kraft paper doesn't work, the template paper flooring installers use is thicker and more durable.


----------



## Ty520




----------



## indaswamp

Got the baffle plate test fit installed today!! WOOHOO!! That was a challenge, but I figured it out. When I made the second pattern in the morning, the humidity was high and the paper expanded, when I spread it out on my work table in the sun...IT SHRANK! So I used cardboard, started over and made another pattern...IT SHRANK TOO!!! I could not believe it! The cardboard shrank more than the paper! 3/16" over 2'; and fast too...like in 2 hours! Crap! I walked off to make some more coffee and think about the problem. Had an A-ha moment...the top holes on the second pattern lined up perfectly, so I put that pattern back in place. Then I marked the shelf brackets on the paper at the bottom. Used the top holes and the marks for alignment. Used the shelf brackets as my pattern. Dad always says,"use the original part for a pattern if you can."; took me 2 days before his wisdom dawned on me! DUH!!! LOL!!! After that eureka moment, It was a piece of cake! All the measurements were within 1/32" when I cut the aluminum. It fit like a glove when I did the test fit. Had some beers and a pizza tonight to celebrate.


----------



## indaswamp

Some pics...

Baffle plate installed, left side view: Bottom bolts are for mounting the shelving brackets, top bolts are for securing the baffle plate....






Right side with shelves installed:






Radiator/fan assembly fits perfectly!











I'm going to make some mounting clips out of aluminum sheet metal to secure the radiator fans in place. Got a few small odds and end left...couple of brackets and clips to make...and the construction phase is done. On to the cooling system this week!

Oh- and the paint job...






This is right after painting. It looks better now...


----------



## indaswamp

I had to take pictures of the cardboard shrink...I could not believe it shrank THAT much!

Left...






Right..






And it was taped down firmly. Tape was still in place, though it was pulled very tightly.


----------



## indaswamp

Front line moving through this morning, so I will be inside fooling with the cooling components...may start doing a little wiring.


----------



## indaswamp

1100 dehumidifier fits perfect on the top shelf...Will put one in each front corner on the top shelf.


----------



## indaswamp

Just an update...
Got the inside of the box deep cleaned and sanitized. Did Final install of the baffle plate. I made some clips for the heat exchanger/fan assemblies to mount them to the back wall and the baffle plate. I drilled the water line holes in the ceiling of the cabinet. Got the water lines run, got the reservoir installed.

Had a set back yesterday evening when I discovered that the left door hinges were loose. Investigating it, the backing plate that the hinges mount to with 3 screws was a piece of 0.1" flat bar and two bottom screws on the top hinge were stripped/rusted out. Had to do a repair. Ended up opening the stainless sheet metal at the top corner and digging out 10" of foam to get to the backing plate. Pulled that out for a pattern. cut a 10.5" replacement piece out of 1/8" flat bar. Tapped the holes and reinstalled. The threads on the screws where pretty bad so I replaced them back with new. Door is rock solid now though...

Got the caster tray fabricated this afternoon. Got too late in the evening for install, will have to do that tomorrow. Will move the cabinet inside tomorrow to finish the cooling system which is mostly electrical work at this point forward. Hope to have it up and running this weekend. I have a bunch of pics.- will post them later.


----------



## pineywoods

Looking forward to the pics sounds like your getting there


----------



## JC in GB

Very nice.  Wish I was as handy working metal as you are.     

JC


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Very nice.  Wish I was as handy working metal as you are.
> 
> JC


Well....growing up as an engineer's son, I learned a whole lot of stuff watching Dad at an early age. I also have the mind for it...Life skills!
It also helps having a friend with the heavy machinery for fabricating, bending and welding aluminum.


----------



## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> Looking forward to the pics sounds like your getting there


Thanks piney! Moved the maturing chamber in the house today!! WOOHOO!!! Happy day today! Beer time! I promise a bunch of pictures will be posted this weekend....I am taking the afternoon off tonight and celebrating the completion of the construction phase. This weekend I will start running and hooking up wire for the cooling system.


----------



## indaswamp

That sucker is HUGE!!! Looked much smaller outside! So much room to hang stuff!!! I am Happy Happy!!!!!!


----------



## indaswamp

Here's the pics...

I am using a coleman 2 qt. insulated water jug for my cooling system reservoir. I have a tendency to over think things and had elaborate plans to make an insulated reservoir...was walking through Walmart and looked up and saw the jugs sitting on the shelf. $4 dollars..I said-"that's it! That will work perfectly!" This is how I secured it to the top of the freezer box using the rivet nuts and a piece of all thread...





This is a pic. of the radiator clips I made from aluminum flashing (looking from the bottom)...





Holes for the water lines drilled...





Cover over the hole where the old water drain line ran through the cabinet...





The bad top hinge plate on the left door...





New plate for install (holes not tapped yet)...





Top left corner opened up to dig foam out and retrieve old backing plate...










New backing plate installed..





And refilled with expanding foam, secured in place with rigging... I used one of the old bolt holes on the roof to secure the 2x4 on one end and  a ratched strap to the bottom hinge on the corner.


----------



## indaswamp

Last Wednesday I had my boat building buddy's son lined up to weld out the caster tray for the freezer box... That did not take too long at all...got it done in less than an hour.

Welds cleaned up, tops of some welds taken off with grinder for the freezer box to sit flush in the tray, acid washed, sharp edges and corners cleaned up with a tiger sanding disk...





Casters installed...










And 

 Steve H
 I had help to lay it down on the back!! LOL!! The bottom had a few rust spots so I cleaned it up with a grinder and sanding wheel, then hit it with some acid wash, then acetone and the last of the can of rust primer...





Let that dry for a couple hours then installed the caster tray. I oversized the holes in the caster tray where the legs were installed in the bottom of the freezer box. Made some 3" X 3"X 5/16" plate washers for the 1/2" bolts to secure the tray to the bottom of the cabinet.





Fit like a glove! I oversized it by about 1/8" all around to allow for pull of the aluminum when welding.

I used stainless steel tie wire I had on hand to secure the water lines on the hose barbs. Bent the cut ends down and held in place with a 4" ziptie. Kept twisting the wire until there was enough compression so that the hose would not turn on the fitting. No leaks when leak testing!





radiator/fan assemblies installed!





And here she is waiting to be moved into the house...


----------



## indaswamp

Cooling system update:
I hooked up the cooling system Friday night. Did not use the controllers at all, everything direct wired for a cooling test of the TEM system. Ambient temp. was 70* in the room. Started at midnight and let it go all night. Woke up in the morning with excitement and anticipation only to be let down...The freezer box was STILL at 70*F! What the heck??? Shut everything down and on the computer doing research... come to find out (late BTW after I bought the TEM modules) that I bought the wrong peltier TEM modules.

Peltier modules have a set temp. differential that they can achieve based on the module and the ambient temperature the unit is operating at. If for example, the differential is 50*F then you should have 25*F of cooling on the cold side and 25*F of heating on the hot side. Peltier technology uses two different metals in the module. One metal will be better for cooling than the other, but you can flip the polarity and force the cold or hot to either side; which is how those travel food and drink cooler/heaters work. If the heat sink on the heat side is not efficient enough, and the hot side gets hotter than it should, this will shift the differential to give you less cooling. If the heat sink is very efficient, then the heat side runs cooler than expected, giving you more drop on the cooling side.

Well, the TEM I bought was not set up for chilling, it was set up as a fluid heater. When I wired it up red to (+) and black to (-) and powered it up, the heat sink on what I thought should be the hot side got cold and the fluid block got hot! So I switched the wires and ran the test. The heat sink got up to 163*F with the fans running!!
What happened is that because of the inefficient heat sink, the heat bled over through the TEM module and was heating the chiller block too....

Long story short-the heat sink is not large enough and this unit is not designed for cooling. I need a huge, very large, efficient heat sink like the TEM unit 

 JC in GB
 uses. I went back looking on aliexpress and found what I needed..the correct TEM module for my application. I will buy (2) 180W refrigeration chillers designed for aquarium applications. I will add two radiator fan assemblies and run 2 TEM systems side by side. I could have bought a 420W refrigeration chiller but from my research two smaller units are more efficient because of the heat removal. So that is what I will do.

So now I am back to waiting again...will be another month before I can make any progress on the cooling system. I hope to have everything else done so that when they arrive it will be plug and go...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Cooling system update:
> I hooked up the cooling system Friday night. Did not use the controllers at all, everything direct wired for a cooling test of the TEM system. Ambient temp. was 70* in the room. Started at midnight and let it go all night. Woke up in the morning with excitement and anticipation only to be let down...The freezer box was STILL at 70*F! What the heck??? Shut everything down and on the computer doing research... come to find out (late BTW after I bought the TEM modules) that I bought the wrong peltier TEM modules.
> 
> Peltier modules have s set temp. differential that they can achieve based on the module and the ambient temperature the unit is operating at. If for example, the differential is 50*F then you should have 25*F of cooling on the cold side and 25*F of heating on the hot side. Peltier technology uses two different metals in the module. One metal will be better for cooling than the other, but you can flip the polarity and force the cold or hot to either side; which is how those travel food and drink cooler/heaters work. If the heat sink on the heat side is not efficient enough, and the hot side gets hotter than it should, this will shift the differential to give you less cooling.
> 
> Well, the TEM I bought was not set up for chilling, it was set up as a fluid heater. When I wired it up red to (+) and black to (-) and powered it up, the heat sink on what I thought should be the hot side got cold and the fluid block got hot! So I switched the wires and ran the test. The heat sink got up to 163*F with the fans running!!
> What happened is that because of the inefficient heat sink, the heat bled over through the TEM module and was heating the chiller block too....
> 
> Long story short-the heat sink is not large enough and this unit is not designed for cooling. I need a huge, very large, efficient heat sink like the TEM unit
> 
> JC in GB
> uses. I went back looking on aliexpress and found what I needed..the correct TEM module for my application. I will buy (2) 180W refrigeration chillers designed for aquarium applications. I will add two radiator fan assemblies and run 2 TEM systems side by side. I could have bought a 420W refrigeration chiller but from my research two smaller units are more efficient because of the heat removal. So that is what I will do.
> 
> So now I am back to waiting again...will be another month before I can make any progress on the cooling system. I hope to have everything else done so that when they arrive it will be plug and go...


That is most frustrating.  When I read the description for the module you got, I thought it was a chiller module as well.  

I also thought my heat sink on my TEM modules was oversized but I guess not.

If it is any consolation, I spent all day Saturday wrestling with a 16 year old clothes washer replacing the basket drive.  After getting it all apart, cleaning it, installing the new basket drive and reassembling it 3 times, I come to find out the control board is also fried.  Good night.  A waste of an entire day and now I am out $1000 for a new washer which I will have to wait for 2 weeks to get.  Most frustrating.

I think it was a bad week for handiwork.  >_<

JC


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Last Wednesday I had my boat building buddy's son lined up to weld out the caster tray for the freezer box... That did not take too long at all...got it done in less than an hour.
> 
> Welds cleaned up, tops of some welds taken off with grinder for the freezer box to sit flush in the tray, acid washed, sharp edges and corners cleaned up with a tiger sanding disk...
> View attachment 631373
> 
> Casters installed...
> View attachment 631374
> 
> View attachment 631375
> 
> And
> 
> Steve H
> I had help to lay it down on the back!! LOL!! The bottom had a few rust spots so I cleaned it up with a grinder and sanding wheel, then hit it with some acid wash, then acetone and the last of the can of rust primer...
> View attachment 631376
> 
> Let that dry for a couple hours then installed the caster tray. I oversized the holes in the caster tray where the legs were installed in the bottom of the freezer box. Made some 3" X 3"X 5/16" plate washers for the 1/2" bolts to secure the tray to the bottom of the cabinet.
> View attachment 631377
> 
> Fit like a glove! I oversized it by about 1/8" all around to allow for pull of the aluminum when welding.
> 
> I used stainless steel tie wire I had on hand to secure the water lines on the hose barbs. Bent the cut ends down and held in place with a 4" ziptie. Kept twisting the wire until there was enough compression so that the hose would not turn on the fitting. No leaks when leak testing!
> View attachment 631380
> 
> radiator/fan assemblies installed!
> View attachment 631379
> 
> And here she is waiting to be moved into the house...
> View attachment 631378



Looks great so far.  I really like your water reservoir.  I may switch mine to that style.

I am so terribly bummed about your cooling system issue.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> That is most frustrating.  When I read the description for the module you got, I thought it was a chiller module as well.
> 
> I also thought my heat sink on my TEM modules was oversized but I guess not.
> 
> If it is any consolation, I spent all day Saturday wrestling with a 16 year old clothes washer replacing the basket drive.  After getting it all apart, cleaning it, installing the new basket drive and reassembling it 3 times, I come to find out the control board is also fried.  Good night.  A waste of an entire day and now I am out $1000 for a new washer which I will have to wait for 2 weeks to get.  Most frustrating.
> 
> I think it was a bad week for handiwork.  >_<
> 
> JC


OUCH! I will only be out $12 bucks when you consider that I can salvage the small fans on the units!! Will try and order the new TEM chillers tonight. Fingers crossed I don't have more problems with aliexpress!!


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> OUCH! I will only be out $12 bucks when you consider that I can salvage the small fans on the units!! Will try and order the new TEM chillers tonight. Fingers crossed I don't have more problems with aliexpress!!



I have had very few issue with AliExpress.  I hope you get what you need quickly.


----------



## indaswamp

COOLING SUCCESS!!!!! FINALLY!!!! WOOHOO!!

Last idea I had...I needed a massive increase in heat dissipation; Sooooo........

I disassembled the TEM module and removed both the fans and the heat sink from the hot side. Took my spare that I bought and pulled off the chiller block and replaced the heat sink and fans on the one in operation with the chiller block with the ports facing 180* the other way. I used the spare radiator fan, spare pump, and a 1 gallon plastic bucket for a reservoir. put it together and turned it on. The hot side is maintaining 90* water temp. and the chiller side has pulled the cabinet temp. down to 63*F from 71*F. Proof it will work-just need to size the components correctly and get the refrigeration TEM modules. I may need (3) 180Watt chillers... That will give me 540 watts of cooling.

Beer time boys!! Been stressed last couple days, finally got proof of concept; IT WILL WORK!!!!!

Only bummer is I'll have to wait another month for the parts!! LOL!!! Oh well...I'll have summer fishing to preoccupy my time. Red Snapper season opens in 2 weeks...


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB


Did a little more research... the TEM chillers like the one you bought are specifically for refrigeration because the copper tubing is hollow and filled with refrigerant. the cooling side is designed to be on the bottom and the heat side should be on top. This allows the liquid refrigerant to pool on the bottom of the copper tubing on top of the heat side of the peltier module. This flashes the refrigerant to vapor and it rises up the tube into the finned/fan section of the radiator where it is cooled and condenses again...excellent heat transfer...which shifts the differential of the peltier unit so it can chill faster with a lower temperature.

(Whatever you do- do not puncture the copper tubing or drill into it.)

This is why those units are so efficient at cooling!!!! Yes, I will by purchasing (3) 180Watt refrigeration chillers!


----------



## indaswamp

Well, another road block with aliexpress...

Apparently my account was hacked. Ali won't take my payment and wants me to verify who I am by sending a litany of personal information...including a bank statement, current picture I.D. Picture of the credit card I will be using...and a host of other stuff. I did a google search for the code aliexpress gave me for the problem and a number of other people have had the same issue and never got it resolved...some jumping through the hoops and sending the information in 5-6 times over 6-7 months and it was still not resolved. So I'm screwed unless a family member or a friend opens an account and places the order for me. 

Not happy today. So close...I can see the finish line and circumstances beyond my control are stopping me. I'll talk to someone tomorrow.....

rant over... this has been such a roller coaster of a ride with this project.


----------



## pineywoods

PM me all the info as to the web site for the company and what you need and I'll order it for you


----------



## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> PM me all the info as to the web site for the company and what you need and I'll order it for you


That is a mighty fine gesture on your part pineywoods. Let me talk to family and close friends tomorrow.


----------



## indaswamp

I found the chillers on amazon. Will be paying more for them, but they will be here by tomorrow @10pm... When they arrive I will begin redesigning the cooling system to fit the chillers. I will only be using 1 reservoir to have as little water in the system as possible, also moving it to the side for easier refilling. Will need to pick up some more hose line for hook up...


----------



## indaswamp

My TEM chillers arrived today at 2:30 pm from Amazon!! Yeah!!!


----------



## indaswamp

IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

WOOOOHOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





I hooked up the new chillers to the system last night and ran them all night to do a cooling test. SUCCESS!

The air dumping into the chamber at the bottom of the radiators is 50*F, and the chamber temp in the middle of the chamber is 52*F; the chiller water reservoir is running 47.5*F right now. After all the challenges I had with this project, I tempered my expectations....but it worked for JC in GB....so......it should work for me too as long as I sized the system correctly. With a name like 'snowman chillers'....they ought to work....right???? LOL!!!

I am so happy right now! Cooling test has been running for 8 hours as of now...I do not know how low the chillers can take it, but at 52*F- I'm calling it a success as the system will be running 54-56*F.


----------



## indaswamp

With proof of concept complete, now I just need to clean the system up. I will make some mounting clips for the chillers and add some insulation. 
Still need to do a dehumidification test to see if the two peltier units I have can handle the cu.ft. of air. Then I'll know whether I need to add auxiliary cold dehumidification.
Will work on hooking up the controllers and the PWMs for the fans. And I need to deep clean the doors...especially around the moulding.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> IT WORKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> WOOOOHOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> View attachment 631696
> 
> I hooked up the new chillers to the system last night and ran the mall night to do a cooling test. SUCCESS!
> 
> The air dumping into the chamber at the bottom of the radiators is 50*F, and the chamber temp in the middle of the chamber is 52*F; the chiller water reservoir is running 47.5*F right now. After all the challenges I had with this project, I tempered my expectations....but it worked for JC in GB....so......it should work for me too as long as I sized the system correctly. With a name like 'snowman chillers'....they ought to work....right???? LOL!!!
> 
> I am so happy right now! Cooling test has been running for 8 hours as of now...I do not know how low thee chillers can take it, but at 52*F- I'm calling it a success as the system will be running 54-56*F.



Excellent news on the testing success of your new unit.  Looking forward to seeing the final build.   

What is your ambient Temp?

JC


----------



## indaswamp

I am shutting the system down as now as the water lines on the outside are starting to condense water..


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB
 - the ambient temp. is 68*F.

Air temp. under the radiators dropped to 48*F, so still got some cooling capacity if I let it keep running....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB
> - the ambient temp. is 68*F.
> 
> Air temp. under the radiators dropped to 48*F, so still got some cooling capacity if I let it keep running....



A 20 degree drop is pretty good.  That should work well for you.  So glad to see it coming together.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> A 20 degree drop is pretty good.  That should work well for you.  So glad to see it coming together.


 
I daisy chained the chillers running off the same water reservoir in series. I also cut down the coleman jug I bought on a chopsaw...cut a 3" doughnut out. Glued the top back on with gorilla glue. The entire system only has about 4 cups of water...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> I daisy chained the chillers running off the same water reservoir in series. I also cut down the coleman jug I bought on a chopsaw...cut a 3" doughnut out. Glued the top back on with gorilla glue. The entire system only has about 4 cups of water...



Nice.  I keep the water at the minimum level to help with response time.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> A 20 degree drop is pretty good.  That should work well for you.  So glad to see it coming together.


I am really impressed that the two units can cool 42.5cu.ft. of space 20*F. The dehumidification test is next, but I am taking a break from fiddling with my chamber and going fishing on the coast tomorrow...tides and weather are perfect. First fishing trip of the summer. Taking my friend and his wife and hope to catch some redfish.

Will fool around with it some more this weekend....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> I am really impressed that the two units can cool 42.5cu.ft. of space 20*F. The dehumidification test is next, but I am taking a break from fiddling with my chamber and going fishing on the coast tomorrow...tides and weather are perfect. First fishing trip of the summer. Taking my friend and his wife and hope to catch some redfish.
> 
> Will fool around with it some more this weekend....



Have fun and hope you get a nice catch.

I am always impressed by the power density of electronic components.  I am also surprised that the TEM can move that much heat being so small.

So glad that this met your expectations.  

I would love it if you sent a bracket and wire ties.  I also loved your snack sticks and LeBlanc's.  Not sure what I have to send back unless you want a larger capacity DC switch?

JC


----------



## indaswamp

Well, once I get the PID controller figures out and up and running, I'll do a dehumidification test.

I hooked the system up direct to power and installed the humidifier and dehumidifiers. Ran the RH% up to 80% and maintained overnight. The system cooled more efficiently with the humid air, got the temp. down to 46*F with the radiator outlet air @45*F....this was at ambient temp. of 68*F so 22*F of cooling below ambient. 





I am impressed! And anxious to get the PID controller figured out and operational.


----------



## pineywoods

Looking forward to the pics of this all set up and running. Then again with product in it


----------



## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> Looking forward to the pics of this all set up and running. Then again with product in it


Thanks piney! ME TOO!!


----------



## indaswamp

So I had an idea...
I pulled out the spare 40amp power supply I bought and put a 110V pigtail plug on it. Hooked the fans and pumps up to that power supply and plugged it into the power strip for continuous power.

hooked the TEM's up to the other power supply and plugged that into a spare inkbird temperature controller I had on hand. Plugged it in and turned the power strip on.

Now I have a way to control the unit both temp. and humidity to run the dehumidifaction test until the rex C1000 PID controller issue get sorted out. 

 JC in GB
 is helping me on that and it is much appreciated!

I am getting a 1*F temperature drop every 12 minutes or so...so in less than 3 hours should be down around 55*F from ambient temp of 68*F.


----------



## indaswamp

This week..
deep clean the doors and door moulding
deep clean the shelves
Fabricate and install the leg extensions on the shelf brackets
Fabricate and install TEM mounting brackets and insulate
clean and install roof shroud


Dehumidification test

If OK, spray down inside of chamber with star san and hang some salumi in the new chamber!

If test is a fail, design cold dehumidification system using a frost free 1.7cu.ft. freezerless refrigerator 110v, 180watt. This will pplug into the RH% controller in tangent with the peltier dehumidifiers for cold and hot dehumidification inside the chamber.


----------



## daveomak




----------



## indaswamp

Well, the dehumidification test is a fail. The two little 22watt peltier dehumidifiers just can't cut it. Will have to design an auxiliary cold dehumidification system to run in conjunction with the peltier units. With a full chamber, I'm looking at somewhere between400-500grams of water vapor in a 24 hour period. I am looking at a 180watt 1.7cu.ft. freezerless 110v refrigerator. I will have to design a baffle system and incorporate the heat sinks placed in contact with the chiller plate on the back wall of the refrigerator. I have the design in my head pretty much figured out.

The inlet and outlet will be 1 1/2" PVC pipe with a small 1 1/2" 5.4CFM fan for slow air speed and high retention time in the refrigerator for maximum moisture removal. I plan on making a header over the refrigerator outlet where it returns to the cabinet. Plan is to use 3" PVC pipe and rip 1/3 off the side. glue caps on the end cut the same, and bolt that to the ceiling over the return vent. will have holes long the back angled down over the radiator fans...

And I may not even use the rex C100 PID controller. The way I have the system powered now, I can use the auber controllers; which I really like.


----------



## indaswamp

A compressor system is more efficient at moisture removal than a peltier system. Using the refrigerator, It will already have a drain in place as well, I will just have to tap into the drain reservoir and install a drain hose. Should be a straight forward build...

I will also have an additional 180W of cooling to supplement the TEM chillers; which brings me to 540W of cooling capacity... and my calculations say I need around 560Watts, so this should work perfectly.....will be able to remove a large amount of moisture without heating the chamber...may even get slight cooling which is OK....


----------



## indaswamp

I have already figured out how I will cut the 1/3 slice off the PVC pipe. Will have to make a jig for the table saw, but it should work perfectly.


----------



## JC in GB

Yes if the auber controllers are doing the job, no need to reinvent the wheel.


----------



## indaswamp

Doing a cooling test using all three TEM chillers using the Inkbird temp. controller to switch 4.5amps of current to (2) 40amp power supplies. I have one power supply running (2) TEM's and the other is running (1)TEM, pumps, and fans. 
Got a 10*F temp drop in an hour. Down to 60*F from 70*F ambient. That is the cooling I was looking for so I will be using (3) 180Watt TEM's for the cooling system.

Now that testing on the cooling system is done, time to clean it up for permanent install. Will solder wire connections and make/install the mounting clips and add piping insulation.

On to the auxiliary cold dehumidification system...


----------



## indaswamp

From 70*F down to 55*F in 1 hour 55 minutes. Perfect!


----------



## indaswamp

Someone made a video on youtube using the idea I had for a refrigerator as a dehumidifier....impressive in practice! This will work GREAT!


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Someone made a video on youtube using the idea I had for a refrigerator as a dehumidifier....impressive in practice! This will work GREAT!




That is a great concept but do you need that low of a humidity level?

Are you going to try this or are you going with the TEM chiller design?


----------



## indaswamp

> That is a great concept but do you need that low of a humidity level?
> 
> Are you going to try this or are you going with the TEM chiller design?



I will have it hooked up to a controller, it will not run constantly. It won't pull the humidity down that low in the chamber being switched by the controller. But yes, I need the ability to remove a massive amount of humidity....400-500g per day of water vapor. 2 peltier units would have to run 24/7 and it would be very inefficient.


----------



## indaswamp

Bought the little refrigerator this afternoon. Test fit on top of freezer cabinet...





It's a magic chef 1.7cu.ft. freezerless refrigerator. I plugged it in before I placed it on top the cabinet and have figured out where I will drill the inlet and outlet holes.

And my lucky streak continues...on the way home with the refrigerator from Home Depot I found a vacuum hose that a neighbor had put to the road.





I was going to use all 1 1/2 PVC pipe, but this flexible hose will be easier to fool with.

And...found a 120V 14ga. 3 wire pig tail I cut off a microwave that another neighbor put to the road. 





That will be used for another 12V power supply. Refrigerator was $89 bucks and the hose and pigtail saved me at least $25-30 bucks....only need to buy fittings and make the baffle for diverting air inside the refrigerator. Then drill some holes and I can do a test....


----------



## Bearcarver

Wow!!
Shouldn't be long now!!
All these parts from the neighbors' piles.
Are you digging these up, or do you have your own "Igor"?

Bear


----------



## indaswamp

Bearcarver said:


> All these parts from the neighbors' piles.
> Are you digging these up, or do you have your own "Igor"?
> 
> Bear


No digging needed...microwave was hard to miss, and the hose was on top of a small pile....easy to spot.


----------



## indaswamp

Bearcarver
 , It's like that time the butcher got his finger caught in the meat grinder.......Won't be Long Now!!!! LOL!!!


----------



## indaswamp

Made some progress on the baffle plates for inside the little refrigerator. Should be able to install the plates and the fittings for the hose tomorrow. Dehumidification test this weekend.


----------



## Sven Svensson

This has been a great project to follow. We’re all cheering you on.


----------



## indaswamp

Sven Svensson said:


> This has been a great project to follow. We’re all cheering you on.


Thanks Sven! Doing something custom just takes time. All those small things you don't think about....like some baffle plate mounting clips. Took me all morning long one day just to make those.


----------



## indaswamp

Well the cold dehumidifier is 95% complete. The Baffle to divert the air over the chiller plate is done. Drilled the holes for the inlet and outlet in the insulated refrigerator box, just need to install the fittings, pop some holes in the ceiling of the freezer cabinet and hook some hose and we are ready for a test! Will do that in the morning....gotta knock of around lunch though...big crawfish boil with my fishing buddy @2pm. Hope the rain holds off.

Should be sitting on go for a dehumidification test sat. night or sunday.


----------



## indaswamp

Cold dehumidifier is finished. All I have to do is hook up some hoses and connect the fan wires and I can run a test. Will wait until tomorrow while the silicone I used to seal up the baffle plate inside the little refrigerator finishes drying....

I expect great results!

So thinking...I have another radiator/fan assembly on order from amazon. With the little refrigerator on top of the cabinet, it takes up quite a bit of room. I have it on the right side, and the TEM on the right side does not have good proper airflow. Now considering using only 2 TEM's to run 4 radiator/fan assemblies. And will offset the TEM on the right over more towards the middle of the cabinet to the left for good airflow. Will have to run the inlet hose over about 6-8 inches to the right inside the cabinet, but that's not a problem.

I have also considered using the small refrigerator to supplement the cooling on initial cool down from ambient temp....


----------



## indaswamp

Also will be switching out the thin 5/16" dia. clear vinyl hose for rigid 5/16" hose...it goes on the fittings better and does not collapse as easily when bending to go through the holes to the cabinet and onto the hose barbs on the radiators.


----------



## daveomak

Following your logic, I think you will have awesome control of the chamber...
You are not just another pretty face... HAHAHAHAHAHA !!!


----------



## indaswamp

New radiator assembly arrived today. I don't think I'll be able to install it this week as I have a big family vacation coming up next week. I have been working on it like mad trying to get the testing phase complete before leaving. I am pretty much there now. The dehumidification test is a success...pulled the RH% down 1 point in less than 45 seconds. That is plenty enough horsepower to dry the air in the chamber....

I may get around to posting the cold dehumidifier build before I leave, if not will do so when I return...


----------



## hoity toit

indaswamp said:


> Fortune shined on me back in early December. I acquired a 42cu.ft. 304 stainless steel solid double door commercial freezer (old Masterbuilt)....for free. I just had to go pick it up. The cooling system does not work, but the box was in excellent shape. After looking into my options for cooling systems, I have decided to go the thermoelectric chiller route.
> 
> JC in GB
> has been a huge help with figuring out the components I need to buy. This will be roughly 8-10% of the cost of refurbishing the freezer with a new compressor system. I am demo'ing the old cooling system today..
> View attachment 529436
> 
> View attachment 529437
> 
> The box is 42.5cu.ft. of space. Should not take much to get it up and running, but I am going to take my time and do it right the first time. No corners will be cut. I already have the humidifier and dehumidifier. Need to order the cooling system components and controllers. The unit will be inside with avg. temp. 68-70*F so only need to chill about 15*F below ambient temp.; the thermoelectric system can handle that.
> 
> I will finally have the maturing chamber I have dreamed of having. I will be able to butcher a whole hog, process it into salumi and salami, and hang it all in my new chamber. It should handle 80-100 kilos of product no problem!! This is gonna be PERFECT for what I need! And it is a freezer...so extra thick insulation! Will hold temps. VERY well!!! I am excited to start the build!


Lucky dog,,,great score ! Very similar to the single door I had give to me that I made a PID controller mailbox mod smoker out of... I'll be watching your build !!

HT


----------



## indaswamp

So I ran a different test just to see the max. humidity removal rate from the new dehumidifier. I ran the RH% up to 90-95% @ ambient temp. in the chamber (72*F; warmer air can hold more moisture than cold air so this is well above the max. humidity the chamber will ever have while up and running with meat hanging in it.) and placed the RH% sensor in the return vent. plugged the cold dehumidifier into the outlet directly...let it run...






After about 20 minutes, the returning RH% dropped to 15.5%!! I am highly impressed!! I should have no issues with removing humidity with this system!!

I am using small 1 1/2" 4-5CFM fans so very slow flow rate. The super dry air will be directed to the back of the chamber to be mixed with the high humidity chamber air....no direct contact of the super dry air with the hanging product...which is a problem I have now with my current set up highjacking a 13cu.ft. residential freezer for a maturing chamber.


----------



## indaswamp

...the RH% in the chamber dropped to around 60% in 20 minutes. So about a 45%RH differential...that is a lot of moisture being removed!! AWESOME!!


----------



## indaswamp

I have pretty much decided that I will only run (2) of the (8) radiator fans continously. The other 6 will switch on with the TEM's and pumps for the cooling cycle. The 2 continuous fans will mix the dry cold air entering the chamber from the cold dehumidifier and give just enough circulation for mixing the dry air all thru the cabinet. Air will be rising 0.15-0.25" per second in the chamber with the 2 fans running. With all 8 fans it will be around 1-1.25" per second...and that will turn over the air in the chamber every minute on the cooling cycle. Should be enough...without drying the salumi too fast....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> ...the RH% in the chamber dropped to around 60% in 20 minutes. So about a 45%RH differential...that is a lot of moisture being removed!! AWESOME!!



That is impressive.  I may have to consider that for my chamber if I decide to so summer runs.

JC


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> That is impressive.  I may have to consider that for my chamber if I decide to so summer runs.
> 
> JC


I did not use the heat sinks. I had them cut ready for install, but had the idea to try just some spacers to move the chiller plate out from the back wall of the refrigerator for better airflow and contact with the plate. I have about a 1" gap behind the plate and 1 1/4" in front of the plate. That works well enough. I used 2" C channel for the baffle plate clips and there was a 1/2" recess in the back wall so the air gap is roughly 2 1/2 inches overall...


----------



## indaswamp

Doing a different test...

Checking the temp. of the return air from the cold dehumidifier and as expected it is below the dew point of the chamber temperature so I will have to insulate the header so moisture does not condense on it and drip on the hanging meats.


----------



## indaswamp

Here is the tubing I will be using... 5/16" ID X 9/16" OD X 1/8" Wall thickness

https://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=43903

25ft. minimum order...


----------



## indaswamp

Have one more test I want to do... I need to verify I don't have condensation on the radiators with the cooling system up and running. Adding a 4th radiator should help, but I may still need to use a larger reservoir to lessen the temp. drop of TEM outlets to the radiators and/or reduce the TEMs down to just 1. That will slow the response time of the cabinet achieving target temp, but that's Ok.


----------



## indaswamp

Thinking....

I may install valves on the inlet and outlet of the TEM's with a by-pass that has a block valve. This will make changing out TEM's in the event of failure easy without having to shut down the system. I can also use 2 TEM's on initial cooldown, then shut it back to 1 TEM if need be to prevent condensation and maintain temp......


----------



## indaswamp

I also plan on dropping a small piece of sacrificial magnesium anode in the reservoir tank to prevent aluminum corrosion on the chiller blocks. I already have the freshwater anodes on hand...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Thinking....
> 
> I may install valves on the inlet and outlet of the TEM's with a by-pass that has a block valve. This will make changing out TEM's in the event of failure easy without having to shut down the system. I can also use 2 TEM's on initial cooldown, then shut it back to 1 TEM if need be to prevent condensation and maintain temp......



*How did you plan on controlling the second chiller?*

*I see a couple options.

1) Chiller #1 operates from cabinet temp

2) Chiller #2 operates from water temp

3) If chiller #1 can't chill the water fast enough, chiller #2 kicks in and brings the water reservoir temp to just above the dew point to assist chiller #1

Option 2

1) Chiller #1 is set to temp set point A.    Both chillers operate off cabinet temp.

2) Chiller #2 is set to temp set point B (A few tenths of a degree higher than A?)

3) Chiller #2 will only kick in when #1 cannot hold temp

My $0.02*

*JC  *


----------



## indaswamp

Both solid ideas. Thanks for your input. I think water temp. would be the way to do it....chamber temp. in *F -5*F. It would be a moving variable to target...not sure how to do that though.

-Most dew points in the 50 -60 degree range @80% RH are about 6 degrees below temp. so If I target a water temp that is 4-5* below chamber temp. I should be good.


----------



## indaswamp

I'll put a link here...
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/name-my-new-curing-chamber.315248/


----------



## indaswamp

Just an update...
Went on vacation last week for 9 days. Waiting on the A/C to be serviced in my Uncle's wood shop then I can start on the insulated header for the return air from the dehumidifier. I received a box of electrical stuff from 

 JC in GB
 last week while I was gone. After the header is installed, I will install the 4th radiator. I also received the thick wall 5/16" tubing I ordered so I can do final install on the TEM chillers. 

Might get some work done on it this weekend, have a lot of catching up to do this week though...gotta pay the bills first.


----------



## indaswamp

I pulled the TEM chillers and the radiator/fan assemblies out of the chamber so I could do final install, but I had one more test I wanted to run..
I have been measuring the return water from the radiators to the reservoir and tracking that. I did not have a convenient way to measure the temperature of the TEM outlets to the radiators while operational once the tubing was in place. So I set up to test this. Used 2qts. of water in  bucket and set one TEM up with a pump over the bucket to pull water from the bucket and return it. I removed the tubing off the return fitting so I could measure the temp. differential.










The temp of the return tracked 1.2~1.8*F below the reservoir temp....call it 1.5*F. This will come in handy to know when I set up the second TEM in auxiliary mode. If I plan to target 56*F chamber temp., then the dew point will be about 50*F. I want to target no lower than about 51*F as the temp. of the radiator inlet water. So if I put the temp. probe in the reservoir, I need to program the controller to shut the auxiliary TEM off when the reservoir temp. reaches 53*F (can't program in decimal, only whole numbers). I will set the range tight, so when the water temp. rises to 54*F, the auxiliary TEM will turn back on for additional cooling. This will give me the widest delta between chamber temp. and water temp. for the fastest cooling without condensation on the radiators.
Those parameters should work....but I might have to tweak it once operational.


----------



## indaswamp

I'll add this here:
https://www.thecalculator.co/others/Relative-Humidity-Calculator-682.html

Very handy RH% dew point calculator....


----------



## indaswamp

Built the dehumidifier return vent header today. I nested a half round piece of 3" thin wall PVC sewer pipe inside of a half round piece of 4" pvc sewer pipe.






I used the 3" doughnut that I cut out of the coleman water jug. the foam was 1/2" thick so I made some spacers to keep the 3" pipe spaced properly. I drilled 4 holes and installed 4 small bolts to secure the pvc in place while the foam expands.





Made a jig out of some scrap 3/8" plywood and a 2x4 to keep the edge of the 4" half round from bowing out or the 3" half round from bowing in. Also used window and door foam which has low expansion and less pressure.















Drying now...just the right amount of foam...LOL!










Will cut/trim it down on my Uncle's table saw sometime this week... Need it to be 1 3/8" tall for low profile against the ceiling of the chamber.


----------



## indaswamp

I will use those same 4 holes to mount the header to a jig to rip it on the table saw. Then will drill those holes out to 1/4" for 1/4" bolts to mount the header to the ceiling using rivet nuts. Will drill the vent holes on the back of the header....


----------



## indaswamp

Got the header cut down at my uncle's today...










Saw blade was not tall enough to cut one pass thru, had to flip it and make 2 cuts, but it worked well. Sawed the ends with a hand saw. I cleaned up any high spots with sand paper.





Drilled the air flow holes, 4 per side and stepped up the hole size in 1/16" increments from 5/16" to 1/2"...











Need to find some 3/4" X 3/16" thick PVC foam weather stripping to seal it up against the ceiling for final install.


----------



## indaswamp

Installed the rivet nuts and test fit.....like a glove.










I am very happy with the way the header turned out! Will pick up some PVC foam weather stripping tomorrow...


----------



## pineywoods

It's looking good very nice work


----------



## indaswamp

Thanks piney! I just rechecked my notes on the air hole sizes....need to go back and redrill them starting with 7/16", then 1/2", 9/16, and 5/8"....I went off memory trying to beat sunset rather than stop and try to find the note pad I wrote it down on. That will give me the correct volume without choking back airflow thru the fans.


----------



## indaswamp

Finally! The last major design project is finished! I had to figure out a way to mount the TEM chillers to the homemade mounting bracket. I had to redesign it 6 times, but the final version has many benefits...
1 The nut is on top on the outside, so it is much easier to install than the original design where the nut was underneath the bracket between the bracket and the clamp bar on the fluid block chiller side. I replaced the nut there with a small 0.35" piece of 3/16" dia. rigid tubing.
2. the tubing protects the bolt threads and will keep them clean when I insulate the chiller block with expanding foam.
3. When the TEM chip goes out, which it will eventually, and needs replacing, with the nut on top on the outside replacement is a cinch!
4. Since I am using rigid tubing as a spacer, there is no chance of over tightening and damaging the TEM chip.
5. Also, the tubing will allow for perfect alignment up or down since it will compress slightly.

Here's the pics...(middle fan removed for install)
















The underside...(TEM chiller block will be on bottom; bracket is upside down for the picture)


----------



## indaswamp

Note- The 4 brackets are still together in one piece. I have yet to go to the boat shop and cut the brackets out on the band saw. That is the last thing I need to do before final install and I am FINISHED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YEAH!!!!!!!


----------



## JC in GB

*Very nice work.  I can't wait to see it in operation.  What a fantastic project!

JC  *


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> *Very nice work.  I can't wait to see it in operation.  What a fantastic project!
> 
> JC  *


I am anxious to finish it. That will be high on the list next week when I return from the fishing camp. Hope to have it up fully operational with product hanging in it by mid-July. Not much left to do on it except hook everything up for final install and a good wipe down on the inside.


----------



## pineywoods

It is looking good how it the fishing going????


----------



## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> It is looking good how it the fishing going????


I'll let you know after we go fishing...I have not left the house yet. Will be at the camp this weekend.


----------



## pineywoods

AH ok I thought you were going for a week my mistake


----------



## indaswamp

5 days...starting Thursday...


----------



## JC in GB

BTL1904 said:


> This is a good size chamber. I'm in the process of building a small 9’x 6’x 2′ chamber. I also have a chest freezer with a thermometer in it that I'm using as a humidifier. I have it set to 48 degrees and it will come up to 62 degrees or so most of the time. I put the freezer on the floor of the room and the chamber on the bench and it works great. So far I've done about 3 pounds of pork and it worked great. I'm going to do about 10 more pounds this weekend.



Have some pics of your set-up?

JC


----------



## indaswamp

9'X6'X2' is a huge chamber....could do 250-300 kilograms or more of salami at one time in it easy. Is this for small commercial sales?


----------



## indaswamp

I am so close to finishing my chamber. Need to insulate the intake and return hoses for the dehumidifier, fill the reservoir with water, and hook up the temperature controller and I'm done! then I can do a full system test and then hang some meat!

Looking for lighting options for the inside of the chamber. Any ideas?


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> I am so close to finishing my chamber. Need to insulate the intake and return hoses for the dehumidifier, fill the reservoir with water, and hook up the temperature controller and I'm done! then I can do a full system test and then hang some meat!
> 
> Looking for lighting options for the inside of the chamber. Any ideas?



I would use LED lighting.  Get a well diffused LED light and run it off the 12 VDC supply.

My $0.02...


----------



## JC in GB

Something like this?









						1.28US $ 14% OFF|2x 17cm Led Cob Bulb 12v 7000k Drl Car Styling Strip Waterproof Cob Led Working Light Driving Daytime Running Light Super White - Signal Lamp - AliExpress
					

Smarter Shopping, Better Living!  Aliexpress.com




					www.aliexpress.com


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> I would use LED lighting.  Get a well diffused LED light and run it off the 12 VDC supply.
> 
> My $0.02...





JC in GB said:


> Something like this?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1.28US $ 14% OFF|2x 17cm Led Cob Bulb 12v 7000k Drl Car Styling Strip Waterproof Cob Led Working Light Driving Daytime Running Light Super White - Signal Lamp - AliExpress
> 
> 
> Smarter Shopping, Better Living!  Aliexpress.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.aliexpress.com


Awesome! Thanks! I was considering 6000K so those look about right. How many do you think I will need for my chamber? I want it lit up pretty good on the inside.

Also, do you know of a door plunger switch that would work? I'd need two of those....so that the lights come on with either switch.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Awesome! Thanks! I was considering 6000K so those look about right. How many do you think I will need for my chamber? I want it lit up pretty good on the inside.
> 
> Also, do you know of a door plunger switch that would work? I'd need two of those....so that the lights come on with either switch.



An E79 series snap action switch would work for you just fine.  You will need to find a mounting scheme for it though.  They are good for 10 amps.  Here is a picture of one.





__





						E79-40A ZF (Formerly Cherry) Panel Mount Pushbutton | Hawk Electronics
					






					www.hawkusa.com
				




I would think 2 or 3 of those LED strips would provide plenty of light to see into the nooks and crannies.

JC


----------



## indaswamp

Thanks 

 JC in GB
!


----------



## JC in GB

I am working on a scheme to switch between 12 VDC and 5 VDC to the TEMs.  This should increase efficiency and also put years of life in the TEMs.

It is a bit easier said than done I am finding.  

JC


----------



## indaswamp

Very cool! Let me know how progress goes.


----------



## indaswamp

Question...
Why 5volts? Best optimization on the performance curve??


----------



## motocrash

Hey Inda, I use these switches in the machines I build. They have many configurations that can be selected on the left hand "narrow results" menu. They are small but robust.


			https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/search/search?fctype=adc.falcon.search.SearchFormCtrl&cmd=Search&searchquery=AEM&categoryId=0&TxnNumber=-1&searchqty=10


----------



## indaswamp

motocrash said:


> Hey Inda, I use these switches in the machines I build. They have many configurations that can be selected on the left hand "narrow results" menu. They are small but robust.
> 
> 
> https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/search/search?fctype=adc.falcon.search.SearchFormCtrl&cmd=Search&searchquery=AEM&categoryId=0&TxnNumber=-1&searchqty=10


Thanks Motocrash!


----------



## indaswamp

My new chamber is operational. Put power to the systems at 3:45pm today; doing systems checks. Everything looks great! The radiator temps. are running 3.5-4*F below chamber temp. so that is about PERFECT! 2 radiators per TEM looks like the sweet spot for 180watt TEM chips. I also have the dehumidification refrigerator hooked up direct to power for auxiliary chilling for initial cool down. I am tracking the RH%, started at 59%RH and it is down around 39%RH right now so PLENTY of horse power for dehumidification. Will need to figure out if I will even need the eva-dry peltier dehumidifiers running in parallel. Going to depend on how much cooling the dehumidification refrigerator generates while up and running.

I have not installed the shrouds yet....will do that after systems check to allow for easy access to the components.

I used some aluminum flashing and Stainless steel tie wire to secure the hose to the PVC fitting on the dehumidifier lines. Used gorilla tape first, then fastened the flashing wrap around it. Insulated with 1/2" thick cotton duct insulation; has R4 value.







Lights on! Systems GO!!!





The components and layout on the roof of the chamber..





The inside...





I liked the metallic blue color on the TEM alumimum water blocks so I bought a can of Krylon Fusion paint in that color to paint the dehumidification header. I think it looks cool....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Question...
> Why 5volts? Best optimization on the performance curve??


No just chose a power output that was roughly 1/2 power.


----------



## indaswamp

Because there is no condensation on the radiators during cool down, there is no wasted energy condensing water! This increases the efficiency of the peltier TEM chillers cooling the chamber down....


----------



## indaswamp

It is 5:10p.m. right now so about 1.5 hours up and running...







5.5*F cooling to go. I can't believe the humidity is down to 25.8%RH!!! So cool! Man this is going to work GREAT! (It is hooked up direct for chilling, won't pull the RH% down that much once hooked up to the controller)


----------



## JC in GB

Very nice.  Can't wait to see that filled with product.

Hats off to your awesome build!


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Very nice.  Can't wait to see that filled with product.
> 
> Hats off to your awesome build!


Thanks @JC in CG! I could not have done it without your help. It was a very fun project and took way more time than I first thought it would. But it should perform exceptionally well.

I just need to dial in the settings and get a feel for how the new chamber runs. 4 times the volume of my current chamber so hopefully no wild swings in RH%....I probably need to turn the humidifier up a little....taking too long to raise the RH%. Gonna run it a little bit and dial it in first, then transfer meats to the new chamber.


----------



## indaswamp

Took 4 hours 15 minutes to chill the chamber down to temp., but the water in the humidifier was at room temp.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> I am working on a scheme to switch between 12 VDC and 5 VDC to the TEMs.  This should increase efficiency and also put years of life in the TEMs.
> 
> It is a bit easier said than done I am finding.
> 
> JC



Hey...look what I found...

DC Voltage Regulator Buck Converter DC 12V 24V to DC 5V 15A 75W Step Down Reducer Power Converter Mini Module Transformer


----------



## indaswamp

This one is 30amps...

Cllena DC 12V 24V Step Down to 5V 30A 150W Converter Voltage Regulator, Waterproof DC/DC Buck Transformer Power Supply


----------



## indaswamp

I have (6) 18" X 24" kitchen towels soaked with water, then wrung out hanging in the chamber to generate humidity. Got a spike to 86%RH immediately after closing the door, but the cold dehumidifier pulled it down to 82.5%RH in about 30 minutes then slowed considerably. I set the controller there at 82.5%RH for about an hour and it was able to maintain that setting. Will lower to 80%RH and see how it goes...


----------



## indaswamp

So...I had to open the chamber doors to take a peek. I had not wrung out the towels enough and water had dripped on the floor-that's the reason why the dehumidifer was pulling the moisture out slowly. I wiped the floor dry and wrung the towels out better and that will simulate salumi better. Now the system is acting as it should. Will let it run all night and check on it in the morning.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> This one is 30amps...
> 
> Cllena DC 12V 24V Step Down to 5V 30A 150W Converter Voltage Regulator, Waterproof DC/DC Buck Transformer Power Supply



Nice little gems there.


----------



## indaswamp

Maintaining 80%RH. It is amazingly steady compared to my small original chamber. Final test will be when I hang some meat in it.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Nice little gems there.


Think those will work? Should I order one to try out? Or are you trying to build one? I also found a 40amp, but price really starts to climb for beefier components I'm sure....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Think those will work? Should I order one to try out? Or are you trying to build one? I also found a 40amp, but price really starts to climb for beefier components I'm sure....


30 Amp should work fine.    I am going to design my 5V switch based upon that module.  I will let you know how it works out.

JC


----------



## JC in GB

Well, I have completed my analysis of the issue and have concluded that there is no way I can get around using a high side switch.  This means that we can do the 12V to 5V switch either with the DC-DC converter you posted earlier or simply use a +5 VDC supply.  I am now prototyping the high side switch for testing.

JC


----------



## indaswamp

Found this....5V; 60Amp-$28

SHNITPWR 5V DC Power Supply Adapter 60A 300W AC to DC Converter Transformer 5 Volt 60 Amp LED Driver 110V / 240V AC Input

Might be the cheaper route to go rather than going through a 12V power supply and then stepping down to 5V...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Found this....5V; 60Amp-$28
> 
> SHNITPWR 5V DC Power Supply Adapter 60A 300W AC to DC Converter Transformer 5 Volt 60 Amp LED Driver 110V / 240V AC Input
> 
> Might be the cheaper route to go rather than going through a 12V power supply and then stepping down to 5V...



My biggest concern at present is I have no P-channel MOSFETs to test my circuit.    

I will have to order a few.


----------



## JC in GB

Placed an order on AliExpress for 10 MOSFETs.  Cost + shipping was just over $3.

50P06 the P-Channel brother to the DC switches I made for you.

Bad news..  Won't get to me until Sept.


----------



## indaswamp

Well, for $3, probably worth the wait! LOL!!


----------



## indaswamp

Beautiful...






She's rockin right along holding steady... Temp. drops to 55.9*F then slowly rise to around 57.2 before the system can catch up switching the cooling on @57*F. Cooling takes about 8 minutes, slow rise takes about 12 minutes.

The dH (dehumidify) cycle is smooth as well. I have the offset @2%RH so when it hits 82%RH the dH kicks on. That takes about 10 minutes to drop the humidity back down to 80%. Not much overshoot on the humidity cycle.

The return dry air is running 45-46*F and does help to stabilize the temp. longer before cooling cycle kicks on. It is not enough to really cool the chamber down on it's own though....but it does help a little. Slightly drier air over the radiators, which helps prevent condensation....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Well, for $3, probably worth the wait! LOL!!



Less than the shipping cost alone buying domestic.  What robbery.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Beautiful...
> View attachment 636852
> 
> She's rockin right along holding steady... Temp. drops to 55.9*F then slowly rise to around 57.2 before the system can catch up switching the cooling on @57*F. Cooling takes about 8 minutes, slow rise takes about 12 minutes.
> 
> The dH (dehumidify) cycle is smooth as well. I have the offset @2%RH so when it hits 82%RH the dH kicks on. That takes about 10 minutes to drop the humidity back down to 80%. Not much overshoot on the humidity cycle.
> 
> The return dry air is running 45-46*F and does help to stabilize the temp. longer before cooling cycle kicks on. It is not enough to really cool the chamber down on it's own though....but it does help a little. Slightly drier air over the radiators, which helps prevent condensation....
> View attachment 636853



Awesome!!!!!!!


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Less than the shipping cost alone buying domestic.  What robbery.


....Time IS money!!! LOL!!!


----------



## indaswamp

Also- I am not using the peltier eva-dry dehumidifiers. The cold dH unit works exceptionally well and I like the additional cooling for a longer time frame between cooling cycles. This removes the maintenance on those units having to empty the reservoirs! I like that! And I'm projecting that I should get over a month from the humidifier reservoir since there is no condensation on the cooling cycle like a regular compressor cooling system. Which forces the humidifer on to replace the lost humidity during the cooling cycle. I will not have that problem....case hardening should not be an issue in this chamber.

I have a couple add ons I want to do. 1. is to add a baffle plate over the intake fan to the dH refrigerator. This will protect the fan blades and force the fan to draw air only from the sides of the fan at the top near the ceiling where the most humid air should be (humidity rises). 2. is to fabricate a shelf on the outside of the freezer for the condensate jug to sit on so it will be secure and not tip over.


----------



## indaswamp

The Cold Dehumidifer build using a 1.7cu.ft. freezerless refrigerator.
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/maturing-chamber-cold-dehumidifier-build.316049/


----------



## indaswamp

Just an update on testing...
I ordered 2 new 1 1/2" 11.26CFM 12V fans for the intake  and return vents of the dH refrigerator to increase the air flow through the system. The airflow was too slow and the little refirgerator was able to chill down low enough to flip the thermostat to shut the unit off. I installed the new fans this evening and running another test tonight. System is running GREAT now! Very responsive and pulls the humidity down FAST!

11.26CFM cycles a little over 1/4 of the chamber air per minute through the little dH unit.

So that part of the chamber is good to go. Only thing now is the airflow from the cooling fans. With 8 fans, I may have too much airflow. I need to verify the CFM of the fans to know for sure. 

 JC in GB
 is trying to work out a solution for a controller on the fans, but it is not as easy as it seems. 

Last resort, I can pull the fans off the radiators, add another aluminum plate to the existing baffle and run it up to the ceiling of the cabinet. Drill cirlces and install the number of fans I need for the proper airflow. This will even out the airflow over all 4 of the radiators.

One way or another, we'll get it sorted out.....

I may make some snack sticks and dry them in the chamber the way it is now...just to check the airflow and put a real test on the systems...especially the cold dehumidifier. That is working out much better than I first thought it would!


----------



## indaswamp

Hey...Looky what I found...

Can control up to 10 fans. Cased plug and play; $25
Noctua NA-FC1, 4-Pin PWM Fan Controller (Black)

Inexpensive model without a case: $9.99; has 4 fan plugs...

SinLoon 2 Pin 3 Pin 4 Pin Fan Adapter PWM PC Chassis Cooling Fan Hub，Chassis Fan Pressure Regulating Governor，4 Way Splitter 12V Speed Controller with 6 Pin Power Port（4 Way with Cable）

Can have either to my door in 2 days...


----------



## indaswamp

Manual for the Noctua PWM controller:
https://noctua.at/pub/media/blfa_files/manual/noctua_na_fc1_manual_en.pdf


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Hey...Looky what I found...
> 
> Can control up to 10 fans. Cased plug and play; $25
> Noctua NA-FC1, 4-Pin PWM Fan Controller (Black)
> 
> Inexpensive model without a case: $9.99; has 4 fan plugs...
> 
> SinLoon 2 Pin 3 Pin 4 Pin Fan Adapter PWM PC Chassis Cooling Fan Hub，Chassis Fan Pressure Regulating Governor，4 Way Splitter 12V Speed Controller with 6 Pin Power Port（4 Way with Cable）
> 
> Can have either to my door in 2 days...



That looks like a nice set up.


----------



## indaswamp

I have (4) 80mm x 80mm x 15mm 12v 4pin 13.31-46.57 CFM Fans ordered. That should give me a flow rate range between 1.23-4.31 Inches per second airflow through the chamber...which is perfect. From his research, Fidel Toldra says the optimum flow rate should be between 0.05-0.1 meters per second which is about 2-4 inches per second.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> That looks like a nice set up.


I like the "no stop" feature on the Noctura. Would hate to have fans stop running n the chamber because the knob was turned too low..... little more than I would like to pay, but at this point, what's another $25 bucks?!?! LOL!! The new fans, cords, and controller will be about another $100 all together, but at least I only need to buy 4 fans instead of 8. I just could not make 8 work....too fast flow rate with the individual fans and can't slow them down enough. 

I have some tinkering I can do on the chamber, but until components arrive sometime next week I am at a stand still.


----------



## indaswamp

Went ahead and ordered the Noctua PWM controller, some cable splitters and cable extensions. That will arrive next Monday. Two of the fans will arrive Tuesday, the other two will not arrive until Weds. 27th... Darn! This should be the last tweak I needed to make before my chamber is exactly how I need it to be. Will have independent control of all three major variables-Temperature, Humidity, AND Air Flow! I am excited to see this project completed!!


----------



## indaswamp

Decided to go ahead and enlarge the PVC fitting size I use for the dH refrigerator. I thought I had used 1 1/2" fittings but on inspection, It was 1 1/4" PVC. Well that explains the slow airflow issues I was having. I am replacing with 2" fittings and 2.5" PVC wood working dust vac. hose. That oversized duct should severely reduce resistance in the line.
A 2" PVC pipe is 2 3/8" O.D. and it will barely fit inside the PVC header I made....but it will fit. Redrilling the hole with a hole saw will be fun. Going to have to use a piece of plywood as a jig to keep the hole saw centered but it should work. I'll work on that while the new fans are in transit.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Decided to go ahead and enlarge the PVC fitting size I use for the dH refrigerator. I thought I had used 1 1/2" fittings but on inspection, It was 1 1/4" PVC. Well that explains the slow airflow issues I was having. I am replacing with 2" fittings and 2.5" PVC wood working dust vac. hose. That oversized duct should severely reduce resistance in the line.
> A 2" PVC pipe is 2 3/8" dia. and it will barely fit inside the PVC header I made....but it will fit. Redrilling the hole with a hole saw will be fun. Going to have to use a piece of plywood as a jig to keep the hole saw centered but it should work. I'll work on that while the new fans are in transit.



The fine tuning took the longest for me it seemed too.   You will get it dialed in perfectly.

JC


----------



## indaswamp

One thing of note too...
When I increased the airflow through the dH fridge, the RH% of the return air increased with the larger volume of air, but it is only 3-5%RH below the chamber RH% and entering the chamber @50*F. The entire chamber volume gets replaced in less than 4 minutes, so very responsive dehumidification and no worries about cold dry air hitting the hanging product.  I like that a lot.....


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> One thing of note too...
> When I increased the airflow through the dH fridge, the RH% of the return air increased with the larger volume of air, but it is only 3-5%RH below the chamber RH% @50*F. The entire chamber volume gets replaced in less than 4 minutes, so very responsive dehumidification and no worries about cold dry air hitting the hanging product.  I like that a lot.....



That is really nice.  You really dug right into the tiny details for this.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> That is really nice.  You really dug right into the tiny details for this.


 Also, that giant aluminum plate on the back wall acts as one huge heat sink with cold air flowing down the back side of it. That is another reason why I can cool down the chamber so fast with the limited cooling capacity I have available. I contemplated fabricating some long, thin aluminum fins to add to the back of the plate, but that was before I knew I needed the dH fridge. With the addition of the dH fridge for initial cool down, I don't think I need to add the fins from the left over aluminum I will have available.


----------



## indaswamp

...with the increased air flow through the dH fridge, and using that for initial cool down, it only takes a little less than 2.5 hours to cool the chamber from 70*F to 56*F.


----------



## indaswamp

Air speed inside the chamber was the last piece of the puzzle. You should have seen my face when I found that little Noctua PWM controller on Amazon while researching the fans I needed to buy....the seas parted....light shined from heaven...LOL!!!!

Now for all the puzzle pieces to arrive by mail!!!!LOL!!!!


----------



## indaswamp

I have an idea on the back burner for a mechanical water level float in the reservoir so I can see the level at a glance without getting on a step stool and peaking in the reservoir jug......but that is low priority until the chamber is fully operation with full control over all parameters...... would hate for the pumps to stop pumping water because the reservoir level is too low...and mess up the TEM chips....and have the chamber warm up......


Unless you know of a cheap 12v digital level indicator with an LED screen that I could hook up.....


----------



## indaswamp

Now it is showing my fans will arrive on Monday. That would be Great!


----------



## indaswamp

So I have learned that the snowman Chiller heat sink is actually a CPU cooler. I had no idea they made those for computers as I don't do any online gaming or high-powered computer graphics. Apparently there are a lot of companies that make them. You can buy the peltier chips, the aluminum fluid block, thermal paste and build your own TEM chillers. Noctua makes one with 140mm fans that is almost 7" tall. Massive surface area for massive cooling...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> So I have learned that the snowman Chiller heat sink is actually a CPU cooler. I had no idea they made those for computers as I don't do any online gaming or high-powered computer graphics. Apparently there are a lot of companies that make them. You can buy the peltier chips, the aluminum fluid block, thermal paste and build your own TEM chillers. Noctua makes one with 140mm fans that is almost 7" tall. Massive surface area for massive cooling...



Right.  I knew that they were used for CPU coolers.  That is where I got the idea in the first place.  LOL.  I just went to Aliexpress for inexpensive parts.

If you upgrade in the future, maybe you can use one of those larger modules?

Thanks for sharing all this additional info.  It will be helpful in the future for sure.

JC


----------



## indaswamp

I saw a CPU cooler rated for 250Watts....

Wish I had known they were CPU coolers when my aliexpress account got hacked, would have made sourcing parts easier. LOL!


----------



## indaswamp

I have the upgraded 2" fittings and 2 1/2" dust collection hose installed in the dH fridge along with the new fans. The fans fit inside the 2" PVC so I re-fabricated new mounts inside the 2" PVC for the fans. this will help with noise and prevent accidentally touching the fan blades with something.

Made progress on the baffle extension  and new clips for the for the 80x80x25mm PWM 4 pin fans. Hope to have that finished up in the next two days when the fans arrive Thursday.

The little Noctua PWM controller arrived today. I wired it up and plugged a PWM 4 pin fan into it...IT WORKS! That little beauty is gonna be awesome once I am finished! WOOHOO!!! I am excited to see this thing 100% complete! So much R&D on this chamber, but it will perform beautifully once it is all done! And I will know every inch of it inside and out for trouble shooting and maintenance down the road.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB
, I found this..
https://koolance.com/liquid-coolant

Probably better than deionized water for the long term.

And this...
https://koolance.com/flow-meters

Cool site with a bunch of good stuff. I plan on adding a flow meter in the future with digital screen.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB
> , I found this..
> https://koolance.com/liquid-coolant
> 
> Probably better than deionized water for the long term.
> 
> And this...
> https://koolance.com/flow-meters
> 
> Cool site with a bunch of good stuff. I plan on adding a flow meter in the future with digital screen.



Awesome info.  I was wondering if there was something like that available.  and now....  I know..   

JC


----------



## indaswamp

I still need to verify that this fluid is compatible with aluminum radiators...


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> I still need to verify that this fluid is compatible with aluminum radiators...



Do they build other kinds?  Copper would be way to $$$

I would also be concerned with how it reacts with plastic and rubber kind of stuff.


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB
> , I found this..
> https://koolance.com/liquid-coolant
> 
> Probably better than deionized water for the long term.
> 
> And this...
> https://koolance.com/flow-meters
> 
> Cool site with a bunch of good stuff. I plan on adding a flow meter in the future with digital screen.



Just checked out the flow meter.  Very cool speed goody for the chamber.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Do they build other kinds?  Copper would be way to $$$
> 
> I would also be concerned with how it reacts with plastic and rubber kind of stuff.



It should not affect plastic nor rubber....


----------



## indaswamp

Progress....
I went ahead and redesigned the radiator clips. First design made for easy positioning allowing me to slide the radiators to add more during R&D. Trying to push the hose on the radiators with them in place in back of the baffle plate was a PITA. So I wanted an easier way to do that and since I need to close off the area above the radiators now that I am moving the fans, figured I could kill two birds with one stone. This is the design I came up with..












The new radiator clips...
















Reversed the screws and small bolts so I could install the baffle plate and tap the screws and bolts to make marks on the plate for hole reference... This is why custom fabrication takes so long.










I have the holes on the ceiling marked, but need to stop by Lowe's tomorrow and pick up a drill bit extension for $9 so I can drill the holes without having to remove the radiators and clips. I have just enough room the make that work.

Not much left now. Install PVC foam rubber to seal the plate, drill the fan holes, install the fans and fan grills, wire it up, install plate. Fan grills are suppose to arrive Saturday...might get here sooner...


----------



## indaswamp

Oh, and I have strip lights on order...should be here friday so I will install those while as well.


----------



## GonnaSmoke

I'm still here, looking good...


----------



## daveomak

Liquid Coolant​Liquid coolants not only enable heat transfer, they must combat a variety of risks like corrosion and biological growth. Koolance liquids won't clog components and can be used for years before replacement.


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> Do they build other kinds? Copper would be way to $$$


Yes, they build copper radiators...about 2.5x the price of aluminum though.


----------



## indaswamp

The last of the parts I ordered arrived today. Lights, double stick tape, and 80mm nickle plated fan grills. I got the fan plate fabricated and have the holes laid out for the fans, just need to cut them out. I might fool with that later Friday night, if not then that will be Saturday's focus....the fun part of a build; hooking everything up!


----------



## indaswamp

JC in GB
...

Looky what I found...
NEIKO 20713A Digital Tachometer, Noncontact Laser Photo Sensor with 2.5 to 99,999 RPM Accuracy, RPM Gauge Marker with Batteries Included 

That would come in real handy to dial the airflow in precisely!


----------



## indaswamp

*WOOOOHOOOO! I CAN HANG SOME MEAT!*












For all intents and purposes, it's done. I still have some small stuff I need to do, but that won't affect how the chamber performs. I am waiting for door light switches to arrive to install, and a dedicated power supply for the lights, make the drain jug shelf, and install an auxiliary switch for the power supply on the top shroud for easy access. But I can do most of this with meat hanging in it. What a project! Way more involved than I thought it would be at first, but the precision control I have over all the parameters was worth it! Thanks for all the advice from the people on SMF- especially 

 JC in GB
 - that contributed on this project. I will be posting a review thread at a later date once I have run it for a while to give my thoughts on it for those contemplating tackling the project to build one for themselves...

It's beer time boys. Time to celebrate!


----------



## jaxgatorz

It looks awesome  !!


----------



## pineywoods

That looks fantastic looks very professional very nice job can't wait to see it full of meat and the results from that


----------



## indaswamp

jaxgatorz said:


> It looks awesome  !!


Thanks jaxgator. I saved myself about $11-12,000 building it myself!!


----------



## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> That looks fantastic looks very professional very nice job can't wait to see it full of meat and the results from that


Thaks pineywoods! This is a life long dream going back 30 years or so... I feel fortunate to have stumbled across that double door freezer; and lucky I saw 

 JC in GB
 post his build thread which planted the seed for my future build today. I have been boarder line obsessed with completing this project. And those casters from Tractor supply that you recommended are awesome! I must have pushed that freezer a mile already...inches at a time...back and forth working on it in the house!!! LOL!!!


----------



## indaswamp

I wish I would have installed the dH intake baffle plate before I stuck the strip lights to the wall between the doors. Would be nice to have them moved down about 2" so there is no glare on the blue baffle plate. I might try the cut the double stick foam tape with a razor then clean the wall and the back of the light with acetone; reapply sticky foam tape and move the light down.....


----------



## indaswamp

Cleaned the shrouds up and installed the 110v toggle switch. Will install the shrouds then install the controllers and PWM switch on the front shroud with sticky velcro strip tape. Then a final systems check tonight. Will hang some meat in it this week....more than likely some snack sticks that will put off a lot of moisture to test the dH system for real....


----------



## indaswamp

Got the shroud installed.





Two things-
A drill will not work unless you plug it in, and  a refrigerator will not run unless you turn it on! LOL! Long night, Last systems check tonight....she's lined out now and cooling down....


----------



## indaswamp

Running the cooling fans at a reduced speed, the chillers can cool the radiator water down to 4.5-5*F below chamber temp., so that is perfect for optimum cooling without condensation...

I have another power supply on order for the lights. I may use it to run the fans constant at the reduced flow rate to see how that works. I'll have to use the 1 of the  MOSFET switches 

 JC in GB
  made for me if I do that for switching the lights.


----------



## indaswamp

After 24 hours of systems checks, I have sanitized the chamber one last time and moved all my Salumi to the new chamber. I will make some salamini sticks soon to add to the chamber.


----------



## indaswamp

Another useful calculator:
https://www.lenntech.com/calculators/humidity/relative-humidity.htm

If the dH air enters the chamber at 50*F; 76%RH, then that air at 56*F is 61.7%RH. 

With the air entering the dH being 82%RH, that is a drop of humidity of over 20%. So in less than 4 minutes, I am pulling 20% of the moisture out of the air. That is awesome!


----------



## Sven Svensson

I stand in awe!


----------



## indaswamp

Sven Svensson said:


> I stand in awe!


Thanks Sven! I am really happy with how it turned out...and even happier at how it is performing! I can't wait to fill it up!! Or have fun trying!! LOL!!! Thinking of some cacciatore sticks, napolitana piccante sticks, or some Calabrian piccante sticks.


----------



## pineywoods

Outstanding job can't wait to see pics of that thing full and the products coming out of it


----------



## indaswamp

Figuring costs...
Cooling system; for everything= $475 ($125 of that was the aluminum baffle plates and clips)
dH system; for everything= $300 ($30 of that was for the aluminum baffle plates; $50 for the PVC header)
Paint, painting supplies- $100
Caster Tray, Casters, welding, supplies = $260
Controllers =$70

Hardware, bolts, nuts, rivet nuts, foam, tape, misc. stuff = about $400...guessing, but I had to buy some tools and that is included in the cost... take out the tools and it is probably around $300. I bought some furniture dollies for $32 so I could get started before the caster tray was complete, but will use those in the future.

So all in, around $1600....take out the tools and call it $1500. Still a bargin for what I have and what I can do with it. If the price of aluminum and PVC (and everything else really) was normal, this project would have been $200 cheaper. I definitely got nickle and dimed to death....$5 bucks here....$10 bucks there...I know the cashiers at Lowe's on a first name basis now! LOL!! But I am happy.

Oh- included in that cost was replacement parts too. I have spares for just about everything, just incase something goes out I can change it quickly to have the chamber back up and operational without waiting.

Considering I was quoted $2,500-3,000 just to have a new compressor cooling system installed, the total cost for what I have is very reasonable.


----------



## pineywoods

For what you have created that is very reasonable and not only a great working system but a very nice looking unit you've done great work


----------



## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> Figuring costs...
> Cooling system; for everything= $475 ($125 of that was the aluminum baffle plates and clips)
> dH system; for everything= $300 ($30 of that was for the aluminum baffle plates; $50 for the PVC header)
> Paint, painting supplies- $100
> Caster Tray, Casters, welding, supplies = $260
> Controllers =$70
> 
> Hardware, bolts, nuts, rivet nuts, foam, tape, misc. stuff = about $400...guessing, but I had to buy some tools and that is included in the cost... take out the tools and it is probably around $300. I bought some furniture dollies for $32 so I could get started before the caster tray was complete, but will use those in the future.
> 
> So all in, around $1600....take out the tools and call it $1500. Still a bargin for what I have and what I can do with it. If the price of aluminum and PVC (and everything else really) was normal, this project would have been $200 cheaper. I definitely got nickle and dimed to death....$5 bucks here....$10 bucks there...I know the cashiers at Lowe's on a first name basis now! LOL!! But I am happy.
> 
> Oh- included in that cost was replacement parts too. I have spares for just about everything, just incase something goes out I can change it quickly to have the chamber back up and operational without waiting.
> 
> Considering I was quoted $2,500-3,000 just to a install a new compressor cooling system installed, the total cost for what I have is very reasonable.



*I am so glad this worked out for you.  I am all for DIY and repurposing old appliances for cottage industry use.  Not only does it save space in the landfills, it provides a special satisfaction that you built this and know it inside and out; literally.  In most cases, you save a great deal of money over buying a commercial model and will be able to do your own upgrades and repairs.

What I find the most rewarding is the education I get in researching and then, through applied physics and frustration, bring the idea reality.

I am certain you must feel a great deal of satisfaction in making such a fine tuned instrument for your meat curing.  What will be even better is the years of use and professional product you get out of that unit.

I am also happy that my knowledge and experience was helpful in the completion of your project.

I am looking forward to seeing how that unit performs for you going forward.

JC   *


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## indaswamp

I have ordered a timer relay to delay turning the dH fans on when the dH controller kicks the dH cycle on. With the dH refrigerator and duct work sitting idle, the duct work and refrigerator warm slightly above chamber temperature-even though the duct work is insulated. The timer will allow the fridge to cool down below chamber temp. to counteract dumping the warmer air into the chamber....should even out the temp. better.

Thanks 

 JC in GB
 for the recommendation.

Hilitand Delay Timer Switch, GRT8-A1 AC/DC 12V~240V Mini Power On Delay Time Relay DIN Rail Type


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## boykjo

pineywoods said:


> Outstanding job can't wait to see pics of that thing full and the products coming out of it


Ditto.............


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## indaswamp

I installed the GEYA timer relay today. It is set for a 2 minute delay for the fans to allow the dH refrigerator time to cool down first before pushing chamber air through it. It works great! dH is more responsive, and Temp. overshoot has been reduced from 0.5*F to 0.1*F...I like it!


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## pineywoods

Sounds like you've got that thing really dialed in awesome job


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## indaswamp

So the Chorizo Sticks have lost 15.44% weight after 3 days of intensive drying in my old chamber; 65%RH @47-52*F. The pH has stabilized @5.00. The Aw is low enough now that the lactic acid bacteria can't ferment sugars any more even at higher temps., so the moment I have been waiting for has arrived....first new salamis are transferred to the new chamber!

Right side (salami):






Left side (salumi):





One of the Chorizo sticks was a little long so I just hung it on the left side. I hung the guanciale low where the air flow will hit it to circulate white mold spores throughout the chamber.

I have the humidity set @78%RH. When it gets to 81%, the dH system kicks on. it takes 18 minutes to drop the RH% back down to 78%, then it takes 20 minutes for the salumi to put out enough moisture to raise the RH% back up to 81%RH.


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## indaswamp

SO MUCH SPACE!!!!


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## indaswamp

Just the Chorizo sticks are putting out roughly 262 grams of water vapor per 24hours. My dH system in the new chamber is handling that nicely -plus all the moisture from my other pieces that are in advanced stages of drying.


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## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> Sounds like you've got that thing really dialed in awesome job


Thanks piney! Still doing small tweaks...but she's running along nicely! First real test tonight with adding new salamini chorizo sticks to the chamber.


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## indaswamp

...roughly 7~8 grams of water with each dH cycle.....


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## indaswamp

I don't know that I will need a humidifier in this new chamber. The humidifier unit has not kicked on since initial cool down when I used the dH refrigerator for auxiliary cooling and it pulled the RH down to 19%. After set temp was reached, I rehumidified the air. I'll wait....but I may pull it and only use it for cool down from ambient. The salumi hanging is generating enough moisture to keep the RH% high. And when I open the door, 70*F; 60%RH air enters and the humidity spikes so that adds RH to the system as well.


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## indaswamp

Checking weights and doing some figuring....the little dH fridge pulled out 330-350grams of water vapor in the last 24 hour period. This is why I made small diameter salami first; the surface area to diameter ratio is large- meaning the water does not have far to travel to the surface so high evaporation rates. This would be the same as (35-40) 60-65mm salamis hanging in my new chamber...so this is a good test.


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## pineywoods

Looking at those pics I think you better get busy making lots more stuff to hang in that new unit. It still looks pretty empty


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## indaswamp

pineywoods said:


> Looking at those pics I think you better get busy making lots more stuff to hang in that new unit. It still looks pretty empty


I plan on it...in time... 
I am giving the dH unit a real world test to see how much water vapor it can handle. Then I will know how much I can load it up. I will have to do it smartly and not cram a bunch of new product in all at once and overwhelm the dH unit. The left side will be all whole cuts, the right side will be for salami. (40) 60-65mm salami would fill up the top shelf hanging space.


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## indaswamp

So...thinking about the airflow. I may get another Noctua PWM controller and set up two independent zones; left and right. The salami will need higher airflow generally than the salumi.

I also may have underestimated the resistance of the radiators to good airflow since I moved the fans. The chorizo stick casings are a tad sticky to the touch which indicates yeast...meaning moisture is not being removed fast enough. I have transferred them to the bottom rack where airflow is the highest. we'll see if that fixes the issue. They are already at 25% weight loss. Sticks dry fast.....


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## indaswamp

On the fans- be sure you buy static pressure fans and not airflow fans for the radiators.....


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> On the fans- be sure you buy static pressure fans and not airflow fans for the radiators.....



Yes that is what I was trying to say.  I called it head pressure.  Not sure if that is the same thing.  If you don't have enough pressure, multiple fans in a bank will fight each other.

JC


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## indaswamp

So this new chamber is as close to ideal as I can get...without being IN Italy doing it au naturale in the open air. Being that my experience drying salumi has been with frost free compressor units, and the tendency for those systems to dry the surface too fast without slight modifications as well as constant monitoring, rotation, and flipping the pieces; I erred on too slow airflow for this new chamber initially. That and underestimating the resistance of the radiators. I have gone back to having the fans installed on the radiators for faster, more axial flow. This has helped. I modified the 80mm PWM fans with aluminum flashing plates to fit the 120mm wide radiators. I used the 4 PWM controlled fans and 4 of the original 120mm fans. I alternated them for more even airflow. This is working out well and I think I'm close to where I need to be. Time will tell once I hang some 50-60mm salami to see how they dry. Once I get the airflow right, this thing is going to produce some exceptionally evenly dried salumi.

So far, even with all the little tweaks I had to do, this system has impressed me. I never would have thought a peltier system could cool down a space that large, but it is doing it...and doing it well. Two 40x40mm little chips....220W of cooling.....


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## HalfSmoked

Awesome job as usual by indi.

Warren


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## HalfSmoked

Thanks for the likes guys I appreciate them

Warren


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## indaswamp

So...playing with the chamber parameters.....

I took my spare inkbird temp. controller and stuck the temp. probe in the cooling water reservoir jug. Set high point @55*F, low point @54*F. The chamber temp. zero'ed in on 55.5*F and holds steady. The water temp. fluctuates between set parameters. The cooling water temp. through the radiators cools down to around 52.5~53*F before rising to almost chamber temperature. This set up is pulling just enough heat out to maintain a steady state. The Temp. only moves up 0.1*F when the dH system kicks on and dumps warm air that is in the duct work into the chamber...but other than that-steady state! Awesome! I will drill a hole in the jug lid and run it like that. The TEM chillers come on for about 1.5 minutes, then shut off for about 45 seconds as the water temp. warms up again.

And I can now run the RH% where everyone suggests the RH% should be...75-80%RH. Without the blast of super dry cold air from a compressor system, this range is ideal.

The more I fool with this chamber, the happier I get! I am so excited to fill it up this fall....or have fun trying!!! LOL!!!


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> So...playing with the chamber parameters.....
> 
> I took my spare inkbird temp. controller and stuck the temp. probe in the cooling water reservoir jug. Set high point @55*F, low point @54*F. The chamber temp. zero'ed in on 55.5*F and holds steady. The water temp. fluctuates between set parameters. The cooling water temp. through the radiators cools down to around 52.5~53*F before rising to almost chamber temperature. This set up is pulling just enough heat out to maintain a steady state. The Temp. only moves up 0.1*F when the dH system kicks on and dumps warm air that is in the duct work into the chamber...but other than that-steady state! Awesome! I will drill a hole in the jug lid and run it like that. The TEM chillers come on for about 1.5 minutes, then shut off for about 45 seconds as the water temp. warms up again.
> 
> And I can now run the RH% where everyone suggests the RH% should be...75-80%RH. Without the blast of super dry cold air from a compressor system, this range is ideal.
> 
> The more I fool with this chamber, the happier I get! I am so excited to fill it up this fall....or have fun trying!!! LOL!!!



So very awesome!!  I am glad the chamber is meeting your expectations.  What a satisfying project.

JC


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## fornoa

Hi Keith (Indaswamp),
How is the huge Fridge project going?
Did the Thermoelectric cooling units do the job?
And if so how did you implement that solution?

Cheers


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## indaswamp

fornoa said:


> Hi Keith (Indaswamp),
> How is the huge Fridge project going?
> Did the Thermoelectric cooling units do the job?
> And if so how did you implement that solution?
> 
> Cheers


The new fridge is operational. I still have some minor tweaks I want to do, but I will wait until after this next batch of 60mm salami is finished drying. I will use those to judge the airflow and make adjustments.

The (2) Thermoelectric modules (TEM) worked great once I got the correct heat sinks. I am using (2) 120mm x 255mm radiators in series per TEM for cooling inside the cabinet. The Temp. of the water at the radiator inlet is running 3.5-4*F below chamber temp. so no condensation on the radiators. Humidity is extremely steady. I have no need for a humidifier as the salumi evaporates enough moisture to keep the humidity high. I also introduce moisture when I open the doors for air exchange. (68*F;60%RH room air) It is very humid here in the South.

I want to split the fans and use 2 separate speed controllers to have 2 zones for drying. Salami needs slightly more airflow than whole muscles so this is how I plan to address that. I will need to make a partition about half way up from the floor in the middle of the cabinet to direct the higher airflow over the salami instead of it bleeding over to the whole muscle side. But that should work. I plan to use a 3/4" sheet of foam board for that. Cut it to fit tight.....


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## fornoa

indaswamp said:


> The new fridge is operational. I still have some minor tweaks I want to do, but I will wait until after this next batch of 60mm salami is finished drying. I will use those to judge the airflow and make adjustments.
> 
> The (2) Thermoelectric modules (TEM) worked great once I got the correct heat sinks. I am using (2) 120mm x 255mm radiators in series per TEM for cooling inside the cabinet. The Temp. of the water at the radiator inlet is running 3.5-4*F below chamber temp. so no condensation on the radiators. Humidity is extremely steady. I have no need for a humidifier as the salumi evaporates enough moisture to keep the humidity high. I also introduce moisture when I open the doors for air exchange. (68*F;60%RH room air) It is very humid here in the South.
> 
> I want to split the fans and use 2 separate speed controllers to have 2 zones for drying. Salami needs slightly more airflow than whole muscles so this is how I plan to address that. I will need to make a partition about half way up from the floor in the middle of the cabinet to direct the higher airflow over the salami instead of it bleeding over to the whole muscle side. But that should work. I plan to use a 3/4" sheet of foam board for that. Cut it to fit tight.....


Really glad to hear the TEM's work a treat.
If you get some time, can you post the actual details (specs) of the components you used, as I am thinking this would be a great solution as a backup unit should my fridge fail or if like you, I come across a larger old commercial fridge or freezer box I can convert to a chamber.
I have one spare fridge ready to go that I can transfer my control equipment to, but instead of buying an other backup fridge should that happen, having your cooling system in place sounds like a great economic solution to any any existingfridge I have or may want to upgrade to in future.
Some images would be helpful also.

My chamber is effectively set and forget, with only one or two tweaks during the curing process but I would really enjoy implementing your solution to the refrigeration aspect as an emergency backup to my current fridge or upgrade unit.

Hope you can share your specs.

Cheers
John


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## indaswamp

JC in GB
 has a thread up on the components he used to convert a small 13cu.ft. residential refrigerator using TEM chips and a list of components. He bought most all the stuff off Aliexpress.

The basics of the TEM unit are a computer CPU cooler (copper tubing with fans), a TEC1-12706  (120W;6Amp) or TEC1-12715 (180W;15Amp) peltier module chip 40mmX40mm, and a 40mmX40mm aluminum fluid block....will also need some thermal electric paste for the contacts. And a clamp. for a fridge smaller than 13cu.ft. you only need one TEM module.

For the 120W, you can use 1 radiator. this will suffice to keep the temp. of the cooling water above the dew point of the chamber temp. so you do not have condensation. If you use the 180W, you need to use 2 radiators in series so enough air contact gives enough heat transfer to keep the water temp. above the dew point of the chamber temp.

1 small goldfish pond pump....60mL per second, about 1 gallon per minute

A reservoir of some sort, I used a 2qt. coleman insulated water jug.

If you want to control air flow then you need a PWM controller like the Noctua unit I bought. You will need 4 pin PWM 120mm x 120mm x 25mm fans. If you do it this way, you can buy just the radiator without the fans and save some money. You can also just use 2 PWM fans instead of 4, depending on if you want a constant very slight airflow. I like Noctua fans too....very highly recommended, and quiet.


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## indaswamp

JC in GB build threads:
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/sausage-curing-cabinet-build-jc-in-gb-part-one.304776/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/sausage-curing-cabinet-build-jc-in-gb-part-two.305179/

https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/sausage-curing-cabinet-build-jc-in-gb-part-three.305436/


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## indaswamp

Noctua makes CPU coolers as well...I recommend one with 12 copper cooling pipes and 120mm fans. That will keep the hot side down to between 78-88*F....


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## indaswamp

BTW, this is a long thread... there are pictures of all the components I used throughout the thread. I also have a post of the the components I used and links. If you have a question about a specific component, please ask.

Here is a CPU cooler made by Noctua:
Noctua 140mm CPU cooler

Components are about 3 times cheaper if you order from aliexpress, but you will have to wait a month or more for delivery.....


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## fornoa

Thanks Indaswamp, that's great.
This info will give me plenty to work with over the next few months.
I'll let you know how I'm going with this down in OZ.

Cheers mate!


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## indaswamp

F
 fornoa
 , you will also need a (1) 60 Amp power supply...


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## indaswamp

fornoa said:


> Thanks Indaswamp, that's great.
> This info will give me plenty to work with over the next few months.
> I'll let you know how I'm going with this down in OZ.
> 
> Cheers mate!


BTW, Welcome to SMF! Nice to have a fellow Salumist on the board! Post up some of your projects...


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## fornoa

indaswamp said:


> F
> fornoa
> , you will also need a (1) 60 Amp power supply...


Thanks for that.

Cheers


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## indaswamp

And unless you live in an area where the relative humidity is low so that you can use a purge system to lower the humidity, you will need to have a way to remove it. I built a cold dehumidifier...
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/maturing-chamber-cold-dehumidifier-build.316049/


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## indaswamp

Rick hooked me up with some stickers....








The finishing touch.


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## fornoa

indaswamp said:


> Rick hooked me up with some stickers....
> View attachment 643713
> 
> 
> 
> The finishing touch.
> View attachment 643714


Does your choice of Norcini Nirvana relate to any relationship your family may have to the town of Norcia in Perugia Italy ?


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## indaswamp

fornoa said:


> Does your choice of Norcini Nirvana relate to any relationship your family may have to the town of Norcia in Perugia Italy ?


No, My family comes from Correggio,Italy. A Norcini was a traveling butcher. They lived in the mountains tending to Proscuitto and other salumi for most of the year, but would travel to the lowlands during the winter going house to house butchering pigs and making salumi on site. Each Norcini had their own style and recipes, this is one of the reasons for the great variety in Italy.


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## indaswamp

So I am thinking of using 
F
 fornoa
 's idea of a purge system on a timer for air exchange. 
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/curing-chamber-modification.316939/#post-2360858

But instead of the main chamber, I will purge the little dH fridge I use for dehumidification. Doing it this way, once it is purged (the air will be very humid), when the dH cycle kicks on, the fridge will start cooling down before the fan kick on (on a timer) and all the humidity that got pushed in with the outside air can condense on the cooling plate! I can remove it before it gets to the chamber! Thinking of using one of those small 4.5CFM fans to circulate the air while the fridge is on, then shut off when the dH fans kick on. Any ideas for control on that 

 JC in GB
?

Every purge would be 4% air exchanged....i.e. 1.7 cu.ft. divided by 42.5 cu.ft.


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> So I am thinking of using
> F
> fornoa
> 's idea of a purge system on a timer for air exchange.
> https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/curing-chamber-modification.316939/#post-2360858
> 
> But instead of the main chamber, I will purge the little dH fridge I use for dehumidification. Doing it this way, once it is purged (the air will be very humid), when the dH cycle kicks on, the fridge will start cooling down before the fan kick on (on a timer) and all the humidity that got pushed in with the outside air can condense on the cooling plate! I can remove it before it gets to the chamber! Thinking of using one of those small 4.5CFM fans to circulate the air while the fridge is on, then shut off when the dH fans kick on. Any ideas for control on that
> 
> JC in GB
> ?
> 
> Every purge would be 4% air exchanged....i.e. 1.7 cu.ft. divided by 42.5 cu.ft.


Let me think on that a bit.


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## fornoa

Ah, I see. I quessed you had an Italian connection. 
As it happens, I was born in the tiny mountainside town of Lettopalena P. Chieti. Everyone there was a Salumista, so there was no need for a Norcini. That's why I wasn't aware of the significance of that word.
Cheers John


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## JC in GB

JC in GB said:


> Let me think on that a bit.



One question, are you trying to purge only the air from the dehumidifier/freezer unit or the entire chamber?


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## indaswamp

JC in GB said:


> One question, are you trying to purge only the air from the dehumidifier/freezer unit or the entire chamber?


Just the little dehumidifier refrigerator so I can use the small refrigerator to condense the water vapor before introducing that air into the chamber.


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## indaswamp

JC in GB

Have not seen you on SMF lately...hope life has turned around for you and is treating you well.

So-here is what I am thinking... a series of timer relays to cascade and control the purge through the little dH fridge. At the start of the dH cycle, when the controller kicks the power on, first thing to happen would be for the purge cycle to kick on. This would involve 2 fans and 2 solenoid valve (fail close so when power is off, they are closed; when power is on, they open). If I use the small 5.4CFM fans, a 20 second purge would suffice. Next in the cascade, a timer relay for the fridge to kick on after the purge; say 30 seconds. Let that run for 3-4 minutes to cool the new air and dehumidify. Probably will need to install a small recycle fan in the dH fridge for this phase to efficiently dehumidify the new air. (still thinking on how to power that). Next in the cascade would be for the dH fans to kick on. Timer delay set for 5 minutes? Then everything would proceed as normal...the system would run until the target low DH setting has been reached and the system shuts off and resets for the next cycle.

Thoughts???


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## indaswamp

purge fans and solenoid valves relay- timer to power off
refrigerator timer relay- timer to power on
dH fans to circulate air through dH fridge-timer to power on


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## JC in GB

indaswamp said:


> JC in GB
> 
> Have not seen you on SMF lately...hope life has turned around for you and is treating you well.
> 
> So-here is what I am thinking... a series of timer relays to cascade and control the purge through the little dH fridge. At the start of the dH cycle, when the controller kicks the power on, first thing to happen would be for the purge cycle to kick on. This would involve 2 fans and 2 solenoid valve (fail close so when power is off, they are closed; when power is on, they open). If I use the small 5.4CFM fans, a 20 second purge would suffice. Next in the cascade, a timer relay for the fridge to kick on after the purge; say 30 seconds. Let that run for 3-4 minutes to cool the new air and dehumidify. Probably will need to install a small recycle fan in the dH fridge for this phase to efficiently dehumidify the new air. (still thinking on how to power that). Next in the cascade would be for the dH fans to kick on. Timer delay set for 5 minutes? Then everything would proceed as normal...the system would run until the target low DH setting has been reached and the system shuts off and resets for the next cycle.
> 
> Thoughts???



At this point, I think I need a block diagram to understand all the gates and times.

This summer has been pretty lame as far as life is concerned.  I am hoping the winter and next summer are better.

Family issues have kept me busy.  I hope this smooths out so I can get back to some sense of normalcy.

I see I even let my Forum subscription lapse. 

Driving your fans should not be an issue, just let me know the voltage and current you need to control and I can come up with something.

JC


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## indaswamp

Checking on the chamber this morning, one of the TEM chips went out. Took about 10 minutes to change it out and I did not have to shut the cooling system down. Just de-energized the power to the power supply going to this TEM, disconnected the wires, then removed the middle fan on the TEM heat exchange (2 wire clips...easy) so I could loosen the bracket bolts. Had the new TEM chip ready to go with thermal paste, reinstall and tighten down hand tight just so the exchanger does not move...not too tight. Put the middle fan back in place with the clips, reconnect power, and done.


----------

