# Why are my temps so low!  Char-griller Pro w/ Sidebox



## mintee

Hey everyone,

First post here, so go easy on me, haha!

Anyway, I purchased a Char-Griller Pro about a year ago and added the side smoke box as seen here. http://img.shoppingnexus.com/products/char-griller-smokin-pro-grill-smoker.jpg

I've used everything from chips, to chunks, to logs and I can never seem to get my temp up past 200F.  Today, it's been about 80F outside and my temp has basically stayed around 160 for the past 5 hours.  Sadly it looks like I'm going to have to turn the oven on and finish my Brisket, Ribs and Chicken.  

I've messed around with both the chimney and vent on the side of the smoke box, but no matter what the combination I cannot seem to have a steady temp.  Usually I keep adding hot charcoal to the main barrel to keep the temp up, but that requries moving the meat and obviously releasing heat and smoke. I know this isn't the proper way of doing it.

I have 1 vent from the smoke box to the main chamber wide open at all times.  I feel maybe I'm losing heat between the two, but I haven't read anything about insulating the seam.  I can provide any extra info needed, but I need help!  

What could I be doing wrong?


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## jirodriguez

Welcome to the forum Mintee.

First question to ask is have you done the mods to your smoker? There are some basic mods that make the chargrillers a much better smoker and make it a lot easier to hold steady temps. Here is a link: http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/forum/thread/81884/char-griller-smokin-pro-mods-complete-w-qview  

Main mods to make are:

1) Replace the factory therm in the lid with two set just above the grate level on the left and right. Factory therm can be off by 50-100°.

2) Get/make/buy some sort of charcoal basket to use in the firebox. It should hold at least 5 lbs. of charcoal and be suspended or lifted at least 4" off of the bottom of the fire box. Do a search for charcoal basket and you will find many threads on these.

3) Use heavy duty all metal dryer vent tubing to extend the smoke stack down to grate level.

4) Flip the charcoal pan in the cooking chamber upside down and hang it as high as it will go. This will act as a baffle/tuning plate to eaven out the temps from end to end. You can also make tuning plates and a baffle out of other stuff as well.

Those are the must do mods for your smoker and they can all be done for under $30.


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## venture

How are you measuring your temps?  If you are using the stock therm, those will read about 60 degrees low if not more.  Do you have a probe therm in the pit at meat height from the grate? That will give you an accurate pit temp. Also, as Johnny said, those units require some simple mods to work right.  Extend the chimney down to grate level as he said.  You can see examples using the search tool.  Also, a coal basket is almost a requirement on these units.

Keep at it and you can get good smokes.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## alelover

What they said plus...Make sure the smoke chamber is sealed up. You may be bleeding off most of your heat through leakage. Smoke should only be coming out of the smoke stack only. There is a vent between the firebox and the smoke chamber? It should be a hole about the size and shape of a football. Leave your exhaust wide open to help the draft. Start with a full  chimney of charcoal. Preferably RO lump.


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## tom37

Something I have had to do at times during strange conditions is, 

I have had temp troubles and had to prop the door to gain enough air flow to make the fire burn hot enough to keep temps. Hot enough may be the wrong term, because if you really crank a giant fire, your gonna warp the pee diddle out of it. 

Two real easy things to try also would be to slightly elevate the stack end or even lower it to make it sit close to level. 

Or

Turn the smoker 180 degrees to see if you are getting a funny air flow caused by a surrounding building or house. I only mention this since I don't know how close your rig is to the house.


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## mintee

Hey guys,

All good things, thanks for the input.  I haven't extended the stack, or gotten a basket for the charcoal.  I believe that's the biggest problems I'm having.  Ended up smoking for about 6 hours yesterday and finished everything in a 275 oven for 2 hours.  Everything was awesome, but obviously I had to cheat!

I think you also hit the nail on the head regarding both losing heat out of the smoke box, and turning the box 180 degrees.  I've used this thing so many times and now I'm gonna take it apart and start sealing it up.  It's gonna be a messy job.

Thanks y'all


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## alelover

Sealing it up is a good start. Here is a good place to researching it.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/search.php?search=fire+rope


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## cliffcarter

You didn't mention what you are using for fuel or how much. Fuel type and amount will effect your temps more than any other factor except wind direction and as Tom37 stated you must keep the intake on the fire box pointed into the wind. If you are using charcoal briquettes switch to lump charcoal the ash from the briqs will choke off the fire and cause low temps. If you are using lump and you are getting low temps use more at the beginning, I always use 2 full(and fully lit) chimneys of lump when I start my CharGriller. Two other very simple things you can do are turn the charcoal grate in the SFB upside down, this will allow more air to get to the charcoal, and remove the charcoal grate from the main chamber so you're not heating it up, too. These are the only mods I have done on mine and have never had problems getting to or maintaining temps and I've cooked at temps ranging from 230° to 325° with no problems. with the right amount of fuel you should be able to also.


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## alelover

I raised my charcoal basket up so more air can flow under it. It helped a bunch.


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## lovinspoonful

mintee said:


> I have 1 vent from the smoke box to the main chamber wide open at all times.  I feel maybe I'm losing heat between the two, but I haven't read anything about insulating the seam.


I'm not specifically familiar with your equipment, but the sentence above gave me pause. You have controllable vents between the smoke box and the main chamber? If so, I expect you would want all of them open, all of the time. In a nutshell, you want to control the level of combustion in your firebox by adjusting the air inflow, and you want the heat and smoke to move into the main chamber. If you are choking the flow of smoke and heat between the firebox and the cooking chamber then you are working against yourself.

As far as the placement of your smoker goes, if you are having trouble with temps try orienting the vent to the firebox upwind to create a slight "forced induction" effect. Conversely if you need to quench temps, orient it 180 degrees.


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## mintee

Ok, I had a family emergency I had to deal with for the past week, so excuse my absence.  Pressured washed my porch today, but I plan on ripping my rig apart this week and sealing up some holes, etc.  

As for the fuel question, I've used everything from coal briquettes to lump, to wood chunks to logs.  This brings me to my next question, if I plan on using logs, raising the grate in the sidebox wouldn't allow me to use any more than maybe 1 small log.  Is there another way around this?  

I'm going to research the fire ropes and see how I can use that, but where in the world can I find a coal basket.  I considered modding a small deep fryer basket and cutting off one side for easy access, but the one pictured from alelover  looked awesome, yet rather small.


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## cliffcarter

mintee said:


> ...  This brings me to my next question, if I plan on using logs, raising the grate in the sidebox wouldn't allow me to use any more than maybe 1 small log.  Is there another way around this?


If you are going to use wood splits for fuel they should be about 8"-10" long and 2"-3" at the widest axis in my experience. I use no more than 1 at a time to maintain proper temps and thin blue smoke. I preheat the splits in the SFB next to the cooking chamber it ensure prompt ignition and avoid smoldering. If you cook with wood you will need to clean the cooking chamber more often. You should not use a charcoal basket if you are cooking with wood splits, simply turn over the grate in the ash drawer so it stands on the "legs".


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## venture

I would stick with lump until you get your issues worked out.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## erodinamik

I had very similar problems with my Char-griller.  The first thing that helped me in a pinch was to put the grates that came with my SFB back in, and put my charcoal on top of that.  It's hard to put much on it and tends to fall out if you over load it but it made a bit difference right away. I now have some expanded metal that rest on the inside of the SFB and gives me an air gap of 6 or so inches (about 2-4 inches lower than the cooking grates in the SFB).  For my money that was the biggest help.  I also installed 2 thermos at cooking level and it's amazing the difference between those two and the thermo on the lid.  I still want to seal up all my hole because I get lots of smoke coming out of lots of places in my smoker, and I feel like that would help direct the airflow to the charcoal and keep temps up.  Mines a work in progress but it's getting there.  Good luck.


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## mintee

Ok, I've added my firerope yesterday, made a charcoal basket out of expanded metal, flipped the charcoal pan over in the cooking chamber, new thermometers should be in the mail today.  I've purchased the (dryer) exhaust vent and I'm going to mount it today, but I haven't determined a way to make it stay conformed to the lid like seen here.  

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p63/Toxie512/Smoker/551d064a.jpg


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## alelover

Just bend it into shape and hose lamp it to the stack. I used a nut and bolt in front to secure it at grate level.


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## venture

I attached mine to the chimney with a hose clamp.  Then simply pulled it a bit so it would stick under the front lip of the lid. I pre cut to approsimate length, as I remember I used about half of the chunk.

Here is the pic of my smoker when it was new.


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## mintee

Ok, just finished everything but the air filled tires.

New Dual Grate Level Thermometers - CHECK!

Dryer Duct Installed and Secured - CHECK!

Charcoal Box made and Installed - CHECK!

Fire Rope Installed - CHECK!

Thinking about throwing a load of charcoal in to give it a dry run once the bonding agent for the fire rope drys out to see what kinda temps and time I can hold.

Gonna maybe do a brisket and pork shoulder Sunday.  I'll post pictures then!  Thanks everyone!

Oh, now I need a stand alone grill again, doh!


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## venture

Dry runs are a great idea.  Waste a little fuel so you know what you are dealing with.  Watch your temps from one side of the grate to the other.

After that, you are on your own to learn the hard way just like the rest of us had to.  LOL

Good luck and good smoking.


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## mintee

Well, the dry run so far is running pretty crappy.  Sadly the only fuel I have is Kingsford Hickory Charcoal Briquets and I don't trust them more than I could throw them (hence me using them as a dry run).  I topped off again at 175F, but I'm dry running on my screened in porch, with little to no air (wind) flow.

So, I Macgyver'd it up and brought out a box fan and set it on low on the FSB side, about 10' away.  Temp went up to 200F, which I am happy with.  It's been about 3 hours now, and I don't see anything close to the 220F mark though.

I'm not against modding a intake fan on the side of this rig, but really?

Sunday I'll take some Q-View photos of what I plan is a BB, Chicken, and maybe a Brisket.


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## venture

You have something weird going on there.  If you have a coal basket, at summer temps you should be fighting to keep that down to 250.  Please post more pics and give us info about your ambients.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## cliffcarter

mintee said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> First post here, so go easy on me, haha!
> 
> I have 1 vent from the smoke box to the main chamber wide open at all times.  I feel maybe I'm losing heat between the two, but I haven't read anything about insulating the seam.  I can provide any extra info needed, but I need help!
> 
> What could I be doing wrong?



Quote:


alelover said:


> ... There is a vent between the firebox and the smoke chamber? It should be a hole about the size and shape of a football.


There is a knockout in the wall of the main chamber where the SFB attaches, did you remove it?


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## mintee

Knockout!!!  %#$^@^!!!!!!!!!!!  I'm such an a-hole!  I just finished about 45 minutes of dremeling and rescrewed it all together.  Every time someone said something about a "foot ball size hole" I thought they meant the diameter of the hole.  

Well, here's pics of the problem, and faux solution, but I think I might go take it apart again and just get rid of the knockouts (on both the FSB and the Cooking chamber, right?)

Go ahead and laugh at me.  I deserve it. :(


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## cliffcarter

Not gonna laugh at ya, I think this is a fairly common problem, you just had the guts to admit it. I think your problem is solved. Good Luck.


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## venture

Still not right.  You need to remove the firebox and knock out that entire football shaped piece.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## mintee

Venture said:


> Still not right.  You need to remove the firebox and knock out that entire football shaped piece.
> 
> Good luck and good smoking.




Ya, I've since taken it apart again and ran thru about 10 cut blades on my little dremel, so it's the way it supposed to be.  I got about 12 chicken quarters on there right now and it's holding steady at 225F for about an hour now.  

I tested the vent/chimney wide open and I got up to 325F so BINGO!


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## venture

Sounds like you are on your way. 

Next time just knock that thing out with a hammer and save your blades.  LOL

Good luck and good smoking.


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## erodinamik

I'm in no position to comment on your error.  When I first opened the box and read the instructions I was very hesitant to punch a big hole in the side of my brand new rig.  Glad you got it figured out though.  When I did mine I used a punch and a hammer and the football hole was made to be punched out like that, no dremeling required.


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## meateater

Smoke on!


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## mintee

Funny, the FSB knockout knocked out very easy, but the main chamber knockout was more like a guideline than anything.  There was proof there was a few easy weld spots, but them metal was still competely a 1 piece.  I didn't wanna risk bending it up, so the dremel it was.


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## solna905

I may be wrong but I dont think that there should be a vent between firebox and smoker.  There should be a cutout where the vent is. It is kind of football shaped.  The vent is only if the grill is used without the firebox. I saw one assembled without removing the cutout but my instructions say to remove it.


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## jirodriguez

mintee said:


> Funny, the FSB knockout knocked out very easy, but the main chamber knockout was more like a guideline than anything.  There was proof there was a few easy weld spots, but them metal was still competely a 1 piece.  I didn't wanna risk bending it up, so the dremel it was.


When I had mine I found using the cutting blade on the dremel to cut the spot welds, then using a cold chisel and hammer worked great, but I also had cut a length of 2x4 that I used to brace the inside of the main chamber because the metal was so flimsy.

Glad to hear you got the temps issue figured out!


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## dodgefan67

great thread! i have the same issue about temps on the exact same char-griller. going to be making the mods to it soon. i have the football hole between the SFB and main chamber out but i need the chimney vent, charcoal box, and extra thermometers added. will work on that and see if my temps go up

but at the same time, they way mine is now, gets up to about 250 from time to time, doesnt always stay that high, but the food does get cooked, so its been ok, but i do leak A LOT of smoke out this thing


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## venture

Well, the insert doesn't need to be cut out.  As others have mentioned, it will benefit from some reinforcement before it is knocked out.  A little common sense goes a long way here.  Just banging away on that can bend things that will cause problems later.

I was luckier than some, cause mine required no sealing around the firebox.

Good luck and good smoking.


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## alelover

I used some high temp RTV around where the SFB meets the cook chamber. A lot of heat can be lost there.


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## terry colwell

What a great theard,,, loved the photo of the inside...lol. I have the same grill and was wondering why you where having such a hard time getting the temp up. I have done NO mods to mine and at grate level with just one chimney starter full of regular charcoal my temps will be around 250 or 300 with just everything shut as normal.About the only thing that I do different is I put my charcoal on the cast iron grates instead of the down on the slide out tray (which I think is worthless other then for cleaning anyway) . If you put the charcoal right next to the FOOTBALL sized opening your temps will most likely go over 300 easly. and once you start throwing wood chuncks on it 400 is not hard to hit either, so watch it when you add wood. I have started moving the charcoal to the far side by the door , or just move the meat towards the vent either or. I will add about 12 to 15 pieaces of fuel every hour or so, and i move the old around so the ash build up drops down to the pan.. And thats about all I have done..


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## tommy012175

I see its been a while since anyone responded to this post but hopefully I get some help.  I can not get mine up to temps at all.  

I installed duct, flipped charcoal tray over, lined in foil, raised charcoal, and installed 2 new thermometers on front.  

New thermometers on front will never go over 160.  But my temp gun and digital says its over 225 most time on grate. 

Here some pics of temps after 2 hrs today.


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## tommy012175

Other pics

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Right side













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## kaz souder

What size of dryer vent hose did you use? All I can find is 4"


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## dirkdigglier

I cannot begin to describe the royal pain in the butt that this issue has caused me. I have tried doing a lot of things differently to get the Char-griller up to temp and have even shy'd away from smoking meat and have been just direct grilling because of this issue (don't judge). I am glad I found this forum post but what really pisses me off now is that it is from like five years ago! Why are they still selling these unmodded if its such a problem??? Why not make it better? Because its not very usable OEM for smoking, trust me I've tried! I wish I would have know this before I started using this thing, I don't mind modding it, sounds like fun actually but......it is used I don't see how I am going to get any RTV to stick to it now. Thank you so much for solving  this for me! Now I am off t o email Char-Griller a piece of my mind!


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## cliffcarter

DirkDigglier said:


> I cannot begin to describe the royal pain in the butt that this issue has caused me. I have tried doing a lot of things differently to get the Char-griller up to temp....


Describe for me the things you have done, please. I believe I can help. I have been cooking successfully on a barely modded Chargriller for years. In fact the mods I have done have only been done in the last 2 years, and I don't always use them when BBQing.


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## dirkdigglier

Cliff

Sorry, I didn’t see your response. Since my original post I have done some MODs but am still having trouble holding an adequate temp. I have:

               Extended the pipe down to the grate

               Installed two temp at grate lvl one on the FB side the other near the new pipe.

               Got a firebasket

               Used fireplace caulking to shore up openings especially between the FB and main unit.

               Installed gasket material around both doors

I used a pan with water and I flipped the charcoal holder upside down to use as a baffle. But I can still not get the temp past 200. Re reading the post I see I need to maybe make sure the charcoal holder (baffle) is placed high and the coal basket as well but I do see how these little adjustments will make that big of a difference. Ideally I would like to have to use the vents a bit to control the temp and not have them wide open and still obtaining a low temp. I am still losing some heat, evident by smoke loss, from the FB door and will try to shore that a bit too. Any other suggestions? I am a bit disappointed with this grill but am not quite ready to throw in   the towel yet.


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## dirkdigglier

I used 3" but I had to ask for it because it was not where the dryer vents were.


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## cliffcarter

I am not a fan of the dryer vent extending the stack to grate level, I believe you need to improve air flow to increase temps and I don't see how this helps. IMHO you are better off extending the stack up on the outside by 12"-16".

If you want to keep the grate as a baffle then you should certainly raise it as high as you can in the cook chamber. This will help raise temps because it will increase air flow in the cook chamber. Some CG users have also drilled holes in the grate to further improve air flow.

IMHO the best thing to do is to remove the CC charcoal grate altogether(this is what I do BTW), in doing so you will have a hot end, near the FB and a cooler end at the stack. This is my preference and how I learned to use my CG, YMMV.


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## dirkdigglier

Thanks for the reply. I will try it out with the CC holder not in play to see how it works and the CC basket higher up. I'll post how it goes.


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## dirkdigglier

So I did a test run with no grate (baffle) and with the charcoal up high in the FB. Same results, temp hovers at 200 and no higher. I had the vents all the way open and even propped the FB door open after a bit to try to increase air intake but no luck. I guess I will try one more time. I will take the dryer vent out and see how it does I guess. I think I have tried everything.


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## dirkdigglier

So I did a test run with no grate (baffle) and with the charcoal up high in the FB pretty right next to the "football:. Same results, temp hovers at 200. When I put some dry woodchips in the charcoal the temp rises to 250 but quickly dissipated once the wood chips expired. I had the vents all the way open and even propped the FB door open after a bit to try to increase air intake but no luck. I guess I will try one more time. I will take the dryer vent out and see how it goes I guess. I think I have tried everything.


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## cliffcarter

Can you post a few pictures of what you are doing, seeing the conditions may help the diagnosis.


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## dirkdigglier

I'll post some pictures tomorrow. Thanks for the help!


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## cliffcarter

One question I forgot to ask- how much charcoal did you use on your last test run?


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## dirkdigglier

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As far as the amount of charcoal I used when I did my last test run I used 1 chimney's worth of charcoal then immediately started another, dumped it then started another and dumped it. The coal holder was completely full. I do not recall what the temp was initial with one chimney but with two it was at 200'ish and the third chimney did not make a difference. I then threw in a couple of handfuls of dry wood chips which flamed up and  the temp got up to 250'ish maybe a little more but quickly died back down to 200'ish. This is practically the same result before I did all the modifications.

1ST pic: two new temp gages

3RD pic: dryer vent and seal going around edges where door meets. I didn't do back because it didn't look like it would work too well. I did get a lot of smoke (heat) escaping from here but I used foil to plug it up and it worked pretty well.

4TH pic: I had a lot of gaps in the football area, I think it and the firebox got tweaked a bit when I moved. I filled them all in as well as all other manufactured holes throughout the grill with a high temp chimney sealant. You can see in the pic some spots where the sealant (gray) got hot and flacked away but the sealant between the two components (grill and FB) is still intact and is doing its job. I had removed the FB  cleaned it up, got new hardware, put a bead of sealant around the football and all fastener holes, torqued the hardware down and then ran a bead from the outside as well.

6TH pic: an after market coal holder I bought. Initially I had it in this position down low w/ the coal holder in the grill flipped over and used as a baffle. I could not get the temp past 200. I had the baffle down low as well.

7TH pic: coal holder placed higher up and used no baffle on my 2nd test run that I described in my first paragraph which only got be again to about 200. During both test runs the vent and the smokestack were wide open. With the coal holder up high on the grates there was a gap where the FB door could not close all the way (8TH pic) which I didn't think was too big of a deal because it would let more air in. I had bought some threaded rods to run through the FB and suspended the coal holder a bit lower so the door could close all the way but I don't think it would make too much of a difference. The FB door is kind of tweaked a bit too. I installed a seal around it as well and it has helped but I do lose some smoke (heat) at the FB as well. But it should not be enough to not let the cooking chamber get up to temp with the vent and smoke stack open imo.

So I guess the next step is suspended the coal holder a bit so the FB door can close and maybe remove the dryer vent. That's all I can really think of.

I really like this grill, its sturdy and large, but this is ridiculous. They only other smoker I have used was a cheppo small knock-off brand from wallyworld and it worked well for me never had a problem smoking meats in it.

Anything else you can think of that might help? Again I appreciate the assistance.

Jason


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## dirkdigglier

Cliff

I did what you suggested in your PM, I replaced the thermometers with a set that had longer (3in) probes and it works! It got up to temp with just one chimney of coals. I dumped another chimney in and was closing the vents off to try to keep it below 300. I don't care what they say about you Cliff, you're alright! Thanks! I can't wait to use it this weekend!

Jason


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## lemans

Here is what I found using my duo. What ever the temp of the fire box is , the CC is 1/3 that temp
 You want to smoke at 250.  You better maintain 700 -800 in the fire box


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