# SV Why are the 'die hards' so afraid of Sous Vide?



## SGMan

And by die hards I mean the grillers, cast ironers, broilers, pit smokers etc.  

I am currently in a heated discussion on FB (yes I know, thats a part of the issue there LOL) in regards to my comment stating that sous vide is a superior way to cook your meat(s) to perfection.   Whoah... The comments range from curiousity to 'GTFO with your Yankee ass boiling method'  Its getting to the point of comedy.  

Ironically, the same people who are going to die by the grill and bash any other method that threatens their style,  are the same ones who have never experienced the superior cook of a sous vide much less of even heard of it as an option.    And then go on to say its 'semantics' when I correct you in saying 'No, you are not boiling your steak'  

The closed mindedness is making my head hurt...  But hey, if you don't like it or agree with it - then don't do it.   Just know that my steak will beat up your steak.


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## Winterrider

You answered your own question, FB.  Controversy is there #1 thing that keeps them going. What others are missing out on is there own fault. Just another tool in the chest, the way I see it .


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## 6GRILLZNTN

This is part of the reason I'm not on FB anymore.  Too much arguing, and people insisting I'm wrong about something.  If SV makes a superior piece of meat for you, then that's all you need to know.  One of these days I'm going to pull the trigger on one.


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## Steve H

5GRILLZNTN said:


> This is part of the reason I'm not on FB anymore.  Too much arguing, and people insisting I'm wrong about something.  If SV makes a superior piece of meat for you, then that's all you need to know.  One of these days I'm going to pull the trigger on one.



Well said. I've been thinking about this as well. Or, just use the pid controller I just made. And use a crock pot or other cooker to try a SV cook.


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## notactjack

Well I'm not sure I'm a die hard about anything, but I've come to the conclusion it's pretty much a waste of time and money. 

I've do steaks better with reverse sear with a cast iron skillet and oven.  Chicken wings turned out good and no oily clean up. But it's a big investment for a chicken wing cooke .   Several London broils later I couldn't make that tender and taste good. 

I really want the sous vide to work but in my experience it's just a gimmick. It might work well for steaks in the catering or restaurant biz but for me no bueno.


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## WeberBlackStoneYoder

I have nothing against sous vide at all. To say that your steak will beat up my steak though does make me LMAO! Give me a 2" Thick Cut Porterhouse and I will put Money on it every time.


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## 6GRILLZNTN

Steve H said:


> Well said. I've been thinking about this as well. Or, just use the pid controller I just made. And use a crock pot or other cooker to try a SV cook.



Steve; If you use your PID with a crock pot please let me know how it works out.  The nerd in me is curious about this.


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## chef jimmyj

5GRILLZNTN said:


> Steve; If you use your PID with a crock pot please let me know how it works out.  The nerd in me is curious about this.



Since the Crock don't Circulate, it is only safe for Intact cuts of meat. Fish, Seafood, Steaks and Chops, no issue. Large , Injected cuts will be in too long and pose a risk. Speaking of Timing...All posted instructions and recipe Timing is Worthless, with a Crock Pot. Without the Circulation cooks take longer...JJ


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## GaryHibbert

I don't have a SV, not because I'm against it or anybody who uses one.  I don't have one for the same reason I don't collect baseball cards---I simply have exactly zero interest in it.
Gary


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## noboundaries

I've been tempted to get a sous vide circulator, but we've had enough unused appliances that ended up in yard sales: toaster ovens, bread machines, crock pots, latte makers, etc. I've looked at sous vide, and just about talked my wife into getting one for my birthday, until she said, "You know, it's just going to end up in a garage sale." She gave me a FRIGGIN' KILLER coffee grinder instead (Breville Smart Grinder Pro) for the same amount of money that gets used once or twice a day.

I'm not opposed to sous vide at all because I'm into simple ways of doing things, even with the grill, smoker, oven, stovetop, roasting coffee, whatever. But sous vide just doesn't interest me enough for me to believe I'd use it enough to replace the same meal that could have been grilled or smoked.


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## chopsaw

I have two . Would not be with out either one .


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## chopsaw

SGMan said:


> But hey, if you don't like it or agree with it - then don't do it. Just know that my steak will beat up your steak.


I do steaks both ways . I am a fan of a SV steak , but your statement is false . I started doing steaks over my charcoal starter with a piece of expanded metal . Fantastic , no SV needed .


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## indaswamp

Sous Vide is a game changer for wild game meat.


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## ofelles

"The closed mindedness is making my head hurt... But hey, if you don't like it or agree with it - then don't do it. Just know that my steak will beat up your steak." 

I know you are but what am I?   or is it I'm rubber and you're glue.  What you say bounces off me and sticks to you!


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## chef jimmyj

I have a SV unit but only used it once. I know it's a personal problem but the wife and I just never seem to be organized enough to execute a cook 24 hours out. 9 out of 10 meals, the meat is defrosting in running water in the sink day of...JJ


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## Steve H

chef jimmyj said:


> Since the Crock don't Circulate, it is only safe for Intact cuts of meat. Fish, Seafood, Steaks and Chops, no issue. Large , Injected cuts will be in too long and pose a risk. Speaking of Timing...All posted instructions and recipe Timing is Worthless, with a Crock Pot. Without the Circulation cooks take longer...JJ



That was the thing I was thinking about. No water circulation. I started thinking about SV's again after reading Bear's write about the SV and Lobster tails. After vacation I'm going to give it a try.


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## SmokinAl

I have 2 SV circulators & they are just another weapon in the arsenal.
They can take the toughest cut of meat & turn it into melt in your mouth, tender & juicy.
But for a steak I prefer wood or charcoal. I have a Santa Maria attachment for my Weber.
And a nice ribeye grilled over hickory is hard to beat!
Al


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## xray

I’m with Al. Can I make a better steak over a wood fire and charcoal?....absolutely!

I mostly use my SV for chicken, pork and pastrami. 

But where SV shines for me is for quick meal prep. My wife and I buy bulk meat, and with a little bit of prep work the SV becomes really helpful.

We will season and vacuum seal chicken breast and pork by the pair (since it’s only us), and throw them in the freezer.

I work until 6pm, my wife works until 3pm. So she will take a frozen package from the freezer and directly into the water bath...Once I get home, the meat is ready, So I just sear and serve. Dinner is ready in a matter of minutes.


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## johnmeyer

I've been using my an analog PID temperature controller I designed and built years ago. I have put marks on it at each of the main SV temps I use. I calibrated it with my Thermapen, so I know it's very accurate. If it were ever to break down, I'd get one of those $25 digital units on Amazon which can also be used for keeping things cold.

My "circulator" is my spoon. The only reason for needing a circulator is to keep hot or cold spots from forming in the water and also to speed the temperature change so the cold food doesn't get an insulating layer of colder water around it. If you stir every few minutes while the food comes up to temp, it works fine. Once the food is at temp, you hardly need to stir at all. 

If you do want to duplicate what I've done, you MUST use an analog slow cooker with no electronics. Mine is just a heating coil and a Hi-Lo-Warm-Off switch. There is no thermostat and there are electronic controls. The good thing is that it was the absolutely cheapest cooker at Target.


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## SmokinVOLfan

Pretty good debate and interesting reading all the comments. I don't have one either but I'm not opposed to it. I've got relatives that will absolutely not eat anything that came from a sous vide. They say cooking meat in a plastic bag causes cancer.


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## chopsaw

SmokinVOLfan said:


> They say cooking meat in a plastic bag causes cancer.


Only in California  .


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## dr k

I did get the Wifi Inkbird SV circulator advertised in the meat thermometers forum a few weeks ago so I can SV and smoke at the same time and the price was great.  I usually do tougher cuts over 24 hour SV cooks with the PID and analog 6 qt Crockpot.  I see convection currents in the water and have had nothing but great results with this set up and never stirred.  I just took the handle off the glass lid to run the probe through and secured with two spring clothes pins. One on each side off the lid.  I do half gallon yogurt batches in the 3 qt slow cooker.  Give the SV crockpot a shot.  No bad results or news yet.  One of my first Ribeye Crockpot with PID SV cooks made the carousel but as I mentioned I mostly stick with tougher cuts to SV.


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## Steve H

dr k said:


> I did get the Wifi Inkbird SV circulator advertised in the meat thermometers forum a few weeks ago so I can SV and smoke at the same time and the price was great.  I usually do tougher cuts over 24 hour SV cooks with the PID and analog 6 qt Crockpot.  I see convection currents in the water and have had nothing but great results with this set up and never stirred.  I just took the handle off the glass lid to run the probe through and secured with two spring clothes pins. One on each side off the lid.  I do half gallon yogurt batches in the 3 qt slow cooker.  Give the SV crockpot a shot.  No bad results or news yet.  One of my first Ribeye Crockpot with PID SV cooks made the carousel but as I mentioned I mostly stick with tougher cuts to SV.



That's encouraging to hear. Thank you.


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## Bearcarver

I see a couple of attitudes similar to mine, so here is a short on my Take:

SV is another tool in the tool box---Not the End-All, but not one I want to be without.
   I don't know any other method that can turn an "Eye Round" or a "Chuck Roast" into a "Prime Rib-Like" piece of Meat. Yes it takes 21 hours to turn the Eye Round or 30 hours to turn the Chucky into that Awesome Pink colored, Tender, Juicy hunk of meat, but I can wait, especially when that Hunk of Meat only cost me about $3 to $4 per pound.

I tried SV on a lot of things, and IMHO, it's mainly for the tougher cuts & the Lean cuts of Meat.
I would rather just Smoke my Prime Rib, and I would rather just Grill my Ribeye, but if I want my Eye Round or Chucky to end up like an Awesome Med-Rare Tender Steak, I'm going with the Sous Vide Game!!! You gotta sear it afterwards, or it will be pale & ugly directly from the SV, but who cares. You can smoke it a little before you SV it too, if you like, but it's the SV that made it Tender.

Some things, like Fish, Shrimp, Scallops, and Lobster Tail, I want them to be safe for my particular health, so I want them to get to 140° IT, but not much more, so I've been using SV, because that puts it at EXACTLY 140° (give or take a half of a Degree).
If I'm making any of those things any other way, the only way I can be sure of getting it to 140° IT is to take it over 140°.

Well, That's the Short of it, but there's lots more. I'm sure I'll never learn all of it.

Bear


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## SGMan

Many great points here!   

And agreed - The SV is just another tool in the arsenal (that I wouldn't want to be without)  
I would say by FAR my favorite thing to cook in the SV (thus far) are pork chops.  Pork chops are a little tricky on the grill to get them 'perfect' and not under or over done.  The SV does this magically every time and the family LOVES them cooked this way.   

So much in fact that my woman said she is glad her momma lives in another state. Cause those chops were so good she would be slapping her


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## banderson7474

I could see pork chops for sure b/c like the person above me said, they can be tricky on the grill.  For my personal tastes on beef, I like the char steak better.  I was never a real fan of prime rib.  I will always order the steak before that.


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## cooperman

I sous vide pork and chicken breasts because those are the hardest for me to cook and get right. They turn out much more tender and juicy. I just did a round eye that was very good.


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## hardcookin

For me a SV doesn't currently fit my needs. I smoke mostly in volume...
And you can only have time, to do so much.


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## solman

GaryHibbert said:


> I don't have a SV, not because I'm against it or anybody who uses one.  I don't have one for the same reason I don't collect baseball cards---I simply have exactly zero interest in it.
> Gary



funny, that's exactly how i feel about golf. :)

but if i was told collecting baseball cards, or even wearing pink underwear, could almost guarantee a consistently well cooked piece of meat, i'd definitely be open to trying it (even the pink).


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## Bearcarver

solman said:


> funny, that's exactly how i feel about golf. :)
> 
> but if i was told collecting baseball cards, or even wearing pink underwear, could almost guarantee a consistently well cooked piece of meat, i'd definitely be open to trying it (even the pink).




Good Points!!
Bear


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## Steve H

5GRILLZNTN said:


> Steve; If you use your PID with a crock pot please let me know how it works out.  The nerd in me is curious about this.



Last night I got a chance to try out the PID as a SV. I used a large Presto 1500 Watt multi cooker. During the test I never stirred the water. The results were encouraging. I set the PID for 150. Which appears to be about the norm for cooking with the SV. With the first run the temp overshot to 154. After a few tweaks and auto tune. I tried again. This time the temp came up to 151. Then settled to 149. After I return from vacation I'm going to do a small eye of round roast to see how it works.








I put the PID thermocouple and one InkBIrd thermocouple in the center. And spaced the other 3 three were spaced around the cooker.







I didn't record the graphs. But the ramp up to the temp looked good. And the PID cycled properly to maintain the 149. This was a fun little build. And I look forward to turning a Eye of round into Prime Rib!


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## mike243

Yes a slow cooker with a controller will work, anything that could be cooked wouldn't know it wasn't in a SV, the reason they circulate water is because of the small area of the heater, the crock pot is surrounded by heat and there's no need to circulate . IMO the crock pot is more versatile with less heat loss and quicker recovery times. I will wait on a factory crockpot/SV unit I think lol


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## dr k

mike243 said:


> Yes a slow cooker with a controller will work, anything that could be cooked wouldn't know it wasn't in a SV, the reason they circulate water is because of the small area of the heater, the crock pot is surrounded by heat and there's no need to circulate . IMO the crock pot is more versatile with less heat loss and quicker recovery times. I will wait on a factory crockpot/SV unit I think lol


i just used the Inkbird wifi advertised here on SMF and it worked great. I have a big aluminum pot and lid I made a cut out for the immersion circulator. Since the metal is paper thin I insulated the pot. After a 30 hour chuck roast the circulator had a lot of calcification and the pot had crystal white deposits adhered to the wall and bottom of the pot. Seems heavy but maybe normal with a little water loss. Nothing like this at all with the PID crockpot SV. I looked up metal containers for SV and no mention with just water reacting with alum. At 135°. Anyone have white crystalline deposits on their metal vessels?  No directions really with this circulator just a pamphlet and I inquired about info on the meat thermometer forum that this SV was advertised on. How many hours before descaling the circulator?


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## Bearcarver

dr k said:


> i just used the Inkbird wifi advertised here on SMF and it worked great. I have a big aluminum pot and lid I made a cut out for the immersion circulator. Since the metal is paper thin I insulated the pot. After a 30 hour chuck roast the circulator had a lot of calcification and the pot had crystal white deposits adhered to the wall and bottom of the pot. Seems heavy but maybe normal with a little water loss. Nothing like this at all with the PID crockpot SV. I looked up metal containers for SV and no mention with just water reacting with alum. At 135°. Anyone have white crystalline deposits on their metal vessels?  No directions really with this circulator just a pamphlet and I inquired about info on the meat thermometer forum that this SV was advertised on. How many hours before descaling the circulator?
> View attachment 397873




My Sous Vide Supreme is all metal, and it never gets any deposits on it, but no water ever evaporates from it either. There is no circulator in it either.

Bear


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## chopsaw

I have pretty hard water at my house . I'll throw some white vinegar in the water after a cook and let it run . Maybe every 4th time . I don't get anything in the pot , just on the inside of the anova . I use stainless steel or plastic .


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## Hawging It

Hey, if you like the SV deal go for it. As for me and my style it just does not interest me. I prefer a charcoal grill and my stick burner. Will never own a pellet grill either. That’s why I live in a free country. I do what I want and cook any way I want.   The way I see it. If they don’t like your cooking style, tell em to kiss your ass! LOL!!

,


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## dr k

Bearcarver said:


> My Sous Vide Supreme is all metal, and it never gets any deposits on it, but no water ever evaporates from it either. There is no circulator in it either.
> 
> Bear


The setup for crockpot SV I've been using for 1.5 years is like yours, no circulation, the same temp everywhere whether you touch the wall or not with a therm but its only 6qt. No water loss since the sensor goes through the hole in the glass lid where you remove the handle and condensation cascades back into the crock. I love it, but wanted to smoke with the PID and SV. I looked for info, but being a new product Inkbird threw in as a sponsor here I'm not impressed with the vagueness before their releasing, Inkbird has no manual. Nothing on the site that this is their product. I have a cooler and 4 gal food grade curing vessel I can use to SV but just want directions from the Mfr. Regarding their product (instruction manual) before voiding their one year warranty.


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## Bearcarver

dr k said:


> The setup for crockpot SV I've been using for 1.5 years is like yours, no circulation, the same temp everywhere whether you touch the wall or not with a therm but its only 6qt. No water loss since the sensor goes through the hole in the glass lid where you remove the handle and condensation cascades back into the crock. I love it, but wanted to smoke with the PID and SV. I looked for info, but being a new product Inkbird threw in as a sponsor here I'm not impressed with the vagueness before their releasing, Inkbird has no manual. Nothing on the site that this is their product. I have a cooler and 4 gal food grade curing vessel I can use to SV but just want directions from the Mfr. Regarding their product (instruction manual) before voiding their one year warranty.




"Sous Vide Supreme" has a Great Web Site too.
If you want to check it out & a mess of their recipes, with an interactive Index, just search "Sous Vide Supreme".

Bear


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## dr k

Bearcarver said:


> "Sous Vide Supreme" has a Great Web Site too.
> If you want to check it out & a mess of their recipes, with an interactive Index, just search "Sous Vide Supreme".
> 
> Bear


Thanks Bear! I researched a ton with SV before getting in. I have Baldwins online book because I like pasteurizing.  Like I did with Mes smokers for 6 months before I pulled the trigger in 2015 before BT. MB had a fraction of similar smokers but before the wave of hybrids. At least I see at a glance what gen it is. I will release from this thread and PM 

 Inkbirdbbq
. There's an instruction manual somewhere.


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## Inkbirdbbq

dr k said:


> Thanks Bear! I researched a ton with SV before getting in. I have Baldwins online book because I like pasteurizing.  Like I did with Mes smokers for 6 months before I pulled the trigger in 2015 before BT. MB had a fraction of similar smokers but before the wave of hybrids. At least I see at a glance what gen it is. I will release from this thread and PM
> 
> Inkbirdbbq
> . There's an instruction manual somewhere.


PM back to you and will send you the sous vide user manual.


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## bregent

The only way I do pork loin these days is SV, then smoke. Best way I've found to get a 1" thick chop that's juicy and cuts with a fork.

But a real game changer for me is short ribs. No other way to get medium rare, fork tender beef ribs. They are amazing.











I probably use my SV 2-3 times a week for various other tough cuts, chicken, and reheating. It's just another kitchen tool, not the end all, but very useful for some things.


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## solman

bregent said:


> But a real game changer for me is short ribs. No other way to get medium rare, fork tender beef ribs. They are amazing.
> View attachment 398935
> View attachment 398936



that looks amazing. if i were to guess the steps to do this, i'd SV for 30-48 hours at 131F, and then smoke at 225F until internal temp reaches 205? am i close? :)


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## chef jimmyj

solman said:


> that looks amazing. if i were to guess the steps to do this, i'd SV for 30-48 hours at 131F, and then smoke at 225F until internal temp reaches 205? am i close? :)



Take another look...They are fork tender and Med/Rare, 130-135. That's magical...JJ


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## bregent

solman said:


> that looks amazing. if i were to guess the steps to do this, i'd SV for 30-48 hours at 131F, and then smoke at 225F until internal temp reaches 205? am i close? :)



Close. SV at 131F for 72 hours, chill, then smoke till about 131F (want to keep them med-rare).  The darkness comes from layering on a glaze during smoke.


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## Rusty Zipper

SGMan said:


> And by die hards I mean the grillers, cast ironers, broilers, pit smokers etc.
> 
> I am currently in a heated discussion on FB (yes I know, thats a part of the issue there LOL) in regards to my comment stating that sous vide is a superior way to cook your meat(s) to perfection.   Whoah... The comments range from curiousity to 'GTFO with your Yankee ass boiling method'  Its getting to the point of comedy.
> 
> Ironically, the same people who are going to die by the grill and bash any other method that threatens their style,  are the same ones who have never experienced the superior cook of a sous vide much less of even heard of it as an option.    And then go on to say its 'semantics' when I correct you in saying 'No, you are not boiling your steak'
> 
> The closed mindedness is making my head hurt...  But hey, if you don't like it or agree with it - then don't do it.   Just know that my steak will beat up your steak.


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## Rusty Zipper

What's Space Book????


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## BuckeyeSteve

I got a SV for Fathers Day.  I am definitely going to do those short ribs!


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## Inkbirdbbq

BuckeyeSteve said:


> I got a SV for Fathers Day.  I am definitely going to do those short ribs!


Can't wait to hear your valuable comment！


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## chopsaw

BuckeyeSteve said:


> I got a SV for Fathers Day.  I am definitely going to do those short ribs!


you're gonna love it .


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## chef jimmyj

You could not tell from some folks attitudes and posts but, there is no My Way or You're an Idiot! There are many ways to cook meat and, get it tender. My Wife and I grew up on cheap cuts of Beef, like Chuck Steaks, covered in Adolf's Meat Tenderizer. It worked! Is it SV Tender? No, but still tasty. I've found most folks that argue one aspect is the only way, have never tried cooking it differently. Or are just plain AFRAID to try something different...JJ


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## Sparky9

SmokinAl said:


> I have 2 SV circulators & they are just another weapon in the arsenal.
> They can take the toughest cut of meat & turn it into melt in your mouth, tender & juicy.
> But for a steak I prefer wood or charcoal. I have a Santa Maria attachment for my Weber.
> And a nice ribeye grilled over hickory is hard to beat!
> Al



Agreed, it’s another tool in the tool box.  My mother has one and we cooked steaks on it once.  The meat was tender but we didn’t season it enough I think.  Next time around we will probably put it on the Q after, or try a sear in a CI.  I think we just need to practice with it just like anything else.  All in all, the family prefers the grill for steaks but I am always willing to try new things.


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## sigmo

Who knew this thread would end up with a lot of great recipes and techniques being posted?!

My and my wife's favorite sous vide "thing" for the last few years has been this:

I buy a few full cryovac tenderloins at Sam's.  They're a lot less per pound than cut tenderloins.

I get out the vacuum sealer and bags and cut the loins into approximately 8 ounce steaks.  I season them (we like a store-bought rosemary garlic mix).

Then I vac-seal them individually, not too high of a vacuum, but getting all of the air out.

Then I freeze them.

When we know we'll want steaks, we put one (to split) or two if we're starving into the pot with the circulator at 131F (55C).

From frozen, I like about 3 to 5 hours for these little beauties.

Then we can prep some asparagus, or whatever, and when we and whatever else we want are almost ready, I take out the steak, pat it dry, and fire up a cheap ceramic-coated non-stick skillet and sear them in butter over high flame for a minute or so.

Super fast and easy.  Cheaper and less effort than a trip to a fast food drive thru, and I kid you not, the best tasting, most tender steak either of us have ever had.  Bar none!

It's to the point that neither of us will even bother ordering steak when we go out anywhere because we know it won't compare.

We both had steaks at a Ruth Chris's, and Kobe steaks at The Stratosphere in Vegas.  Sorry, great meals, but the steaks simply cannot compare to what ends up being about ten minutes of actual "work" at our house with the sous vide!

Melt in your mouth doesn't begin to describe it.

Now, I do a mean steak on the grill.  A little Smokey Joe with raging charcoal is my favorite.  I love super hot charcoal, and the effect of getting an incredible initial sear from the radiation off of perfect coals, and the subsequent cooking with the lid on, and vents choked back so you have some lower heat and a highly reducing atmosphere to get them just right.

And I love my smoker.  And I want to try some reverse sear, etc.  But man, we are absolutely spoiled by the sous vide.

For Christmas this last year, I bought two big rib roasts.  I cut them into six two-pound rib eye steaks.  Seasoned them.  Vacuum packed them.  Froze them.

I bought a picnic cooler just to use for this one sous vide meal.  I modified it to accommodate three circulators because I could not work out the thermal load calculations, and wanted to be safe.

I bought two additional sous vide circulators, and used all three at once.  It turns out it was overkill, but I needed to be sure with such an important family meal on the line.

Four hours before we planned on eating, I fired up the trio of circulators to make sure the temperature would be up before I put these enormous steaks in.

Three and a half hours before the meal time, I put in the steaks.  I used a grate from a smoker to force all of the bags to be completely submerged, and every so often, moved the bags-o-steak around to assure they all got equal treatment.

When everything else was ready, or almost, I got the steaks out, dried them, and seared them in a huge cast iron skillet, in butter.  I did have to do them in two batches, three at a time.

Every single person said they were the best steaks they had ever eaten, including my son, who is a grill/smoker/sous-vide fanatic in his own right.

The adults shared their steaks with the grandkids, and even the kiddos ate mass quantities!  I could not have been happier!

Having worked for a chain of environmental laboratories for many years as, among other things, their expert on precision temperature control and monitoring, I can tell you that an actively-stirred water bath is the most stable and precise temperature reference and control method available.

For precise incubation of bacteriological samples, nothing comes close.  I built systems for them to incubate hundreds of samples at once with control within 1/10th degree C, and these were always recirculating water baths.

Water has a very high specific heat.  It has relatively high density.  It has high thermal conductivity.  And it is a liquid!  It is almost the ideal heat transfer medium.  And it's just plain water!  So convenient, safe, and easy to work with.

Immersion circulators have been a staple in the laboratory for 30 years or more.  They're the standard by which all other temperature control systems are judged, (and come up short).  My hat is off to whoever came up with the idea of using one to cook food.

Anyhow, as cheap as an immersion circulator is these days, you really owe it to yourself to give it a try.  Another tool in our arsenal.  And a really easy way to make a world-class meal with "fast food" ease.

You can have my immersion circulators when you pry them from my cold, dead, fingers!  But I will also keep my smoker, and my charcoal grills, thank you!

I have to try some of the other techniques from this thread now!


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## mike243

Bought a cheap 1200w SV unit and tried 2 big T bones that I know would have been tougher than leather,wife wont eat red and very little pink, 3 hrs at 160 for the heck of it. Over done for me and a little dry but not like leather , wife said it tasted more like roasted beef than steak, seared in skillet after bath. 135 for my next adventure and will leave hers out, it seems to hold temp really good but time will tell if It will hold up. also did a couple of chicken breasts at 150 for about 90 minutes and browned afterwards that were good.


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## sigmo

Try 131 (55C).  It's hot enough that you won't be in any danger even if you leave them in for over 3 hours, but to me, a perfect medium rare.

I hope you like it as much as my wife and I do.


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## SGMan

Yes, 160 is way too hot for your meats.  Thats approaching veggie territory!

Surprisingly - I got my mother a SV cooker and her favorite thing to make in it is in fact veggies!  She recently started dabbling in steaks and chops, but the drop in temp was a shocker for her.


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## atomicsmoke

Richard Foster said:


> I don't think its a question of fear but of preference. I could just as well ask what makes people so dumb as to come onto a smoking and barbeque forum to discuss boiling meat. It is just as stupid as it would be for me to go hang out on a vegan forum and try to discuss pork butts and brisket.


Wow...
Look closer...this is the SV subforum. And you thought you'd never get caught reading about boiled meat...lol


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## chopsaw

SGMan said:


> Ahhh, and I see what you did there Richard...
> I ignored your first attempt at what I can only assume is trolling me, so you went ahead and re-reiterated your boiling meat comment.



Well said .


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## Winterrider

Have never done veggies.  Curious how long and what temps would you need to soften up something like say, baby carrots seasoned up ? Potatoes ?


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## SGMan

Winterrider said:


> Have never done veggies.  Curious how long and what temps would you need to soften up something like say, baby carrots seasoned up ? Potatoes ?



Ill check with my mother as she seems to have some of the veggies down pat.  But I believe its in the 180-190 ranges.   I just know that if you plan to do meats in conjunction, you should do your veggies ahead of time as they take a higher temp - Let me verify for you Im asking her now!


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## SGMan

Winterrider said:


> Have never done veggies.  Curious how long and what temps would you need to soften up something like say, baby carrots seasoned up ? Potatoes ?



Okay, I did verify with her - She says she has had wonderful success with corn on the cob and baby potatoes.   The temp is ~181.5 and she runs it for about an hour or so (although most recipes call for ~35 minutes)   As far as baby carrots go, I can't give you a definitive answer on that one (until I take a stab at them again) :p


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## chopsaw

Winterrider said:


> Have never done veggies.  Curious how long and what temps would you need to soften up something like say, baby carrots seasoned up ? Potatoes ?


Works great for vegetables . The corn is fantastic . Just watch what bags you use at higher temps . I've had cheap freezer bags fail . So I only use vac bags at higher temps .


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## Bearcarver

Winterrider said:


> Have never done veggies.  Curious how long and what temps would you need to soften up something like say, baby carrots seasoned up ? Potatoes ?





*Here's an Index for all kinds of SV Veggie Cooks:*
https://blog.sousvidesupreme.com/category/all-recipes/vegetables/

And if you look on the Left side you'll see all the other categories of all the other things to SV. I got this with my Sous Vide Supreme---Very User Friendly.

Bear


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## Winterrider

Thank you SGMan, Chop, and Bear. Appreciate it...
I do use vac bags 90% of the time.


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## smokebuzz

Not that I'm opposed to it, the only thing i like cooked in water is pasta. I'm sure boiled ribs will be a thing again some day. Until then, i'll continue to burn wood.


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## johnmeyer

smokebuzz said:


> Not that I'm opposed to it, the only thing i like cooked in water is pasta. I'm sure boiled ribs will be a thing again some day. Until then, i'll continue to burn wood.


Just to be clear, the food never touches the water, and the water is _way _below 212° F, so nothing gets boiled, and the effect on the food is quite different than my English mother-in-law produced when she cooked (_everything_ was boiled).

And to the person cooking chicken at 160° F, I recommend doing it again, but at 142°. That is what is recommended by the "SeriousEats" site, which has a really good sous vide section:

Sous Vide Recipes


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## Bearcarver

johnmeyer said:


> Just to be clear, the food never touches the water, and the water is _way _below 212° F, so nothing gets boiled, and the effect on the food is quite different than my English mother-in-law produced when she cooked (_everything_ was boiled).
> 
> And to the person cooking chicken at 160° F, I recommend doing it again, but at 142°. That is what is recommended by the "SeriousEats" site, which has a really good sous vide section:
> 
> Sous Vide Recipes



Just to clarify:
142° SV is Fine for White Meat, but not for Dark Meat.
Dark Meat is normally between 160° and 167°.

Bear


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## atomicsmoke

I jumped late on the SV bandwagon, thougjt it was just another kitchen gadget like those advertised on late night infomecials.

I was wrong ofcourse. 

Having said that, not everything is what is cracked up to be. I was very excited st the beginning with the SV steaks (followed by a quicl grill sear). Then i found it was not as good as old school grilling. Especially for dry aged cooked rare.


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## SGMan

atomicsmoke said:


> I jumped late on the SV bandwagon, thougjt it was just another kitchen gadget like those advertised on late night infomecials.
> 
> I was wrong ofcourse.
> 
> Having said that, not everything is what is cracked up to be. I was very excited st the beginning with the SV steaks (followed by a quicl grill sear). Then i found it was not as good as old school grilling. Especially for dry aged cooked rare.



And again, its not exactly a one size fits all tool. But it does some things on a level (consistently) that I can on a hit and miss basis.  Im definitely a better home cooking artist with it in my arsenal. (Along with my smoker, airfryer, InstantPot, blowtorch...)   Please don't tempt me with new toys, I got yelled at more than once for what I have now LOL

But always remember its a wand.  A wand that does magical things to tougher cuts of meat.
Its a magic wand.  Just let it happen


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## johnmeyer

Bearcarver said:


> Just to clarify:
> 142° SV is Fine for White Meat, but not for Dark Meat.
> Dark Meat is normally between 160° and 167°.
> 
> Bear


Thanks for that. It is a very important clarification. More on this can be found here:

https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/07/the-food-lab-complete-guide-to-sous-vide-chicken-thigh.html#temp


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## sigmo

It is also fantastic for the most tender cuts as well.

What I use it for the most is tenderloin steaks.  As I mentioned above, tenderloins seasoned, vacuum packed, then frozen can be pulled out of the freezer, cooked in the sous vide at 131F for between 3 and 5 hours, then quickly pan-seared in butter.  The result is the best steak I've ever eaten, bar none.

And the ease of cooking is fantastic.  They come out exactly the same every time.  This is perfect for my wife and I because we both work, and are still able to enjoy a fantastic meal regardless of whether or not one of us gets home late.

I, too, highly recommend the Serious Eats site for excellent and highly scientific instructions on all things Sous Vide.

https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/06/food-lab-complete-guide-to-sous-vide-steak.html

The main point of Sous Vide cooking is that you cook to a perfectly controlled, perfectly uniform, and perfectly repeatable internal temperature as opposed to cooking based on time with the outside of the food exposed to a much higher temperature than the actual target temperature for the food.

Check out the articles at that site for various foods.

Does it do everything well?  No.

Is it suitable for or better than anything else for all situations?  No.

But it is an incredibly accurate and repeatable way to do certain things.  It is highly recommended.

To those of you dismissing it without trying it or even studying it first:  I don't understand your reluctance to give it a fair chance.  If people gave up on all new ideas without trying them, we wouldn't even have fire, let alone smoking or any other form of cooking.

When I met my wife, she had grown up eating only meat her father had caught or killed, and then cooked by her British "war bride" mother.  That meant meat was not easily available, and when it was, it was cooked to the consistency of shoe leather.

I invited her to my place for steaks.  She hated steak, and was very reluctant.  I prepared them as I'd learned to do, marinating them briefly to get them up to room temperature before grilling them starting over hot coals in my little Smokey Joe, which does a fantastic job for small batches, and is highly and quickly controllable.  You can get a super high sear at the start, with incredible radiant heat from the raging coals, then cover the grill and close down the vents to get the longer, slower part of the cooking (still very fast, though).

She was amazed!  She'd never had proper medium rare steak.  She immediately fell in love with steak, a food she loathed all of her life up to that point.

Maybe that's why she married me!  Charcoal grill courtship!

Anyhow, my point is that new ways of cooking something can be a revelation.  Keep an open mind.  Sous Vide wouldn't have any fans if it was bad.  Why would a bunch of smoking and grilling fanatics embrace it if it sucked?

At least study it and appreciate it for the scientific and technical aspects.  Read up at the Serious Eats site.  Everything is explained well and has been researched extensively.

As has been stated over and over in this thread:  It's an excellent tool to add to your arsenal.  I promise, you won't sail off the edge of the earth and be eaten by dragons.  Really.


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## Bearcarver

atomicsmoke said:


> I jumped late on the SV bandwagon, thougjt it was just another kitchen gadget like those advertised on late night infomecials.
> 
> I was wrong ofcourse.
> 
> Having said that, not everything is what is cracked up to be. I was very excited st the beginning with the SV steaks (followed by a quicl grill sear). Then i found it was not as good as old school grilling. Especially for dry aged cooked rare.



Yup---So far the things I like the least in my SV, are Ribeyes & Prime Rib, but Ribeyes come out Great on my Grill, and what my Smoker does to Prime Rib shouldn't even be legal.
SV doesn't break down the fat, like high heat does.

Bear


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## hoity toit

I have 2 sous vide units, one mounted on an old ice chest, the other is much like a old roaster. The only reason I like them is because you can put multiple foods in at the same time and hold them till ready to serve. Basically a holding or warming oven. I do at times put a steak in and then sear it on the grill right before serving. It works for me, but a steak right on the coals is hard to beat.

HT


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## johnmeyer

The last few posts remind me of what it was like when I bought my first microwave oven in 1979. I thought I could use if for *everything, *and so I made brownies in the microwave (nothing but chocolate goo); biscuits (came out like Italian gnocchi); a roast (tough and tasteless); and, believe it or not, our Thanksgiving turkey.

The moral of the story is the same as for sous vide: it's not for everything.


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## Inkbirdbbq

hoity toit said:


> I have 2 sous vide units, one mounted on an old ice chest, the other is much like a old roaster. The only reason I like them is because you can put multiple foods in at the same time and hold them till ready to serve. Basically a holding or warming oven. I do at times put a steak in and then sear it on the grill right before serving. It works for me, but a steak right on the coals is hard to beat.
> 
> HT


Yes. Such a great work requires the expenditure of much money and time. With the Sous vide, it's easier to work.


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## Inkbirdbbq

johnmeyer said:


> The last few posts remind me of what it was like when I bought my first microwave oven in 1979. I thought I could use if for *everything, *and so I made brownies in the microwave (nothing but chocolate goo); biscuits (came out like Italian gnocchi); a roast (tough and tasteless); and, believe it or not, our Thanksgiving turkey.
> 
> The moral of the story is the same as for sous vide: it's not for everything.


What an interesting experience,lol


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## S-met

Hot pot and fondue using SV to pre-cook the ingredients. Success, would definitely repeat. Its not a fix-all, but is a great tool when used properly.


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## Inkbirdbbq

S-met said:


> Hot pot and fondue using SV to pre-cook the ingredients. Success, would definitely repeat. Its not a fix-all, but is a great tool when used properly.
> View attachment 403742
> View attachment 403743
> View attachment 403744


That's awesome


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## sigmo

Bearcarver said:


> Yup---So far the things I like the least in my SV, are Ribeyes & Prime Rib, but Ribeyes come out Great on my Grill, and what my Smoker does to Prime Rib shouldn't even be legal.
> SV doesn't break down the fat, like high heat does.
> 
> Bear



Interesting point about the way different heating methods render the fat in a steak.

There's something about the intense infra red radiation from hot charcoal that does the surface of a rib-eye, or T-Bone very nicely!

And the fat does get done differently.

I have yet to try prime rib in a smoker.  Sounds interesting!



johnmeyer said:


> The last few posts remind me of what it was like when I bought my first microwave oven in 1979. I thought I could use if for *everything, *and so I made brownies in the microwave (nothing but chocolate goo); biscuits (came out like Italian gnocchi); a roast (tough and tasteless); and, believe it or not, our Thanksgiving turkey.
> 
> The moral of the story is the same as for sous vide: it's not for everything.



Microwaving is an interesting thing.  I studied microwave theory a little in college, and got quite a bit of RF experience as a ham from the time I was a kid, and where I worked in the late '70s and early '80s.  It's good to try to envision what's happening in a microwave oven to better decide how to use it for various cooking.

You need to think about what sort of a "load" different foods present to microwave radiation, and then visualize how the radiation field will expose the food, and how it will absorb (or not) that energy.

And then you need to think about how that energy will transfer into the food.

One of the best things ever was the MicroCrisp elevation rack.  Getting the food up away from the bottom of the oven is an excellent idea so the radiation can bounce off the bottom of the oven and illuminate the underside of whatever you're cooking to make the heating a bit more even.

It's a pity they no longer sell those.  Off topic, but microwave cooking is an interesting subject, for sure!


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## Bearcarver

sigmo said:


> Interesting point about the way different heating methods render the fat in a steak.
> 
> There's something about the intense infra red radiation from hot charcoal that does the surface of a rib-eye, or T-Bone very nicely!
> 
> And the fat does get done differently.
> 
> *I have yet to try prime rib in a smoker.  Sounds interesting!*
> 
> !




Take your Pick:
*Prime Rib Calendar (14 Smoked Prime Ribs)
Smoked Prime Rib (Double Birthday Dinner 2017)
Smoked Prime Rib (47th Anniversary Dinner)
Smoked Prime Rib (49th Anniversary Dinner)
Smoked Prime Rib (First of 2017) 
Smoked Prime Rib (Apple Smoke) 
Smoked Prime Rib (New Best Ever)*
*Smoked Prime Rib (Another One)*
*Smoked Prime Rib (Great Stuff)
Smoked Prime Rib (Best Ever)*
*Smoked PRIME RIB *(Multiple Woods)
*Smoked Prime Rib* (Panned)
*Smoked Prime Rib (Panned #3)
Smoked Prime Rib (Easter 2018)
Smoked Prime Rib with Apple Dust (July 2019)*

Bear


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## S-met

sigmo said:


> Microwaving is an interesting thing. I studied microwave theory.
> ...And then you need to think about how that energy will transfer into the food.
> ...Off topic, but microwave cooking is an interesting subject, for sure!


We can tie this together and keep on topic.

Microwaves are awesome tools, but most people don't have a clue about their use. Most people just turn it on with no regard for power settings or wattage yet complain about poor results. That's like trying to smoke @500f° and wonder why your end results suck. Dial back the power and let it cook a little longer, you just might be surprised. Really helps reduce the molten outside/frozen center issue too.

I see the same thing with the new SV owners to a different extreme. Over and under cooking is a big problem because they don't understand food-theory and temperature/time relationships for the collagens to render. Too little time and its tough, too long and its mush.


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## sigmo

Bearcarver said:


> Take your Pick:
> *Prime Rib Calendar (14 Smoked Prime Ribs)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Double Birthday Dinner 2017)
> Smoked Prime Rib (47th Anniversary Dinner)
> Smoked Prime Rib (49th Anniversary Dinner)
> Smoked Prime Rib (First of 2017)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Apple Smoke)
> Smoked Prime Rib (New Best Ever)*
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Another One)*
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Great Stuff)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Best Ever)*
> *Smoked PRIME RIB *(Multiple Woods)
> *Smoked Prime Rib* (Panned)
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Panned #3)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Easter 2018)
> Smoked Prime Rib with Apple Dust (July 2019)*
> 
> Bear



Wow!  Thank you for those.  Excellent descriptions.  My wife LOVES prime rib.  I really need to try this!



S-met said:


> We can tie this together and keep on topic.
> 
> Microwaves are awesome tools, but most people don't have a clue about their use. Most people just turn it on with no regard for power settings or wattage yet complain about poor results. That's like trying to smoke @500f° and wonder why your end results suck. Dial back the power and let it cook a little longer, you just might be surprised. Really helps reduce the molten outside/frozen center issue too.
> 
> I see the same thing with the new SV owners to a different extreme. Over and under cooking is a big problem because they don't understand food-theory and temperature/time relationships for the collagens to render. Too little time and its tough, too long and its mush.



That "Serious Eats" website is a great place to start for folks new to Sous Vide.  They really describe the theory well, and go into food safety issues extensively as well as lots of recipes and how-to descriptions for various foods.

As for microwave ovens, I couldn't agree more.

A magnetron is an interesting device.  We studied them back in that microwave class I had in about 1977.  I always had it in my mind that to get them to oscillate, you might have to start and run them at full power.  And that explained why microwave ovens only cycle them full-on and full-off when you adjust the duty cycle with the knob, slider, or keypad.  You can hear the system switch on and off, and usually see the lights in the oven dim when the tube is actually fired up and irradiating the food.

And that's less than ideal.  What you'd really like to have is a way to actually adjust the power output of the tube continuously, so you'd get more even power.  That would be gentler.

And now I see "inverter" type microwave ovens on the market, and reading up a bit, I see that they are, indeed, adjusting the power output of the magentron!

That should be a lot nicer than hitting the food with full power for 15 seconds, then switching it off for 15 seconds over and over.  The next microwave oven I get will certainly be one with the inverter technology.  I also insist on a rotating turntable as well.

The first person I ever knew who got a microwave oven was a friend's folks.  His dad was a doctor, and they had money!  This would have been in the early '70s, or perhaps late '60s.

I remember that we just had to experiment with it.

We put a bar of his mom's fancy soap in the oven, and it appeared to do nothing... for a while!  Then it suddenly expelled its insides out through a hole, and left a shell of soap.  We just put that back where we found it.  ;)

Next, we put a raw egg in the oven.  We turned it on, and waited.

After the time expired (I think it was 30 seconds or a minute), his dad walked in.  He looked at the egg, felt it, and said that it wasn't done yet, so HE put it back in and set the timer again and walked out of the kitchen.  About the time he exited the room:  BOOM!  Covered the inside of the oven with scrambled egg!  We were so glad it was he that had put it back in the oven!  :)

I do find having a microwave oven indispensable.  But you do have to think about what's going on, and adjust the power to something that matches the size and impedance of the load as well as its ability to absorb the radiation.

I often read the instructions on a frozen meal and then modify it.  I don't like being bothered to cook it on high, then open and stir and then replace it and hit it hard again.  Instead, I adjust the power level to something that I figure will integrate to the same total power delivered, and then cook it all in one step at that lower power.  I'd rather wait longer than have to do the stirring.

But I also appreciate how stirring something occasionally is often the only way to get it done evenly.

I do eggs sometimes.  I just crack the eggs into a Corel bowl, add a bit of milk and a bit of butter, and stir/whip them.  Then I put them in the nuke, and give them full power while watching.  When the surface starts to cook, I open the oven and stir well.  Then back in for another 10 to 15 seconds, then another stir.  I repeat that until I get the stiffness of scrambled egg that I want.

I wonder if one of the inverter type units would make that better.

And I've done brownie mix in a coffee mug.   You just have to watch it and stir it once.  It's not like a normal brownie, but it's not bad.  Some ice cream on top, and a spoon, and you're set!

Cookie dough works the same way.  Just do a single serving, and watch it, giving it short bursts.  Again, I wonder if an inverter microwave oven might allow this to be done more evenly and better.

Crud!  Now I NEED to get me a new microwave oven with the inverter!  ;)


----------



## Bearcarver

sigmo said:


> Wow!  Thank you for those.  Excellent descriptions.  My wife LOVES prime rib.  I really need to try this!




Since you never Smoked a Prime Rib, you won't believe how easy it is.
I swear it's the easiest thing I ever Smoke, and with the Biggest Reward.
Your wife will Love it!!
And Thanks for the Like.

Bear


----------



## drdon

Bearcarver said:


> Take your Pick:
> *Prime Rib Calendar (14 Smoked Prime Ribs)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Double Birthday Dinner 2017)
> Smoked Prime Rib (47th Anniversary Dinner)
> Smoked Prime Rib (49th Anniversary Dinner)
> Smoked Prime Rib (First of 2017)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Apple Smoke)
> Smoked Prime Rib (New Best Ever)*
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Another One)*
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Great Stuff)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Best Ever)*
> *Smoked PRIME RIB *(Multiple Woods)
> *Smoked Prime Rib* (Panned)
> *Smoked Prime Rib (Panned #3)
> Smoked Prime Rib (Easter 2018)
> Smoked Prime Rib with Apple Dust (July 2019)*
> 
> Bear


One day......one day.......Nothing more to say......
Don


----------



## johnmeyer

sigmo said:


> As for microwave ovens, I couldn't agree more.
> 
> A magnetron is an interesting device.  We studied them back in that microwave class I had in about 1977.


I got my start at the microwave test equipment division of Hewlett-Packard in 1973. We built klystron generators which produced exactly the same frequency as a microwave oven. I had to take a safety course the first day on the job and what I learned gave me a lot of respect for what microwaves can do.

And, speaking of the magnetron, I still have the first microwave oven that I bought in late 1978, an Amana. I use it as a backup or when we sometimes "need" two microwaves when reheating several leftovers as once.

The reason I still have it and use it is that its magnetron died about twenty-five years ago and I found a cheap, generic magnetron replacement in a catalog (this was before the Internet). It was the simplest repair of all time (just remember to discharge the capacitor!), although I don't think it ever quite had the same power (probably 85% of what it was).

I then pulled it apart (which apparently you are not supposed to do) and pulled out two of the most amazingly strong magnets I've ever encountered. My daughter ended up using it in a science project to levitate a spinning disc for a project where you were supposed to design a disc that would spin for a long time.


----------



## Smokin' in AZ

S-met said:


> We can tie this together and keep on topic.
> 
> Microwaves are awesome tools, but most people don't have a clue about their use. Most people just turn it on with no regard for power settings or wattage yet complain about poor results. That's like trying to smoke @500f° and wonder why your end results suck. Dial back the power and let it cook a little longer, you just might be surprised. Really helps reduce the molten outside/frozen center issue too.
> 
> I see the same thing with the new SV owners to a different extreme. Over and under cooking is a big problem because they don't understand food-theory and temperature/time relationships for the collagens to render. Too little time and its tough, too long and its mush.




Well said about microwaves, I repaired residential and commercial ovens for several years and totally understand power settings. High should only be used for very short periods (30-60 seconds) or for boiling water! I have gotten somewhat lazy and tend to reheat stuff mostly and that is at 60-70% power or defrost at 10-20% power. My biggest problem was explaining this to every customer for years, should have recorded it and just played it back.

Funny story, a lot of times I would be greeted at the front door by a child screaming "The microwave man is here Yea!" apparently Mom became too dependent on the darn thing.


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## indaswamp

Smokin' in AZ said:


> "The microwave man is here Yea!" apparently Mom became too dependent on the darn thing.


----------

