# First Big Smoker Build. Advice welcomed!



## smokin-aces

Hey guys,

I am starting my first "big" smoker project, and of course big is relative. I have built two 55 gallon double barrel smokers in the past (one this May and one a few weeks ago), but I decided to step into the big leagues and make a trailer smoker. 

The smoker I am making is a tank that is 7 feet long and has a 30 inch diameter. I was originally going to make a typical smoker with a separated fire box piped into the tank, but today plans changed a little. As I was pulling out my 5 foot fire box to cut down to size, it was obvious that it would be big and gauty. So my biggest critic (my dad) suggested that I make 1/3 of  the tank the fire box and make the other 2/3 of the tank the smoker since more than likely I will not need 7 feet of smoking room any way. BUT the twist is that the *fire area*  will have a rack in it to turn it into a direct heat/open flame grill. This will give the rig the versatility of wood fire grilling steaks, burgers, and hot dogs while at the same time being able to slow cook boston butts, ribs, chickens, and turkeys on the other side.

The inside of the tank will have a steel plate dividing the fire area from the smoker area so true smoking can be done on the larger portion.

The question is, what is this setup called? I'm sure I am not the first person to build this type of cooker.

Also, has anyone ever used a down draft style smoker? Where the smoke and heat enter the tank high and the exhaust is below the cook racks. This is the setup I will have to use due to the fire "box" and the smoker tank being the same thing and on the same level. 

Another question I have is, has anyone ever used wire pallet racks for meat racks? They are the wire part that sits on the metal frame that is used to store pallets of goods in ware houses. They are rated at 2000+ lbs. and they sell on ebay for $14 for a 36X48 inch rack. My only concern is on the "grill/firebox" side hotdogs and burgers may fall through when being flipped. 

Another option I thought of is wire racks sold by Uline and Global industrial. They come in a variety of sizes but cost anywhere from $26-$50 a piece. Their weight capacity is 800 lbs and they come in a chrome finish. 

Any tips and advice is much welcomed.   

Here is the start of this project. I started this Saturday.













1229121812.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Dec 31, 2012






I am going to deck in the back part of the trailer and put removable walls to carry wood with me. I am also going to build a table over about half of this area. The table will be high enough to store wood under but not so high that it would be uncomfortable to prepare food on. The angle iron I welded in this area is to bolt the decking onto in the future. Plus it stiffens the trailer up a little. 













1231122109a-1.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Dec 31, 2012


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## smokin-aces

No one has any input?


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## smokin-aces

For anybody that is silently watching this build.. here is the progress so far. 

I made the handles for all three doors. 













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__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 1, 2013


















0101131955a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 1, 2013


















0101131954a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 1, 2013






I got the hinges "dressed up" and welded on. These hinges started as big 4" commercial grade hinges. 













0101131954b.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 1, 2013






The welding is rough, but I will grind them down to make them presentable.













0101131955.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 1, 2013






I only cut one door completely. I have them all cut along the top and bottom but I still have to make the vertical cuts on two of them. Any ideas of what to use for exhaust? I'm thinking 5 or 6 inch square tubing... I believe that would look better than plain round pipe.


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## s2k9k

Looking good so far!

I've never built one but I like the look of big bore bologna cut chrome exhaust tips for the stacks!


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## daveomak

smokin-aces said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am starting my first "big" smoker project, and of course big is relative. I have built two 55 gallon double barrel smokers in the past (one this May and one a few weeks ago), but I decided to step into the big leagues and make a trailer smoker.
> 
> The smoker I am making is a tank that is 7 feet long and has a 30 inch diameter. I was originally going to make a typical smoker with a separated fire box piped into the tank, but today plans changed a little. As I was pulling out my 5 foot fire box to cut down to size, it was obvious that it would be big and gauty. So my biggest critic (my dad) suggested that I make 1/3 of  the tank the fire box and make the other 2/3 of the tank the smoker since more than likely I will not need 7 feet of smoking room any way. BUT the twist is that the *fire area*  will have a rack in it to turn it into a direct heat/open flame grill.
> 
> *This will give the rig the versatility of wood fire grilling steaks, burgers, and hot dogs while at the same time being able to slow cook boston butts, ribs, chickens, and turkeys on the other side.*
> 
> That might be a physics nightmare....  Keeping the heat traveling through the smoker while cooking steaks at the same time...
> 
> One or the other could be accomplished...
> 
> *The inside of the tank will have a steel plate dividing the fire area from the smoker area so true smoking can be done on the larger portion.*
> 
> *The question is, what is this setup called? I'm sure I am not the first person to build this type of cooker.*
> 
> I would call it a "down draft" smoker... I think Jabbo, (or something like that),  uses it...
> 
> Also, has anyone ever used a down draft style smoker? Where the smoke and heat enter the tank high and the exhaust is below the cook racks. This is the setup I will have to use due to the fire "box" and the smoker tank being the same thing and on the same level.
> 
> Another question I have is, has anyone ever used wire pallet racks for meat racks? They are the wire part that sits on the metal frame that is used to store pallets of goods in ware houses. They are rated at 2000+ lbs. and they sell on ebay for $14 for a 36X48 inch rack. My only concern is on the "grill/firebox" side hotdogs and burgers may fall through when being flipped.
> 
> Another option I thought of is wire racks sold by Uline and Global industrial. They come in a variety of sizes but cost anywhere from $26-$50 a piece. Their weight capacity is 800 lbs and they come in a chrome finish.
> 
> Any tips and advice is much welcomed.


It appears you have sectioned the tank into 3 equal parts....  The design you previously spoke of, "down draft", the firebox should be about 1/3 the size of the cook chamber....  If you use one of the sections for the grill / firebox, the firebox is 1/2 the cook chamber...   It will work, just wanted to let you know...  Dave


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## daveomak

Aces, morning..... After looking and pondering.... trying to incorporate the BBQ grate in the firebox creates some logistical situations for all the parts needed to make the design functional....   Let us know what you came up with....   Dave

_                   Click on picture to enlarge...._













Down Draft Smoker.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Jan 2, 2013






*Calculations used for your smoker*

Link to BBQ Pit Calculator


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## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am starting my first "big" smoker project, and of course big is relative. I have built two 55 gallon double barrel smokers in the past (one this May and one a few weeks ago), but I decided to step into the big leagues and make a trailer smoker.
> 
> The smoker I am making is a tank that is 7 feet long and has a 30 inch diameter. I was originally going to make a typical smoker with a separated fire box piped into the tank, but today plans changed a little. As I was pulling out my 5 foot fire box to cut down to size, it was obvious that it would be big and gauty. So my biggest critic (my dad) suggested that I make 1/3 of  the tank the fire box and make the other 2/3 of the tank the smoker since more than likely I will not need 7 feet of smoking room any way. BUT the twist is that the *fire area*  will have a rack in it to turn it into a direct heat/open flame grill. This will give the rig the versatility of wood fire grilling steaks, burgers, and hot dogs while at the same time being able to slow cook boston butts, ribs, chickens, and turkeys on the other side.
> 
> The inside of the tank will have a steel plate dividing the fire area from the smoker area so true smoking can be done on the larger portion.
> 
> The question is, what is this setup called? I'm sure I am not the first person to build this type of cooker.
> 
> Also, has anyone ever used a down draft style smoker? Where the smoke and heat enter the tank high and the exhaust is below the cook racks. This is the setup I will have to use due to the fire "box" and the smoker tank being the same thing and on the same level.
> 
> Another question I have is, has anyone ever used wire pallet racks for meat racks? They are the wire part that sits on the metal frame that is used to store pallets of goods in ware houses. They are rated at 2000+ lbs. and they sell on ebay for $14 for a 36X48 inch rack. My only concern is on the "grill/firebox" side hotdogs and burgers may fall through when being flipped.
> 
> Another option I thought of is wire racks sold by Uline and Global industrial. They come in a variety of sizes but cost anywhere from $26-$50 a piece. Their weight capacity is 800 lbs and they come in a chrome finish.
> 
> Any tips and advice is much welcomed.
> 
> Here is the start of this project. I started this Saturday.
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> __ smokin-aces
> __ Dec 31, 2012
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> I am going to deck in the back part of the trailer and put removable walls to carry wood with me. I am also going to build a table over about half of this area. The table will be high enough to store wood under but not so high that it would be uncomfortable to prepare food on. The angle iron I welded in this area is to bolt the decking onto in the future. Plus it stiffens the trailer up a little.
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> __ smokin-aces
> __ Dec 31, 2012


hello  i don't think you are going to be happy with the finished product. here is my reasoning. first heat rises. your opening into the cook chamber is on the top half. if it was on the bottom, same problem. that is why they put the fire box at the end and down. it may burn a lot of fuel only to find out you can't get it hot enough. i have built several smokes. and what you are trying to make is an offset smoker. but leaving out the off set part..........just my .02     hope others will jump in here.....i wish i could say i like the design. but you ask for input.

david


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## bruno994

I'm not going to say it can't work, but my thinking you are going to have a heck of a time drafting that thing.  Smoke and heat want to go up no matter where your firebox enters the main chamber, so you may or may not have any heating problems, it may just not be very consistent.  You might come off better making it a reverse / reverse flow rig, with the exhausts under the RF plate back on the firebox side of the main chamber (still haven't convinced myself that this plan would even work for you.) 

And as far as having a work are up on the trailer, but having to get off and on the trailer while you are cooking, going to get old quick.  Maybe just mount some burners and wood storage on the trailer with some fold out shelves that can be worked on while standing on the ground.  If you could access the pit while on the trailer, not as big a problem.


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## daveomak

bruno994, evening...   The air/heat flow design is a "copy" from Jambo Pit Smokers.... It is a very successful smoker and has won many awards...  Their design was pointed out to me several months ago by a member here...  

Dave


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## smokin-aces

bruno994 said:


> I'm not going to say it can't work, but my thinking you are going to have a heck of a time drafting that thing.  Smoke and heat want to go up no matter where your firebox enters the main chamber, so you may or may not have any heating problems, it may just not be very consistent.  You might come off better making it a reverse / reverse flow rig, with the exhausts under the RF plate back on the firebox side of the main chamber (still haven't convinced myself that this plan would even work for you.)
> 
> *And as far as having a work are up on the trailer, but having to get off and on the trailer while you are cooking, going to get old quick.  Maybe just mount some burners and wood storage on the trailer with some fold out shelves that can be worked on while standing on the ground.  If you could access the pit while on the trailer, not as big a problem.*


I think you may have misunderstood my plan, or maybe I didn't explain it good. My plan is to floor the trailer from the tank back. I will put walls around the floor to hold wood. About waist high or a little higher will be the wood table. I will have complete access to the table flat footed on the ground (this is a jon boat trailer mind you) , as well as access to the smoker from the ground. Hopefully this is more clear than before. Thank you for your input!


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## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> Aces, morning..... After looking and pondering.... trying to incorporate the BBQ grate in the firebox creates some logistical situations for all the parts needed to make the design functional....   Let us know what you came up with....   Dave
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> _                   Click on picture to enlarge...._
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> __ daveomak
> __ Jan 2, 2013
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> *Calculations used for your smoker*
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> Link to BBQ Pit Calculator


Okay, let me try to explain my thinkology on the logistics of this firebox/grill. I am planning to put the fire grate in the bottom of the barrel where the wood is ~6-8" above the bottom. The cook surface will be at cooking door level ~15" above the bottom of the barrel. I plan to put a door on the flat side of the the barrel to feed the wood and a intake damper under that. 

Is 6-8" high enough from the bottom to keep the fire alive? Keep in mind this is a 30" barrel. 

I may decide that I want to make the cooking surface only in the tank when in use in order to keep it from being continuously exposed to the flame.

I appreciate the input! It makes me consider things I previously had not thought about. That is how good products are developed!

Here are a few drawings. 













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__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 2, 2013


















0102132229a.jpg



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__ Jan 2, 2013


















0102132230a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 2, 2013






Maybe this clarifies.. if you can see it.


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## smokin-aces

After looking at the Jambo design, I can see how similar my ideas are to their product. However, I did not "copy" them, I just have to do it this way because the "firebox" and cook chamber are on the same level because they are the same tank. 

One major difference between the Jambo design and mine is that I am planning to have the heat to cook chamber hole at the very top of the barrel in a crescent shape. And I plan to have the exhaust below the cooking surface by 8" or so. 

I look forward to see how this design will work. If I have similar results to the Jambo design, it should be evenly heated and have a consistent temperature for long periods. WE WILL SEE!


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## bruno994

Dave, yep, I'm very familiar with the Jambo design, cooked next to a few of them, but the Jambo "heat chute" entering the cook chamber starts below or at grate level and angles upward to come in above the bottom grate, not even with it.  You might have to put a deflector plate in the smoke chamber to divert the heat upward and not directly on the meat.  I hope you understand what I'm saying, similiar to a Jambo.  Obviously that design will work great (because alot and I mean alot of comp teams have gone Jambo) and I had a guy on another forum building a Jambo clone that worked out very well for him.  But on the Jambo, your firebox is still an offset, not on a level playing field as this build.  I understand the concept, just not your usual design with basically the upper level of the fire being at food height.  I can't wait to see it completed Smokin-aces, because that's what makes the world go round, different ideas, different takes on the same concept.  If we all had the same pit, it would be a boring world! 

To answer a few of your questions:

_*Is 6-8" high enough from the bottom to keep the fire alive? Keep in mind this is a 30" barrel. *_   Should have no problem getting air flow underneath the fire at this height.  Dave can and will give you some more insight into the dampers for your firebox.  You might not need one below your fire, but maybe one even with if not a bit higher.  To feed air to the fire, but not push it, making fire control easier.  Like I said, Dave will come along and explain that better.

_*I may decide that I want to make the cooking surface only in the tank when in use in order to keep it from being continuously exposed to the flame.  *_Excellent idea.

_*I appreciate the input! It makes me consider things I previously had not thought about. That is how good products are developed!  *_Glad to help, anything for someone wanting to smoke meat!

_*Another question I have is, has anyone ever used wire pallet racks for meat racks? They are the wire part that sits on the metal frame that is used to store pallets of goods in ware houses. They are rated at 2000+ lbs. and they sell on ebay for $14 for a 36X48 inch rack. My only concern is on the "grill/firebox" side hotdogs and burgers may fall through when being flipped. *_

_*Another option I thought of is wire racks sold by Uline and Global industrial. They come in a variety of sizes but cost anywhere from $26-$50 a piece. Their weight capacity is 800 lbs and they come in a chrome finish.   *_I would go with just plain old 3/4 x 9 expanded metal.  I know we can get it for about $60 for a 4 x 8 sheet around here, your area may be a bit different.  Then I framed out my grates with 3/4 x 3/4 x 1/8 angle. 

Most of all, keep it moving and keep us updated with the pics, I love watching a build come together.  That's what inspired me to take on my build last year.


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## smokin-aces

Thank you for your input bruno! I will not be doing anything on the smoker build at least until the weekend. However, I did acquire two wire shelves like I explained earlier. One is a 24" X 24" and the other is 60" X 30". FREE!! It doesn't get any better than that. I will be sure to post pictures when I make progress.


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## daveomak

Aces, evening.... Using 5" sq tube w/ 0.125 wall I would make the stack 48" above the cook chamber to exceed the calculator numbers... that allows for some friction loss...   

The firebox intake calls for 60 Sq in. intake..  I would have that at grate level or lower.... that way the ash under the wood can fall out... burning a fire from the top is OK except the ash falls into the wood choking off the air....  then I would have a second air inlet above the fire to move the heat, when necessary, into the cook chamber..  doesn't have to be big, maybe 4 sq in....  You will not be able to open it until the cook chamber gets to temp and the stack gets hot and can draw from the cooker...  others have found the "above grate" inlet made their smokers 1000% better than the original design... better cook chamber temp control, less fuel usage...  Just passing on what they write me after changing their smoker design...

If you made a slide in ash pan that fit under the grate, you could put the intakes in the ash pan face...  or slide the ash pan in and out for air control....  might work... tricky to adjust... just thinking outside the box.... 

When you cut the arc for the opening to the cook chamber, the distance from the wall to the horizontal cut needs to be 8.25" to meet the calculator specs for good heat/air flow...

Sitting back and thinking about all the pieces and how they go together and what the outcome will be, will help you seeing the big picture....  1 hour of thought beats 5 hours of redo..  

I and others love builds and are willing to help in any way we can... We want you to have the best smoker in the neighborhood and make the best Q......     We don't want much do we...

Dave


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## themule69

i'm watching the build. remember to post pics for all to see.


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## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> Aces, evening.... Using 5" sq tube w/ 0.125 wall I would make the stack 48" above the cook chamber to exceed the calculator numbers... that allows for some friction loss...
> 
> The firebox intake calls for 60 Sq in. intake..  I would have that at grate level or lower.... that way the ash under the wood can fall out... burning a fire from the top is OK except the ash falls into the wood choking off the air....  t*hen I would have a second air inlet above the fire to move the heat*,
> 
> *How far above the fire? How hard would it be to put a fan on a thermostat here? What I mean is, would the efficiency gain of having a fan offset the trouble and initial cost of installing a thermostat controlled fan to blow across the fire? ROI if you are familiar with that acronym. *
> 
> when necessary, into the cook chamber..  doesn't have to be big, maybe 4 sq in....  You will not be able to open it until the cook chamber gets to temp and the stack gets hot and can draw from the cooker...  others have found the "above grate" inlet made their smokers 1000% better than the original design... better cook chamber temp control, less fuel usage...  Just passing on what they write me after changing their smoker design...
> 
> If you made a slide in ash pan that fit under the grate, you could put the intakes in the ash pan face...  or slide the ash pan in and out for air control....  might work... tricky to adjust... just thinking outside the box....
> 
> *When you cut the arc for the opening to the cook chamber, the distance from the wall to the horizontal cut needs to be 8.25" to meet the calculator specs for good heat/air flow...*
> 
> *Is this from the top center of the tank down?*
> 
> Sitting back and thinking about all the pieces and how they go together and what the outcome will be, will help you seeing the big picture....  1 hour of thought beats 5 hours of redo..
> 
> I and others love builds and are willing to help in any way we can... We want you to have the best smoker in the neighborhood and make the best Q......     We don't want much do we...
> 
> Dave


Wow! There is some good information in that post!  Thank you for the detailed information... very useful stuff


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## themule69

aces.. may i suggest the handle for the fire box. add a piece of pipe to the right side. long enough to extend past the end of the fire box. so when you are getting the fire going, flames are shooting  up. you can close the lid without being in the fire. also for adding fuel, your face is not in the direct heat that will be rising....if you end up with a work are on the fire box end make sure the handle will not flip a plate or anything else that is on the work are off......building a smoker is a lot more work than most people think it is..... i know i said i'm not liking the fire box at grill height. i hope i'm wrong.......i hope this ends up being a great smoker for you.... keep the pics coming.
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





david


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## smokin-aces

themule69 said:


> i'm watching the build. remember to post pics for all to see.


I plan on it! When I do more to it I will update with pictures... keep watching the thread though because I will most likely be posing questions.


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## smokin-aces

About the extended handle. I am planning to put a stove door on the flat side of the fire box end. In other words, when looking at the smoker from the back, on that end you will see a stove door where I can put the wood in and build the fire. This end will also have a damper or two to control air intake.


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## themule69

themule69 said:


> aces.. may i suggest the handle for the fire box. add a piece of pipe to the right side. long enough to extend past the end of the fire box. so when you are getting the fire going, flames are shooting  up. you can close the lid without being in the fire. also for adding fuel, your face is not in the direct heat that will be rising....if you end up with a work are on the fire box end make sure the handle will not flip a plate or anything else that is on the work are off......building a smoker is a lot more work than most people think it is..... i know i said i'm not liking the fire box at grill height. i hope i'm wrong.......i hope this ends up being a great smoker for you.... keep the pics coming.
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aces  i misspelled work area twice in the the same post put are instead of area....i'm thinking Q not spelling....i love Q.....also something to think about is a jack on both back corners of the trailer...so when you hit the road to smoke or grill you can level the trailer. if you are using foil pans or foil wrapped meat. the juices won't run to one side.......and more important, if people sit on it, or climb up to get fuel or something out of a cooler. it doesn't raise the front up.....i saw a trailer with turkey fryers raise up from someone climbing on it. 4 people  went by air to the burn unit (jacks are cheap)

david


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## smokin-aces

I have thought about this,(not the flipping boiling oil on people part) and I am wondering if one jack centered in the back is enough for this trailer? This is a 15-16' jon boat trailer and the weight is pretty heavily distributed to the front. I would definitely want the fold-away style. It seems easier and faster to put away when I'm ready to leave. What do you think? This trailer is 44" wide frame to frame.


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## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> I have thought about this,(not the flipping boiling oil on people part) and I am wondering if one jack centered in the back is enough for this trailer? This is a 15-16' jon boat trailer and the weight is pretty heavily distributed to the front. I would definitely want the fold-away style. It seems easier and faster to put away when I'm ready to leave. What do you think? This trailer is 44" wide frame to frame.


i would do two, one on each corner. harbor freight has them fold away for about 20.00 . the last build i did i put the jacks on first thing so i could level the trailer for the build. i was building outside. the jacks made it to where i could use a level. to get everything streight.


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## smokin-aces

Yeah, It would be worth it to have two. I plan to do some more work on it tomorrow. I will be sure to take plenty of pictures and update the build thread.


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## smokin-aces

Does anyone have any ideas of how to make a rack that can be adjusted height ways? The part of this smoker that is the firebox will also be used as a grill and I want that rack to be adjustable height. Thank you!


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## smokin-aces

I got a little done on the smoker today. I finished cutting the doors out, put strapping inside 2/3 of the doors, put "stoppers" on the hinges, started on the exhaust box, and I got 2/3 of the racks in. 

Here are some pictures to better explain my progress.

The doors all cut out 













0105132119.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 5, 2013






Here you can see the doors all open to the same angle because of the "stoppers" I made.













0105132119a.jpg



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__ Jan 5, 2013






Here is a close up of one of the stoppers with the door open against it.













0105132120.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 5, 2013






Here is a view of the stoppers on the top half of the hinges.













0105132122.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 5, 2013






From the other end.













0105132122b.jpg



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__ Jan 5, 2013






A close up of one of the stoppers.













0105132122a.jpg



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__ Jan 5, 2013






The straps inside the doors and the 2 racks.













0105132120a.jpg



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__ Jan 5, 2013






The start of the exhaust box held up to the end of the tank.













0105132121a.jpg



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__ Jan 5, 2013






Isometric view of the exhaust box. The exhaust pipe will be on top of this.













0105132121b.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 5, 2013


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## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> I got a little done on the smoker today. I finished cutting the doors out, put strapping inside 2/3 of the doors, put "stoppers" on the hinges, started on the exhaust box, and I got 2/3 of the racks in.
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> __ Jan 5, 2013
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looking good...i like to see the welds ground flat like the last pic...i hear welders say i want you to see my weld. i prefer ground flat for looks...if i was welding for a living, the just chip...but for a grill..that's just that extra that not many people will know that they noticed... but it's like shaved door handles on a hot rod... you know you spent the extra time and it's there.........keep the pics coming. when you get a chance to weld.....

  as far as racks... i don't know how to make them adjustable.. other than several  slides to slide them in........the grills that most parks have you can adjust.... but you are using a pipe which if you move the grate it won't be the right size for the pipe..,..you can do  2 or 3 grates in each door. take out what you are not using.....if the fire box is the only place you are doing a fire. it shouldn't have to raise or lower.............

  again my .02


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## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> I got a little done on the smoker today. I finished cutting the doors out, put strapping inside 2/3 of the doors, put "stoppers" on the hinges, started on the exhaust box, and I got 2/3 of the racks in.
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put an extra weld pass on the door stop...that is a weak point for a big door.

  now am i up to .03?


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## smokin-aces

Thank you for the comment about the welds. I agree, I think the little details is what makes something like this look better than the rest. If it doesn't look like it was welded, that makes it look better. On the other hand, if I were making a structural weld that didn't need to be cosmetically pleasing, then yes I would leave it alone and be proud of my weld, but here it needs to look good as well as be strong.

As far as the adjustable rack goes, I need it to be adjustable only in the fire box side. Just like the grills at parks, I want to be able to adjust how close the meat is to the flame. That is the reason for the need of adjustability. I just haven't came up with any ideas yet that allows for the rack to be adjustable and removable.


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## smokin-aces

The door stops actually are welded on both sides, it's just hard to see from those pictures. And yes you are up to .03 but that's good. I need all the extra eyes and advice I can get.


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## daveomak

*How far above the fire? How hard would it be to put a fan on a thermostat here?  *What temp zone would the thermostat be linked to ?? If you had a fan on an adj. speed controller, that would be a killer idea...  I would have it about 4-6" below the top of the FB so air shot directly into the cooking chamber and not screw up the BBQ grate heat flow.... 

*What I mean is, would the efficiency gain of having a fan offset the trouble and initial cost of installing a thermostat controlled fan to blow across the fire? ROI if you are familiar with that acronym.**  *The fire has plenty of BTU's and heat is lost in the FB... Moving the heat through to the CC is where efficiency is gained...  

Getting the heat of the fire box, through to the CC and out the stack, is the big problem..... If the fire box and CC are not air tight, efficiency is lost from the natural convection/draw of the stack.... without a perfectly air tight system, the FB just heats up and nothing else....  Sealing up the system to absolutely air tight, and getting the heat to move, is where the ROI will be seen...   A little help from a fan at the top of the FB to help direct that heat would be a major deal...  The FB will be at about 600-700 degrees and using some of that heat to get the CC up to 225 ish would be a good thing....

*When you cut the arc for the opening to the cook chamber, the distance from the wall to the horizontal cut needs to be 8.25" to meet the calculator specs for good heat/air flow...*

*Is this from the top center of the tank down?  *Yes, in an upside down "smile" shape..  The opening can be larger also.... That is the minimum size opening...   

About the shelf in the FB for the BBQ grate...   I thought I read where the 3rd shelf you bought was smaller.... I couldn't find that dimension...   Cantilever braces in the back of the FB, to hold up the cooking grate, might work...  I'm not sure you will need an adjustable shelf... The FB is going to be screaming hot while smoking...   6-700 deg or higher....  

As a side note... Anything you put inside the FB will restrict the air/heat flow to the CC...

Dave


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## smokin-aces

First of all thank you for the input Dave. Now as far as the adjustable shelf goes, chances are that I will not be cooking in the FB while smoking. Cause like you said it will be extremely hot in there. So I want to be able to adjust the shelf so that when I am only grilling I can move the shelf closer to the fire or further away to regulate how it cooks. I also want it to be removable so that it isn't always exposed to the flame. Also, I think you were asking the size of the FB BBQ shelf. It is a 24 X 24" square. I wanted it smaller so it could move up and down in the FB without binding. Please elaborate on this cantilever system. I am not familiar with that.

For the fan idea, I had originally thought about putting the fan on the outside of the FB blowing across the top of the fire and into the CC. I was planning on putting the thermostat in the CC probably in the center. This way when it gets below 200 or so the fan would kick on.

I have seen a smoker with this kind of setup with the fan and thermostat, but it works backwards to what you would naturally think it should. When the temp gets to hot, it turns on and blows across the fire which evidently makes the flame smaller. When it gets down to the temp it is set on the fan turns off. This just doesn't seem right to me. What do ya'll think?

Another question I have is what kind of fans can withstand the temperatures that the FB reach? I originally thought about an electric fan used for vehicles. These are the fans that go on the radiator and they are used to save space and free up HP. The problem is that I don't think a radiator gets as hot as the FB will. If a car's thermostat is 190 degrees, I can only assume that the radiator would get to 300 degrees at the hottest. The FB will be hotter than this and may damage the fan. Any ideas about which fan to use? And can I use a universal thermostat with any fan?

I appreciate any input. And I appreciate anyone that can read my rather lengthy posts.


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## smokin-aces

I am thinking about putting a sink on the back of the trailer as well. I have already planned to make the back of the trailer floored so I can haul wood with me. Above that. half will be a work area/counter. Now the question is, should I put a sink on the other half to help prepare the meat? Would it be useful or in the way. I would run a pipe that would come out from under the trailer that I could hook a garden hose up to for water supply. I have seen sinks on smoking rigs, but I wonder how useful they actually are?


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## daveomak

*For the fan idea, I had originally thought about putting the fan on the outside of the FB blowing across the top of the fire and into the CC.*

That is what I thought, and I thought it would work well....  If the fan is on a constant speed, adjust the air to the fire to heat it up a little.... The two controls will work together..  I was thinking a fan like a hair dryer into a 2" pipe type thing.... maybe 3 speed hair dryer or fan speed controller.... Of course a hair dryer wouldn't stand the radiant heat from the FB but that is just an example...   

The fan is only necessary because of the elevation of the exhaust stack inlet and it is a down draft smoker.....













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__ daveomak
__ Jan 6, 2013


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## bruno994

smokin-aces said:


> I am thinking about putting a sink on the back of the trailer as well. I have already planned to make the back of the trailer floored so I can haul wood with me. Above that. half will be a work area/counter. Now the question is, should I put a sink on the other half to help prepare the meat? Would it be useful or in the way. I would run a pipe that would come out from under the trailer that I could hook a garden hose up to for water supply. I have seen sinks on smoking rigs, but I wonder how useful they actually are?


If your planning on cooking on the road, comps, family get togethers, festivals, etc, a sink will come in quite handy.  I use mine more for washing hands and knives than anything else.  As far as meat prep, I do all of it in foil pans or on butcher paper so I can just throw them away, wash my hands and be done.  If your going to be doing most of or all your cooking at home, it probably won't be used as much, but it's still a nice addition.  At my last comp, I had as many people compliment me about the sink and water setup as I did the actual pit!  I have mine setup 2 ways, I can feed it with a garden hose if I am somewhere with water or I can feed it off my fresh water tank with a 2.9 GPM 12 volt RV water pump.  The grey water tank under the sink is a 21 gallon, the fresh water is 16 gallons, it's on the other side.  I have room for a larger sink that would allow me to fit larger things in, but for now the 15" square one works just fine ($99 at Home Depot with faucet and strainer included).













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__ bruno994
__ Dec 21, 2012


















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__ bruno994
__ Dec 21, 2012






Your build is shaping up nicely.


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## smokin-aces

Dave, I like the idea of the hair dryer just because it is making me consider other than ordinary fan types. But like you said, the hair dryer wouldn't hold up to the heat from the FB. Also, I have in the back of my mind a fan that will run off of the trucks charging system (battery) so that if I am off somewhere, I can still use the fan. Maybe some of you onlookers can come up with a fan idea that is large enough to move heat through this setup (I do not know how powerful it needs to be), withstand Fire Box heat (I do not know how hot that is), and run off of a 12 volt system without draining it completely. I really am enjoying all the ideas and comments on here. It is making me think about many scenarios before acting on one.


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## smokin-aces

Bruno, I like the sink on your rig. I like how you have tanks to carry your own water. I think I will probably get a small sink like this, just because I do not know what my future with this rig will be. I may compete, or I may take it to a family event, but either way I want to be prepared. What do you power your water pump from? Do you have it wired to a car battery? By the way I am keeping my eyes peeled on craigslist for a used sink, there are 2 bay stainless sinks for ~$20, compared to ~$80 at Lowes. Thank you for the pics of your setup, it cleared the mud up.


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## daveomak

Aces, evening..... Check the rules to events before you start.... some places you need 3 sinks, one of them a certain distance from the others for washing hands... grey water tank and hot water etc...   don't want to see you build it twice...   Dave


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## smokin-aces

Really? What if I have no sinks? Is that also against the rules? How does one get involved in BBQ competitions? Most of the ones I have seen are invitation only. Thanks for the heads up.


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## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> *For the fan idea, I had originally thought about putting the fan on the outside of the FB blowing across the top of the fire and into the CC.*
> 
> That is what I thought, and I thought it would work well....  If the fan is on a constant speed, adjust the air to the fire to heat it up a little.... The two controls will work together..  I was thinking a fan like a hair dryer into a 2" pipe type thing.... maybe 3 speed hair dryer or fan speed controller.... Of course a hair dryer wouldn't stand the radiant heat from the FB but that is just an example...
> 
> The fan is only necessary because of the elevation of the exhaust stack inlet and it is a down draft smoker.....
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Could you explain the drawing a little? I'm not sure What you mean at the top of the drawing. Also how did you come up with 25" on the closest side of the tank? What are the rectangles inside the tank? Thank you.


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## daveomak

You said your rack was 24 x 24.... you don't want the rack hitting the door when you close it....

and you want the rack to be able to slide in the door...

Rectangles are the cantilever pins for the racks.... 

The drawing is a little screwed up.....   end view inside the circle tied in with an angled view behind it.....  and the door is weird.....   

Sorry....


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## bruno994

smokin-aces said:


> Really? What if I have no sinks? Is that also against the rules? How does one get involved in BBQ competitions? Most of the ones I have seen are invitation only. Thanks for the heads up.


You do not have to have a "sink", but you might be required to have a specific area to wash your hands and one to wash, one to rinse and one to sanitize your utensils and reusable dishes.  I know you had mentioned putting a burner and propane tank on the trailer as well, great idea (for boiling water), you will need it for your dishwashing and sanitizing.  KCBS rules (http://www.kcbs.us/index.php) state (Rule 17) that each team must have a separate container for washing, rinsing and sanitizing of all utensils.  This can be accomplished by simply bringing some jugs of water (5 gallon buckets, coolers with a spicket that can be turned on or off, not push button style, etc.) or have running water either on or in your trailer.  Some even pre-boil all their water and put in a cooler, it will stay warm for quite a while, eliminating the need to boil or heat water on site.  Of course for $250, you can install a propane fired, on demand water heater on your rig and not have to worry about heating water up.  As far as the 4 sinks, you  can either have a 4 sink setup, 3 together for washing utensils and 1 separate (available on ebay, under concession stand 3 compartment sink) for washing hands or you can buy 4 of the gray bus boy boxes from a restaurant supply store or Sams' carries them as well.  Mark each one for what it's purpose is and you'll be in compliance.  Of course quite a few teams travel in RV's making comps and cleaning quite a bit easier, but for those of us that don't have that luxury, lugging water and setting up cleaning areas is a chore.  here in Texas, we mainly have IBCA contests and the rules are a bit more laid back.  They do require you to handle all uncooked and cooked meats in a sanitary way, but I have never been checked for my conditions.  Of course, I take great care with it all, because I'm feeding myself and my family with the leftovers anyway.

I have my 12 volt pump powered by one of the 12 volt rechargeable power supplys used for jumping off a battery.  You can also just use a lawn and garden battery or wire it into your trucks power system. 

As far as finding BBQ events, check the KCBS website under events for a complete listing (I think Tennessee has 15 events scheduled rightn now from April to October, but I'm sure there are a numer of others in and around the state to enter.  Most KCBS events also have either a Pro Division (anyone can enter in) and a Backyard Division for those that consider themselves beginners or rookies.


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## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> You said your rack was 24 x 24.... you don't want the rack hitting the door when you close it....
> 
> and you want the rack to be able to slide in the door...
> 
> Rectangles are the cantilever pins for the racks....
> 
> The drawing is a little screwed up.....   end view inside the circle tied in with an angled view behind it.....  and the door is weird.....
> 
> Sorry....


Okay that makes more sense. I wasn't criticizing your drawing, just needing some clarifying... sometimes I'm not the smartest cookie in the jar...

So are Cantilever racks basically several "resting" points set at different heights of which the rack can be set on? For example, angle iron set at say 6-8" apart vertically on each side of the rack so it can be placed on the different heights?


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## smokin-aces

bruno994 said:


> You do not have to have a "sink", but you might be required to have a specific area to wash your hands and one to wash, one to rinse and one to sanitize your utensils and reusable dishes.  I know you had mentioned putting a burner and propane tank on the trailer as well, great idea (for boiling water), you will need it for your dishwashing and sanitizing.  KCBS rules (http://www.kcbs.us/index.php) state (Rule 17) that each team must have a separate container for washing, rinsing and sanitizing of all utensils.  This can be accomplished by simply bringing some jugs of water (5 gallon buckets, coolers with a spicket that can be turned on or off, not push button style, etc.) or have running water either on or in your trailer.  Some even pre-boil all their water and put in a cooler, it will stay warm for quite a while, eliminating the need to boil or heat water on site.  Of course for $250, you can install a propane fired, on demand water heater on your rig and not have to worry about heating water up.  As far as the 4 sinks, you  can either have a 4 sink setup, 3 together for washing utensils and 1 separate (available on ebay, under concession stand 3 compartment sink) for washing hands or you can buy 4 of the gray bus boy boxes from a restaurant supply store or Sams' carries them as well.  Mark each one for what it's purpose is and you'll be in compliance.  Of course quite a few teams travel in RV's making comps and cleaning quite a bit easier, but for those of us that don't have that luxury, lugging water and setting up cleaning areas is a chore.  here in Texas, we mainly have IBCA contests and the rules are a bit more laid back.  They do require you to handle all uncooked and cooked meats in a sanitary way, but I have never been checked for my conditions.  Of course, I take great care with it all, because I'm feeding myself and my family with the leftovers anyway.
> 
> I have my 12 volt pump powered by one of the 12 volt rechargeable power supplys used for jumping off a battery.  You can also just use a lawn and garden battery or wire it into your trucks power system.
> 
> As far as finding BBQ events, check the KCBS website under events for a complete listing (I think Tennessee has 15 events scheduled rightn now from April to October, but I'm sure there are a numer of others in and around the state to enter.  Most KCBS events also have either a Pro Division (anyone can enter in) and a Backyard Division for those that consider themselves beginners or rookies.


So basically I need to check local competitions rules and build accordingly? It seems like you have some in depth knowledge about BBQ regulations..


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## daveomak

Yep..... But the way the round tank taper toward the top, getting the depth for the rack will be a problem for several racks....   It will get too narrow.....   Dave


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## smokin-aces

How would I go about making my own burner for the fire box? I am wanting to put something under the fire rack so I can open the propane and push a button to start a fire until the wood catches. Can I just take some gas pipe (I have seen some pipe called black pipe mentioned on this forum) and drill holes in it, put a one way valve on it and plumb it to a propane tank? This seems too simple...


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## daveomak

I would get a weed burner.. one of those 50,00 btu units.... open the FB door and VOILA !!! Instant fire....  Less hassle with the burner plugging up with ash etc.... Keep it simple.... Less work in the long run...


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## smokin-aces

Does a weed burner work that fast? If it is almost instant (less than 10 minutes) I may do this. But I am going for this: put wood in, shut lid, turn bottle on, walk away, come back (should be to temperature by now), turn bottle off, and put on meat.

And what if the homemade burner was on the sides pointed in, would that eliminate it getting plugged? And if I did want to make my own burner, how would I do so?

By the way, a 5,000,000 BTU Weed Burner on amazon is $57. Would installing a burner in the FB be around this cost and would it be this effective? I assume I would have to buy the burner pipe, a valve, hose, and more pipe to plumb.


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## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> Yep..... But the way the round tank taper toward the top, getting the depth for the rack will be a problem for several racks....   It will get too narrow.....   Dave


Could I just sit the rack in the tank and see how low it sits relative to center, then know that that far above center would interfere with door operation? Or put a straight edge across the door and raise the rack and straight edge until they touch and not go above this point? I sat the rack in the tank and it sits about 6" above the bottom of the tank..


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## daveomak

*Does a weed burner work that fast? If it is almost instant (less than 10 minutes)*

I start fires in my fire pit, once all the wood is stacked etc, in less than 2 minutes...


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## smokin-aces

Nice! Seems like I will be going that route.


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## smokin-aces

I have a question concerning exhaust. I wonder how well metal building downspout would hold up as exhaust for the smoker? I could get it to be any size, I assume.

I would want 7". This is of course square. The advantage over .125 square tube is this would be much lighter, but would it rust out fast (within 5-10 years)? They last forever as downspouts but I wonder how the heat will effect its durability.


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## bruno994

_*So basically I need to check local competitions rules and build accordingly? It seems like you have some in depth knowledge about BBQ regulations.*_

I have a lot of free time at work...I can watch and read alot of Q stuff in an 8 hour day!  LOL.  I think if you install a sink with a water supply and grey water tank along with a propane burner, you will have no problems at all.  The only item you would need then would be to pick up 3 of the bus boxes or some other similiar size tubs for the dishes and utensils.  Most of us use disposable pans so there is not really that much that needs washing, knives and hands are the 2 biggest things I wash.  I also have a couple sauce pans I use for heating up sauces or au jus, but most of the time with those, I throw them in a box at the end of the day and into the dishwasher when I get home.  To be honest, the 3 tub or 3 sink setups are more for show, than they are for anything else.  Nice to have if you have alot of washing to do, but you will probably not use them that much in the end, unless you're doing catering or possibly vending.  At a comp, keep it simple, which means disposable.  Most big ones have trash pickups or at the very least a community dumpster to dispose of bags of trash.  Other big "show" items are a bleach cleaner and some Lysol wipes.  People walking around see them and immediatley will think CLEAN when they see either of those.  I always have them out in plain view and use them of course when needed.  Paper towels are a must.  Cloth towels are kind of frowned upon due to the potential presence of bacteria on a dirty towel.  I keep cloth towels for use on certain things, such as wiping down the shelf on my pit, one at my sink for drying my hands after washing, but if your doing cleaning, paper towels are a must.  Once again, a disposable item.  A box of food prep gloves is a must as well, Sams' has 500 pair for $6.  Even though you may wash your hands constantly, nothing shows concern like covering your hands while prepping and serving food. 

I know were getting a bit off your build and thats the concern of this thread, but some of this could put some ideas into your head for additions to your trailer, allowing you to be ready to handle anything.


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## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Dave, I like the idea of the hair dryer just because it is making me consider other than ordinary fan types. But like you said, the hair dryer wouldn't hold up to the heat from the FB. Also, I have in the back of my mind a fan that will run off of the trucks charging system (battery) so that if I am off somewhere, I can still use the fan. Maybe some of you onlookers can come up with a fan idea that is large enough to move heat through this setup (I do not know how powerful it needs to be), withstand Fire Box heat (I do not know how hot that is), and run off of a 12 volt system without draining it completely. I really am enjoying all the ideas and comments on here. It is making me think about many scenarios before acting on one.


i'm not sure how many cfm a hair drier puts out. however an outdoor wood boiler furnace. uses between a 50 and 150 cfm fan. if you mounted it divorced from the firebox and under it should not heat up. you could still be under and pipe it so as the air enters above or anyplace you wanted.. a radiator fan is going to be a lot more cfm and more money. a computer fan is a low voltage fan with lower than 50cfm.....as far as a sink goes farther down in this post..... 30 or 55 gal plastic barrels work well and just gravity feed the water to the sink.

david


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## smokin-aces

Yes, I appreciate all the ensight. I have never competed with BBQ so I don't have the slightest idea of what to expect, thus I don't have the slightest idea of some things that would be useful in competition.


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## smokin-aces

themule69 said:


> i'm not sure how many cfm a hair drier puts out. however an outdoor wood boiler furnace. uses between a 50 and 150 cfm fan. if you mounted it divorced from the firebox and under it should not heat up. you could still be under and pipe it so as the air enters above or anyplace you wanted.. a radiator fan is going to be a lot more cfm and more money. a computer fan is a low voltage fan with lower than 50cfm.....as far as a sink goes farther down in this post..... 30 or 55 gal plastic barrels work well and just gravity feed the water to the sink.
> 
> david


This sounds good. Do you know what kind of voltage these wood boiler furnace fans use? I am not wanting a generator so I want to be able to use a car battery. I like the plastic barrel idea, but will this fit within competition specs?


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> This sounds good. Do you know what kind of voltage these wood boiler furnace fans use? I am not wanting a generator so I want to be able to use a car battery. I like the plastic barrel idea, but will this fit within competition specs?


the fans for all the wood boilers that i know of would be 115 volts. probably under 2 amp but not sure. the little desk fan beside me is .2 amp (that is point 2). so amps x volts = watts or 115x2=230. or 115x.2=23 watts. so a small power inverter would run it fine off of a battery. not sure if a plastic barrel would be allowed in compatition. it should be. it is just a storage tank. they are food grade.

david


----------



## smokin-aces

Sounds good. Now the next question is how man CFM's would it take to move heat through the CC without blowing it all out too fast?


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> This sounds good. Do you know what kind of voltage these wood boiler furnace fans use? I am not wanting a generator so I want to be able to use a car battery. I like the plastic barrel idea, but will this fit within competition specs?


here is a fan from grainger .t is .23 amp so 115x.23=26.45 watts











PSC Blower,115 Volt
Item # 1TDN7
PSC Blower, Forward Curve, Direct Drive, Wheel Dia 3 In, CFM @ 0.000-In SP 50, Voltage 115, 60 Hz, Single Phase, Full Load Amps 0.23, RPM 3036
 
DAYTON
1TDN7
4319Ready to Ship  





*When can I get it?*
1
$73.50


----------



## smokin-aces

Could a fan like this be used with an adjustable thermostat?


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Sounds good. Now the next question is how man CFM's would it take to move heat through the CC without blowing it all out too fast?


no clue... it would in fact add heat maybe lots of heat. as soon as you get far enough along to where you can build i fire. do a test burn and see what temps you get. if you need more use the hair dry into an air vent and see what happens. you can always add a damper to the fan to control it if needed. you can use scrap for a mok up.

 i didn't come up with the fan idea. i just found the fan.


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Could a fan like this be used with an adjustable thermostat?


i'm sure it could be. with a furnace they use aqua stats to send a signal go to grainger.com or give them a call. or i bet someone on here will answer that.


----------



## smokin-aces

What if this was put on the exhaust... would it create draft correctly and being heat through or would it just suck out all the hot air? This is an inline duct fan.













Inline Duct fan.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 7, 2013


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> What if this was put on the exhaust... would it create draft correctly and being heat through or would it just suck out all the hot air? This is an inline duct fan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Inline Duct fan.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ smokin-aces
> __ Jan 7, 2013


it wouldn't stand up to the heat.


----------



## smokin-aces

themule69 said:


> no clue... it would in fact add heat maybe lots of heat. as soon as you get far enough along to where you can build i fire. do a test burn and see what temps you get. if you need more use the hair dry into an air vent and see what happens. you can always add a damper to the fan to control it if needed. you can use scrap for a mok up.
> 
> i didn't come up with the fan idea. i just found the fan.


Good idea. It would probably be best to get it functional, then add a fan according to what is needed.


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Good idea. It would probably be best to get it functional, then add a fan according to what is needed.


natural draft is going to be your best bet all the way around.


----------



## daveomak

Aces, evening..... You do not want the fan on a thermostat.....  You adjust the temp of the smoker with the damper under the fire....


----------



## smokin-aces

Evening, Would the fan just be continuously running? And do you have any idea what kind of cfm I need for this setup?


----------



## daveomak

smokin-aces said:


> Evening, Would the fan just be continuously running?
> 
> *I would say yes, because of the design o f smoker... *
> 
> And do you have any idea what kind of cfm I need for this setup?
> 
> *Guessing, 5 - 20 cfm.....  Your FB is 10 cu ft, and CC is 20 cu ft...  That is why I recommended a "fan speed controller" for the fan....  You could add a venturi to the air stream.... I would put it inside the FB....  Pick up the hot air....  More effective heat movement...  An aquarium type pump "could" work for this... *
> 
> View media item 191633


I would try the smoker without any gimmicks..... no fans, no temp controllers and see what happens....  It may be the best smoker on the block.. or neighborhood...  If you have it sealed up with no air leaks, it could be the best smoker in the town..  Dave


----------



## smokin-aces

DaveOmak said:


> I would try the smoker without any gimmicks..... no fans, no temp controllers and see what happens....  It may be the best smoker on the block.. or neighborhood...  If you have it sealed up with no air leaks, it could be the best smoker in the town..  Dave


Morning, you are right! I am definately going to add fans and "gimmicks" as a last resort. After looking at the available options, if I decide to go with some sort of fan system, it would probably be just as cheap to go with a BBQ Guru setup. These are from $130 and up. Some kits come with the fans and controller interface as a package, others are all seperate.


----------



## smokin-aces

I plan to get some things accomplished on the smoker tomorrow. Stay tuned for more pictures and questions...


----------



## smokin-aces

Okay today I feel like I am much closer to smoking some meat on this thing. I put the plate in the tank that divides the cook chamber from the fire box. Also I finished the exhaust box and made am intake damper. Now all that's left is the exhaust pipe (still haven't decided what to use), thermometers, paint and flooring the back of the trailer. 













0112131655.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 12, 2013


















0112131655a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 12, 2013


















0112131655b.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 12, 2013


















0112131656a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Jan 12, 2013


----------



## themule69

i'm still in.


----------



## smokin-aces

Does anyone have any input on cooking a whole pig? For instance... how long are the pigs normally? Would a pig rotisserie be necessary? How much of the pig is normally eaten when it's cooked whole?


----------



## moikel

Yes I have done whole pigs but in my woodfired oven so may not be much help. You dont need a rotisserie ,I eat everything. I have done them flattened out,I have done them with the cavity filled with veg & spices then stitched shut.

Love the smoker!


----------



## moikel

I am going to do a pig soon,total fire ban here still terrible dangers in country areas.So it will be a little way off. Biggest I have done is about 60 pounds,took less than 5 hours but was pretty tiring.I will scale it down. 

Its just about a pig bid enough to have the fat cover & small enough to move in & out of oven to baste it turn it around. Thats where you have an advantage with your smoker. Way better access. Splayed & flattened cook faster & crisper. That said keeping it round stuffing cavity with,big bits red pepper,onion,fennel,etc,fennel seed,garlic,cbp,EVO,white wine lemon ,rosemary,then stitching it shut has a certain sense of theatre when you cut the string to serve the veg. Also very moist.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## smokin-aces

So how do you serve the pig? Do you just slice off a hunk and dig in? Skin and all? Seems odd to me but I hear of people doing it all the time. Also how does a whole pig compare in flavor to other single pork products... for instance, is it similar to eating a Boston Butt only a whole pigs worth?


----------



## daveomak

smokin-aces said:


> So how do you serve the pig? Do you just slice off a hunk and dig in? Skin and all? Seems odd to me but I hear of people doing it all the time. *Also how does a whole pig compare in flavor to other single pork products... for instance, is it similar to eating a Boston Butt *only a whole pigs worth?


Aces, morning... Whole pig, skin on, is moist, juicy, tender, flavorful......Absolutely better than any pig I have cooked and eaten....  all the fat mingles with the meat for a flavor experience beyond explanation....   Pull the skin off of a section and dig in....  Wear a bib when eating pork from a whole pig....     

Dave


----------



## smokin-aces

mmmmmm Sounds great! I will definitely have to try it. Do you think a pig would fit in my smoker? With the section between the doors?


----------



## daveomak

Depends on how big the pig is....


----------



## smokin-aces

Average to small sized... what ever size that is.


----------



## smokin-aces

What do ya'll think about a double-walled stove pipe? Would there be an advantage to this compared to a single-walled pipe? I am thinking that a double-walled pipe would stay cooler to the touch.


----------



## smokin-aces

I have considered an insulated pipe as well. They are pricey but it will cost me approximately the same amount to get a plain 6" steel pipe as it will to buy a stainless insulated pipe. Plain 6" dia X 48" long cost ~$50 to buy and another $50 to ship... a stainless insulated is ~$120 shipping included. For a few more dollars I can have stainless insulated.


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> What do ya'll think about a double-walled stove pipe? Would there be an advantage to this compared to a single-walled pipe? I am thinking that a double-walled pipe would stay cooler to the touch.


i'm not seeing a reason to try and keep the stack cool. if for some reason you would like it cool. get some exhaust wrap. if the stack is that hot. think of what the temp will be at grate level.


----------



## smokin-aces

I was just thinking about if someone accidently rubbed against it. If it were insulated it wouldn't burn... plus stainless exhaust pipe would look good.


----------



## smokin-aces

Sorry to say I do not have much to update ya'll on this weekend. All I can say is that I got a really nice exhaust pipe. It is 6" ID 8" OD Stainless Steel Fully Insulated and 48" long. Should look nice after I polish it up.


----------



## smokin-aces

I still do not have much to say as far as an update goes. Sorry! This thread has not died, I just have been side tracked the last couple weekends. I will be sure to update as soon as I do something!


----------



## themule69

i'm still in. can't wait to see some smoke.


----------



## smokin-aces

Same here... bettter yet, some smoked food hmmmm BBQ ( as Homer Simpson would say)


----------



## smokin-aces

Well I finally got back on the smoker today. Been a couple weeks! So I got the big stack on and the cooking rack on the fire side and I fired her up today! Cooked some hamburgers and buddy were they good!

Here she is puffin away.













0209131541_zps6082ad92.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 9, 2013


----------



## daveomak

Aces.... Looks very good.....  I'm glad the design worked exactly as you planned it.....    Are we going to get pics of finished inside of the smoker from end to end ????  Folks could learn a few things if you did that.....    Me included  ....

Dave


----------



## smokin-aces

Yes there will be many pictures to follow. I still haven't gotten it finished. I have to add thermometers, door latches, paint and other various odds and ins. But I plan to add more pictures tomorrow. 

One thing that I think will put this smoker over the top (in my opinion)  is when I put the decking on the back of the trailer. It will have a treated lumber floor with standard 5.5 inch decking to haul wood, with walls along with a top that is hinged to act as a roof for keeping the wood dry when traveling and can be opened to be used as  a counter. I haven't decided if I want the other half to be a sink of not... I guess I will make that decision in time.

Thank you by the way for the compliment.


----------



## smokin-aces

Oh and by the way... For anyone that doubted this design I would like to inform you how this performed for the first time in an unfinished state.

As far as draft goes (for those of you that thought that the exhaust being low and the smoke inlet being high would cause draft issues): The draft was so strong with the damper slid all the way open that the flame closest to the damper could not stand up straight because the wind coming through was so strong. Looking at the damper from the side all you could see is smoke rolling up to the bottom of the damper and immediately getting blown into the FB. It made that noise that fire makes when being blown on by a strong wind.

As far as temperature goes, I put a meat thermometer that only reads to 220 degrees F and within 20 seconds sitting on a rack was pegged out. And this is with a small 2-3 log fire. I would guess the temperature to be close to 350 or 400. Again with a small fire. 

As far as smoke flow goes, the entire CC must fill with smoke before it can escape the exhaust. Which is exactly what happened. When the fire got going good and I shut all the doors it took a few minutes for the smoke to start coming out the exhaust pipe, when I opened a door to see what it looked like, all I could see was a tank full of smoke. 

Side notes: The fire could easily be  controlled with only the fire box damper. If I shut the damper all the way the fire choked down to embers, half way = half fire , all the way open = full blaze with strong draft. I do not have any exhaust damper yet, and may not need one if it keeps this up.

Also I enjoyed loading wood to the fire from the top instead of from the side like I am accustomed to doing with my double barrel smoker.


----------



## smokin-aces

I still do not know what to call this smoker. I haven't seen another one like this. The part that makes it unique is the fire box being in the same tank as the cook chamber. Also with the firebox serving as an open flame grill. Can anyone lead me in the right direction for the name of this smoker? Thank you.


----------



## themule69

i'm glad it is working great. looking forward to seeing some great Q.

happy smoken.

david


----------



## smokin-aces

I got quite a bit done on the smoker today. I was able to paint it early this morning and I also got a good start on the floor of the trailer. Finally I got my thermometers on there too. 

The box you see on the back of the trailer is still unfinished... I ran out of screws and the sun was getting low in the sky. The finished "box" will have a top that is in two parts and hinged so I can keep the wood dry when I am hauling it and fold it out when I am cooking to have more counter space. I am throwing around the idea of putting a type of thick plastic on the under side of the lid so I will have a good surface to prepare food on.  I am still undecided about putting a sink on the other half of the table top. I have a couple surprises I am going to wait until later to unveil... 

Trailer before floor.













0216131034_zps544d6bd6.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Another view of pre floor trailer













0216131034b_zpse0d5fb98.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Doors side pre floor. Note this is a boat trailer













0216131034a_zps3b7b0dd8.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Here is the floor













0216131504_zps49b01706.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Long view













0216131504a_zpsc39c24f4.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Close up













0216131504b_zps21f12617.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






With the unfinished wood box













0216131650_zps2779e956.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Another view of wood box













0216131650b_zps40a7623f.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






View from doors side













0216131651_zpse2881df5.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Close up of counter space under smoker doors and thermometers













0216131651a_zpsb0598d5a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013






Front view. Notice I masked the boat trailer look by running the floor up square to the front.













0216131654_zpse8fc58e0.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 16, 2013


----------



## michael ark

Looks great!


----------



## JckDanls 07

I know you know better..   but just a friendly reminder...  your counter space under the doors...  is that pressure treated wood..  If so please do not set raw meat on it...  maybe line it with some of the plastic cutting boards or something of that sort...


----------



## smokin-aces

JckDanls 07 said:


> I know you know better.. but just a friendly reminder... your counter space under the doors... is that pressure treated wood.. If so please do not set raw meat on it... maybe line it with some of the plastic cutting boards or something of that sort...


Yeah I wouldn't do that anyway just because of the dirtiness of it.... I am going to make the under side of the lid that will eventually be on the wood box plastic... I am thinking maybe .5" thick white plastic..


----------



## smokin-aces

I know some of you were wanting a tour of the inside of the smoker... So here it is. The smoke comes up to the top of the tank and fills the tank from the top down. The exhaust is under the racks so it forces the smoke and heat to fill the entire tank before it escapes. If you have any questions or suggestions feel free to chime in! 

This is the fire side of the tank.













0217131352_zps18f53e2a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






Here is the top of the divider that is between the fire part and the smoking chamber. 













0217131352a_zpse87e3ff4.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






This is a view of the intake damper slot all the way open.













0217131353a_zps0e068965.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






Here is a closer view of the divider gap.













0217131353_zps807c547a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






This is the view looking from the left most side of the tank back to the fire side of the tank.













0217131353b_zpsf70dc2d6.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






This is the inside of the exhaust box.













0217131354_zpsd97b3907.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013






Here is a view of the exhaust box looking down through the grate.













0217131354a_zpsbaae32bf.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 17, 2013


----------



## black

z


----------



## smokin-aces

Here she is with the smoke rolling! Cook chamber was about 400*F and the fire chamber was about 500*F. ~3-4 log fire...













0224131609_zps603b9884.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 28, 2013






Here she is before I finished it like in the above picture.. but it is a closer view.













0223131342_zps3ec0961f.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Feb 28, 2013


----------



## black

z


----------



## themule69

looks great aces. i'm so glad it is working the way you wanted. i see many years of great Q.

happy smoken.

david


----------



## smokin-aces

I don't consider her to be finished yet, but she is finished enough to cook on. I am cooking a chicken and a butt on it now. The butt will cook all night, but the chicken will come off in a few minutes! I can't wait to take her to competitions this summer! I don't even care if I win I just think it will be fun. Thanks everyone for all the positive feedback and the input. I will be sure to keep this thread up as I continue to finish this build. I still have a few more things I am going to do to it. Stay tuned!


----------



## smokin-aces

The chicken turned out pretty good, but I am pretty critical of my own cooking so I didn't think it was as good as it could have been. 

The butt was over cooked. Normally I cook butts in a covered pan for ~10 hrs covered. After 10 hrs I uncover the pan for 30 mins to an hour and let it "smoke". That always turned out moist, tender, and smoky. But with the new smoker I tried a new technique. Uncovered and not in a pan for the entire time. Not smoky and not tender or moist. Still have to learn the smoker though. 

I am not satisfied with good meat. I want mind blowing food. Competition winning food. Advice on cooking great meat is welcomed...


----------



## christo0pher

I made the handles for all three doors.


----------



## smokin-aces

Christo0pher said:


> I made the handles for all three doors.


?? Is this a compliment? Or are you confused? lol


----------



## smokin-aces

Cooked some steaks on it for supper today.... I have to say they were pretty delicious!! Sorry for not having pictures. Going to visit some family this weekend and planning to cook some butts, maybe a chicken or turkey and possibly some steaks on it.Can't wait to see how it turns out.


----------



## daveomak

smokin-aces said:


> Cooked some steaks on it for supper today.... I have to say they were pretty delicious!! Sorry for not having pictures. Going to visit some family this weekend and planning to cook some butts, maybe a chicken or turkey and possibly some steaks on it.Can't wait to see how it turns out.


..............
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





............  We need Q-Views ............    I need to drool on my keyboard just a bit.....   

Dave


----------



## smokin-aces

Sorry Dave, I didn't get any pictures of the steaks... you'll just have to take my word that they were delicious!!! 

I have a few more surprises to post on here. I'll give you a hint.... they are tail light lenses, and they look like pigs.. Will post pictures soon!


----------



## smokin-aces

Here are the Pig tail lights. 

Left side.













0314132019_zps97fc4acb.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 14, 2013






Right Side













0314132019a_zps34adb57a.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 14, 2013


----------



## themule69

smokin-aces said:


> Here are the Pig tail lights.
> 
> Left side.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 0314132019_zps97fc4acb.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ smokin-aces
> __ Mar 14, 2013
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right Side
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 0314132019a_zps34adb57a.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> __ smokin-aces
> __ Mar 14, 2013


wow that is not a hog. that is an arkansas razorback. whooooooooooo pig soeeeee.
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





no david this is his tail lights. he can call them tail lighs if he wants. it is his build!

pig soeee razorbacks.
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





damn mule don't
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





.

ok my bad. i like the tail lighs and the smoker.

happy smoken.

david


----------



## rasimmo

I like the lenses. Did you make them or buy them? More details about them please.


----------



## smokin-aces

Before I go into detail about the tail light lenses... Let's go over what all I cooked this weekend.....

2 chickens

6 turkey legs
3 butts

3 steaks

6 hamburgers

3 pork loin steaks

1 turkey

1 rack beef short ribs

1 brisket

12 pork ka bobs

Que View.......

Charred Turkey legs













0316130956a_zps1ab2074f.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






Smoked Turkey













0316130956b_zps69d37ed4.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






Turkey close up













0316130956c_zps465d7d91.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






Front half of grill (pork ka bobs)













0316131124_zps999317d3.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






Back half of grill (chicken/pork slices/butt)













0316131124a_zpsde6c9483.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






Pork ka bobs













0316131225_zpsf39722e9.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






close up













0316131226_zps989198b8.jpg



__ smokin-aces
__ Mar 18, 2013






It was a very successful weekend and everyone there was RAVING about the food. We grazed on the meat all day. I kept the meat rolling off the smoker/grill constantly. I am now excited to use this big rig even more.  Anytime you eat wood grilled turkey legs for breakfast, you know it's the start of a good day!!!


----------



## smokin-aces

Now the tail light lenses. The company I work for uses a plastic guy that makes all our fixtures out of plexi glass or other plastics. So one day while I was presenting the design of a new fixture we wanted him to make, I noticed some pink plastic in his foyer. I thought about it and decided I would ask him to make a big pig that I could put on the tongue of my trailer. Then  I had the idea of having 2 more made that were scaled down for tail light lenses. So now I have 2 tail light pigs and one 32" pig to go on the tongue.... They are laser cut and all identical. The only difference between the big pig and the small pigs is that the small pigs are scaled down. 

It ought to turn some heads at competitions!!!

Well worth the investment!


----------



## smokin-aces

I just wanted to give an update on this smoker. 

This smoker is the most efficient smoker I've ever used. I can put 2-3 good logs in the fire box and the smoker will hold 200*F for 6-8 hours. Once I set the damper to the temp I want, the temp stays within 5 degrees +/- of what I have it set on. The doors don't leak smoke out because of the flat steel seal I put on the inside of the doors. 

The grill/firebox works great too. I can literally cook steaks or hamburgers as I am smoking meat on the other side. I am amazed at how efficient this smoker is using nothing less than a slide damper. 

Thank you for all the input.


----------



## playmtex

20140108_133256.jpg



__ playmtex
__ Jan 8, 2014





Looks good here's pic of one built 8 years ago


----------



## smokin-aces

Does that one get used? It looks like is never seen a fire. It looks good though.


----------



## playmtex

Use it all the time just repainted it


----------



## jagra

I've been researching how to convert my 750 gal propane tank into a smoker, looking at how I want it to cook and how to make it all work right.  I was starting to design simliar to how you have done yours.  In addition to using the FB for direct grilling, I also wanted to set it up for dutch oven use too.  I would love any help you could provide.  Do you have a plate underneath the cooking rack for better radiant heat?  I'm thinking about doing that and use the plate to also catch grease or be used to add liquid for a moist smoke.  Thoughts?


----------



## daveomak

Jagra said:


> I've been researching how to convert my 750 gal propane tank into a smoker, looking at how I want it to cook and how to make it all work right.  I was starting to design simliar to how you have done yours.  In addition to using the FB for direct grilling, I also wanted to set it up for dutch oven use too.  I would love any help you could provide.  Do you have a plate underneath the cooking rack for better radiant heat?  I'm thinking about doing that and use the plate to also catch grease or be used to add liquid for a moist smoke.  Thoughts?




Jagra, afternoon and welcome.....   Your questions could get lost on this thread.....  I think you will be better served starting a new thread in Reverse Flow smokers section......    Dave


----------



## ab canada smoke

I really like the sleek look of the one piece profile unit you are building.

No one has mentioned a double baffle between the firebox and the smoker chamber...

Would some efficiency of flow be gained by using a double baffle between the firebox and the smoker, with a space between the baffles to create a downward duct. The spacing would only have to be wide enough to allow the proper volume of ducting equal to the cutouts
The baffle near the firebox would have the cutout at the top - the baffle near the smoker would have the baffle near the bottom - flow exits the firebox at the top of the firebox, travels down in the baffle space. and enters the smoker box at the lower elevation, travels across and upwards to your stack opening

 if anyone has seen this sort of thing - and knows it works or does not work 

thx


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## smokin-aces

I would think that could work, but I don't see an advantage of doing that. 

I think one reason this smoker is so efficient and holds such a constant temp is because the flow enters high and exits low. Heat naturally rises, so if it is forced to exit low, that means the entire cook chamber is filled with heat before any of it leaves.


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