# Mr T's "Smoked Cheese From Go To Show" w/ Q- View



## mr t 59874

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              ​                      A piece and slices of three-year-old smoked cheddar​      Mr.T’s​*        “Smoked Cheese, From Go to Show”*​
    _Those of us who smoke cheese enjoy that little something extra, and smoking cheese is fun and easy to do.  Hard cheeses are the easiest and with the proper equipment smoked soft cheeses can add that something spectacular to any meal. _

_   While going to the extra effort to smoke that favorite cheese.  Why not add another dimension and age your own cheese and save some really big bucks at the same time._

_   The youngest cheese that I smoke is a minimum of two years old, the oldest and best cheese I have ever eaten is, my 12 year old hickory smoked Limburger, sadly not much of that is left.

  There is a ton of controversy when it comes to aging, smoking and preserving cheese.  The following are the techniques that I have used for many years; you are welcome to glean from it what you like._

_  Hopefully this will encourage someone to age, smoke and preserve their own cheese._

_Mr. T_
 

*FAQ’s*

*Question:* Can I age store bought cheese?

*Answer:* Yes, I normally will buy cheese in the cryovac package, 2 to 5 Lbs. the larger the better.   

                                                        60 Lbs. Aging Cheese
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*Question: *Will it age in the package?

*Answer:*  Yes it will.  Make sure there are no leaks that would allow liquids to escape and contaminates to enter. Waxed cheeses although will age better. A very dry cheese can age for years, while moist cheeses will simply get old.

*Question:*  At what temperature should I store the cheese?

*Answer:*  Store hard cheeses at temperatures between 70°F - 21°C & 35°F - 2°C. The ideal aging temp is 52°F - 11°C  to 56°f - 13°C.   My hard cheeses are kept at a minimum of 45°F - 7°C.  The closer to 70°F - 21°C, the faster it will age. Softer cheeses should be stored in the cooler range of 50°F - 10°C to 35°F - 2°C. 

*Question:*  How long can I age my cheese?

*Answer:*  I don’t know of any limits in time.  The longest I have aged a cheese is the 12-year-old Limburger.  I have read that some have aged Cheddar for 25 years and more.  Cheddar’s flavor becomes increasingly sharp; its firm texture becomes more granular and crumbly with age.  Cheese never stops aging.  Left long enough, mild cheddar will turn into extra sharp.  A semi – hard/hard cheese will never spoil as long as it is vacuum packed and refrigerated.  It gets better with age also.
Ready to be Smoked​3   ​






*Question:*  How much should I smoke at one time?

*Answer:*   Smoke according to the size of the block.  I smoke cheese as we need it.    Cut your blocks into sections approximately the size of a quarter pound stick of butter for better smoke penetration. A one pound block may be cut in half, while a two or five pound block will need to be sectioned for good smoke absorption.
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*Question: *What temperature should cheese be prior to smoking?

*Answer: *It depends on how much smoke you want your cheese to take on. The cooler the cheese the more smoke it will take on in a time period, this is desired when smoking cream type cheese and helps in avoiding melting. If a more mild smoke is desired, allow the harder cheese to come to ambient temperature prior to smoking. 

Bring it to ambient temperature in it's original packaging before cutting into desired blocks. This will avoid a skin from developing on the surface, and allow the smoke to better penetrate the cheese.

*Question: *  At what Temperatures should I smoke?
*Answer:*  Consider that cheese will begin to change its texture at 80°F - 27°C so; a true cold smoke will be needed.   The definition of a true cold smoke is 90°F - 32°C or less.    To preserve the quality of the cheese, mine is pulled from the smoker if the internal smoker temperature reaches 70°F -to 75° then, if needed, continue when the elements are cooler.   The smoking time is continued from when it was pulled from the smoker.  Do not smoke below 35°F - 2°C. Hard, semi-hard, soft and cream cheeses may be smoked at 55°F - 13°C.

*Note:* You can take the cheese on up to the melting point if you like and it may still be desirable to your taste, but the quality of the cheese will be lost.
 

*Question:*  How long should I smoke the cheese?

*Answer: *  Only experience will determine this as it really depends on your taste.

   I usually will smoke the hard cheeses for two hours depending on the density of the smoke and type of wood used. The harder the cheese the more dense smoke it can take.  If it is a caramel color you are looking for, a dense smoke for 5 hours may be required.  Depending on the type and texture of your cheese, monitor the smoke as a lighter smoke will sometimes infuse a more desirable flavor than a heavy dense smoke will.  Cream or blues will take a much shorter smoking time than the harder cheeses. Some softer cheeses may be done in half an hour. 

    Learn to keep good records.  In your records note the type of cheese, ambient temperature, internal smoker temperature, type and amount of wood, the density of the smoke and, of course, the time, color and taste.
Ready for Smoker​5​






*Question:* What woods should I use?

*Answer:*   Hickory, apple, cherry and alder among others work very well.

*Question:*  Okay it’s smoked. Now what?

*Answer:*  Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day.  If it is going to be consumed soon, wrap in a cling type wrap and put in fridge or store at previously discussed temperatures. It is best to let hard cheese rest at room temperature for two to three weeks to allow the smoke to permeate the cheese. Depending on the type of cheese, if it is going to be kept for a few months, coat it with olive or vegetable oil and place on a rack in a container and refrigerate.  Reapply oil every two weeks.  A damp paper towel may be kept in the container to provide added moisture.  After slicing some for use, reapply oil.  The oil will help keep mold from forming on the outside.  If the cheese is going to be aged further, it is waxed and stored as usual.  Of course, it can be vacuum sealed also.

*Question:*   Can I freeze my cheese before or after smoking?

*Answer:*    It’s my opinion that, the quality of the cheese is seriously compromised by freezing.

*Question:*  What cheeses can be waxed?

*Answer:*  Only the hard cheeses should be waxed, Cheddar, Swiss, Colby, etc. The less moisture you have in your cheese the better for waxing. 

*Question:*  Can I use paraffin to wax cheese?

*Answer:*  No.  Paraffin is not pliable and will crack and break in time allowing contaminates in and molds to form. Use only wax designated as cheese wax. It will remain pliable and allow your cheese to breathe which aids in aging. It will also take a much higher heat when melting which when applied, helps in preventing mold.

*Question:  *At what temperature should I heat the wax?

*Answer:*  Germs are killed at 180°F - 82°C. To prevent mold, heat wax to 225°F - 107°C - 240°F - 116°C or the wax manufacturer's suggested temperature.  BE CAREFUL if taken too high, the waxes flash point may be reached.  To prevent pinholes, apply three coats by dipping or brushing the wax on.  To prevent melting the first coat of wax, apply the additional coats at a lower temp, 160°F - 71°C.

*Note:  *1* - *Use a designated pan to melt wax in, not a good one.  

             2 - Suggest using a hot plate rather than a gas stove for obvious reasons.

*Question:*   Can I use a double boiler to melt the wax?

*Answer:*   Not for the first coating. Water boils at 212°F - 100°C at sea level and generally decreases 2°F - -17°C per 1000 ft as elevation increases.  Therefore, the desirable temperatures cannot be reached.  
Waxed Cheddar​6​






*Question:*  Where can I get Cheese wax?

*Answer:*  Cheese making suppliers will have it or, it may be purchased on line. 
Vacuum Packed​7​






The below cheeses are what is kept on the kitchen counter for short time use.  Note the aged 4-year-old cheddar has been on the counter for three months, no mold.
8​

*Question:* How is cheese properly served?

*Answer: *  *Number one rule:* Do not eat cheese cold or straight from the refrigerator. The cold temperature hinders the natural flavors and fragrance  of the cheese. The aromatic and complex flavors of cheese don't really begin to appear until the cheese is at room temperature.

*To enjoy all the flavors and aromas of any cheese it is important that it be served at room temperature (72°) or its proximity.*

Cheese is composed largely of fat.  Since fat means flavor, the goal is to amplify it as much as possible. When fat molecules are cold, they contract, when they warm, they relax, allowing a greater perception of flavor. 

Pull your cheese out of the refrigerator at least an hour to a hour and a half before serving.  To keep your cheese from drying out, never unwrap your cheese when you bring it out of the refrigerator.  If serving waxed cheese at room temperature, wait until ready to serve before removing wax or if wrapped, unwrapping. 

Be careful, though, especially in the summer months, if you warm up the cheese too much, it'll start to sweat and melt in unappetizing ways. Try to keep it at or around 72°.

To cut any cheese properly—hard or soft —use a good chef's knife or a good all-purpose utility knife. To cut very soft, cheese such as chevre cleanly, use a length of stretched dental floss.

  Serving cheese after the main course, prior to or in place of dessert, adds an elegant touch to casual dinners.  If served before dinner, with cocktails, remember that cheeses can be filling.  Serve in limited quantities and variety.  

If serving more than one type of cheese, provide separate knives for each cheese. Do not overcrowd the serving tray, as guest will need room to slice the cheeses. 
 

*Question:*   What do I do if I find mold on my cheese?

*Answer:*    The mold on hard or semi-soft cheeses may be washed with a scrub brush or, cut away and re-waxed or oiled.

  

Soft cheeses, such as cottage cheese, cream cheese, and ricotta cheese, that have mold  should be discarded. The same goes for any kind of cheese that's shredded, crumbled or sliced.

With these cheeses, the mold can send threads throughout the cheese. In addition, harmful bacteria, such as listeria, brucella, salmonella and E. coli, can grow along with the mold.

Mold generally can't penetrate far into hard and semisoft cheeses, such as cheddar, colby, Parmesan and Swiss. So you can cut away the moldy part and eat the rest of the cheese. Cut off at least 1 inch (2.5 centimeters) around and below the moldy spot. Be sure to keep the knife out of the mold so it doesn't contaminate other parts of the cheese.

Of course, not all molds pose a risk. In fact, some types of mold are used to make cheeses, such as Brie, Camembert and Blue's. These molds are safe to eat.

*Note: *Store blue-veined and other intentionally moldy cheeses away from other cheeses as the mold spores can contaminate other cheeses.

If you're not sure what type of cheese you have or what to do if it grows mold, the safe course is to discard it.

*Question:* Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?

*Answer: *   
It could be as simple as applying too much smoke. It's imperative that you monitor the color and density of your smoke as there are many outside influences that can change both. Take the time that others smoke with a grain of salt, use it possibly as a guide but, not knowing the color and density of their smoke, their info is mostly useless.  And they may have a bitter taste out of the smoker themselves.

Remember, regardless the smoke generator you are using, the whiter the smoke, the more unforgiving it is as shorter smoking times are required.

 Many tend to over smoke their cheese making it inedible when it comes out of the smoker, thereby they vac-seal it and let it set sometimes for months before they can consume it. You don’t deliberately over smoke a chicken then let it rest for weeks before eating it, so why would you do it to cheese?

For an example as to learn how to smoke cheese that is edible right after being smoked, take a block of cheddar and cut it into bite sizes. While taking good notes, place the pieces into your smoker/product chamber and begin applying smoke. At 20 or 30-minute intervals take a taste test of one of your samples. When you get to your desired taste, pull the cheese, you are done. This can be done using many different smoke applications.

The heavier and more dense the smoke the sooner it will be done, possibly in as little as a few minutes. A lighter, thin smoke applied from a distant fire box may take hours. This is something you have to take into consideration when being advised as to how long to smoke a product without knowing the kind of smoke used.

When done, note the color of your cheese, this is what you want to shoot for in future smokes. The color of the cheese will depend on the type of smoke being used along with the wood.

*Creosote* = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the ones pictured below. Using an smoke generator inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. 

An attempt was made in the following threads to demonstrate how to significantly prevent a bitter taste on a product from occurring. You will notice a great difference between placing a smoke generator inside the product chamber/smoker and placing it in an external firebox and piping the smoke to the chamber. Piping the smoke to a chamber produces a much cleaner smoke. The longer the run from the firebox to the chamber, the cleaner the smoke will be, meaning less creosote deposits. AMNPS & Smoke Daddy Myths?  -  Cleaning up your act - clean smoke is delicious smoke!

Now, how do we replicate the smokers of old in today’s environment? We start by using a remote firebox and pipe the smoke produced by your smoke generator of choice to the product chamber, which could be your smoker or a cardboard box, whatever you want to use. To cool the smoke as much as possible, the firebox is also being used as a heat sink, the more mass the better. The pipe used (preferably single wall stovepipe) to transport the smoke will also act as a heat sink so the longer it is, the better the results.

  Examples:



The above is an example using an Smoke Daddy Big Kahuna smoke generator in conjunction with a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber. 













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The above is example using a tray type pellet smoke generator inside a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber.

View media item 459259
The above example uses a tray type smoke generator inside a mailbox feeding an MES.

View media item 459449
The above example is using a MES cold smoke attachment feeding an MES.

*Question:*   Can I get this type of cheese on-line?

*Answer:*   Yes and here is a link to get you started.

                    https://www.wisconsincheesemart.com/cheese/ 

*              Mr. T's  Christmas 2015 Gift Cheese - Aged - Smoked - Waxed*

*                                                       03 / 27 / 2015*













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                                                 3.5-year-old Cheddar













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It took 20 hours of light white smoke to reach the desired color. Used Pitmaster pellets with AMNPS 

in a remote iron stove 8 feet away.  Highest temperature reached during smoke, 68.5°.













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20 hours of smoke compared to non-smoked.  The streaks in the cheese were caused by the

1/4 cup of whey that escaped from the aging cheese while inside the original packaging for 3.5 years.













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Pie pan used for dipping.













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First coat of wax applied at 240° to deter mold growth.  Additional coats applied at 160°.













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Info tags applied to still wet second coat.













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After three coats of wax, it is now ready for further aging or until the Holidays.

*Note:*   The cheese rested overnight before waxing.  A taste test revealed a very mild non-bitter taste.

            I cannot over-emphasize the importance of using a remote smoke generator in order to cool and clean the

            smoke prior to coming into contact with the cheese. It eliminates much if not all of any bitter taste.

*2016 Christmas Gift Cheese - Aged - Smoked - Waxed  - **6 and 9 year old cheese*

*Mr. T’s 2016 Christmas Gift Cheese - Aged – Smoked - Waxed*

Included in this year’s gift cheeses are five pounds of 6-year-old Tillamook Medium Cheddar and two pounds of 9-year-old Tillamook Extra Sharp Cheddar.

Some left unsmoked the rest received 18 hours of a very light cob smoke before waxing. The following was the process.













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Selected cheese













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The corn cob pellets used in a tray type smoke generator were a combination of whole and broken pellets. An earlier test made on fresh cheese determined the color/taste desired which took 20 hours of smoke.













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6-year-old Tillamook Medium Cheddar













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9 - year- old Tillamook Extra Sharp Cheddar













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Residual liquid from each package, 7 tsp. from the 5 # of medium cheddar, 4 tsp. from the 2 # of extra sharp. Note the extra oil/fat in the whey of the extra sharp. This is a natural occurrence especially when aging cheddar cheese and nothing to be concerned over.













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Six hours into the smoke, could not help the reflections.













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Sixteen hours into the smoke, note the color and density of the smoke.













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Wax used













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Cheese ready for dipping. You can see the difference between the non-smoked and smoked cheese. The cheese went directly from smoker to the waxing table.













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First dip in 220° - 225° wax to kill bacteria and prevent molding. The subsequent two dips are at 160° for secure seal.













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After second dip, identifiers are applied to still hot wax.













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After third dip, the cheese is ready for continued aging.

*Note:*  Test results after removing from smoker were the Medium was now Extra Sharp with a good smoke flavor. The Extra Sharp was sharp yet surprisingly mellow with a good smoke flavor. The extra sharp had to be cut carefully as it was brittle and wanted to break, it will be good used as grated or chunked cheese.

*Related Threads:*   My Cold Smoking Options w/Q - View  -  Mr T's "Smoked Cheese From Go To Show" w/ Q- View

Tom

*Additional Information:*

Understanding Smoke Management

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/139474/understanding-smoke-management

My Cold Smoking Options

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123840/my-cold-smoking-options-w-q-

Moldy Cheese

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/food-and-nutrition/AN01024

Listeria in soft cheese made with unpasteurized milk such as queso fresco, Feta, Brie and Camembert.

http://www.foodsafety.gov/poisoning/causes/bacteriaviruses/listeria/

view

*                                                             Tillamook Cheese*

               Type                                              Aged                                             Uses

Medium Sharp Cheddar                           60 days                        snack, sandwich, main dish

Sharp Cheddar                                    Nine + months                        appetizer or main dish

Reserve Extra Sharp                                2 years                                    gourmet side dishes

                                                                                 compliments smoked salmon and  sauces

Vintage White Extra sharp Cheddar        2 + years                      companion to fruit and wine

Vintage Medium White Cheddar            100 + days                             well with fruit and wine

Monterey Jack                                                                                           topping on any dish

Pepper Jack                                                                 southwest recipes, snack with crackers

Swiss                                                                                                                       burgers and soup

Colby                                                                         sandwiches appetizer with crackers or bread


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## dls1

Another very impressive tutorial Mr T. As with your ones on salmon and kraut , this pretty much gives me, as well as others, a solid foundation. In other words, how much more do I really need to know to produce an outstanding product. Nice pics and the BV looks like it would make a great partner with aged and smoked cheddar.

My only problem is my lack of patience with the aging. I guess I need to seek out well aged cheese.

Thanks again for your effort and sharing.


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## mr t 59874

dls. My pleasure.  Thank you very much for the kind words.


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## smokinhusker

Great!!! To the point and very informative. Thank you!


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## thoseguys26

Great info, thank you. I've only aged provolone for six months before smoking. It was delicious.


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## uechikid

One of the moderators should make this thread a sticky.  So much great information in one thread.


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## driedstick

very good info i will bookmark this page if you dont mind


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## mr t 59874

Glad you found the info helpful.  Of course you may bookmark.  If I can help in anyway, post in this thread or you may PM me.

Mr. T


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## dragonmaster194

MrT, This great info is outstanding!  My son in Tacoma loves smoked cheese, and I am going to visit next month.  I will be using your tips to smoke some for him.  Thank you so much for sharing.  Keep on keeping on.  Steve


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## hitechredneck

Very cool...  Because of this post, I'm going to attempt my first cheese smoke this weekend.  I've got some extra sharp cheddar, some colby, and some Colby-Jack cheeses.  How long do you usually let the cheeses rest after a smoke before you cut into them?  I'll probably not be able to wait that long.


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## mr t 59874

HiTechRed Neck,

  Congratulations on your first cheese smoke.  To answer your question, a week’s rest will give the cheese some time to mellow out.  As this will be your first smoke with cheese go ahead and take some samples as the cheese is curing.  It will give you an idea on the importance of curing.  The longer it cures, the better it will be.  Take very good notes on everything (ambient temperature, smoker temperature, type of cheese and wood along with the amounts, smoke density, time and flavor) as they will be valuable in the future.

  One word of caution though.  I see you live in the San Antonio area.  The temperature at night is in the seventies and pushing one hundred during the day.  As the cheese’s texture will begin to change at 80°, I pull mine when the smoker temperature reaches 70 -  75°.  Unless you have a way of keeping your temperature down, I would recommend waiting until cooler weather arrives.  Your cheese will keep just fine and even get better in the fridge.  Patience now means quality later.  While you are waiting for cooler weather, it is a good time to stock up.

Maybe this will help a little further. 

My Cold Smoking Options

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/forum/newestpost/123840

Good luck and keep us posted.  If I can help any further, please ask.

Mr. T


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## scarbelly

First - Thanks to Mr T for a great post on smoking cheese

Most of us who have been smoking cheese for a while let it rest in the fridge for a minimum of two weeks. I personally like 4-6 weeks. I have some that is 14 months old and Nepas just opened some that was aged 20 months.

Here is a link to the cheese section which has lots of posts on this subject 

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/f/2166/cheese

If you want instant gratification try some fresh mozzarella - here is a link to some I have done 

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/101771/smoked-mozzarella


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## backwoods bbq

so you age your cheese First? then smoke? do you age after you smoke it also?


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## smoking b

Backwoods BBQ said:


> so you age your cheese First? then smoke? do you age after you smoke it also?


Yup check out post #12


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## mr t 59874

Backwoods BBQ said:


> so you age your cheese First? then smoke? do you age after you smoke it also?


Backwoods,

Yes most of my cheese begins aging in the package it was purchased in, plastic or wax.  It is then smoked and depending on when it is intended for use it is either vacuum packed and held for up to another three months or  for the prime cheese, I  wax it after smoking and keep it for an indefinite amount of time. This allows the smoke to mellow throughout the whole block and continue to age at a faster rate.


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## hoity toit

thankx for the good post!!!


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## sidpost

Thank you Mr. T!  That is an impressive post for a newbie like myself looking to smoke cheese.


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## mr t 59874

sidpost said:


> Thank you Mr. T!  That is an impressive post for a newbie like myself looking to smoke cheese.


Your welcome, have fun and enjoy.  Any questions, please ask.

Tom


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## forluvofsmoke

Nice thread! Bumping this up so others can catch what I missed.

That settles it for me...my cheeses are getting smoke in the AM! No point in waiting when the cheese can only get better over time!

Eric


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## bamajon

Great thread.  I've been wanting to start smoking cheese for a long time now.  Pinneywoods gave me an amaz-n-smoker to use so now i have no excuse.  thanks to him and this thread i think i got what i need.  I'll let you guys know how it goes.  Thanks again.


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## disco

Great information. Thanks.


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## dougmays

awesome write up Mr. T! I've been wanting to do this for awhile now and t his answered alot of questions!

One thing..you say to leave it out for weeks at room temp to let the smoke penetrate...the cheese doesn't get hard while you do that? i've seen cheese left out for a hour and it hardens up. Does the aging process make it not go stale?


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## mr t 59874

dougmays said:


> awesome write up Mr. T! I've been wanting to do this for awhile now and t his answered alot of questions!
> 
> One thing..you say to leave it out for weeks at room temp to let the smoke penetrate...the cheese doesn't get hard while you do that? i've seen cheese left out for a hour and it hardens up. Does the aging process make it not go stale?


Thank you.  You can leave the hard cheeses at 70 or below to mellow if it is vacuum sealed or preferably waxed.   Hard cheeses that are waxed will age much better.


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## toby bryant

I love smoked cheese, I try and smoke a few pounds every couple of weeks from fall til spring so I have plenty to get me through the warm months. Great tutorial Mr. T.


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## mr t 59874

Edited the original thread by adding the following links.

Understanding Smoke Management

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/139474/understanding-smoke-management

My Cold Smoking Options

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123840/my-cold-smoking-options-w-q-view


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## dougmays

Mr T 59874 said:


> Thank you.  You can leave the hard cheeses at 70 or below to mellow if it is vacuum sealed or preferably waxed.   Hard cheeses that are waxed will age much better.


ah ok! so this will be a winter time activity for me living in south florida :)


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## mr t 59874

To alleviate any concerns of aging cheese, the following information has been added to the original thread.

Moldy cheese

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/food-and-nutrition/AN01024

Listeria in cheese made with unpasteurized milk.

http://www.foodsafety.gov/poisoning/causes/bacteriaviruses/listeria/

Tom


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## BGKYSmoker

Mr T 59874 said:


> To alleviate any concerns of aging cheese, the following information has been added to the original thread.
> 
> Moldy cheese
> 
> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/food-and-nutrition/AN01024
> 
> Listeria in cheese made with unpasteurized milk.
> 
> http://www.foodsafety.gov/poisoning/causes/bacteriaviruses/listeria/
> 
> Tom


Yeah i agree.

I aint never had any cheese go bad. Its like sausage when smoked and dry cured, mold dont like to grow on smoked items.


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## kathrynn

Tom and Rick...thanks for the updates...will go read those after I play in the garden a while.  Should answer some questions that newer folks have!

Kat


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## bamajon

Thanks guys. Answered some questions for me.


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## whartless

Hello all. 

I'm thinking of trying to smoke some cheese for the first time and I have a few questions. What kind of cheese should I attempt first and where would be the best place to get it. Also is the tin can and soldering iron the best method to produce smoke. I have a charbroil offset. 

Thanks. 
Will


----------



## mr t 59874

whartless said:


> Hello all.
> 
> I'm thinking of trying to smoke some cheese for the first time and I have a few questions. What kind of cheese should I attempt first and where would be the best place to get it. Also is the tin can and soldering iron the best method to produce smoke. I have a charbroil offset.
> 
> Thanks.
> Will


whartless, Welcome to the forum.

Cheddar will be a good start for you and can easily be found in any grocery.  It is a good idea to stick with the hard and semi - soft cheeses for a while.  Any type of smoke generator can be used. Set the smoke generator in the fire box of your offset and allow the smoke to enter the grill area with the cheese.  This will help produce a smoother smoke as some of the smoke residue will be left behind.  Keep notes on the type of wood, temperature, time and density of smoke.  Keep the internal smoker temperature below 75°.

Any more questions, please ask on the forum or you may PM me.

The following should help also.  Have fun and enjoy.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/139474/understanding-smoke-management-updated-5-18-13

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123840/my-cold-smoking-options-w-q-view

Tom


----------



## whartless

So I can use just an ordinary block of cheddar from the grocery store cheese section?

Will.


----------



## oldschoolbbq

Shut the Front Door, you got all the tools...Great Post and now I gotta beg for one of those Cheese cutters. Good Grief... it never stops. I knew that coming in , but the toys keep multiplying now
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






  .

Gotta do some more for meself , the Kids done scarfed it all down.

Keep up the good smokes,and as always . . .


----------



## mr t 59874

whartless said:


> So I can use just an ordinary block of cheddar from the grocery store cheese section?
> 
> Will.


Absolutely,  buy a block and cut it so you have sections the approximate size of a 1/4 lb. of butter. 

Tom


----------



## whartless

Awesome!  Thanks for your help! 

Will.


----------



## mr t 59874

whartless said:


> Awesome! Thanks for your help!
> 
> Will.


Will, let us know how it turned out along with the details.

Tom


----------



## whartless

Will do. Thanks for the help Tom!


----------



## eman

I have found that a 4 oz block is the best size for me to smoke. Reason being is i can eat 4 oz in one sitting. I have done cheese w/ the tin can method and now use a AMNPS. Both will work. Minimum 2 weeks rest after smoking! 4-6 weeks is better. You have to try a bite right out the smoker LOL.

 It will taste like you licked the inside of your smoker, but then you will see the reason for aging and it will be a bit easier to do.


----------



## mr t 59874

The following should help in decreasing the strong smoke taste and resting time after smoking with a AMNPS. 

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/140797/amnps-smoke-daddy-myths

Tom


----------



## cmondo84

Great thread, I have been thinking about smoking some cheese and now I have a great resource.


----------



## mr t 59874

cmondo84 said:


> Great thread, I have been thinking about smoking some cheese and now I have a great resource.


If I can be of any help, please ask.

Tom


----------



## chubbabubba

Wow, amazing information. Thanks for sharing this. I'm excited to start smoking some cheese soon.

~Bob


----------



## bajabarrister

Greetings Mr. T! I followed your tutorial and smoked up 13 lbs. of medium cheddar and Colby Jack cheese yesterday. My ambient temperature was 80 degrees. I used my Smoke Hollow smoker and AMNPS5X8 pellet smoker. This was my first cold smoke. I used one single course of BBQ'rs Delight Hickory pellets. As an experiment, I laid in a about 3 linear inches of Western BBQ Products Hickory Smokin' Chips at the end of the line of pellets. I tried this because the chips are so much more economical than pellets. I cut up the cheese to resemble 1/4 pound sticks of butter as you suggested. I lit off the pellets and off we went! The pellets worked flawlessly. In turn, they lit the Smokin' Chips and they also worked perfectly. The cup of pellets and the 1/4 cup of chips smoked for an incredible 3 1/2 hours! I still had chips left unburned, that I moved in order that they would not ignite. I let the cheese "rest" overnight and sealed it up with a FoodSaver vacuum sealing system in the morning. During the smoke, the temperature spiked to 90 degrees twice. Both times were when the Smokin' Chips were smoldering. I simply opened the smoker each time for a couple of minutes to bring the temperature down. I just HAD to taste some of the cheese before I sealed it for aging. The cheese already tastes AWESOME! The next 30 days of aging is going to be killing me!  Thanks for sharing your knowledge!


----------



## mr t 59874

Glad the tutorial was helpful.  Good job on the cheese.  Do to your location, I understand it may be difficult to keep the cheese under 75°, but try to do so.  Have you considered waxing any of it and building your inventory?

If I can help in the future please ask.

Tom


----------



## themule69

Tom

Great info. I will be buying some wax today.

Thanks for the help in the PM

Happy smoken.

David


----------



## sodak

Mr T,

I am trying the smoked cheese now, thanks for all the info.  I plan on air vac sealing the cheese after it is done for it to age.  Can I vac seal it right after it comes out of the smoker or place it in the regular storage bag for the 24 hours first?

Thanks 

Wes


----------



## mr t 59874

Sodak said:


> Mr T,
> 
> I am trying the smoked cheese now, thanks for all the info.  I plan on air vac sealing the cheese after it is done for it to age.  Can I vac seal it right after it comes out of the smoker or place it in the regular storage bag for the 24 hours first?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Wes


Wes, sure you can vac seal after smoking, if the cheese is dry.   Smoking cold cheese in a warm smoke will cause condensation to form on the cheese.  Although not harmful to the cheese, allow it to air dry prior to sealing.

If you intend to age more than two or three months,  seal your cheese in wax, it will result in a much greater product.  If you need help doing this, I would be happy to help.

Tom


----------



## sodak

Mr. T.

Thanks for the reply.  I did end up waiting a couple of hours and have had it in the back of the pantry to age.  I pulled it out last night just to see what was going on with it.  It seems that maybe I didn't give it enough time to cool.  There isn't any holes that I can see but it looks like there is air in it now that wasn't in there when we vac sealed it.  When I squeeze it I don't hear or feel any air escaping.  I also noticed that there is some oil (I'm assuming thats what it is) from the cheese.  It is yellow and looks thicker than water.  Do you think it will still be OK or should I ditch it and try again.  It is sharp cheddar and colby jack I bought at Sam's Club if that makes a difference.

Thanks again

Wes


----------



## mr t 59874

Sodak said:


> Mr. T.
> 
> Thanks for the reply.  I did end up waiting a couple of hours and have had it in the back of the pantry to age.  I pulled it out last night just to see what was going on with it.  It seems that maybe I didn't give it enough time to cool.  There isn't any holes that I can see but it looks like there is air in it now that wasn't in there when we vac sealed it.  When I squeeze it I don't hear or feel any air escaping.  I also noticed that there is some oil (I'm assuming thats what it is) from the cheese.  It is yellow and looks thicker than water.  Do you think it will still be OK or should I ditch it and try again.  It is sharp cheddar and colby jack I bought at Sam's Club if that makes a difference.
> 
> Thanks again
> 
> Wes


You are doing just fine.  Don't worry about the moisture in the vac seal.  You will be fine with this process using the hard cheeses.  Soft cheese will need to be refrigerated.

Keep an eye on it and if mold does begin to appear, carve or wash the mold off and reseal or wax. If you are not getting a good seal with your bags, rub some vegetable oil on the cheese before sealing.  This will help in keeping air from reaching the cheese.

Be patient,  you will be rewarded.

Tom


----------



## mr dirt

Hi Tom,

When you allow your cheeses to dry before sealing, typically how long do you let them rest?

Also is it necessary to oil the cheese if you are vacuum sealing them?

George


----------



## mr t 59874

Mr dirt said:


> Hi Tom,
> 
> When you allow your cheeses to dry before sealing, typically how long do you let them rest?
> 
> Also is it necessary to oil the cheese if you are vacuum sealing them?
> 
> George


Hi George,

It wouldn't hurt to coat in oil, but it isn't necessary, I don't.  Let it rest until any or all condensation has gone or if waxing let rest at least overnight up to a day.

Tom


----------



## bkleinsmid

Mr. T.........thank you so much for this thread. About 4 years ago I tried my first batch of cheddar in the smoker. It turned out so bad, I said I would never ruin a good cheese like that again. Now, after reading this thread, I can see so many things I did wrong. I have two black labs that will eat almost anything and they wouldn't touch it.

So, with this info, I'm headed to Sam's Club tomorrow. I think some cheddar and jack cheese........maybe some Colby......is in my future. Now, back to re-read this all again and book mark it. I'm excited to give this adventure another try.....

Thanks again,

Brad


----------



## hoity toit

I use the AMPS for the cold smoke,....I also add 2 foil trays of ICE on the bottom 2 racks to help keep the temp around 50 degrees. Never turn the electric on the MES on at all., AMPS N ICE is all I use. If you put the ice in a deep freeze overnight to make sure it is really really cold it will last longer,. Works for me.

Dexter


----------



## mr t 59874

bkleinsmid said:


> Mr. T.........thank you so much for this thread.  I'm excited to give this adventure another try.....
> 
> Thanks again,
> 
> Brad


Brad, If I can help, please ask.

Tom


----------



## bkleinsmid

Thanks Tom.........I will put you on speed dial.........
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






The weather here is in the 40's and 50's right now and my large offset will stay nice and cool..........not like my first try in my ECB.

My first ???........I have a nice collection of pellets for my AMNPS and yesterday I picked up some corn cob pellets. Do you think that corn would work for cheese or shall I stick with a good wood type.........and for about how long in the smoker? Is the 2 to 3 hour time about right?

Thanks,

Brad


----------



## mr t 59874

bkleinsmid said:


> Thanks Tom.........I will put you on speed dial.........
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The weather here is in the 40's and 50's right now and my large offset will stay nice and cool..........not like my first try in my ECB.
> 
> My first ???........I have a nice collection of pellets for my AMNPS and yesterday I picked up some corn cob pellets. Do you think that corn would work for cheese or shall I stick with a good wood type.........and for about how long in the smoker? Is the 2 to 3 hour time about right?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Brad


The weather is perfect for you.  If you have a good collection of pellets, try different ones, no need to smoke all of it at once.  Stretch it out and enjoy what you are doing.  Corn cob will work fine, try some on your Colby.

As for time, don't fall into the time rut.  Different weather conditions will cause any smoker to react differently.  Keep good notes and learn to judge your smokes by watching the smoke color and density, then smoke to a desired color.

Tom


----------



## bkleinsmid

Thanks again..........

I will get the cheese tomorrow but I'm sure some of it will be in the smoker by the weekend this time. The rest of it will sit for a bit. And I will be good enough to let it rest for at least a week for a sample. I will give the bulk of it until the holiday's to open.

Brad


----------



## knuckle47

Fantastic information Mr. T...thanks.  My wife and I had frequently bought cob smoked cheddar on the many years of visits to her family in the northeast kingdom.  

I am starting this process next week when local temps will be nearer to the 50's.  I am going to add a Smoke Daddy to an old whiskey barrel I have here. Is it realistic to build a series of grates inside ?  How far apart might be a good idea?  Never having cold smoked before is there something I should know about the corn cobs?  Yes they are dry...but do they get chopped up  to pellet or chip size?


----------



## mr t 59874

knuckle47 said:


> Fantastic information Mr. T...thanks. My wife and I had frequently bought cob smoked cheddar on the many years of visits to her family in the northeast kingdom.
> 
> I am starting this process next week when local temps will be nearer to the 50's. I am going to add a Smoke Daddy to an old whiskey barrel I have here. Is it realistic to build a series of grates inside ? How far apart might be a good idea? Never having cold smoked before is there something I should know about the corn cobs? Yes they are dry...but do they get chopped up to pellet or chip size?


Thank you knuckle.

The Smoke Daddy will give you plenty of smoke so keep an eye on the cheese and smoke to a desired color rather than by time.  Also watch the temperature and keep it below 80° for hard cheeses, 55° for soft.  If you have problems controlling the heat we can fix that.

Give yourself 7.62cm clearance between the top of your product to the next shelf.

Breaking the cobs up with a hammer should work.

Make a test run before putting cheese in to test the temps and burn time.

Hope this helps,

Tom


----------



## daveomak

Give yourself *7.62cm* clearance between the top of your product to the next shelf.

Tom, morning...... I thought you lived in Montana......  
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Your friend.....  Dave

EDIT........ OK ...... I see now......   NE Kingdom.......    
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





  .....


----------



## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> Give yourself *7.62cm* clearance between the top of your product to the next shelf.
> 
> Tom, morning...... I thought you lived in Montana......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Your friend.....  Dave


I do and I won't tell you how long it took me to figure that out.  
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





Tom


----------



## knuckle47

Sorry guys,  it's such a standard thing in northern Vermont it just failed to explain it...especially after all the great cheese explaining !


----------



## thatcho

Mr. T, Excellent thread it needs to be a cheese sticky for sure. I just purchased  a couple two pound blocks of colby and mild cheddar. I do not have access to a vaccum package system but have lots of ziplocks. Will the Ziplocks be suitable to allow the resting period after the smoke?  Also i have a MB 30 vertical smoker should i place the cheese starting from middle racks up or top racks only? Oh ambient temps are low forty deg. and will be using peach on one batch and alder on another along with AMNPS. All from Todd.


----------



## mr t 59874

Thatcho said:


> Mr. T, Excellent thread it needs to be a cheese sticky for sure. I just purchased  a couple two pound blocks of colby and mild cheddar. I do not have access to a vaccum package system but have lots of ziplocks. Will the Ziplocks be suitable to allow the resting period after the smoke?  Also i have a MB 30 vertical smoker should i place the cheese starting from middle racks up or top racks only? Oh ambient temps are low forty deg. and will be using peach on one batch and alder on another along with AMNPS. All from Todd.


Thatcho, thank you.

  If the cheese has moisture on it, let it rest on a rack and inside a open zip bag overnight so the moisture can dissipate.  Do not rub the moisture off as it has flavor in it that we want to keep with the cheese.

You can keep your cheese in a zip bag for short term if needed.  The down side to storing in zip bags is the bags allow oxygen in which promotes molding.  It would be better to wrap tightly in cling wrap or if you wish coat the cheese in vegetable oil and store in a plastic container along with a damp towel.  The oil will keep outside air from coming into contact with the cheese.  Recoat every couple weeks or when you cut some away. Of course waxing is always an option for the hard cheeses.

Not being familiar with the MB models, I would think if you tented the AMNPS with foil that has holes poked in it so the smoke would spread evenly, you could probably use all of the upper racks.  Keep a eye on the lower rack so it doesn't get hotter than what you want.

Enjoy your cheese.

Tom


----------



## hoity toit

forluvofsmoke said:


> Nice thread! Bumping this up so others can catch what I missed.
> 
> That settles it for me...my cheeses are getting smoke in the AM! No point in waiting when the cheese can only get better over time!
> 
> Eric


I agree totally. So much information in this thread !!


----------



## ak1

Great thread. I learned a lot.


----------



## mr t 59874

Mr T 59874 said:


> Thatcho, thank you.
> 
> If the cheese has moisture on it, let it rest on a rack and inside a open zip bag overnight so the moisture can dissipate.  Do not rub the moisture off as it has flavor in it that we want to keep with the cheese.
> 
> You can keep your cheese in a zip bag for short term if needed.  The down side to storing in zip bags is the bags allow oxygen in which promotes molding.  It would be better to wrap tightly in cling wrap or if you wish coat the cheese in vegetable oil and store in a plastic container along with a damp towel.  The oil will keep outside air from coming into contact with the cheese.  Recoat every couple weeks or when you cut some away. Of course waxing is always an option for the hard cheeses.
> 
> Not being familiar with the MB models, I would think if you tented the AMNPS with foil that has holes poked in it so the smoke would spread evenly, you could probably use all of the upper racks.  Keep a eye on the lower rack so it doesn't get hotter than what you want.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese.
> 
> Tom





Mr T 59874 said:


> Thatcho, thank you.
> 
> If the cheese has moisture on it, let it rest on a rack and inside a open zip bag overnight so the moisture can dissipate.  Do not rub the moisture off as it has flavor in it that we want to keep with the cheese.
> 
> You can keep your cheese in a zip bag for short term if needed.  The down side to storing in zip bags is the bags allow oxygen in which promotes molding.  It would be better to wrap tightly in cling wrap or if you wish coat the cheese in vegetable oil and store in a plastic container along with a damp towel.  The oil will keep outside air from coming into contact with the cheese.  Recoat every couple weeks or when you cut some away. Of course waxing is always an option for the hard cheeses.
> 
> Not being familiar with the MB models, I would think if you tented the AMNPS with foil that has holes poked in it so the smoke would spread evenly, you could probably use all of the upper racks.  Keep a eye on the lower rack so it doesn't get hotter than what you want.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese.
> 
> Tom





AK1 said:


> Great thread. I learned a lot.


Let us know how your cheese turns out.


Mr T 59874 said:


> Thatcho, thank you.
> 
> If the cheese has moisture on it, let it rest on a rack and inside a open zip bag overnight so the moisture can dissipate.  Do not rub the moisture off as it has flavor in it that we want to keep with the cheese.
> 
> You can keep your cheese in a zip bag for short term if needed.  The down side to storing in zip bags is the bags allow oxygen in which promotes molding.  It would be better to wrap tightly in cling wrap or if you wish coat the cheese in vegetable oil and store in a plastic container along with a damp towel.  The oil will keep outside air from coming into contact with the cheese.  Recoat every couple weeks or when you cut some away. Of course waxing is always an option for the hard cheeses.
> 
> Not being familiar with the MB models, I would think if you tented the AMNPS with foil that has holes poked in it so the smoke would spread evenly, you could probably use all of the upper racks.  Keep a eye on the lower rack so it doesn't get hotter than what you want.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese.
> 
> Tom





Hoity Toit said:


> I agree totally. So much information in this thread !!





Mr T 59874 said:


> Thatcho, thank you.
> 
> If the cheese has moisture on it, let it rest on a rack and inside a open zip bag overnight so the moisture can dissipate.  Do not rub the moisture off as it has flavor in it that we want to keep with the cheese.
> 
> You can keep your cheese in a zip bag for short term if needed.  The down side to storing in zip bags is the bags allow oxygen in which promotes molding.  It would be better to wrap tightly in cling wrap or if you wish coat the cheese in vegetable oil and store in a plastic container along with a damp towel.  The oil will keep outside air from coming into contact with the cheese.  Recoat every couple weeks or when you cut some away. Of course waxing is always an option for the hard cheeses.
> 
> Not being familiar with the MB models, I would think if you tented the AMNPS with foil that has holes poked in it so the smoke would spread evenly, you could probably use all of the upper racks.  Keep a eye on the lower rack so it doesn't get hotter than what you want.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese.
> 
> Tom


----------



## duffman

Great Thread. I have a question. I was going to do a cheddar cheese here in a few weeks when I have some time. after it is smoked, dried and vacuum sealed how long will it be good for in the fridge?


----------



## mr t 59874

DUFFMAN said:


> Great Thread. I have a question. I was going to do a cheddar cheese here in a few weeks when I have some time. after it is smoked, dried and vacuum sealed how long will it be good for in the fridge?


Thank you.  Don't feel that the cheddar has to be refrigerated.  Keep it at 70° or below.  As for how long it will be good for, years.

Tom


----------



## ak1

A question Mr T. I was at the store today and saw some small rounds of waxed old cheddar. But, they had a best before date. It confused me. Can it still be aged more.


----------



## ak1

OOPS. one more question. Can I age the store bought cryovacked cheddar etc in a bar fridge if the thermostat is set to it's warmest setting?


----------



## knuckle47

Hello again Mr. T,

As an update for the last 6 weeks....probably smoked 35 plus lbs of cheeses in my dedicated wine barrel cold smoker.  Thanks a bunch!  It was your amazing and inspiring post.

It has been long enough that the first few batches have matured enough to eat and giveaway to some family.  They have tasted FANTASTIC !

I look back occasionally on your post to double check on my procedures and noticed in the photos of smoked cheese, you have a picture with Gouda, Monterey Jack and Cheddar.  It looks as though the Gouda has the red "skin" still on it.  I have one like it ready to smoke, do you leave this on during the smoke and then just vac seal again when finished?

Thank you again for the excellent guidance and motivation!


----------



## mr t 59874

AK1 said:


> A question Mr T. I was at the store today and saw some small rounds of waxed old cheddar. But, they had a best before date. It confused me. Can it still be aged more.


Yes, you can age more.  If the cheese is sold as a sharp cheese and you want a sharp cheese then go by the "best by date".  If aged for a longer time, it will become extra sharp.  If you intend to age for a long period, wax it as it will age much better although I do have some that is over four years old and not smoked or waxed yet.

Tom


AK1 said:


> OOPS. one more question. Can I age the store bought cryovacked cheddar etc in a bar fridge if the thermostat is set to it's warmest setting?


The ideal aging temp is ± 52°.  Keep it between 70° and 35°.

Tom


knuckle47 said:


> Hello again Mr. T,
> 
> As an update for the last 6 weeks....probably smoked 35 plus lbs of cheeses in my dedicated wine barrel cold smoker. Thanks a bunch! It was your amazing and inspiring post.
> 
> It has been long enough that the first few batches have matured enough to eat and giveaway to some family. They have tasted FANTASTIC !
> 
> I look back occasionally on your post to double check on my procedures and noticed in the photos of smoked cheese, you have a picture with Gouda, Monterey Jack and Cheddar. It looks as though the Gouda has the red "skin" still on it. I have one like it ready to smoke, do you leave this on during the smoke and then just vac seal again when finished?
> 
> Thank you again for the excellent guidance and motivation!


Glad you are enjoying your cheese and am proud that I could help.  The Gouda that I smoke is cut into wedges so I smoke with the wax on.

Tom


----------



## nola saints smoker

Well, I guess this will be my next adventure. I do like cheddar and mozz so will probably try those maybe this weekend. I don't have a vac sealer yet so will just put in a zip lock as outlined by Mr T. I also don't have any fruit woods- i only have pecan pellets and a pellet mix I bought from Lowes. I've used both for beef sticks and neither produces a heavy smoke taste so I assume either will be good for the cheese.

Eddie


----------



## daveomak

Nola Saints Smoker said:


> Well, I guess this will be my next adventure. I do like cheddar and mozz so will probably try those maybe this weekend. I don't have a vac sealer yet so will just put in a zip lock as outlined by Mr T. I also don't have any fruit woods- i only have pecan pellets and a pellet mix I bought from Lowes. I've used both for beef sticks and neither produces a heavy smoke taste so I assume either will be good for the cheese.
> Eddie





Tightly wrap with plastic wrap before putting in the zip bags...   If you take the cheese out to cut some....  re wrap the left cheese with new plastic wrap...   helps to stop the mold growth.....    Dave


----------



## spacetrucker

great thread, I have smoked a lot of cheese and very much enjoyed reading this thread,  I am quite sure I learned several things.













smoking cheese.JPG



__ spacetrucker
__ Feb 2, 2014


















smokin cheese.JPG



__ spacetrucker
__ Feb 2, 2014


----------



## nola saints smoker

I'm a bit confused about storage. Since I don't have a vac sealer yet, I will have to wrap in saran and then in a zip lock bag. This weekend, I will smoke a 1lb block of cheddar and either a 1lb block of mozz or hot pepper. My plan is to cut each block in half and cold smoke half of each for 1 hr and the other half for 2 hrs.

From reading this post, I should remove from the smoker and allow to sit on the counter then wrap.

My confusion is do I wrap the cheese in saran and leave on the counter for a week, two weeks or more?

When do I place the cheese in a zip lock bag?

When do I place in the fridge?

My fridge stays at a temp between 36-40 degrees and I've noticed items on the top rack sometimes have moisture form in the containers or bags. I've also seen cheese form mold in my fridge, which I assume is from the moisture in the bags.

We eat cheese often but usually not everyday so I want to make sure the cheese does not go bad.

Thanks

Eddie


----------



## mr t 59874

Nola Saints Smoker said:


> I'm a bit confused about storage. Since I don't have a vac sealer yet, I will have to wrap in saran and then in a zip lock bag. This weekend, I will smoke a 1lb block of cheddar and either a 1lb block of mozz or hot pepper. My plan is to cut each block in half and cold smoke half of each for 1 hr and the other half for 2 hrs.
> 
> From reading this post, I should remove from the smoker and allow to sit on the counter then wrap.
> 
> My confusion is do I wrap the cheese in saran and leave on the counter for a week, two weeks or more?
> 
> When do I place the cheese in a zip lock bag?
> 
> When do I place in the fridge?
> 
> My fridge stays at a temp between 36-40 degrees and I've noticed items on the top rack sometimes have moisture form in the containers or bags. I've also seen cheese form mold in my fridge, which I assume is from the moisture in the bags.
> 
> We eat cheese often but usually not everyday so I want to make sure the cheese does not go bad.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Eddie


Eddie,  When smoking your cheese, take note on the type and amount of wood being used along with the color and density of the smoke and of coarse the time.  It will be invaluable info in the future.

The reason for letting the cheese set open on the counter is to allow any moisture that may have accumulated to evaporate, do not wipe off.  If it is dry, you can go ahead and wrap.  If wrapped tightly, a zip bag really isn't needed.  The idea is to keep air from reaching the cheese which will promote mold growth. To help with this, you may want to coat it with a little vegetable oil prior to wrapping or of coarse you can wax hard cheeses such as your cheddar.

You may leave the cheddar or other hard cheeses on the counter (under 70°) until consumed, no need to refrigerate as many think, the mozz and pepper jack, I would put in the fridge (55°- 34°).

Hopefully this has helped answer your questions, if I can help further, please ask.

Enjoy your cheese and have fun.  Let us know here how it turns out.

Tom


----------



## nola saints smoker

Mr T 59874 said:


> Eddie,  When smoking your cheese, take note on the type and amount of wood being used along with the color and density of the smoke and of coarse the time.  It will be invaluable info in the future.
> 
> The reason for letting the cheese set open on the counter is to allow any moisture that may have accumulated to evaporate, do not wipe off.  If it is dry, you can go ahead and wrap.  If wrapped tightly, a zip bag really isn't needed.  The idea is to keep air from reaching the cheese which will promote mold growth. To help with this, you may want to coat it with a little vegetable oil prior to wrapping or of coarse you can wax hard cheeses such as your cheddar.
> 
> You may leave the cheddar or other hard cheeses on the counter (under 70°) until consumed, no need to refrigerate as many think, the mozz and pepper jack, I would put in the fridge (55°- 34°).
> 
> Hopefully this has helped answer your questions, if I can help further, please ask.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese and have fun.  Let us know here how it turns out.
> 
> Tom


Thank you Mr T. I apprecaite your help. Great write up.

 As for the wax, do you simply melt it and dip the cheese in it? Not familiar with the process.

I don't have any fruit woods so I will be using pecan pellets. I find the flavor is fairly mild. I do have a mix of pellets that I picked up from Lowes. I can't remember which type of woods are used but I think it does have some fruit woods in it.


----------



## knuckle47

Hi Eddie,

If I can add a comment on the vacuum sealer.  My wife an I bought a food saver brand at Sam's club over 10 years ago.  Initially we used it a bit but with the first month, we found it took up counter space and we may have been too lazy to wrap it up an place it in a cabinet.  Just silly stuff but it had gotten a bit odd having 40% of the stuff in the refrigerator/freezer in those seal bags.

It sat in the cabinet for 5 yrs, unused.  Occasionally we would use it on sale priced chicken or beef that we couldn't pass up on price.  It does an excellent job keeping the air out and the product fresh.  If you had a block of cheese, seal it back up and it was good for a very long time.

Here it is 5 yrs later and I am finding my self smoking foods.  Now that thing has become invaluable.  I have about 55lbs of cheese in the fridge( only because I know once April comes, no more cheese smoking )that is so tightly sealed, I know it will last for a very long time.  When I take one out of the drawer, it is packed of wonderfully, I don't fear having too much on hand that might go bad.

I now have no choice but to use the sealer more frequently on other foods in the house that prematurely mold up or sour and it has actually saved us money by extending the usage of some foods. ( like the ads say)

If you going to find yourself in cheese smoking long term, I can't recommend it more.  Let it be known, after the first few years, I knew we had just threw away $139.00.  Now, i am glad we have it.

Good luck with your cheese.  Since starting in December, I know have a wide variety of cheeses and smoke flavors to choose from as they are "coming of age"


----------



## nola saints smoker

knuckle47 said:


> Hi Eddie,
> 
> If I can add a comment on the vacuum sealer. My wife an I bought a food saver brand at Sam's club over 10 years ago. Initially we used it a bit but with the first month, we found it took up counter space and we may have been too lazy to wrap it up an place it in a cabinet. Just silly stuff but it had gotten a bit odd having 40% of the stuff in the refrigerator/freezer in those seal bags.
> 
> It sat in the cabinet for 5 yrs, unused. Occasionally we would use it on sale priced chicken or beef that we couldn't pass up on price. It does an excellent job keeping the air out and the product fresh. If you had a block of cheese, seal it back up and it was good for a very long time.
> 
> Here it is 5 yrs later and I am finding my self smoking foods. Now that thing has become invaluable. I have about 55lbs of cheese in the fridge( only because I know once April comes, no more cheese smoking )that is so tightly sealed, I know it will last for a very long time. When I take one out of the drawer, it is packed of wonderfully, I don't fear having too much on hand that might go bad.
> 
> I now have no choice but to use the sealer more frequently on other foods in the house that prematurely mold up or sour and it has actually saved us money by extending the usage of some foods. ( like the ads say)
> 
> If you going to find yourself in cheese smoking long term, I can't recommend it more. Let it be known, after the first few years, I knew we had just threw away $139.00. Now, i am glad we have it.
> 
> Good luck with your cheese. Since starting in December, I know have a wide variety of cheeses and smoke flavors to choose from as they are "coming of age"


Thank you for the info. This weekend will be my first time smoking cheese. To be honest, I've only tried smoked cheddar and that was bought at Wally World two years ago while on vacation in FL. It was actually really good. I've been reading these cheese threads for a while now and have always wanted to try smoking my own cheese since I've been smoking meats for a few years now. I just never had a way of getting smoke in my smoker without using heat. Now I have an Amazen Prod tube smoker and been using that.

As for the vac sealer, I'm leaning towards the VacMaster 110. it's the smaller and cheapest in their line but figured it would serve the purpose for what I will use it for. And that will be to vac seal pulled pork, sausage, chicken and cheese.


----------



## nola saints smoker

knuckle47 said:


> Hi Eddie,
> 
> If I can add a comment on the vacuum sealer. My wife an I bought a food saver brand at Sam's club over 10 years ago. Initially we used it a bit but with the first month, we found it took up counter space and we may have been too lazy to wrap it up an place it in a cabinet. Just silly stuff but it had gotten a bit odd having 40% of the stuff in the refrigerator/freezer in those seal bags.
> 
> It sat in the cabinet for 5 yrs, unused. Occasionally we would use it on sale priced chicken or beef that we couldn't pass up on price. It does an excellent job keeping the air out and the product fresh. If you had a block of cheese, seal it back up and it was good for a very long time.
> 
> Here it is 5 yrs later and I am finding my self smoking foods. Now that thing has become invaluable. I have about 55lbs of cheese in the fridge( only because I know once April comes, no more cheese smoking )that is so tightly sealed, I know it will last for a very long time. When I take one out of the drawer, it is packed of wonderfully, I don't fear having too much on hand that might go bad.
> 
> I now have no choice but to use the sealer more frequently on other foods in the house that prematurely mold up or sour and it has actually saved us money by extending the usage of some foods. ( like the ads say)
> 
> If you going to find yourself in cheese smoking long term, I can't recommend it more. Let it be known, after the first few years, I knew we had just threw away $139.00. Now, i am glad we have it.
> 
> Good luck with your cheese. Since starting in December, I know have a wide variety of cheeses and smoke flavors to choose from as they are "coming of age"


Forgot to add, I only have a couple months to cold smoke cheese as it will start warming up here in the South around Mar/Apr. There will be a few days of cool weather through May but for the most part it will start getting HOT and HUMID. My plan is to get a few blocks smoked between now and Mar/Apr and that should last until the fall.


----------



## mr t 59874

Nola Saints Smoker said:


> Thank you Mr T. I apprecaite your help. Great write up.
> 
> As for the wax, do you simply melt it and dip the cheese in it? Not familiar with the process.
> 
> I don't have any fruit woods so I will be using pecan pellets. I find the flavor is fairly mild. I do have a mix of pellets that I picked up from Lowes. I can't remember which type of woods are used but I think it does have some fruit woods in it.


Your welcome,  It is vital that you use cheese wax, no other will work.  It can normally be purchased at wine and beer hobby shops as they usually carry cheese making supplies.  The wax can be dipped or brushed on.  The process is covered in this thread.

You will enjoy smoking using different woods as you don't need to smoke it all at once.  Take your time and experiment, it will all be good, just some will better than other although what you don't care for, someone else may like.

Tom


----------



## shelterit

Mr. T, I found this thread back in September and have been smoking cheese ever since trying to stock up for the long hot summer.  The smoked cheese quickly justified the cost of the smoker to the wife. She absolutely loves the cheese. I just wanted to say thank you for your in depth tutorial it has been very helpful. Now that the holidays are over the cheese stock is starting to come back up.

Nola SS, Just like Knuckle I had a food saver for about 10 years that I rarely used. It was the cheapest version and a PITA to use.  Well as soon as I needed it for the cheese wouldn't you know it, it broke.  So after a ton of research I bought the FoodSaver V4880 and still cant believe I dropped $200 on it but it has been worth every penny.  The greatest feature is the little handle sealer that vacs the air out of the Fresh Saver bags (ZipLocks with a valve built in) We use it just about daily. just my 2 cents.


----------



## driedstick

shelterit said:


> Mr. T, I found this thread back in September and have been smoking cheese ever since trying to stock up for the long hot summer.  The smoked cheese quickly justified the cost of the smoker to the wife. She absolutely loves the cheese. I just wanted to say thank you for your in depth tutorial it has been very helpful. Now that the holidays are over the cheese stock is starting to come back up.
> 
> Nola SS, Just like Knuckle I had a food saver for about 10 years that I rarely used. It was the cheapest version and a PITA to use.  Well as soon as I needed it for the cheese wouldn't you know it, it broke.  So after a ton of research I bought the FoodSaver V4880 and still cant believe I dropped $200 on it but it has been worth every penny.  The greatest feature is the little handle sealer that vacs the air out of the Fresh Saver bags (ZipLocks with a valve built in) We use it just about daily. just my 2 cents.


 Yeppers great thread,  Gosh smoked cheese goes so fast around here - glad the mrs okay'd the smoker LOL


----------



## bruno2014

Thank you so much for this article!! I, like another poster here tried smoking some cheese in a Little Chief a few years ago. What a disaster it was. One bite of it and I ended up spitting it out!I thought I just didn't have the right "magic" to do it right. I told myself I would never waste good cheese again!

Then I happened upon this article and it gave me the desire to try it again. I learned so much. Thank you for sharing your (I suspect) hard earned tips.
I realized that I did so many things wrong and that cheese smoking is different that meat and fish. 

I am currently impatiently waiting for my batch of cheese to age!

Thank you! And good smoking to you! Thumbs Up


----------



## thatcho

Sorry for the late reply. Allowed my cheese to rest for two weeks wrapped in Saran Wrap in the fridge. Cut up into small squares served with same size pieces of ham and turkey. Served as appetizer before Christmas dinner. Went fast! Took some to work and now making a batch for some guys at work. Thank you Mr. T.


----------



## thatcho

Mr.T 59874, just recently smoked some Havarti and Gouda. Both are a first with this types of cheese. I allowed to rest overnight on counter thn vaccum sealed and placed in my basement. Stays round 55 deg. I noticed some moisture in only the pack of Gouda what should i do? Any adice is appreciated.


----------



## mr t 59874

Your fine, just place in fridge.


----------



## thatcho

Thnk u Mr.T 59874.


----------



## djstight

I just posting so I don't lose this thread.  Nice work Mr. T


----------



## daveomak

djstight said:


> I just posting so I don't lose this thread.  Nice work Mr. T




djs....   below the post is a yellow star....   click on it to follow the thread...  or unfollow...


----------



## djstight

perfect...thanks


----------



## mr t 59874

Thank you djs, have fun and enjoy your smoked cheese.  Now is the time to smoke for the holidays.  Try waxing for that extra special gift.

Tom


----------



## themule69

Mr T 59874 said:


> Thank you djs, have fun and enjoy your smoked cheese.  Now is the time to smoke for the holidays.  Try waxing for that extra special gift.
> 
> Tom


I have been trying to stock up on cheese for a couple of years.













20140328_161744.jpg



__ themule69
__ Mar 28, 2014


















20140328_161753.jpg



__ themule69
__ Mar 28, 2014






I started using a food saver and a Weber kettle. (everyone should own a kettle)













smoked cheese 19.JPG



__ themule69
__ May 3, 2013


















cheese may 10.JPG



__ themule69
__ May 3, 2013






Then I moved up to a AMNPS and a UDS. ( Todd at A-MAZE-N-PRODUCTS is also a sponsor here)













cheese may 4.JPG



__ themule69
__ May 3, 2013






This was in the beginning. I thought I was smoking a lot of cheese.













cheese may 1.JPG



__ themule69
__ May 3, 2013






The first time I took some smoked cheese as a dish I was kind of looked at like my cheese just flew off of my cracker or 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






.  

Now after a few years of Face book post of my cheese smokes and a little word getting around I am smoking a little more cheese at a time. I now do about 25 LBS at a time several times a year. I am also using a MES 40 instead of the UDS for a vessel. ( I do still have and use my UDS)













20140327_091818.jpg



__ themule69
__ Mar 27, 2014






Well with all good thing their comes an end. The 2 Foodsavers Got to where I had to work on one while I was working with the other.

So you know how things work! I once again had to take it to the next level.  ( if I had used the wax that I bought or the bee's wax that I have from my bee's I might have been OK for a while)

So I found a deal on a chamber sealer. It was a Vac-Master 













vacmaster vp112 2.jpg



__ themule69
__ Dec 25, 2013


















vacmaster vp12.jpg



__ themule69
__ Dec 25, 2013






I bought 4000 bags from Lisa at Vacuum Sealers Unlimited ( a sponsor here)

No pic.
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





.  I am about out now.

So now is where I say "Thank YOU MR T" do you have any idea how much this thread has cost me???

I had a friend drop by yesterday to get a block of cheese to give as a gift.  He was in the first round or

people thinking "my cheese must of just flown off of my cracker" I was smoking cheese before I read this

thread. With your help I have made it this far in the smoked cheese world. Next step is to make my own

cheese. I always smile every time this tread come around 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





.







Happy smoken.

David


----------



## driedstick

Nice Mule, Yes this thread is the bomb, when anyone is wanting to know or starting with cheese I always throw them this link. Mr T is the "MAN"!!

What did that Vac Master run you? Was it used? 

A full fridge of cheese is a happy fridge

DS


----------



## mr t 59874

So now is where I say "Thank YOU MR T" do you have any idea how much this thread has cost me???

I had a friend drop by yesterday to get a block of cheese to give as a gift.  He was in the first round or

people thinking "my cheese must of just flown off of my cracker" I was smoking cheese before I read this

thread. With your help I have made it this far in the smoked cheese world. Next step is to make my own

cheese. I always smile every time this tread come around 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





themule69, Well you are welcome.  Have you tried convincing yourself, sometimes Christmas comes early?

Great pics, I must say " I'm proud of you".

You will like Lisa's bags.

Later,

Tom


----------



## themule69

driedstick said:


> Nice Mule, Yes this thread is the bomb, when anyone is wanting to know or starting with cheese I always throw them this link. Mr T is the "MAN"!!
> 
> What did that Vac Master run you? Was it used?
> 
> A full fridge of cheese is a happy fridge
> 
> DS


I don't remember. It was a new open box return. I don't remember how much it was. I am thinking around 500.00

I look at the fridge as half empty. I am wanting to buy a wine fridge for my cheese. I will find one someday. I will probably blame that on this tread as well.

Happy smoken.

David


----------



## themule69

Mr T 59874 said:


> So now is where I say "Thank YOU MR T" do you have any idea how much this thread has cost me???
> 
> I had a friend drop by yesterday to get a block of cheese to give as a gift.  He was in the first round or
> 
> people thinking "my cheese must of just flown off of my cracker" I was smoking cheese before I read this
> 
> thread. With your help I have made it this far in the smoked cheese world. Next step is to make my own
> 
> cheese. I always smile every time this tread come around
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> themule69, Well you are welcome.  Have you tried convincing yourself, sometimes Christmas comes early?
> 
> Great pics, I must say " I'm proud of you".
> 
> You will like Lisa's bags.
> 
> Later,
> 
> Tom


HMMM maybe a wine fridge for keeping cheese at 60° for early Christmas 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





.

Happy smoken.

David


----------



## oregon smoker

to all,

watch the ones with two temps and you can build them into a cabinet. ours was good ( two temps ) but would freeze up due to circulation. needed to turn down and throttle back on it. then the temps were off. it was a Vino Temp great unit just not good for our application. just a heads up for what you look for. the new unit is a vino temp but different installation in the new ranch and performing fine.

Tom


----------



## socal mesmoker

Wanted to bump up this thread so that other first timers like myself can get some of the knowledge that I received just from reading this thread.  Another round of cheeses are coming in the very near future!  Thanks Mr. T!

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/172565/smoked-cheese-first

Shed


----------



## nrdk

Going to give smoked cheese/butter a try for a first time tonight, bought blocks of mild and sharp cheddar, mozz, pepper jack, colby, monterey jack, and some butter all to throw in the smoker.

Nice and chilly here in Iowa, so they'll go in the MES30 (unplugged) with the AMPNS.

Plan of attack:

Cut 1lb blocks of cheese/butter in half length wise, keeping good space between blocks. Smoke 3 to 4 hours with AMPNS, keeping interior temp under 75 degrees and rotating racks every 30 minutes and flipping cheese/butter every hour.

Now, the one thing I've got a bit of confusion on is letting the cheese dry after it comes from the smoker. I've seen a couple different opinions, but the general consensus seems to be to put *on a rack* in slightly open 2gal zip bags with a spacer to keep the plastic off the cheese, overnight or for a few hours prior to vac sealing?

Once vac sealed, best to age for a bare minimum of 2 weeks in a cool place (thinking basement, as it stays consistently around mid 60s).


----------



## socal mesmoker

nrdk,

Sounds like you've got a good game plan which was similar to what I had mapped out.  Yes, put your cheese on a rack inside the slightly opened zip bag so the cheese does not touch the bag at least overnight or when there is no more moisture on your cheese.  Then you can vacuum seal.  You can store your cheese in a cool place or in the refrigerator for at least 2 weeks.

I'm planning on doing my 2nd round of cheese this weekend since a lot of it was consumed during Thanksgiving.  I learned from my first mistakes so I think this time around will go much smoother.  Keep notes since that will allow you to perfect your cheese craft!

Shed


----------



## mr t 59874

Yes, you are good to go.  As SoCal mentioned , once the moisture, if any has evaporated, it may be sealed or waxed for longer storage.

Keep a close eye on the internal temp as the AMNPS does put more heat out than one would expect, especially if placed in a insulated collector.

No need to flip the cheese.  If you are changing racks because of the heat, try to refrain from doing so even if you have to smoke again as you are constantly allowing the smoke to escape.  Not only will your product be done sooner, you wont be putting all your eggs in the same basket.

Keep track of the time, but learn how to smoke to a desired color for each of your cheeses.  Note the ambient and the internal collector temperature along with the smoke density and color. 

The basement should be fine, but keep an eye on it to insure good seals.  

Take your time and have fun.  No need to make a job out of it. If heat becomes a problem, it can easily be taken care of.

Enjoy,

Tom


----------



## nrdk

image.jpg



__ nrdk
__ Dec 2, 2014






Top: 1 lb Monterey jack, 1 lb extra sharp cheddar, 1 lb butter split in half

Bottom: 1 lb Colby, 1 lb Pepperjack, 1 lb Mozzerela, 1 lb Sharp Cheddar

Got it started about a half hour ago, thanks for the help guys. Not going to touch it until 10.

Got the AMNPS loaded with a row and a half of the smokedaddy perfect mix and a beer cracked to wait it out.


----------



## nrdk

Thoughts on how/best way to rest the butter after smoke?


----------



## mr t 59874

nrdk said:


> Thoughts on how/best way to rest the butter after smoke?


 When smoking blocks of butter, I simply, carefully unwrap then replace after smoking.   The following will give you an idea as to how I normally smoke butter. 

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/142289/smoked-butter-from-scratch-q-view-updated-6-14-2013

Tom


----------



## nrdk

Took butter out after hour and a half, couldn't resist trying it even after telling myself not to, just as disgusting as everyone says. Wrapped back up, placed in ziploc, sealed, and placed in fridge for some time.

Cheese looking good, had to open the door for a bit to cool back down. Added a bag of ice to help regulate temp













image.jpg



__ nrdk
__ Dec 2, 2014


----------



## nrdk

Pulled at 3 and a half hours












image.jpg



__ nrdk
__ Dec 2, 2014






Using wine corks between the racks to keep the plastic off, gotta say smoke smell is strong enough to give me a headache. Really hope that mellows out in the next few weeks.













image.jpg



__ nrdk
__ Dec 2, 2014


















image.jpg



__ nrdk
__ Dec 2, 2014


----------



## mr t 59874

Looking good so far.  With the amount of smoke you are using, try smoking your butter for fifteen minutes and adjust from there.  So many oversmoke products for whatever reason then complain about the process or equipment. They are then discouraged from trying something new again at their loss.  Start out with short durations and build from there and keep good notes.

Tom


----------



## nrdk

Mr T 59874 said:


> Looking good so far.  With the amount of smoke you are using, try smoking your butter for fifteen minutes and adjust from there.  So many oversmoke products for whatever reason then complain about the process or equipment. They are then discouraged from trying something new again at their loss.  Start out with short durations and build from there and keep good notes.
> 
> Tom


Thinking that would have been best, but what's done is done. Will give it a few weeks before trying the butter again.

Checked the cheese this AM prior to work, was dry so went ahead and vac sealed all individually and placed in basement, sitting at around 68 degrees when checked this morning.

Thanks for all the invaluable help Tom, hoping here in a couple weeks it'll be well mellowed in time for Christmas baskets.


----------



## daveomak

nrdk said:


> Thinking that would have been best, but what's done is done. Will give it a few weeks before trying the butter again.
> 
> Checked the cheese this AM prior to work, was dry so went ahead and vac sealed all individually and placed in basement, sitting at around 68 degrees when checked this morning.
> 
> 
> Thanks for all the invaluable help Tom, hoping here in a couple weeks it'll be well mellowed in time for Christmas baskets.




nrdk, morning....    Personally, I would not stored vacuum packed cheese at room temperature....   The possibility of botulism toxin is present....   It may be a small possibility but it's still there....    Age it in the refer at 38 or below...


----------



## nrdk

DaveOmak said:


> nrdk, morning.... Personally, I would not stored vacuum packed cheese at room temperature.... The possibility of botulism toxin is present.... It may be a small possibility but it's still there.... Age it in the refer at 38 or below...


Yea, funny you should mention that, SWMBO thought the same thing, came across it this morning after I left for work and moved it to the fridge, texted me asking why I went to all the work just to forget the cheese in the basement


----------



## daveomak

Good partner to have....   hang on to her....   she's worth it.....


----------



## biggqwesty

What a top read Mr T and all who have contributed. 
I'm going to do the letter box mod to my keg smoker for cold smokes, but would like some done for Christmas..

One question though. How the hell do you keep it for 12 years??? That would kill me lol.. 

But on a serious not I'm thinking of wax covering the cheese as presentation plays a big part.. Is it safe to apply a simple sticker to the wax for id reasons?
Or should I be tying a tag to it with string??

Thanks again


----------



## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> nrdk, morning.... Personally, I would not stored vacuum packed cheese at room temperature.... The possibility of botulism toxin is present.... It may be a small possibility but it's still there.... Age it in the refer at 38 or below...


nrdk,  I am not going to get into a long discussion about botulism on this thread or on this forum, but there are a few things that one should understand about it. Bot spores are present in everything we eat.  It takes a certain environment for them to grow and become hazardous.  Some think that if a product is simply absent of oxygen it is heaven for bot spores.  I have even seen on this forum that closing the lid on a grill is dangerous.  A couple things that must be considered in inhibiting bot spores in cheese is acidity and pH which is never mentioned.  If botulism is a concern, do research on it.  

Talk to a reputable cheese monger and ask why they refrigerate there hard cheeses and they will most likely tell you that it is a general perception here in the United States that cheese must be refrigerated and many won't buy it if it is setting out.  Just think of all the Old World cheese around the world that is aged in caves at temps in the 50° range.  In short, store your cheese at whatever temperature you feel comfortable with. 

Tom


----------



## daveomak

For what it's worth....  excerpt from the link below.....  Spores can be picked up on your kitchen counter from root veggies or darn near anything else....    The  possibility is very rare... 


Cheese and other dairy products can also be contaminated with the bacterium.  For example, in 1999, researchers in Rome, Italy, reported testing 1,017 commercially produced mascarpone cheese samples, as well as 260 samples from other dairy products.  Of the mascarpone samples, 331 samples, or 33%, tested positive for botulinum spores.  The 7 samples previously identified as being involved in an outbreak of foodborne botulism were contaminated with type A botulism.  Of the other dairy products, 11 samples tested positive for spores.  The researchers determined that, for mascarpone cheese, at 28 degrees C ( 82 degrees F), the bacterium germinated after 3 days and produced toxins on the fourth day. 


http://www.tarakharper.com/b_botuln.htm

http://annals.org/article.aspx?articleid=710035


----------



## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> For what it's worth.... excerpt from the link below..... Spores can be picked up on your kitchen counter from root veggies or darn near anything else.... The possibility is very rare...
> 
> 
> Cheese and other dairy products can also be contaminated with the bacterium. For example, in 1999, researchers in Rome, Italy, reported testing 1,017 commercially produced mascarpone cheese samples, as well as 260 samples from other dairy products. Of the mascarpone samples, 331 samples, or 33%, tested positive for botulinum spores. The 7 samples previously identified as being involved in an outbreak of foodborne botulism were contaminated with type A botulism. Of the other dairy products, 11 samples tested positive for spores. The researchers determined that, for mascarpone cheese, at 28 degrees C ( 82 degrees F), the bacterium germinated after 3 days and produced toxins on the fourth day.
> 
> 
> http://www.tarakharper.com/b_botuln.htm
> 
> http://annals.org/article.aspx?articleid=710035


Morning Dave,  Mascarpone is a very soft cheese, not at all what I would age at warmer temps. 

Tom


----------



## mr t 59874

BigGQWesty said:


> What a top read Mr T and all who have contributed.
> I'm going to do the letter box mod to my keg smoker for cold smokes, but would like some done for Christmas..
> 
> One question though. How the hell do you keep it for 12 years??? That would kill me lol..
> 
> But on a serious not I'm thinking of wax covering the cheese as presentation plays a big part.. Is it safe to apply a simple sticker to the wax for id reasons?
> Or should I be tying a tag to it with string??
> 
> Thanks again


Thank you.

Your mod will help you very much. There are so many things that can be cold smoked.

It's difficult to store cheese for long periods, but well worth it.  As your inventory builds though, it gets somewhat easier.

 Apply three coats, one hot and the others cooler, after applying the second coat, place your sticker while the wax is still tacky.  When the third coat is applied your sticker will be secured.

Enjoy your cheese.

Tom


----------



## daveomak

Tom, morning....    Those links and other stuff were for folks that skim over stuff... you probably have helped a few that read a post and only read every other word....   This morning on another forum, I was dealing with a person about a very contagious disease....  He had lived in NE India and moved to the states....  I asked where he lived, and another member wrote me and said, "He told you he lived in India"...   

Sooo, anyway, that is where that came from.....  Someone could have skipped over "HARD" cheese and thought "CHEESE" ....  It happens all the time....    Like, I will cure this pig leg in 120 Ppm nitrite and hang it for 6 months....   It's OK for brined bacon so it should be good for a ham leg....    Some folks don't understand the devil is in the details....


----------



## bwsmith_2000

Mr. T,

     I know that this post has been up for a while.  But I have just decided that I want to smoke some cheese. Your post is inspiring. I have just cleaned up the smoker and with the cooler weather, I'm ready to start the smoke. I'm definitely going to put some limburger in with the smoke. I like your description of the 12 year old. Sincere thanks for the post. I'm going to kick off tomorrow morning.

Bill


----------



## mr t 59874

bwsmith_2000 said:


> Mr. T,
> 
> I know that this post has been up for a while.  But I have just decided that I want to smoke some cheese. Your post is inspiring. I have just cleaned up the smoker and with the cooler weather, I'm ready to start the smoke. I'm definitely going to put some limburger in with the smoke. I like your description of the 12 year old. Sincere thanks for the post. I'm going to kick off tomorrow morning.
> 
> Bill


Bill, Thank you.  Keep the temp as low as you can with the limburger.  Carefully unwrap it and you can put it back in the same wrapper and refrigerate.

Let us know how it goes.

Have fun,

Tom


----------



## biggqwesty

Quick question for the pros. 
I understand the rest in slightly open bag over night, but I want to leave a batch for a month. 
Do we seal the cheese up after the days rest or leave it slightly open for a few weeks??


----------



## mr t 59874

BigGQWesty said:


> Quick question for the pros.
> I understand the rest in slightly open bag over night, but I want to leave a batch for a month.
> Do we seal the cheese up after the days rest or leave it slightly open for a few weeks??


The rest period is to allow any moisture if any to evaporate.  Once there is no longer any moisture present, it may be sealed.

Tom


----------



## biggqwesty

Thanks.


----------



## nrdk

Anyone know a good pairing guide for smoked cheese? Including various chunks of the cheeses I smoked a couple weeks ago in gift baskets to family for the holidays, and would like to have a card suggesting good wine pairs if possible.

1 lb Colby

1 lb Pepperjack

1 lb Mozzerela

1 lb Sharp Cheddar

1 lb Monterey jack

1 lb extra sharp cheddar

Thanks in advance


----------



## mr t 59874

This should help you.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...0rxNe1j-dXiR4m2FDewxeqw&bvm=bv.81828268,d.cGU

Tom


----------



## nrdk

Mr T 59874 said:


> This should help you.
> 
> http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...0rxNe1j-dXiR4m2FDewxeqw&bvm=bv.81828268,d.cGU
> 
> Tom


Thanks for the link, makes for interesting reading, was just curious if anyone had a personal 'updated' list given the smokey goodness we impart.


----------



## biggqwesty

Hey guys. Have a small question. 
When I was doing my first batch yesterday I noticed the cheese i pulled after the 2 hour mark was remarkably more oily then the 1 hr and 3hr smokes. 
Is this something I should be concerned with or is it all ok..


----------



## mr t 59874

BigGQWesty said:


> Hey guys. Have a small question.
> When I was doing my first batch yesterday I noticed the cheese i pulled after the 2 hour mark was remarkably more oily then the 1 hr and 3hr smokes.
> Is this something I should be concerned with or is it all ok..


You are fine.  The internal smoker temp may have gotten a little high causing the sweat before settling down and the moisture evaporating.

Enjoy,

Tom


----------



## freakynorm

I have a question. Once the cheese is smoked and you leave it in a bag with a slight opening. Say you get a bit of moisture on the cheese. Should you wipe it off or air dry it? Once it is dry, and you vacuum seal it, can you put it in the fridge or should you leave it at room temp still?


----------



## mr t 59874

freakynorm said:


> I have a question. Once the cheese is smoked and you leave it in a bag with a slight opening. Say you get a bit of moisture on the cheese. Should you wipe it off or air dry it? Once it is dry, and you vacuum seal it, can you put it in the fridge or should you leave it at room temp still?


The opening does not require to be slight,  we do want the moisture to escape.  Hard chesses are the only ones to be left at 70° or less while the moisture evaporates, the softer chesses must be refrigerated during this process.  Do not wipe the moisture off, you are removing what you just put on.  After it is vacuum sealed it may be refrigerated and most prefer to do so, no problem at all, but further aging is slowed.  Hard cheese may be left, unwaxed, at the warmer temps for a short time, but the opportunity for mold growth is increased by doing so.  If you would like your cheese to age further, keep it in the range of 45-55°.  If you are considering freezing the cheese, keep in mind that although mold growth will be eliminated, further aging will cease.

Enjoy,

Tom


----------



## snorkelinggirl

Every time I visit this thread, I learn more about cold smoking cheese.  Thanks for a great thread, Tom!

Clarissa


----------



## la122685

Mr. T,

Sorry if this has been asked, I read through this thread a little bit ago and don't recall now.  When you age your cheese, you do this before you smoke it?

Thanks.


----------



## mr t 59874

la122685 said:


> Mr. T,
> 
> Sorry if this has been asked, I read through this thread a little bit ago and don't recall now.  When you age your cheese, you do this before you smoke it?
> 
> Thanks.


No problem as it's a very good question.

Actually it can be aged both before and after smoking and vac sealing or waxing.  Wax for longer periods.  The average age of my fresh cheese is 4 years.  Normally I smoke 5# blocks so, some normally gets put back for further aging.  Very rarely do I consume fresh smoked cheese prior to 3 or 4 months. 

Curds though are consumed as early as shortly after they come out of the smoker.  In order to do this, a very clean and smooth smoke is required.

Hope this answers your questions.

Enjoy your cheese.

Tom


----------



## la122685

Mr T 59874 said:


> No problem as it's a very good question.
> 
> Actually it can be aged both before and after smoking and vac sealing or waxing.  Wax for longer periods.  The average age of my fresh cheese is 4 years.  Normally I smoke 5# blocks so, some normally gets put back for further aging.  Very rarely do I consume fresh smoked cheese prior to 3 or 4 months.
> 
> Curds though are consumed as early as shortly after they come out of the smoker.  In order to do this, a very clean and smooth smoke is required.
> 
> Hope this answers your questions.
> 
> Enjoy your cheese.
> 
> Tom


Thanks buddy.  That answer's my question. 

I smoked several different cheeses and let them sit for about 2 months before I started eating them.  Don't get to much cold weather down here in Miami, so gotta take advantage of these little fronts that come in to get a couple more batches going.  Give me a chance to let some age longer as well.  

Great write up by the way!


----------



## mr t 59874

la122685 said:


> Thanks buddy.  That answer's my question.
> 
> I smoked several different cheeses and let them sit for about 2 months before I started eating them.  Don't get to much cold weather down here in Miami, so gotta take advantage of these little fronts that come in to get a couple more batches going.  Give me a chance to let some age longer as well.
> 
> Great write up by the way!


Hope you and our other Southern friends are able to take advantage of this cold front.  
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Tom


----------



## daveomak

Mr T 59874 said:


> Hope you and our other Southern friends are able to take advantage of this cold front.  :yahoo:
> 
> Tom




CRUEL.....   REALLY CRUEL.....   but I'm laughing out loud....        :ROTF....


----------



## bwsmith_2000

Mr. T,

     Just wanted to get back to you and again thank you for a wonderful post. I now have a refer with about 40 lb. of smoked various cheeses. And I have to say that your suggestion of the limburger cheese was really good ...... that's smoked limburger brown mustard, and a healthy slice of sweet onion. A cold beer goes good with it too. Thanks for a great post.

Bill


----------



## mr t 59874

DaveOmak said:


> CRUEL..... REALLY CRUEL..... but I'm laughing out loud....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....


What??????  It's a nice balmy 34° here.  My wife brought 2lbs. of Lighthouse cheddar curds home and want's them smoked today so she can share at work Monday.  I have a 5lb. block of 4 year old Tillamook cheddar that's begging to go in with it. 

T


DaveOmak said:


> CRUEL..... REALLY CRUEL..... but I'm laughing out loud....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....





bwsmith_2000 said:


> Mr. T,
> 
> Just wanted to get back to you and again thank you for a wonderful post. I now have a refer with about 40 lb. of smoked various cheeses. And I have to say that your suggestion of the limburger cheese was really good ...... that's smoked limburger brown mustard, and a healthy slice of sweet onion. A cold beer goes good with it too. Thanks for a great post.
> 
> Bill


Thank you, Bill.  Sounds like you are getting quite the inventory built up, proud of you.  Try adding a couple sardines to your Limburger sandwich, puts it over the top.

T


----------



## graco

This was awesome.


----------



## hillbilly jim

Amazing tutorial!

Mr. T, you have inspired me, Sir!


----------



## spring chicken

I just read Mr. T's post about smoking cheese and his replies to questions.  I learned more about smoking cheese in a few minutes than I have in years of trying on my own, sometimes with the help of other Eggheads like me.  Yes, I'm an Egghead.  I cook (and smoke) using a Big Green Egg ceramic smoker/grill.  Although my latest batch of smoked cheese was tasty, I really felt that it lacked something.  My latest method of smoking is using a metal bean can, a cheap soldering iron and only some smoking chips in the fire pit of the Egg.  It works quite well to generate smoke but I was sure there is a better method.  You just convinced me there is a better way.  Thank you very much.  I'll try again, this time armed with a lot more knowledge.


----------



## graco

This post is too good.


----------



## mr t 59874

Spring Chicken, welcome to the forum.  

Sounds like you have gotten the smoke generator figured out. The most important thing is the internal smoker temperature as the texture of most hard cheeses will begin to change at 80°, soft cheese at 55°.  This does not mean that cheese smoked at higher temps won't be good, it's just that the quality of the original block will begin to change.  There are those who either deliberately or because they have no choice take their cheese to higher temps, even to the melting point and are quite pleased with the result.  The final result all depends on your personal taste.

As for time, learn to smoke your cheese to a desired color.  Each individual has a different desired taste.  Due to the many variables when smoking, you will soon learn to disregard the time someone else or even yourself smokes their cheese unless you have tasted their cheese and are using their smoker at their location to smoke yours.

Keep good notes and you will soon be producing a product you will be proud of.

Enjoy your cheese, if you think I can help in the future, please ask,

Tom


----------



## mr t 59874

Been getting questions on how to serve cheese.  The following was added to the thread.

*Question:*  How is cheese properly served?

*Answer: *  *Number one rule:*  Do not eat cheese cold or straight from the refrigerator. The cold temperature hinders the natural flavors and fragrance  of the cheese. The aromatic and complex flavors of cheese don't really begin to appear until the cheese is at room temperature.

Cheese is composed largely of fat.  Since fat means flavor, the goal is to amplify it as much as possible. When fat molecules are cold, they contract, when they warm, they relax, allowing a greater perception of flavor.

Pull your cheese out of the refrigerator at least an hour to a hour and a half before serving.  To keep your cheese from drying out, never unwrap your cheese when you bring it out of the refrigerator.  If serving waxed cheese at room temperature, wait until ready to serve before removing wax or if wrapped, unwrapping.

Be careful, though, especially in the summer months, if you warm up the cheese too much, it'll start to sweat and melt in unappetizing ways. Try to keep it at or around 72°.

To cut any cheese properly—hard or soft —use a good chef's knife or a good all-purpose utility knife. To cut very soft, cheese such as chevre cleanly, use a length of stretched dental floss.

 Serving cheese after the main course, prior to or in place of dessert, adds an elegant touch to casual dinners.  If served before dinner, with cocktails, remember that cheeses can be filling.  Serve in limited quantities and variety. 

If serving more than one type of cheese, provide separate knives for each cheese. Do not overcrowd the serving tray, as guest will need room to slice the cheeses.


----------



## vwaldoguy

It may be in the thread somewhere, but didn't have time to read all 8 pages. So after you smoke the cheese, you can leave it vacuum sealed at room temperature?  Or do you age it post-smoke in a refrigerator?


----------



## 4pogo7

Mr T 59874 said:


> ​                      A piece and slices of three-year-old smoked cheddar​      Mr.T’s​*        “Smoked Cheese, From Go to Show”*​


That just looks fancy right there! Very nice post with lots of good info!


----------



## smokingpigfoods

Once vacuum sealed it should be refrigerated.


----------



## biggqwesty

vwaldoguy said:


> It may be in the thread somewhere, but didn't have time to read all 8 pages. So after you smoke the cheese, you can leave it vacuum sealed at room temperature?  Or do you age it post-smoke in a refrigerator?


If you read the first post scroll about 1/5 threw it you'll see storage of cheese. You don't have to refrigerate but keep it cool and dry..
I'm in a double walled stone home and the laundry has a thick cement floor. 
Under or laundry sink is where I store mine. Stays nice and cool once vac sealed..


----------



## mr t 59874

vwaldoguy said:


> It may be in the thread somewhere, but didn't have time to read all 8 pages. So after you smoke the cheese, you can leave it vacuum sealed at room temperature?  Or do you age it post-smoke in a refrigerator?


To elaborate a bit more on BigGQWesty's post.  Only hard cheeses may be stored at 70° F - 21.1° C or lower.  Soft cheeses must be refrigerated at 55° F - 12.8 C or lower.  Cheese may be aged both pre-smoke and post-smoke.

Westy,  Sounds like a perfect place to store cheese, close to cave-like conditions.

T


----------



## foamheart

Wow, I can't believe I have missed this. Thank you Case for being to my attention.

Tom that is outstanding and the pictures and explanations were perfect. I always wondered about tying a piece of dental floss around a block of smoked cheese and dropping it in the hot wax...... The plating method w/ the wax you showed was so simple. 

BTW I saw another of your knives I want!

Really exceptional tutorial.


----------



## mr t 59874

Thread update.

*Question:* Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?

*Answer:* Creosote = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the one pictured below. Using an AMNPS inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. Other smoke delivery systems can be used but will not be discussed on this forum.  













000_0027.JPG



__ mr t 59874
__ Feb 14, 2015


----------



## 4pogo7

Mr T 59874 said:


> Thread update.
> 
> *Question:* Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?
> 
> *Answer:* Creosote = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the one pictured below. Using an AMNPS inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. Other smoke delivery systems can be used but will not be discussed on this forum.


Okay I feel a little silly asking this, but what do you mean by "heat sink"?

I understand using a smoke delivery system like above to get "cleaner" smoke, but is the "heat sink" part just to keep the temp low in the product chamber for a cold smoke?

Thanks


----------



## mr t 59874

A heat sink is a device that draws heat from a hot object (smoke) and disperses it into the cooler surroundings(iron stove), so as to cool the hot object(smoke).

Hope this helped.

Tom


----------



## 4pogo7

That does help, sort of what I was thinking. Cool, clean smoke!

Thanks,

I'm Tom too!


----------



## daveomak

A mail box mod acts as a sort of heat sink also...














DSCF2019.JPG



__ daveomak
__ Nov 25, 2015


----------



## 4pogo7

DaveOmak said:


> A mail box mod acts as a sort of heat sink also...


Morning Dave,

I am fairly familiar with that method as so many MES guys use it on here. I have also read most of your threads about it. Based on this thread and others I have seen by Mr. T and friends on bitter cheese, creosote, and mods, I assume the longer the piping, with any mod, the cooler/cleaner the smoke will be? Depending on outside temps and weather conditions and such of course.

I have read a lot of the threads about smoking cheese as I really want to do it soon, and my dad just did some in his MES a few weeks ago. He doesn't have any mods, and my family didn't want to wait to try it. Sat wrapped in the fridge a day or two and then people started to dig in. I wasn't a huge fan. Hickory was he wood and to me it was bitter and harsh. I tried to tell them to let it rest and mellow but they wanted to eat it and seemed to like it. I want to follow methods I have seen on here when I do mine and hope to get better results.


----------



## daveomak

4PoGo7 said:


> DaveOmak said:
> 
> 
> 
> A mail box mod acts as a sort of heat sink also...
> 
> 
> 
> Morning Dave,
> 
> I am fairly familiar with that method as so many MES guys use it on here. I have also read most of your threads about it. Based on this thread and others I have seen by Mr. T and friends on bitter cheese, creosote, and mods, I assume the longer the piping, with any mod, the cooler/cleaner the smoke will be? Depending on outside temps and weather conditions and such of course.
> 
> I have read a lot of the threads about smoking cheese as I really want to do it soon, and my dad just did some in his MES a few weeks ago. He doesn't have any mods, and my family didn't want to wait to try it. Sat wrapped in the fridge a day or two and then people started to dig in. I wasn't a huge fan. Hickory was he wood and to me it was bitter and harsh. I tried to tell them to let it rest and mellow but they wanted to eat it and seemed to like it. I want to follow methods I have seen on here when I do mine and hope to get better results.
Click to expand...



Hickory is a pretty strong flavor wood....   Go with a fruit wood like peach or pecan... maybe even alder or Pitmasters Choice...   I normally use PC because that's the mildest wood I had, until now.....  I just bought the "Sweet woods" pellets and alder from Todd....  Soooooo, I will be trying those soon....  I usually smoke cheese in the winter when it's below freezing...   I do have to trick the MES 30 to start at those temps...  I use a hair dryer or space heater to warm it so it will fire up the heating element....  They have some sort of "low temp override" that my MES won't start up at about 30 deg. F...

Oh.....  I usually smoke cheese about 2-4 hours....   ALSO, get the cheese up to 60 degrees or so....  above the ambient temp so condensate doesn't form on it....   water and smoke don't taste good...  tastes like acid rain....


----------



## 4pogo7

Thanks Dave!


----------



## driedstick

Great update Tom!! I just opened some of the cheese I smoked with Orange wood---*BINGO*!!!!! I found my new go to wood for cheese,,,The pack I opened was smoked on 11-8 so it did mellow a while but I used the mailbox also,, smoked for about 6hrs I think,,, I will have to go back and check my notes - Also the flavor was white garlic cheddar 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






  

DS


----------



## redheelerdog

driedstick said:


> Great update Tom!! I just opened some of the cheese I smoked with Orange wood---*BINGO*!!!!! I found my new go to wood for cheese,,,The pack I opened was smoked on 11-8 so it did mellow a while but I used the mailbox also,, smoked for about 6hrs I think,,, I will have to go back and check my notes - Also the flavor was white garlic cheddar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> DS


Orange wood? They have Orange trees in ID? LOL!

Do you use an AMAZN and pellets with the Orange?  Interesting and sounds really good.

I have been nibbbling this weekend on some Apple smoked cheddar, vintage 10/17/15 and it is great!


----------



## driedstick

redheelerdog said:


> Orange wood? They have Orange trees in ID? LOL!
> 
> Do you use an AMAZN and pellets with the Orange?  Interesting and sounds really good.
> 
> I have been nibbbling this weekend on some Apple smoked cheddar, vintage 10/17/15 and it is great!


Actually orange pellets, yep use them in the amps,,,I opened some back from March of this yr and it was flippin awesome!! I have some from 2013 that I am waiting to get at.

Going to go with some pellets from Todd next. 













IMG_20151107_161200380_HDR[1].jpg



__ driedstick
__ Nov 9, 2015






 A full smoker is a happy smoker

DS


----------



## redheelerdog

Where did you get the orange? I want to try it. - Thanks!


----------



## driedstick

redheelerdog said:


> Where did you get the orange? I want to try it. - Thanks!


Local BBQ supply store here locally,,, You may want to see if Todd has any,, or order online,, do a google search,,,I know this company has a online store

DS


----------



## oregon smoker

Redhealerdog,

Here is All Delights BBQ home page, you can order direct, only orange supply I have found besides Amazon,

Home Page,  http://bbqrsdelight.com/

Orange Pellet page,   http://store.bbqrsdelight.com/pd-orange---1lb-bag-pellets.cfm

Tom


----------



## redheelerdog

Quote:


driedstick said:


> Local BBQ supply store here locally,,, You may want to see if Todd has any,, or order online,, do a google search,,,I know this company has a online store
> 
> DS





Oregon Smoker said:


> Redhealerdog,
> 
> Here is All Delights BBQ home page, you can order direct, only orange supply I have found besides Amazon,
> 
> Home Page,  http://bbqrsdelight.com/
> 
> Orange Pellet page,   http://store.bbqrsdelight.com/pd-orange---1lb-bag-pellets.cfm
> 
> Tom


Thanks boys!


----------



## biggqwesty

So boys I bit the bullet and bought some cheese wax..
I personally wanted black lol but wife said red.. lol
So it's worked well. Smoked this morning on pecan 
Then on with the double boiler and wax bowl. 
Once it was melted on with the first coat using a brush. 
Omg it's blood red and a pain to get streak free. 
Next time I'm just going to get the first coat on and then dip them to get the smooth surface. See how that goes..
Anyway they have come out good but a bit rough. 
Now it's time to store and wait
http://s1272.photobucket.com/user/B... Uploads/20151212_145437_zpsayzgzm4k.jpg.html
http://s1272.photobucket.com/user/B...ads/FB_IMG_1449896940139_zpspyddaivw.jpg.html


----------



## mr t 59874

Let me be the first to congratulate you on your first wax and thank you for contributing to the thread. See lead doesn't taste bad at all does it?  I can tell by your rig that your whole family are adventurist.

A couple reminders.  Do not toss the wax as it can be used over and over.  Just clean it and add it to your fresh wax.  You have gone the extra mile to produce a fine product. I see one tweek you may want to consider to help ensure you have a quality product on your next run.   Please read below.

The following is a segment taken from the OP .

*Question:  *At what temperature should I heat the wax?

*Answer:*  Germs are killed at 180°F - 82°C. To prevent mold, heat wax to 225°F - 107°C - 240°F - 116°C or the wax manufacturer's suggested temperature.  BE CAREFUL if taken too high, the waxes flash point may be reached.  To prevent pinholes, apply three coats by dipping or brushing the wax on.  To prevent melting the first coat of wax, apply the additional coats at a lower temp, 160°F - 71°C.

*Note: * 1 *-* Use a designated pan to melt wax in, not a good one. 

            2 - Suggest using a hot plate rather than a gas stove for obvious reasons.

*Question:*   Can I use a double boiler to melt the wax?

*Answer:*   Not for the first coating. Water boils at 212°F - 100°C at sea level and generally decreases 2°F - -17°C per 1000 ft as elevation increases.  Therefore, the desirable temperatures cannot be reached. 

 Lead doesn't taste bad at all now does it?​

Have fun and enjoy your cheese, you have worked hard for it.

Tom


----------



## dr k

Mr T 59874 said:


> 1                  1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A piece and slices of three-year-old smoked cheddar
> 
> Mr.T’s
> 
> *        “Smoked Cheese, From Go to Show”*
> 
> _Those of us who smoke cheese enjoy that little something extra, and smoking cheese is fun and easy to do.  Hard cheeses are the easiest and with the proper equipment smoked soft cheeses can add that something spectacular to any meal. _
> 
> _   While going to the extra effort to smoke that favorite cheese.  Why not add another dimension and age your own cheese and save some really big bucks at the same time._
> 
> _   The youngest cheese that I smoke is a minimum of two years old, the oldest and best cheese I have ever eaten is, my 12 year old hickory smoked Limburger, sadly not much of that is left.
> 
> There is a ton of controversy when it comes to aging, smoking and preserving cheese.  The following are the techniques that I have used for many years; you are welcome to glean from it what you like._
> 
> _  Hopefully this will encourage someone to age, smoke and preserve their own cheese._
> 
> _Mr. T_
> 
> 
> *FAQ’s*
> 
> *Question:* Can I age store bought cheese?
> 
> *Answer:* Yes, I normally will buy cheese in the cryovac package, 2 to 5 Lbs. the larger the better.
> 
> 60 Lbs. Aging Cheese
> 
> 2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question: *Will it age in the package?
> 
> *Answer:*  Yes it will.  Make sure there are no leaks that would allow liquids to escape and contaminates to enter. Waxed cheeses although will age better. A very dry cheese can age for years, while moist cheeses will simply get old.
> 
> *Question:*  At what temperature should I store the cheese?
> 
> *Answer:*  Store hard cheeses at temperatures between 70°F - 21°C & 35°F - 2°C. The ideal aging temp is 52°F - 11°C  to 56°f - 13°C.   My hard cheeses are kept at a minimum of 45°F - 7°C.  The closer to 70°F - 21°C, the faster it will age. Softer cheeses should be stored in the cooler range of 50°F - 10°C to 35°F - 2°C.
> 
> *Question:*  How long can I age my cheese?
> 
> *Answer:*  I don’t know of any limits in time.  The longest I have aged a cheese is the 12-year-old Limburger.  I have read that some have aged Cheddar for 25 years and more.  Cheddar’s flavor becomes increasingly sharp; its firm texture becomes more granular and crumbly with age.  Cheese never stops aging.  Left long enough, mild cheddar will turn into extra sharp.  A semi – hard/hard cheese will never spoil as long as it is vacuum packed and refrigerated.  It gets better with age also.
> 
> Ready to be Smoked
> 
> 3
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:*  How much should I smoke at one time?
> 
> *Answer:*   Smoke according to the size of the block.  I smoke cheese as we need it.    Cut your blocks into sections approximately the size of a quarter pound stick of butter for better smoke penetration. A one pound block may be cut in half, while a two or five pound block will need to be sectioned for good smoke absorption.
> 
> 4
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question: *  At what temperatures should I smoke?
> *Answer:*  Consider that cheese will begin to change its texture at 80°F - 27°C so; a true cold smoke will be needed.   The definition of a true cold smoke is 90°F - 32°C or less.    To preserve the quality of the cheese, mine is pulled from the smoker if the internal smoker temperature reaches 70°F -to 75° then, if needed, continue when the elements are cooler.   The smoking time is continued from when it was pulled from the smoker.  Do not smoke below 35°F - 2°C. Hard, semi-hard, soft and cream cheeses may be smoked at 55°F - 13°C.
> 
> *Note:* You can take the cheese on up to the melting point if you like and it may still be desirable to your taste, but the quality of the cheese will be lost.
> 
> 
> *Question:*  How long should I smoke the cheese?
> 
> *Answer: *  Only experience will determine this as it really depends on your taste.
> 
> I usually will smoke the hard cheeses for two hours depending on the density of the smoke and type of wood used. The harder the cheese the more dense smoke it can take.  If it is a caramel color you are looking for, a dense smoke for 5 hours may be required.  Depending on the type and texture of your cheese, monitor the smoke as a lighter smoke will sometimes infuse a more desirable flavor than a heavy dense smoke will.  Cream or blues will take a much shorter smoking time than the harder cheeses. Some softer cheeses may be done in half an hour.
> 
> Learn to keep good records.  In your records note the type of cheese, ambient temperature, internal smoker temperature, type and amount of wood, the density of the smoke and, of course, the time, color and taste.
> 
> Ready for Smoker
> 
> 5
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:* What woods should I use?
> 
> *Answer:*   Hickory, apple, cherry and alder among others work very well.
> 
> *Question:*  Okay it’s smoked. Now what?
> 
> *Answer:*  Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day.  If it is going to be consumed soon, wrap in a cling type wrap and put in fridge or store at previously discussed temperatures. It is best to let rest at room temperature for two to three weeks to allow the smoke to permeate the cheese. Depending on the type of cheese, if it is going to be kept for a few months, coat it with olive or vegetable oil and place on a rack in a container and refrigerate.  Reapply oil every two weeks.  A damp paper towel may be kept in the container to provide added moisture.  After slicing some for use, reapply oil.  The oil will help keep mold from forming on the outside.  If the cheese is going to be aged further, it is waxed and stored as usual.  Of course, it can be vacuum sealed also.
> 
> *Question:*   Can I freeze my cheese before or after smoking?
> 
> *Answer:*    It’s my opinion that, the quality of the cheese is seriously compromised by freezing.
> 
> *Question:*  What cheeses can be waxed?
> 
> *Answer:*  Only the hard cheeses should be waxed, Cheddar, Swiss, Colby, etc. The less moisture you have in your cheese the better for waxing.
> 
> *Question:*  Can I use paraffin to wax cheese?
> 
> *Answer:*  No.  Paraffin is not pliable and will crack and break in time allowing contaminates in and molds to form. Use only wax designated as cheese wax. It will remain pliable and allow your cheese to breathe which aids in aging. It will also take a much higher heat when melting which when applied, helps in preventing mold.
> 
> *Question:  *At what temperature should I heat the wax?
> 
> *Answer:*  Germs are killed at 180°F - 82°C. To prevent mold, heat wax to 225°F - 107°C - 240°F - 116°C or the wax manufacturer's suggested temperature.  BE CAREFUL if taken too high, the waxes flash point may be reached.  To prevent pinholes, apply three coats by dipping or brushing the wax on.  To prevent melting the first coat of wax, apply the additional coats at a lower temp, 160°F - 71°C.
> 
> *Note:  *1* - *Use a designated pan to melt wax in, not a good one.
> 
> 2 - Suggest using a hot plate rather than a gas stove for obvious reasons.
> 
> *Question:*   Can I use a double boiler to melt the wax?
> 
> *Answer:*   Not for the first coating. Water boils at 212°F - 100°C at sea level and generally decreases 2°F - -17°C per 1000 ft as elevation increases.  Therefore, the desirable temperatures cannot be reached.
> 
> Waxed Cheddar
> 
> 6
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:*  Where can I get Cheese wax?
> 
> *Answer:*  Cheese making suppliers will have it or, it may be purchased on line.
> 
> Vacuum Packed
> 
> 7
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The below cheeses are what is kept on the kitchen counter for short time use.  Note the aged 4-year-old cheddar has been on the counter for three months, no mold.
> 
> 8
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:* How is cheese properly served?
> 
> *Answer: *  *Number one rule:* Do not eat cheese cold or straight from the refrigerator. The cold temperature hinders the natural flavors and fragrance  of the cheese. The aromatic and complex flavors of cheese don't really begin to appear until the cheese is at room temperature.
> 
> Cheese is composed largely of fat.  Since fat means flavor, the goal is to amplify it as much as possible. When fat molecules are cold, they contract, when they warm, they relax, allowing a greater perception of flavor.
> 
> Pull your cheese out of the refrigerator at least an hour to a hour and a half before serving.  To keep your cheese from drying out, never unwrap your cheese when you bring it out of the refrigerator.  If serving waxed cheese at room temperature, wait until ready to serve before removing wax or if wrapped, unwrapping.
> 
> Be careful, though, especially in the summer months, if you warm up the cheese too much, it'll start to sweat and melt in unappetizing ways. Try to keep it at or around 72°.
> 
> To cut any cheese properly—hard or soft —use a good chef's knife or a good all-purpose utility knife. To cut very soft, cheese such as chevre cleanly, use a length of stretched dental floss.
> 
> Serving cheese after the main course, prior to or in place of dessert, adds an elegant touch to casual dinners.  If served before dinner, with cocktails, remember that cheeses can be filling.  Serve in limited quantities and variety.
> 
> If serving more than one type of cheese, provide separate knives for each cheese. Do not overcrowd the serving tray, as guest will need room to slice the cheeses.
> 
> 
> *Question:*   What do I do if I find mold on my cheese?
> 
> *Answer:*    The mold on hard or semi-soft cheeses may be washed with a scrub brush or, cut away and re-waxed or oiled.
> 
> 
> 
> Soft cheeses, such as cottage cheese, cream cheese, and ricotta cheese, that have mold  should be discarded. The same goes for any kind of cheese that's shredded, crumbled or sliced.
> 
> With these cheeses, the mold can send threads throughout the cheese. In addition, harmful bacteria, such as listeria, brucella, salmonella and E. coli, can grow along with the mold.
> 
> Mold generally can't penetrate far into hard and semisoft cheeses, such as cheddar, colby, Parmesan and Swiss. So you can cut away the moldy part and eat the rest of the cheese. Cut off at least 1 inch (2.5 centimeters) around and below the moldy spot. Be sure to keep the knife out of the mold so it doesn't contaminate other parts of the cheese.
> 
> Of course, not all molds pose a risk. In fact, some types of mold are used to make cheeses, such as Brie and Camembert. These molds are safe to eat.
> 
> If you're not sure what type of cheese you have or what to do if it grows mold, the safe course is to discard it.
> 
> *Question:* Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?
> 
> *Answer: *
> It could be as simple as applying too much smoke. It's imperative that you monitor the color and density of your smoke as there are many outside influences that can change both. Take the time that others smoke with a grain of salt, use it possibly as a guide but, not knowing the color and density of their smoke, their info is mostly useless.  And they may have a bitter taste out of the smoker themselves.
> 
> Remember, regardless the smoke generator you are using, the whiter the smoke, the more unforgiving it is as shorter smoking times are required.
> 
> Creosote = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the ones pictured below. Using an smoke generator inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. Other smoke delivery systems can be used but will not be discussed on this forum.
> 
> An attempt was made in the following thread to demonstrate how to significantly prevent a bitter taste on a product from occurring. You will notice a great difference between placing a smoke generator inside the product chamber/smoker and placing it in an external firebox and piping the smoke to the chamber. Piping the smoke to a chamber produces a much cleaner smoke. The longer the run from the firebox to the chamber, the cleaner the smoke will be, meaning less creosote deposits. AMNPS & Smoke Daddy Myths?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 000_0027.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Feb 14, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Question:*   Can I get this type of cheese on-line?
> 
> *Answer:*   Yes and here is a link to get you started.
> 
> https://www.wisconsincheesemart.com/cheese/
> 
> *              Mr. T's  Christmas 2015 Gift Cheese - Aged - Smoked - Waxed*
> 
> *                                                       03 / 27 / 2015*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 000_0241.JPG
> 
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> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
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> 
> 
> 3.5-year-old Cheddar
> 
> 
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> 
> 000_0251.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It took 20 hours of light white smoke to reach the desired color. Used Pitmaster pellets with AMNPS
> 
> in a remote iron stove 8 feet away.  Highest temperature reached during smoke, 68.5°.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 000_0253.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 20 hours of smoke compared to non-smoked.  The streaks in the cheese were caused by the
> 
> 1/4 cup of moisture that escaped from the aging cheese.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 000_0257.JPG
> 
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> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pie pan used for dipping.
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 000_0254.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First coat of wax applied at 240° to deter mold growth.  Additional coats applied at 160°.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 000_0255.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Info tags applied to still wet second coat.
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 000_0256.JPG
> 
> 
> 
> __ mr t 59874
> __ Mar 27, 2015
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After three coats of wax, it is now ready for further aging or until the Holidays.
> 
> *Note:*   The cheese rested overnight before waxing.  A taste test revealed a very mild non-bitter taste.
> 
> I cannot over-emphasize the importance of using a remote smoke generator in order to cool and clean the
> 
> smoke prior to coming into contact with the cheese. It eliminates much if not all of any bitter taste.
> 
> *Additional Information:*
> 
> Understanding Smoke Management
> 
> http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/139474/understanding-smoke-management
> 
> My Cold Smoking Options
> 
> http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123840/my-cold-smoking-options-w-q-
> 
> Moldy Cheese
> 
> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/food-and-nutrition/AN01024
> 
> Listeria in soft cheese made with unpasteurized milk such as queso fresco, Feta, Brie and Camembert.
> 
> http://www.foodsafety.gov/poisoning/causes/bacteriaviruses/listeria/
> 
> view
> 
> *                                                             Tillamook Cheese*
> 
> Type                                              Aged                                             Uses
> 
> Medium Sharp Cheddar                           60 days                        snack, sandwich, main dish
> 
> Sharp Cheddar                                    Nine + months                        appetizer or main dish
> 
> Reserve Extra Sharp                                2 years                                    gourmet side dishes
> 
> compliments smoked salmon and  sauces
> 
> Vintage White Extra sharp Cheddar        2 + years                      companion to fruit and wine
> 
> Vintage Medium White Cheddar            100 + days                             well with fruit and wine
> 
> Monterey Jack                                                                                           topping on any dish
> 
> Pepper Jack                                                                 southwest recipes, snack with crackers
> 
> Swiss                                                                                                                       burgers and soup
> 
> Colby                                                                         sandwiches appetizer with crackers or bread


This thread came out the same month I joined SMF.  I picked up a three lb. block of mild white cheddar and five lb. block of extra sharp cheddar both cryovac.  They have been aging in my crisper drawer since 12.2.13.  I have another 5lb'er of mild cheddar at my parents in their spare fridge crisper drawer since 12.5.14.  I guess I'm due for another block because I want to buy one five lb'er a year and age the newer purchased blocks of cheese in their cool basement or move them all to their basement ASAP. 

-Kurt


----------



## mr t 59874

Dr K said:


> This thread came out the same month I joined SMF.  I picked up a three lb. block of mild white cheddar and five lb. block of extra sharp cheddar both cryovac.  They have been aging in my crisper drawer since 12.2.13.  I have another 5lb'er of mild cheddar at my parents in their spare fridge crisper drawer since 12.5.14.  I guess I'm due for another block because I want to buy one five lb'er a year and age the newer purchased blocks of cheese in their cool basement or move them all to their basement ASAP.
> 
> -Kurt


Good planning Kurt. Your mild cheddar is most likely leaning toward extra sharp by now. This is going to be an exceptional cheese. Once you have your smoke delivery system perfected to reduce any bitter taste, consider waxing it for further storage.

Tom


----------



## terry56

I have finished smoking some 2 year old cheddar. I am going to put it in the fridge wrapped in Saran for a couple of weeks to let it mellow and the smoke flavour to get all the way through. Is there anything I should do before vacuum packing? Also what temperature do I store it at to let it continue aging?

I'm rather new at this so any and all advise is appreciated.


----------



## mr t 59874

terry56 said:


> I have finished smoking some 2 year old cheddar. I am going to put it in the fridge wrapped in Saran for a couple of weeks to let it mellow and the smoke flavour to get all the way through. Is there anything I should do before vacuum packing? Also what temperature do I store it at to let it continue aging?
> 
> I'm rather new at this so any and all advise is appreciated.


I take it you smoked some extra sharp, that is going to be good. You will be fine with the cling wrap for a short time. There is no reason though it couldn't be vac sealed or waxed now.

Cheddar is best aged at ± 55°. It can be stored at temps between 70° and 35°.

T


----------



## mr t 59874

Edit to the original post includes the following mods.

T

*Question:*  Why does my cheese taste bitter right out of the smoker?

*Answer: *  
It could be as simple as applying too much smoke. It's imperative that you monitor the color and density of your smoke as there are many outside influences that can change both. Take the time that others smoke with a grain of salt, use it possibly as a guide but, not knowing the color and density of their smoke, their info is mostly useless.  And they may have a bitter taste out of the smoker themselves.

Remember, regardless the smoke generator you are using, the whiter the smoke, the more unforgiving it is as shorter smoking times are required.

Creosote = Bitter    Your smoke is depositing too much creosote onto the cheese. Suggest using a different smoke delivery system such as the ones pictured below. Using an smoke generator inside a cast-iron stove which is used as a heat sink and collects most of the creosote. The smoke then travels through a 10ft section of 3 inch stove pipe to the product chamber. 

An attempt was made in the following threads to demonstrate how to significantly prevent a bitter taste on a product from occurring. You will notice a great difference between placing a smoke generator inside the product chamber/smoker and placing it in an external firebox and piping the smoke to the chamber. Piping the smoke to a chamber produces a much cleaner smoke. The longer the run from the firebox to the chamber, the cleaner the smoke will be, meaning less creosote deposits. AMNPS & Smoke Daddy Myths?  -  Cleaning up your act - clean smoke is delicious smoke!

Now, how do we replicate the smokers of old in today’s environment? We start by using a remote firebox and pipe the smoke produced by your smoke generator of choice to the product chamber, which could be your smoker or a cardboard box, whatever you want to use. To cool the smoke as much as possible, the firebox is also being used as a heat sink, the more mass the better. The pipe used (preferably single wall stovepipe) to transport the smoke will also act as a heat sink so the longer it is, the better the results.

 Examples:



The above is an example using an Smoke Daddy Big Kahuna smoke generator in conjunction with a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber. 













000_0027.JPG



__ mr t 59874
__ Feb 14, 2015






The above is example using a tray type pellet smoke generator inside a wood stove leading to a 22cf product chamber.

View media item 459259
The above example uses a tray type smoke generator inside a mailbox feeding an MES.

View media item 459449
The above example is using a MES cold smoke attachment feeding an MES.


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## hillbilly jim

Mr. T, question, Sir:

In your FAQs, you said "... It is best to let rest at room temperature for two to three weeks to allow the smoke to permeate the cheese." I have a Foodsaver machine. Should I vacuum bag it toward the purpose of letting it rest at room temp or leave it open to breathe?

Thank you, Sir!


----------



## chef jimmyj

Hillbilly Jim said:


> Mr. T, question, Sir:
> 
> In your FAQs, you said "... It is best to let rest at room temperature for two to three weeks to allow the smoke to permeate the cheese." I have a Foodsaver machine. Should I vacuum bag it toward the purpose of letting it rest at room temp or leave it open to breathe?
> 
> Thank you, Sir!


Mr T has not been active for a few months...Vac Pac the cheese. Most will dry out uncovered. Fresh/Soft cheese, Cream, Mozz, Feta, should be refrigerated. Sliceable Semisoft cheeses will be fine at room temp...JJ


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## hillbilly jim

Got it. Thank you, Chef!


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## daveomak

I tightly wrap my cheese in saran before vac-packing for easy removal later...  I put several hunks of cheese in one bag...   open, remove and reseal...   saves on bags....


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## bauchjw

You can vacuum seal his cheese as soon as any moisture that may have collected on the cheese has gone away.


----------



## njg26crux

My first post here ...

I did a marathon smoking on our last Holiday weekend and now have some Smoked Cheese.

I purchased this:













20160903_165231.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






Prepped them like this (Started on a Gasser but moved it to the Green Egg):













20160903_180858.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






Smoked them in a Green Egg w/ an AMNPS for for about 5 hours (AMNPS went out twice until I found the sweet spot / Vent Openings) at night, Temp kept under 65 deg.

Results:













20160904_093028.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






I left them on the counter to cool / dry, then Vac Packed them and placed them in the wine fridge @ 55 deg.

It has been 3 weeks and I am torn between leaving them like that until I want to use or ordering Cheese Wax.

Is it worth the effort of waxing this cheese (Do I have to worry about ammonia, acetic acid, & CO2 affecting taste. Or does this occur in non aged cheeses) ?

What does a better job of aging Cheese, before smoking or after?

FYI The other smoked items:

Round Bone Roasts and Beef Short Ribs













20160903_161905.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






The Round Bone Roasts made some Texas no Bean Chili













20160903_182802.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






The Beef Short Ribs were for Saturday Dinner w/ Smoked Manhattans (using the Smoking Gun)













20160903_184554.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016


















20160903_213408.jpg



__ njg26crux
__ Sep 27, 2016






Sunday Night was a Brisket (Sorry No Pics).

Monday Night was cold smoked Bone in Rib eyes cooked Sous Vide (Using a Beer Cooler w/ 135deg water for 2 hr)  then finished on a smoking hot cast iron skillet with a blowtorch (Also No Pics).

Thanks in advance for your replies!


----------



## forluvofsmoke

I'd be for waxing all that cheese...either wax it or have it destroyed with mold...sooner the better. You may want to read back through on the soft cheese...I don't smoke it, so don't deal with the necessary steps involved.

Eric


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## forluvofsmoke

I just had a little chat with Mr T and he reminded me that you should not wax soft cheeses, but you definitely should wax the hard cheeses for longer aging. Vac-pack the softer cheese.

Eric


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## njg26crux

Thanks!

I ordered 5 lbs of wax.

The Buffalo Moz didn't last a week!

I tried a few pieces at the 3 week mark and WOW.

Tell Mr. T Thanks also.

Jeff


----------



## mikedaub

Ok.. I've got a question, which is more out of curiosity than anything else..

I just smoked my first batch of cheese, (http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/254896/giving-this-smoking-cheese-a-shot) and I am pretty happy so far (I haven't tasted it yet, but seems good 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






), and then this thread was given to read when asking about storage...

In Mr. T's original post, and as others have stated - "Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day"   What is the point of the zip lock?  I understand why to let it rest (moisture dries), and why if you use a Zip lock, why you would leave it open (again moisture), but why use one at all?  What is the benefit, or is it just a personal preference thing?  I just took my cheese off the smoker racks, put them on some cookie racks, and in the fridge they went.  Maybe I should have just kept them outside of the fridge, but I chose the fridge. to let them dry.  My only complaint, and it was mentioned somewhere in the thread, is the smell of the smoke in my fridge, as they dried.  Would the zip lock help with that?


----------



## bauchjw

Mikedaub said:


> Ok.. I've got a question, which is more out of curiosity than anything else..
> 
> I just smoked my first batch of cheese, (http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/254896/giving-this-smoking-cheese-a-shot) and I am pretty happy so far (I haven't tasted it yet, but seems good :biggrin: ), and then this thread was given to read when asking about storage...
> 
> In Mr. T's original post, and as others have stated - "Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day"   What is the point of the zip lock?  I understand why to let it rest (moisture dries), and why if you use a Zip lock, why you would leave it open (again moisture), but why use one at all?  What is the benefit, or is it just a personal preference thing?  I just took my cheese off the smoker racks, put them on some cookie racks, and in the fridge they went.  Maybe I should have just kept them outside of the fridge, but I chose the fridge. to let them dry.  My only complaint, and it was mentioned somewhere in the thread, is the smell of the smoke in my fridge, as they dried.  Would the zip lock help with that?



Sorry for the delay, I just talked to Tom and he gave the following:

In Mr. T's original post, and as others have stated - "Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day" (only hard cheeses) What is the point of the zip lock? (sanitation) I understand why to let it rest (moisture dries), and why if you use a Zip lock, why you would leave it open (again moisture), but why use one at all?  What is the benefit, or is it just a personal preference thing? (again, sanitation) I just took my cheese off the smoker racks, put them on some cookie racks, and in the fridge they went.  Maybe I should have just kept them outside of the fridge, but I chose the fridge. To let them dry.  My only complaint, and it was mentioned somewhere in the thread, is the smell of the smoke in my fridge, as they dried.  Would the zip lock help with that? (yes, it also helps contain the smoke aroma)


Keep in mind that hard cheeses including cheddar can be kept at room temperature, 70° or below, for a length of time. By keeping the hard cheese in a bag overnight, a skin will develop on the cheese which then helps assist in waxing. Cheese may be vac sealed as soon as all moisture has dissipated, no need to keep it longer unless it is going to be waxed. If oils are on the surface, caused by smoking at too high of a temperature, go ahead and vac seal.

Soft cheeses can be placed at room temperature until moisture, if any, has dissipated, then either consumed or vac sealed, never waxed.

All cheeses should be consumed at room temperature in order to highlight it's aroma.

A clean, smooth smoke will make an extraordinarily delightful smoked cheese right out of the smoker.


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## mikedaub

bauchjw said:


> Sorry for the delay, I just talked to Tom and he gave the following:
> 
> In Mr. T's original post, and as others have stated - "Place in a zip type bag leaving a small opening to keep condensation from forming and allow it to set on a rack at room temperature for a day" (only hard cheeses) What is the point of the zip lock? (sanitation) I understand why to let it rest (moisture dries), and why if you use a Zip lock, why you would leave it open (again moisture), but why use one at all? What is the benefit, or is it just a personal preference thing? (again, sanitation) I just took my cheese off the smoker racks, put them on some cookie racks, and in the fridge they went. Maybe I should have just kept them outside of the fridge, but I chose the fridge. To let them dry. My only complaint, and it was mentioned somewhere in the thread, is the smell of the smoke in my fridge, as they dried. Would the zip lock help with that? (yes, it also helps contain the smoke aroma)
> 
> 
> Keep in mind that hard cheeses including cheddar can be kept at room temperature, 70° or below, for a length of time. By keeping the hard cheese in a bag overnight, a skin will develop on the cheese which then helps assist in waxing. Cheese may be vac sealed as soon as all moisture has dissipated, no need to keep it longer unless it is going to be waxed. If oils are on the surface, caused by smoking at too high of a temperature, go ahead and vac seal.
> 
> Soft cheeses can be placed at room temperature until moisture, if any, has dissipated, then either consumed or vac sealed, never waxed.
> 
> All cheeses should be consumed at room temperature in order to highlight it's aroma.
> 
> A clean, smooth smoke will make an extraordinarily delightful smoked cheese right out of the smoker.


So, essentially, the addition of the bag while letting it rest is just for sanitation purposes..  Great.. Thanks..


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## thatcho

Mr. T I have a question about some new cheese I came across. It is a hard semi soft 













IMG_0023.PNG



__ thatcho
__ Dec 26, 2016






How would I attempt to wax this or should I.


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## forluvofsmoke

Thatcho said:


> Mr. T I have a question about some new cheese I came across. It is a hard semi soft
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_0023.PNG
> 
> 
> 
> __ thatcho
> __ Dec 26, 2016
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How would I attempt to wax this or should I.


Due to the surface texture (peppercorns) I think you would destroy the cheese by waxing (when wax is removed it would take peppercorns with it). Also, if it is not a hard cheese it should not be waxed.

I'll forward your question to Mr T and get back with you ASAP.

Eric


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## mr t 59874

I cannot advise waxing this cheese. I you do, wrap it in cheesecloth in order for the wax not to come into contact with the surface of the cheese.

T


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## mr t 59874

Been getting similar questions from individuals, so thought I would attempt to answer them here.

*Question:* Does cheese need to sit for a period of time before consumption?

*Answer:* No, many tend to over smoke their cheese making it inedible when it comes out of the smoker, thereby they vac-seal it and let it set sometimes for months before they can consume it. You don’t deliberately over smoke a chicken then let it rest for weeks before eating it, so why would you do it to cheese?

For an example as to learn how to smoke cheese that is edible right after being smoked, take a block of cheddar and cut it into bite sizes. While taking good notes, place the pieces into your smoker/product chamber and begin applying smoke. At 20 or 30-minute intervals take a taste test of one of your samples. When you get to your desired taste, pull the cheese, you are done. This can be done using many different smoke applications.

The heavier and more dense the smoke the sooner it will be done, possibly in as little as a few minutes. A lighter, thin smoke applied from a distant fire box may take hours. This is something you have to take into consideration when being advised as to how long to smoke a product without knowing the kind of smoke used.

When done, note the color of your cheese, this is what you want to shoot for in future smokes. The color of the cheese will depend on the type of smoke being used along with the wood.

*Question: *How do you store cheese?

*Answer: *

In order to answer your question, it would be helpful to know the type of cheese you smoked, hard, semi-hard, soft, or creamy as they require different means of storing, a simple container, vac-seal or waxing are the most common.

If you are storing hard or semi-hard cheese for a short period of time, cheese paper may be used. If storing hard or semi-hard cheese for longer periods you may vac-seal or wax. Be advised though, using cling wrap or vac-sealing can suffocate your cheese, not allowing it to age as it would in wax, also depending on the plastic used, you may find your cheese taking on a plastic taste.

If vac-sealing, don’t worry about moisture on your cheese. Mold is caused by oxygen reaching your cheese, not moisture. Cheese such as cheddar that has been aged for a number of years will naturally expel moisture within its packaging. You may find an example of that here.   http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/245739/2016-christmas-gift-cheese-aged-smoked-waxed

 I let my hard cheeses air dry before vac-sealing for cosmetic reasons as moisture can cause streaking on the surface of the cheese. I will let it set overnight if my intent is to wax. This will allow a thin skin on the surface, which to me, allows for better waxing as you don’t want to wax cold cheese.

Hopefully this helps in answering your questions.

Have fun and enjoy your cheese,

Tom


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## dls1

Excellent post Tom.

It pretty much sums up about all you need to know on how to properly smoke cheese, especially the part that so many people miss regarding keeping some distance between the source of smoke and the product being smoked.

Those that have the smoke source immediately adjacent to the product then say that, even though it tastes like the bottom of a well used ash tray , it's normal, and just wait a few weeks and it will be fine. The taste of creosote's offspring, soot, will mellow over time, but never fully dissipates.  

D


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## ab canuck

Outstanding tutorial, Thank you for posting this thread. Tried to give point to it but unable.


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## seanysmokes

Scarbelly said:


> First - Thanks to Mr T for a great post on smoking cheese
> 
> Most of us who have been smoking cheese for a while let it rest in the fridge for a minimum of two weeks. I personally like 4-6 weeks. I have some that is 14 months old and Nepas just opened some that was aged 20 months.
> 
> Here is a link to the cheese section which has lots of posts on this subject
> 
> http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/f/2166/cheese
> 
> If you want instant gratification try some fresh mozzarella - here is a link to some I have done
> 
> http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/101771/smoked-mozzarella


Regarding letting the cheese rest after smoking, are you letting it rest in the fridge on a rack or is it being vacuum sealed/waxed/etc. prior to the resting period?


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## mr t 59874

seanysmokes said:


> Regarding letting the cheese rest after smoking, are you letting it rest in the fridge on a rack or is it being vacuum sealed/waxed/etc. prior to the resting period?


Welcome to the forum and thank you for your question. The answer you are looking for can be found in the original thread or partially in post #191 above.

For a short answer, hard cheeses can rest and stored at room temperature, 70° or below, until dry of any possible moisture then sealed by whatever means you choose. Other cheeses such as medium or soft can be kept at 55° or below. Cream and cottage cheese should be kept at refrigerator temps.

T


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## mr t 59874

Edited the thread to include the following.

*Question: *What temperature should cheese be prior to smoking?

*Answer: *It depends on how much smoke you want your cheese to take on. The cooler the cheese the more smoke it will take on in a time period, this is desired when smoking cream type cheese and helps in avoiding melting. If a more mild smoke is desired, allow the harder cheese to come to ambient temperature prior to smoking.

Bring it to ambient temperature in it's original packaging before cutting into desired blocks. This will avoid a skin from developing on the surface, and allow the smoke to better penetrate the cheese.


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## fleetline51

Absolutely Outstanding Tutorial/Pictorial!  
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





  

I too smoke cheeses frequently and have been for years. Much of what you posted are my methodologies of smoking cheese,

All of what you put up took much time and forethought-All of which was garnered from your years of practical experience.

Thank You much for sharing this wealth of experience and knowledge with all here on these Forums!
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





Best Regards,

Tony


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## kurt boutin

I apologize if this was covered, but I didn't see any reference to a preference of waxing vs. vacu-sealing. 

Thoughts?

Kurt




mr t 59874 said:


> Edited the thread to include the following.
> 
> *Question: *What temperature should cheese be prior to smoking?
> 
> *Answer: *It depends on how much smoke you want your cheese to take on. The cooler the cheese the more smoke it will take on in a time period, this is desired when smoking cream type cheese and helps in avoiding melting. If a more mild smoke is desired, allow the harder cheese to come to ambient temperature prior to smoking.
> 
> Bring it to ambient temperature in it's original packaging before cutting into desired blocks. This will avoid a skin from developing on the surface, and allow the smoke to better penetrate the cheese.


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## dr k

kurt boutin said:


> I apologize if this was covered, but I didn't see any reference to a preference of waxing vs. vacu-sealing.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> Kurt


The first coat of wax at 240* kills the mold and the other layers at 160* to keep the first layer from melting. I don't wax since I don't do much cheese. I guess hot wax pastureizes the outside of the cheese.


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## sinner

I just read through a little of this post cause I was wanting to smoke some cheese but now I'm like wow didn't know about all of this. I was just going to buy some Gouda, Cheddar, Pepper Jack and muenster cheese. The little 8oz block Kraft cheese or even the 8 Oz Walmart brand cheese to smoke and eat on. I'm assuming I shouldn't buy these or does it matter?

Also can this type of cheese be aged?


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## dr k

sinner said:


> I just read through a little of this post cause I was wanting to smoke some cheese but now I'm like wow didn't know about all of this. I was just going to buy some Gouda, Cheddar, Pepper Jack and muenster cheese. The little 8oz block Kraft cheese or even the 8 Oz Walmart brand cheese to smoke and eat on. I'm assuming I shouldn't buy these or does it matter?
> 
> Also can this type of cheese be aged?


You can smoke any size cheese.  I'll try individual wrapped Colby and mozzarella next but usually the size you mentioned.  For aging I go with 3-5lb blocks of unsliced cheddar that are hard cheeses that are vac sealed since they have the least amount of surface area for the size. I put the bought date on it and forget about it for 3-4 years lr more in the fridge crisper drawer.  I ate a block early this year.  The cheese expels whey over time,  shrinking,  getting more crumbly, sharp and calcifies with a slight granule texture. It's worth the wait.  If you get two or three blocks the initial wait is tough but buy one when you eat one once a year and you will always have aged cheese on hand.
This was great. Cut in fourths and vac seal the other three a keep refrigerated not frozen. If the house is <70° you can leave out in a ziplock bag while the others continue to age in the fridge.


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## ab canuck

YUMMMM!!!!!


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## hacksawdwyer

mr t 59874 said:


> Thank you.  Don't feel that the cheddar has to be refrigerated.  Keep it at 70° or below.  As for how long it will be good for, years.
> 
> Tom


Will refrigeration hurt the flavor?


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## dr k

hacksawdwyer said:


> Will refrigeration hurt the flavor?


Mr t hasn't been on SMF for about a year and a half according to clicking on his Avatar/profile.  Refrigeration is fine.  I age my cheddar in the crisper drawers in their original cryovac packaging for years.  Freezing is bad.


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## pugsbrew

The one thing I'm trying to wrap my head around, is the resting the cheese, after smoking, in a plastic bag.  I know sanitation has been mentioned for the reason.  Question, can the same thing be accomplished my using paper towels or cheesecloth?  Obviously resting the cheese on the towel/cloth, and covering with the towel/cloth (on a cooling rack).  This would eliminate the moisture build up in the plastic bag.

What am I missing here?

Thanks


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## zwiller

I don't have any moisture build up in the bag since I warm the cheese up for an hour or so prior to smoking so no condensation forms.  Also, I use dust and there is very little heat produced.


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## xray

pugsbrew said:


> The one thing I'm trying to wrap my head around, is the resting the cheese, after smoking, in a plastic bag.  I know sanitation has been mentioned for the reason.  Question, can the same thing be accomplished my using paper towels or cheesecloth?  Obviously resting the cheese on the towel/cloth, and covering with the towel/cloth (on a cooling rack).  This would eliminate the moisture build up in the plastic bag.
> 
> What am I missing here?
> 
> Thanks



You will be fine using your method. I usually rest mine overnight in the refrigerator. I place the cheese on a wire rack and loosely cover with parchment paper or wax paper...whatever I have on hand.

Then, the next day I vac-seal the cheese and store it in my cheese and beer fridge.


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## chef jimmyj

Mr. T was banned for being argumentative and disrespectful to staff...JJ


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## pugsbrew

chef jimmyj said:


> Mr. T was banned for being argumentative and disrespectful to staff...JJ



I assume this info is still correct?  I'm just trying to solve my mind fart on the issue, which it has. I believe.

Thanks


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## pc farmer

pugsbrew said:


> I assume this info is still correct?  I'm just trying to solve my mind fart on the issue, which it has. I believe.
> 
> Thanks




Yeah, hes not coming back


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## forgiven1

WOW, 9 year old aged cheese.   The ideas passed around here are gonna cost me so much time and money!!    mr t, you are really livin' the dream :)   Thanks for sharing.


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