# Vac Bacon



## Rob242 (Dec 30, 2019)

How long does dry cure have to stay in a vac sealed bag to be cured?


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## rexster314 (Dec 30, 2019)

Usually the minimum is 7 days. but YMMV


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## Bearcarver (Dec 30, 2019)

I don't do anything shorter than 8 days, but that's maybe just me.
Longest probably about 13 Days.
That's Dry Cured with TQ.
However I don't Vac Seal my Curing bags. Not Necessary. IMO

Bear


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## Steve H (Dec 30, 2019)

Same 10-12 days. Zip lock bag works fine. If you're worried about a mess. Then double bag it. Or use a vacuum bag, but don't vacuum it completely. Then seal.


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## fished (Dec 30, 2019)

Why not vacuum them completely?  I'm asking because I have two I started curing yesterday with TQ, I vacuumed them completely.

Thanks


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## Steve H (Dec 30, 2019)

It just might make it harder to kneed and move around the juices. Might be ok though.


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## Bearcarver (Dec 30, 2019)

I don't vac seal my curing stuff, because I don't want to suck up any juices into my Vac Packer.
Like Steve said, "it might not be good to make it a tight package".
The bottom of one side lays in the juices. Then when you flip it over the other side gets it's turn to lay in the juices. Most of the juices get absorbed through the bottom of the meat, from the juices it's laying in.

Bear


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## chopsaw (Dec 30, 2019)

I'm thinking I read some where  here that vac sealing meat while curing  was not good .


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## SmokinAl (Dec 31, 2019)

I vac seal my dry cured meats. I don't pull all the air out & make a really tight vacuum, so there is room for the juices to move around in. I also dry cure my bacon for 14 days.
Al


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## Rob242 (Dec 31, 2019)

I think I red that it cuts the time to cure in half.


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## Steve H (Jan 1, 2020)

I've vac sealed meat to speed the marinating/tenderizing process. And this works great. I wouldn't be surprised if there is a commercial application to speed curing under a vacuum. If there is. I have no knowledge of how to go about it.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

I can't find anything, from USDA or other, that says Curing under Vacuum is not safe. Adding the Dry Cure ingredients and sealing imnediately, there will be no liquid to worry about sucking up into your sealer. There is also no issue with distribution of cure and any liquid, as when vac-packed there is still enough room to message the liquid and Cure ingredients  around because the liquid can stretch the bag slightly.
If you Google Vacuum curing bacon safely, you get a list of several SMF threads on the subject...JJ


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## Steve H (Jan 1, 2020)

So, what is your opinion 

 chef jimmyj


 chef jimmyj
 ? I trust in your judgement. And I'm betting many others trust you as well. Using a vacsealer to seal the bag without creating a vacuum I think is smart so it doesn't leak. But with actually vacuuming and sealing. I'm still curious how the juices will be able to distribute evenly.


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## Bearcarver (Jan 1, 2020)

I don't know about others, but when I do 6 or more large pieces of Belly slabs, I spread the cure, put them in the bags one at a time, until I have them all in the bags. Then I clean that part of the counter & my hands, so I'd be ready to seal the bags in my sealer. By this time there would certainly be plenty of juices in the bags to get sucked up into my machine. It only takes a couple minutes for the juices to show up, when using TQ.
I don't do all the things that need to be done ---One at a Time. So there would definitely be juices getting sucked up, but not if I use Ziplocks.
So instead of looking for things wrong with using a vac sealer, maybe look what the advantages are & what the bad things are with using ziplocks.
Hmm---Never had a problem in 10 years:
Never had any ziplocks leak into fridge---Things like that.
What are the problem I missed with using Ziplocks??

Bear


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## daveomak (Jan 1, 2020)

In my opinion, when you compress the meat, the curing ingredients can't work their way through the meat.... 
Partially vacuum the bag leaving a decent air space around it...
Personally, I cure meat with the bag open to the atmosphere..  That allows for water to evaporate and partially dries out the meat for a more intense flavor....   Similar to the dry aging process ....
Bacon, I cure in air...  on wire racks....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

Steve H said:


> So, what is your opinion
> 
> chef jimmyj
> ?  I trust in your judgement. And I'm betting many others trust you as well. Using a vacsealer to seal the bag without creating a vacuum I think is smart so it doesn't leak. But with actually vacuuming and sealing. I'm still curious how the juices will be able to distribute evenly.



It's no different than a store bought Butt, Chicken or Pork Tenderloins. They all get Vac-Packed tight to completely remove air. But, when you buy them days or weeks later, the meat is surrounded but several ounce of leached out juices. The plastic Vac-Bags Stretch slightly as the Juices come out of the meat.



 Bearcarver
 , I can't speak for TQ as I don't use it. But I have never had Bellies get more than Damp in the time it takes for me to Rub 3-4 pieces with a mix of Cure #1, Salt and Sugar then Vac-Seal them. Of course I'm a lot Younger than you too! LOL...JJ


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

Folks here use Zip Bags, Plastic Containers, Vac-Pack all the way or partially, Salt Box, and on Racks, over a drip pan, in the refer.  They ALL get good results. Choose your method and start Makin' Bacon...JJ


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## Bearcarver (Jan 1, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> It's no different than a store bought But, Chicken or Pork Tenderloins. They all get Vac-Packed to remove air. But, when you buy them days or weeks later, the meat is surrounded but several ounce of leached out juices. The plastic Vac-Bags Stretch slightly as the Juices come out of the meat.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




You're obviously Good at Rubbing it in.---Pun Intended!
Could be I don't just throw it all in & Done.
Step #1 Put 1 piece on a plate.
#2. Rub half of TQ on one side.
#3 Rub other half on 2nd side.
#4 Rub Brown Sugar on one side.
#5 Flip & rub Brown Sugar on 2nd side.
#6 Slide Piece in Ziplock.
#7 Scrape off & add TQ & Brown sugar that fell off onto plate.
#8 Squeeze air out of bags & Zip closed.

Do these 8 steps X 5 more to complete all 6 pieces.
Believe me, there is no way I could Seal those bags with my Vacuum Sealer TOO MUCH JUICES ACCUMULATED-----No matter how Old & crippled I am!!

Bear


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

John. I can totally see how you get liquid before sealing with the detailed steps you take rubbing each ingredient separately. 
I make a separate Rub of my ingredients for the weight of each piece. I rub each portion, one at a time, on a flexible cutting mat. I bag the piece and dump any rub that didn't stick in the bag. I repeat until the 3 to 4 pieces are bagged then seal. I only purchase one belly, 11-12 pounds, so there in never more than 4 pieces to deal with. Lots of ways to our goal of great Bacon...JJ


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## Bearcarver (Jan 1, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> John. I can totally see how you get liquid before sealing with the detailed steps you take rubbing each ingredient separately.
> I make a separate Rub of my ingredients for the weight of each piece. I rub each portion, one at a time, on a flexible cutting mat. I bag the piece and dump any rub that didn't stick in the bag. I repeat until the 3 to 4 pieces are bagged then seal. I only purchase one belly, 11-12 pounds, so there in never more than 4 pieces to deal with. Lots of ways to our goal of great Bacon...JJ




Plus like you say, TQ mix might bring the juices out quicker.
As for my doing 6 pieces---That's because I'm lazy, because my MES can smoke 6 pieces (2 slabs cut into thirds), so I do two slabs, because if I'm going to go through the work of curing & smoking, I'm going to fill the MES & get a bunch done, And not have to Cure & Smoke two batches.
However This is all from yester-year for me, because this is all too much for me any more. Now I usually only do 2 pieces, like a butt split in half, so I can use my Kitchen Fridge.
I got rid of my curing fridge in the basement, because I can't do the steps, down to the fridge every day for up to 2 weeks, flipping packages.

I could probably do the vac sealing now since I only do 2 packages nowadays, but I'm a lot slower than I used to be.---Agent Orange is a Bitch, believe me!

And I like your post #17 best---Many ways to skin a cat!! (or a Hog).
People should do it the way they want, and not criticize the way people have been doing it for 10 years.

Bear


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

Check out this Article. I guess my Vac-Tumbler is worthless, other then some amount of tenderizing...JJ 





__





						why pressure and vacuum marination does not work
					





					genuineideas.com


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## Steve H (Jan 1, 2020)

So, all of us that vacuumed meat to marinate. Have hallucinated the difference? Cough, cough, BS, cough. I know that when I vacuum marinate chicken with teriyaki. I see the color clear to the center.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 1, 2020)

I looked at that and thought, WTF? There are hundreds of episodes of Chopped, Beat Bobby Flay and Iron Chef, where marinated Meat gets Vac-Packed to speed infusion. Veggies get Vac-Packed with a Vinaigrette for a Quick Pickle and so on. 
I thought you guys might appreciate the detail. I have to say, If it can be validated, the Green Dyed Chicken was pretty compelling...JJ


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## SmokinAl (Jan 2, 2020)

All I know is it takes 5 days to make pickles under vacuum, and without vacuum 5 to 6 weeks to get the same flavor.
Al


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## Steve H (Jan 2, 2020)

Well, HPP, high pressure processing is not used for infusion of flavors. At least not at our company. It is used to stabilize the flavors. And gives it a longer "fresh" taste and longer shelf life. The one we run at work is capable of reaching 87,000 psi. Which is around 6000ATM.  We do everything from fresh OJ to hams. Not sure what the point was even bringing that up. 
The dye test was only for 1 hour. Is it safe to assume that after 12 hours it would penetrate further under vacuum? Still, I know what I see and taste from doing speed marinates and pickles.


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## Rob242 (Jan 2, 2020)

I'm trying it and will see.
3 days later, I don't know but my meat is not really vac packed it's not leaking that I can see. 
Will up date later.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 3, 2020)

What does putting that pressure to OJ accomplish? Just curious...JJ


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## Steve H (Jan 3, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> What does putting that pressure to OJ accomplish? Just curious...JJ



It will allow freshly squeezed orange juice to maintain its freshness without being pasteurized. It is amazingly delicious OJ. Just a bit $$ for my budget, around 24.00 a gallon. It has orange juice only. No water or anything else add to it. We get bins of fresh oranges. And we squeeze them on site.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 3, 2020)

$24 a Gallon? You can buy a Cuisinart Electric Juicer for a buck more and make all the OJ you want. Who buys that OJ?...JJ


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## Bearcarver (Jan 3, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> What does putting that pressure to OJ accomplish? Just curious...JJ




Makes Him Run Faster!!

Bear


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## Steve H (Jan 3, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> $24 a Gallon? You can buy a Cuisinart Electric Juicer for a buck more and make all the OJ you want. Who buys that OJ?...JJ



Enough people to warrant running the line 24/5.


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## chopsaw (Jan 3, 2020)

My OJ taste like Metamucil  .


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 3, 2020)

Steve H said:


> Enough people to warrant running the line 24/5.



Holy Crap! Where isn't sold.  I don't recall seeing it at any grocery stores. I hate processed OJ taste nothing like fresh squeezed...JJ


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## Steve H (Jan 3, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> Holy Crap! Where isn't sold.  I don't recall seeing it at any grocery stores. I hate processed OJ taste nothing like fresh squeezed...JJ



Most Wegmans carry it. If you get a chance try it. It is sold in quarts, 1/2 gallon, and gallons.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 3, 2020)

Thanks. No Wegmans closer than a 3 hour drive. But my oldest lives a couple of miles from one, in the big city. I'll have to talk her into getting some when she comes out in Feb...JJ


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## Rob242 (Jan 25, 2020)

Vac sealed dry cure bacon is easier to put in the fridg. Taste is a little difference and is firmer than wet cure. I am a little more towards the wet cure. I also use pork butts for my bacon.
Either way good luck with yours.


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