# Fermenting Pickles.... my first attempt.... Update 10/8/12



## daveomak (Aug 21, 2012)

Several members "ferment" foods....  I have read threads and posts and watched videos on how easy it was....   so, with the garden in full swing, I ordered air locks etc...  

Here is my first ever batch of fermented vegetables.....  I notice the air bubbles in the jar..... they have been taken care of....   The lid is from the store and I drilled a hole with a step drill so the air lock would just penetrate about 3/4"....  Looking around and checking the web for "food safe plastics" I found that most plastic containers like the one pictured below are "PET" or "PETE".... (they are the same) and would work fine....  So I drilled a hole in it as an example....  

The recipe is easy... no boiling....   No pressure cooker....   I like it.... In a week or so I will have some taste test results....  

Recipe below for those interested.... 













cukes first batch.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Aug 21, 2012






"PET" and "PETE" are food safe containers.....  













empty container.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Aug 21, 2012






All the reading I did and surfing the web, I decided to buy a book....  Fermenting for Idiots or something like that....  

I had to tweak the recipe a bit and I am looking for help, if the salt amount is correct.... the recipe called for 1 Tbs of (fine sea salt) per cup of water.... Since all I had was pickling salt, I measured 1 Tbs and weighed it.... It weighed about 18-19 grams so I rounded the amount for simplicity to 20 grams per cup of distilled water.....  Is that OK.??... within guidelines ??  I suppose the taste test will tell the truth.... My concern is there were no guidelines for wt. / wt. ingredients (as if this was not scientific and "close" was OK....)  

13    ----       4"pickles

10   -----      crushed cloves garlic

4     -----      chili japones

1       ---       grape leaf........   rinsed if necessary (freshly picked from the garden)(next batch I may use 2-4, depending on the tannin taste and crispness)  

                   The grape leaf is supposed to add tannin to keep the cukes crisp or use black tea or horseradish leaf....

4 cups ----   distilled water

80 grams   ---    Morton's pickling salt (I may switch to Sea Salt for added minerals)

Dill weed   ---  All that was left from brides pickling cukes....  not that much as you can see....

Jar and stuff was washed with hot soapy water, rinsed w/hot water, rinsed w/vinegar.....

cukes -- flower ends cut off...... scrubbed...... iced for an hour...  

garlic, dill, chili's, grape leaf added to the jar..... salt dissolved in the distilled water.....  chilled cukes added to the jar..... brine added to the jar..... lid w/airlock screwed onto the jar..

Now, about grape leaves.... I have some in the dehydrator for fermenting stock this winter.... are dried leaves OK to use ??  Will they lose tannin ???  

Thanks for looking and your help....  I need all the help I can get.....    

Dave


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## diggingdogfarm (Aug 21, 2012)

That's a lot of salt Dave, an 8.8% brine, the most that I would use is 5.4%, and that produces a fairly salty pickle.
Half-sours are usually made in about a 3.6% brine.
One thing to consider, the higher the salt level the more difficult it is to kick-start the fermentation process, that's especially true in summer with high temperatures, so it's imperative to
keep the pickles as close to 65 degrees as possible during fermentation.

The only other potential red flag i see is scrubbing the cukes, scrubbing them too much can limit the natural beneficial bacteria on the surface (the starter you want to triiger fermentation), causing problems.

I don't foresee a major problem with using dried leaves, while I've never tried it, we know that tannins are well preserved in dried tea, etc.

HTH

~Martin


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## hogrider47 (Aug 21, 2012)

Hi there Dave  I have a 1 gallon jar with an air lock in the lid like yours. I have made sauerkraut in it now like you I want to make some dill pickles in it. Your recipe looks good. I have one that says to fill jar to just under the rim with cukes then add 2 cups of distilled water with 3 tbls of celtic sea salt dissolved in it. finnish filling jar with more distilled water to top it off them put a weight on top and screw on cap with air lock and let sit for 4 days between 60 and 70 degrees. then remove air lock plug the hole or replace lid with one that has no hole and keep in fridge of up to a few months. I think I'll make a jar myself  Good Luck and keep in touch how you make out  Ed


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## badbob (Aug 21, 2012)

Hey Dave, you can use regular oak leaves or tea bags for the tannin if you ever have trouble finding grape leaves. I use 'em. I have plenty of oak trees and no tea trees or grape vines.


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## smokinhusker (Aug 21, 2012)

Wow that is way cool! I'm interested in the taste test, so I'll be looking for the update!

Those are some beautiful cukes btw.


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## daveomak (Aug 21, 2012)

DiggingDogFarm said:


> That's a lot of salt Dave, an 8.8% brine, the most that I would use is 5.4%, and that produces a fairly salty pickle.
> Half-sours are usually made in about a 3.6% brine.





Hogrider47 said:


> Hi there Dave  I have a 1 gallon jar with an air lock in the lid like yours. I have made sauerkraut in it now like you I want to make some dill pickles in it. Your recipe looks good. I have one that says to fill jar to just under the rim with cukes then add 2 cups of distilled water with 3 tbls of celtic sea salt dissolved in it. finnish filling jar with more distilled water to top it off them put a weight on top and screw on cap with air lock and let sit for 4 days between 60 and 70 degrees. then remove air lock plug the hole or replace lid with one that has no hole and keep in fridge of up to a few months. I think I'll make a jar myself  Good Luck and keep in touch how you make out  Ed


Ed, evening.... Lets share notes on this process.... Sounds like we are both pretty green when it comes to this pickling thing....  You are way ahead of me on sauerkraut.... haven't made any yet...  Kraut and Kimchi are on my to-do list for now....  I love cabbage....


BadBob said:


> Hey Dave, you can use regular oak leaves or tea bags for the tannin if you ever have trouble finding grape leaves. I use 'em. I have plenty of oak trees and no tea trees or grape vines.


What kind of Oak leaves are you using ???  We have scrub Oak here.... I don't know it's real name... only if you water it, it will die....

If the grape leaves work OK, I will try the dried ones....


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## chef jimmyj (Aug 22, 2012)

Looks like a great simple set up. Good luck...JJ


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## daveomak (Aug 22, 2012)

DiggingDogFarm said:


> That's a lot of salt Dave, an 8.8% brine, the most that I would use is 5.4%, and that produces a fairly salty pickle.
> Half-sours are usually made in about a 3.6% brine.
> One thing to consider, the higher the salt level the more difficult it is to kick-start the fermentation process, that's especially true in summer with high temperatures, so it's imperative to
> keep the pickles as close to 65 degrees as possible during fermentation.
> ...


Martin...  If I make a 5% brine.  wt/wt  water/salt....  does the weight of the pickle figure in there at all ??   Some recipes I have been reading today call for........3 Tbs. salt / pound veggies then add water to cover....    

The more I read, the more confused I get.....   kind of like adding cure to meat.. each type of meat and curing process, the amount / pound changes.... thanks for taking the time to help me and other interested parties out on this subject....


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## diggingdogfarm (Aug 22, 2012)

DaveOmak said:


> Martin...  If I make a 5% brine.  wt/wt  water/salt....  does the weight of the pickle figure in there at all ??



No, in this case you want the brine to be of a particular concentration to discourage nasties.
I'm sure that there is a way to do it as an equilibrium brine so that you have a starting brine concentration enough to discourage the nasties as well as the proper amount of salt to eliminate the possibly of over salting, but I haven't experimented with that.....maybe someday.


~Martin


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## tennsmoker (Aug 22, 2012)

Dave, you are finally in to something that I could share some insight.. I have been canning from the garden for at least 20 yrs now and the_* kosher dill pickles *_are one of my favorites, the favorite are the jalapenos. 

First I started with the same approach that you are doing "*my own recipe" or trying to perfect one, *well after about three season's and numerous recipes I discovered something off the shelf that was 10 times better and pretty much fool proof!!

Everyone in this family and my other family back in Tex says they are better than anything off the shelf.

I guess a similar analogy would be to make a great batch of Summer Sausage or Snack Sticks, it's hard to beat AC Leggs or one of the other well known sausage Co's, I think you would agree.

If you want to try my recipe I will gladly share It with you. The #1 trick is opening a jar of pickles or peppers two or three yrs after canning that are still crunchy. I have eaten many canned pickles/peppers that somebody else made 6 mos or yr later that is already mushy!!

Do you still have cucumbers?? mine are all gone!! Here are some Q-View's.

Al













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__ tennsmoker
__ Aug 22, 2012


















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__ tennsmoker
__ Aug 22, 2012


















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__ tennsmoker
__ Aug 22, 2012






haven't bought pickles, peppers or tomatoes in at least 15 yrs


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## tennsmoker (Aug 22, 2012)

Please guys,

this is not a hi-jack, just replying to Dave's pickle project

Al


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## ironhorse07 (Aug 22, 2012)

I would be interested. Been lurking on these threads to try this myself this year.


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## daveomak (Aug 22, 2012)




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## tennsmoker (Aug 23, 2012)

Morning Dave,

thanks for looking & the compliment.  _*Send me a pickle!! LOL*_

Al


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## thoseguys26 (Aug 23, 2012)

What type of tea / bags would one use to replace the grape leaves?


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## daveomak (Aug 24, 2012)

thoseguys26 said:


> What type of tea / bags would one use to replace the grape leaves?


One recipe recommends "black tea".....  white oak, horseradish

http://www.pickl-it.com/faq/373/high-level-tannins-white-oak-grape-leaves/


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## diggingdogfarm (Aug 24, 2012)

FWIW, I don't like oak leaves, the flavor is too strong.

Bay leaves are another option, and they add flavor, although I have no idea how much tannin they contain relative to grape leaves.

~Martin


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## daveomak (Aug 24, 2012)

OK..... Here is batch #2....    5% pickling salt brine solution...(per Diggy)...  and 1 horseradish leaf.....  

So now we have an 8.8% and a 5% brine mix to test the saltiness and a grape leaf and a horseradish leaf for tannins and crispiness to the pickles....  Fermenting is so easy and fast preparation time..... I really am looking forward to the taste test....  

Spices are the same as batch #1.... can't change too much stuff at one time....  DUH.. 

I missed picking the cukes one day... they sure grow fast....   may take awhile for these big guys to pickle properly....  

What do I know ??? nothing....  I'm learning though... 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






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  .... every day you learn something don't count toward your days allowed on earth...   "anonymous"













batch #2.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Aug 24, 2012


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## thoseguys26 (Aug 24, 2012)

Looking great! I know exactly what you mean about the cucumbers. I can't believe how fast they can grow!

I've gotta try this.


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## thoseguys26 (Aug 24, 2012)

Oh yeah, Tennsmoker, If I see a tornado I'll be camping out in your cellar! Love it.


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## thoseguys26 (Aug 24, 2012)

Dave, what was the amount of salt per cup of water to get 5%?


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## daveomak (Aug 24, 2012)

1 quart = 32 oz.... 5% of 32 oz = 1.6 oz / qt.  = 0.4 oz / cup  =  11.3 grs salt / cup.....   That is the way I have to figure out this stuff....   

or  32 oz x 28.35 grs/oz = 907 grs/qt  /  4 = 226 grs./cup @ 5% =  11.3 grs salt/cup for a 5% solution... 

Volume measurement is too inaccurate to get any kind of consistency.....   Dave


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## thoseguys26 (Aug 26, 2012)

I'm right behind you Dave, thanks for the info and the help and the experiment!













Screen Shot 2012-08-26 at 12.18.03 AM.jpg



__ thoseguys26
__ Aug 26, 2012


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## daveomak (Oct 8, 2012)

Results are in...Taste test today..... 6 weeks pickling time....at 66 deg F.... 

Batch #1 was bland, not very crisp..... kinda not too good, but edible...  not salty to me.....  I'll have to find someway to improve them... don't want to throw them out.... liquor in the jar remained clear throughout the aging process....

Batch #2 was somewhat flavorful, fairly crisp, in fact better than some store bought for crispness.... not enough dill or garlic or heat flavor and not salty.....  the jar was cloudy during the aging process... maybe it had to do with less salt and/or horseradish leaf....  darned if I know..... I think I could slightly taste the tannin, not sure there either.... 

Diggy suggeested the 5% brine.... (read diggy's post #2)  I'm sticking to that brine mix....  Horseradish leaves being bigger might be why more tannin and the crisper pickle...  I'll contemplate that...   A lot more dill, garlic and hot peppers and we may have something that closely resembles a decent dill pickle...  I like the fresh taste better than vinegar I think.... It is different... more like "real" food...

OK, take it for what it is worth.... that is my test for this year..... I put the jars in the fridge and will taste them in another month or so....  

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Batch #1

All the reading I did and surfing the web, I decided to buy a book....  Fermenting for Idiots or something like that....  

I had to tweak the recipe a bit and I am looking for help, if the salt amount is correct.... the recipe called for 1 Tbs of (fine sea salt) per cup of water.... Since all I had was pickling salt, I measured 1 Tbs and weighed it.... It weighed about 18-19 grams so I rounded the amount for simplicity to 20 grams per cup of distilled water.....  Is that OK.??... within guidelines ??  I suppose the taste test will tell the truth.... My concern is there were no guidelines for wt. / wt. ingredients (as if this was not scientific and "close" was OK....)  

13    ----       4"pickles

10   -----      crushed cloves garlic

4     -----      chili japones

*1       ---       grape leaf..*......   rinsed if necessary (freshly picked from the garden)(next batch I may use 2-4, depending on the tannin taste and crispness)  

                   The grape leaf is supposed to add tannin to keep the cukes crisp or use black tea or horseradish leaf....

4 cups ----   distilled water

80 grams   ---    Morton's pickling salt (I may switch to Sea Salt for added minerals)  

Dill weed   ---  All that was left from brides pickling cukes....  not that much as you can see....

Jar and stuff was washed with hot soapy water, rinsed w/hot water, rinsed w/vinegar.....

cukes -- flower ends cut off...... scrubbed...... iced for an hour...  

garlic, dill, chili's, grape leaf added to the jar..... salt dissolved in the distilled water.....  chilled cukes added to the jar..... brine added to the jar..... lid w/airlock screwed onto the jar..

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

OK..... Here is batch #2....    5% pickling salt brine solution...(per Diggy)...  and 1 horseradish leaf.....  

*So now we have an 8.8% and a 5% brine mix to test *the saltiness and a grape leaf and a horseradish leaf for tannins and crispiness to the pickles....  Fermenting is so easy and fast preparation time..... I really am looking forward to the taste test....  

Spices are the same as batch #1.... can't change too much stuff at one time....  DUH..


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## whistech (Nov 18, 2012)

I found this site has information on pickles that you are making.     The product they are trying to sell looks similar to your homemade version.

http://www.pickl-it.com/blog/636/brine-recommendations/


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## dirtsailor2003 (Nov 30, 2012)

TennSmoker said:


> *the favorite are the jalapenos. *


I'd like to know more about those! My better half has been asj=king me to pickle some up!


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