# What am I doing wrong with this  pellet grill? - help if you can please - pics enclosed



## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

Hello,

I tried to use my pellet grill again yesterday.

I cooked 2 racks of spare ribs at 275 just under 4 hours total and they were nasty and burned flavor from the grease burning.

I cooked them 3 hours at 275 on the smoker flat with some rub and spritzed with apple juice a few times, then wrapped for 45 minutes then sauced for 5-10 and done.

The Cabelas ( camp chef dlx ) pit was clean when I started, I even ran it earlier in the week and just burned off anything that was lingering at 400. The pit is level and drains into the bucket.

Pics show the handful of burned fat/grease that was left after the cook.  Is this the expected behavior of this grill?

Do all models of pellet grills do this?

Is it better to run these low and slow so the fast is less apt to burn?  What is the point of this pit running at 500 then?

I must be missing something or is this just an oven that everything is to be cooked in a pan?

Really scratching my head and any input would be appreciated.

thanks in advance!

my Google pics - 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/5YhmqBedlkxdAEJh2

https://photos.app.goo.gl/nPj9CrWfAMNt9LRB2

thanks haeffnkr


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## unclebubbas bbq (Jul 31, 2017)

Try kicking the temperature down to 225 to see if you still get the heavy smoke from the grease. I also wrap my drip pan with HD foil, makes clean up very easy. Dumb question but is there a heat shield above the fire pot?


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

UncleBubbas BBQ said:


> Try kicking the temperature down to 225 to see if you still get the heavy smoke from the grease. I also wrap my drip pan with HD foil, makes clean up very easy. Dumb question but is there a heat shield above the fire pot?


Hi,

I can try that and see what happens at 225.

I asked the foil or not to foil question before and more suggested to not foil, but yes clean up would be easier.

Does adding foil change the heat transfer overall for the grill?

Yes there is a heat shield under the grease pan.

thanks haeffnkr


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## lovethemeats (Jul 31, 2017)

Thats what it sounds to me to. Way to high of temp. By reading the post. Sounds like you were trying to speed cook them. Low and slow is the motto for all smoking of meats. I don't have a pellet grill but the temps seem way to high. 
Something to remember. Even if a car can go 220mpg. Do you open it up to that speed and just go all the time at that speed. No.  Temps at the high range is ment for certain foods when you want to sear them to lock in the juices and then cook them the rest of the way on a lower heat. Try to step back and let your unit do the work at a slower pace. You will like what you end up with.


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

Hello,

Are you saying that 275 is too high for a grill that goes up to 500 plus?

Most guys now are cooking pork at 275 to 300 from what I am reading.

thanks haeffnkr


lovethemeats said:


> Thats what it sounds to me to. Way to high of temp. By reading the post. Sounds like you were trying to speed cook them. Low and slow is the motto for all smoking of meats. I don't have a pellet grill but the temps seem way to high.
> Something to remember. Even if a car can go 220mpg. Do you open it up to that speed and just go all the time at that speed. No. Temps at the high range is ment for certain foods when you want to sear them to lock in the juices and then cook them the rest of the way on a lower heat. Try to step back and let your unit do the work at a slower pace. You will like what you end up with.


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## unclebubbas bbq (Jul 31, 2017)

275 is not too high to cook ribs at. You need to trouble shoot 1st to see the cause of the problem. I once cranked my RECTEC up to 450 with a greasy drip tray, the tray caught on fire and a plume of heavy white smoke poured out of the smoker. Never mind scorching the powder coat finish.  After cleaning it I tried 500 with perfect results. No more smoke

So I recommend starting at 225 or 235 to see what the unit will do, everyone I personally know with a pellet grill always uses foil on their drip tray, it's just so much easier


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## unclebubbas bbq (Jul 31, 2017)

One more question, what type of pellets are you using? If you are home heating pellets that could also be a large part of the problem


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## bregent (Jul 31, 2017)

I prefer cooking ribs at 275 and have never had a problem. Takes about 3 hours and I don't wrap. 

275 is certainly not too high and you should not get burning grease at that temp.  I suspect the problem might be that the temperature was spiking high above your set temp which caused the grease to burn. Did you monitor the temp swings?


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

UncleBubbas BBQ said:


> One more question, what type of pellets are you using? If you are home heating pellets that could also be a large part of the problem


Lumberjack, multiple flavor, same results.  No not heating pellets.

thanks for asking.

haeffnkr


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

bregent said:


> I prefer cooking ribs at 275 and have never had a problem. Takes about 3 hours and I don't wrap.
> 
> 275 is certainly not too high and you should not get burning grease at that temp.  I suspect the problem might be that the temperature was spiking high above your set temp which caused the grease to burn. Did you monitor the temp swings?


I monitored the pit temps with a known accurate bbq thermometer that was placed close to the factory probe and the 2 read the same or very close  to the same temps for the whole cook.

What I dont know is how hot the grease pan was when the pit temp was 275 measured 5 to 6 inches above it.  I have a infrared thermometer that I can check the grease pan temps and see how hot it is. If that grease pan is 400 to 500 and is burning everything that drips on it, like I am experiencing then that is a design issue and I need to add and insulate another sheet pan on top of the grease pan.... or sell this unit.

thanks haeffnkr


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## bigtrain74 (Jul 31, 2017)

The drip tray needs to be 100% clean if you are not using foil. Otherwise it burn and yes, you get nasty tasting food. I know ruining a few meals.


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## bregent (Jul 31, 2017)

haeffnkr said:


> I monitored the pit temps with a known accurate bbq thermometer that was placed close to the factory probe and the 2 read the same or very close  to the same temps for the whole cook.
> 
> What I dont know is how hot the grease pan was when the pit temp was 275 measured 5 to 6 inches above it.  I have a infrared thermometer that I can check the grease pan temps and see how hot it is.
> 
> thanks haeffnkr


I'm sure the grease pan is higher than 275, but surprised that it's getting hot enough to burn the grease. I don't recall if I cooked ribs at 275 when I owned my CampChef, but that's the only way I cook em on my Memphis. 

>Does adding foil change the heat transfer overall for the grill?

Yes, foil is a reflector and will reduce the amount of radiant energy coming from below. In your case, maybe this will be helpful. If I were you, I would trying going down to 250 and test a single rack, and if that doesn't work, down to 225.


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

BigTrain74 said:


> The drip tray needs to be 100% clean if you are not using foil. Otherwise it burn and yes, you get nasty tasting food. I know ruining a few meals.


Good point, thanks.

It was clean when I started, all scraped clean,  even ran it on Wednesday up to 400 with no food to burn off anything that lingered from 2 weekends ago.

thanks for input.

haeffnkr


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

bregent said:


> I'm sure the grease pan is higher than 275, but surprised that it's getting hot enough to burn the grease. I don't recall if I cooked ribs at 275 when I owned my CampChef, but that's the only way I cook em on my Memphis.
> 
> >Does adding foil change the heat transfer overall for the grill?
> 
> Yes, foil is a reflector and will reduce the amount of radiant energy coming from below. In your case, maybe this will be helpful. If I were you, I would trying going down to 250 and test a single rack, and if that doesn't work, down to 225.


Makes sense...thanks.

I will add foil and/or add another sheet pan above the grease pan to try and lower the temp and get it closer to pit temp and not screaming hot in which it must be 400 plus when when the pit is at 275.


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## bigtrain74 (Jul 31, 2017)

another tip, make sure your grill is flat or even tilted down to the right (towards the grease bucket) so it flows out of the grill and doesnt linger around.


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## chef jimmyj (Jul 31, 2017)

Pictures are worth a 1000 words. I have seen that burnt Carbon, not grease, many times...The problem? Burning Sugar. Sucrose, wht/brn sugar burns, at 320+. Fructose in Apple juice or honey, around 230. Guys that smoke in the average pit at 275 have no issue because dripping sugar hits a 275 surface and does not burn. In your pellet grill the rack is at 275 but the grease tray over the burn pot, where you are dripping, is likely close to 500°F. The burning sugar is giving a bitter smoke. To use your rub and spritz, not really needed at temps below 300, cut your temp to 200-225. Having lined the drip tray with foil, put 3-4 hours of smoke on them ribs.Take the ribs off and remove the dripped on foil. Increase the grill temp to 300. While heating, foil your ribs with whatever and cook about a hour more or to desired doneness or lT. If you want crispier bark, crank the heat again, to 500. Remove the foiled ribs and carefully open the pouches. Place the pouches on the grill  for a few minutes to caramelize and crisp. Since nothing will be dripping in the hot tray, you won't get nasty smoke.

The other option is to stay the current course of temp and time but use a sugar free rub like SPOG and drink the apple juice. Only stuff dripping and vaporizing will be fat and a little meat juices and they taste good...JJ


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## retiredbadge (Jul 31, 2017)

I use the 3-2-1 method at 200-230 degrees on my traeger. I wrap after the first 3 hours.  Mine always turn out fantastic.


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## bregent (Jul 31, 2017)

>The other option is to stay the current course of temp and time but use a sugar free rub like SPOG and drink the apple juice.

>Only stuff dripping and vaporizing will be fat and a little meat juices and they taste good!...JJ 

That's an excellent point. Burnt sugar is a likely culprit. I know a lot of PelletHeads that follow the Fast Eddy method for ribs. That method includes coating the ribs with brown sugar, then rub, then cook for 3 hours at 275 and finish with a glaze. However, some pellet grill owners report that the sugar burns on their pellet grills at that temp - so they omit the sugar and everything is fine.


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## haeffnkr (Jul 31, 2017)

So... I play with the grill tonight... I opened up the pit to find this lovely mess. Do all pellet grills blow the ash around like this?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/A0g1Zqbf2duec4Et1 \

I cleaned it up and put it back together and put my thermometer next to the factory one and set the controller at 275.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/ViIup3HtAUIAkrJr1

I come back after 30 minutes to find my pit is running around 15 to 20 degrees hotter than advertised.....ugh

https://photos.app.goo.gl/pqOWuyWOevzopb8a2

I read the temp from the grease pan at 350 to 370.... UGH.... and when I tried to read the temp of the actual grate it always read about the same ... 350 to 370 ish... more UGHHHH

https://photos.app.goo.gl/4hBuc3rtN93g95ms1 https://photos.app.goo.gl/Ffwp68aGrEYaETjF2

But it did sort of make sense that the temp 6 inches above the bottom grate... where the temp probes and say the pit is 275ish... that the upper grate is at 270ish.... make sense sort of I guess.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/cjInEN4MlzQx2I2Q2

Then I crank it up to 300 and come back 15 minutes later and to find the grate temp is 470 .... love that feature :)

https://photos.app.goo.gl/jdfzrrX12GSRIM5I2

Lets review.... at 275

- Factory probe measures about 15 degrees lower than expected 

- Grate temps where I cook are 75 to 100 degrees hotter than I expected and is WELL with in the temps of burn anything that touches it.

- Upper grate is very close to advertised temp

- at 300.... way too hot..... 

I guess tomorrow I can try it at high and low smoke and see what happens... the manual says essentially cook pork at low temps. Maybe the swing at 200 is less than 275 and 300. More to come when I hear from Cust Service.....

Oh and one more thing... I run over to Costco to see a Traeger/Camp Chef/Cabelas/you name company grill with very similar parts. As in the stainless handles, grate, exhaust chimney, almost exact same fire box, heat deflector and grease pan??

https://photos.app.goo.gl/GoexVuibb4SJu5Q93

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Y7yYdpGF61IA8rKZ2

thanks for all the help, keep it coming

haeffnkr


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## unclebubbas bbq (Aug 1, 2017)

The ash under the drip pan is normal. I usually take mine apart and vacuum out about every 3 cooks. I once did a long cook on a brisket and it was windy, my brisket was cover in ash...I never new I had to clean it out....that won't ever happen again


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## wanna-be-smoker (Aug 1, 2017)

with mine I have cooked at all different temps with the drip pan covered/not covered/cleaned/not cleaned and never had any issues with any excessive smoking or burnt smell or flavors. If/when you fold make sure the foil is as flat as possible with no wrinkles or the drippings will have a hard time running off into the bucket.


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## zerowin (Aug 1, 2017)

wanna-be-smoker said:


> with mine I have cooked at all different temps with the drip pan covered/not covered/cleaned/not cleaned and never had any issues with any excessive smoking or burnt smell or flavors. If/when you fold make sure the foil is as flat as possible with no wrinkles or the drippings will have a hard time running off into the bucket.


I'd say I have the same experience.  I've had a drip tray foiled with lots of burned on stuff and ran mine hot this weekend and didn't have any off taste in the food, but I don't doubt JJ's wisdom on burn temps at all.

My only question is do you leave the pellets in the hopper or auger all the time, or do you clean them out completely after each cook?  My first small pork shoulder had a burned off taste to it which I believe was from humidity in the pellets.  They didn't burn clean completely, and I think there was excess in the burn pot just smoldering until clean pellets ran through and lit properly.  Since then, I always put a bowl under it and feed the remaining auger pellets out with a few feed cycles.


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## wanna-be-smoker (Aug 1, 2017)

for me i fill the hopper and never empty it and just use whats in there until such time its close to being gone and I add the next flavor of pellet to try out. My cooker sits on the front porch in all (summer and will prob put in the garage in the winter) weather with no issues that have been noticeable.

Im still relatively new to my pellet cooker and still trying to figure out whats best pellet and what not. But so far i have tried hickory/mesquite and apple and they all are a bit stronger than what my family likes. The pit boss competition blend has been spot on for them in all sizes and cuts of meat.


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## bregent (Aug 1, 2017)

The ash is normal and the difference in temp between the controller and a third party thermometer is well within the norm. Also, most pellet grill temps will swing at least +/- 10F, and my DLX was much worse. I've never measured the temp of the drip pan, but it doesn't seem unusual. I'd expect it to be quite a bit higher than the air temp that the controller is measuring. 

Getting back to your original problem, did you have a lot of sugar in your rub?


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## haeffnkr (Aug 1, 2017)

bregent said:


> The ash is normal and the difference in temp between the controller and a third party thermometer is well within the norm. Also, most pellet grill temps will swing at least +/- 10F, and my DLX was much worse. I've never measured the temp of the drip pan, but it doesn't seem unusual. I'd expect it to be quite a bit higher than the air temp that the controller is measuring.
> 
> Getting back to your original problem, did you have a lot of sugar in your rub?


Yes I had some sugar - it was this recipe - http://www.slapyodaddybbq.com/2012/02/syd-all-purpose-rub/.  

While I understand sugar will burn sooner than fat, etc... if anything drips on a 400 or more degree metal plate it will burn.

I never had a problem with the pellets and wet, unit is stored in the garage between uses.

Cust Service said the ash level blowing around in the pit is expected.

They are testing a grill today to see what the temps are.

They are saying I am the first to bring this to their attention, which seems odd to me because of how this oven is designed. She was explaining to me how this oven works... which I get... it needs to be hotter closer to the fire box and the fans will blow the heat around the grease pan .... but if the grease pan is 75 to 150 degrees over your set temp things will burn as I see it.  Any metal plate that is close to 400 or hotter will burn things.

If your pizza has some cheese and toppings fall to the bottom of the oven in your house, especially a gas oven, it will burn and stink. Same principal... lots of direct heat under smoking hot metal and heat rolling around the edges onto your food. 

I will test again tonight with my set temp lower and see what the grease pan and lower grate measure.

Seems like I will have to insulate with foil or metal pans between the grease pan and lower grate to keep the burning to a minimum as I see it.

thanks haeffnkr


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## wanna-be-smoker (Aug 1, 2017)

bregent said:


> The ash is normal and the difference in temp between the controller and a third party thermometer is well within the norm. Also, most pellet grill temps will swing at least +/- 10F, and my DLX was much worse. I've never measured the temp of the drip pan, but it doesn't seem unusual. I'd expect it to be quite a bit higher than the air temp that the controller is measuring.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Did you get rid of your DLX ?? and if so what was the biggest reason and what did you replace it with


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## bregent (Aug 1, 2017)

wanna-be-smoker said:


> bregent said:
> 
> 
> > The ash is normal and the difference in temp between the controller and a third party thermometer is well within the norm. Also, most pellet grill temps will swing at least +/- 10F, and my DLX was much worse. I've never measured the temp of the drip pan, but it doesn't seem unusual. I'd expect it to be quite a bit higher than the air temp that the controller is measuring.
> ...


I ended up returning the DLX to CC after 5 or 6 months when it developed severe temperature swings and flame outs that CC could not resolve. We replaced just about every component but the problem persisted. Never was able to trace the root cause of the issue. 

I ended up getting a Memphis Elite that had only been used once.


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## haeffnkr (Aug 1, 2017)

Hello,
Cust Service response - 

_Hello 

Thank you for your email. It does not look like your receipt was attached to the email I received. However, we will still get the parts shipped out as quickly as possible. 

Our engineers got back with me from their testing today with the following info. They have tested out a couple grills and found that all of them do have a high temperature on the drip pan and grill grate. They said this is normal and was pre designed. I do apologize, they were not able to find a way to insulate, to decrease the heat without causing temperature swings to accrue. The reason they get hot is heat transfer, when the air convents up and around the drip tray into the main body of the grill. This is what causes the temperature in increase in the drip tray and cooking grate. They explained that it is similar to an oven, when you move food down closer to the element, it will increase in temperature the closer you get no matter what the temperature you set it too.

I do apologize for this confusion on this situation. As I said before, this has not been brought to our attention before. However, now this has been tested, and we know this is normal. We have sold thousands of these with great reviews. I know as a consumer myself, I can understand the confusion and frustration, but now we know that these temps are normal.

Best Regards,
Camp Chef
Warranty Dept._

I also spoke with one of their engineers about the grill and how he uses it, he has one that he has used frequently for 4 years.
Basically he uses it at low smoke ( 225 ) for long cooks and ramps it up if foiled to finish. He never has run this smoker and 275 for hours. He has run it 325 for chicken. 
He basically said when they tested it is working as designed, just like the oven in my house.... hotter on the bottom plate then the air temp on the racks. 
I was the first person to bring this to their attention. 

To Note - 
Everyone I have talked to has been more than nice to me at Camp Chef.

Next steps - 
I will check the temps at 225 ( low smoke ) and see what the grate temps and drip pan temps and adjust my process from their. 
I will also test with foil and or another pan under the grate and try to block some of the heat coming off drip pan. 

thanks haeffnkr


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## wanna-be-smoker (Aug 2, 2017)

so far in my experience camp chef has been great in their customer service. I called them yesterday on a couple meat probes that went wacky and with no questions asked they sent me out totally free two new replacement probes.


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## chef jimmyj (Aug 2, 2017)

The Rub used is 25% Sugar. Give a good coat of rub then start washing it off with sugary Apple Juice and you might as well be pouring Pancake Syrup on the 400°F+ Drip Shield...It's going to Burn and give the meat a bitter flavor. Anyone that cooks a steak on a Gas Grill has seen a lot of the smoke flavor comes from vaporizing fat and meat juices burning an giving flavor. Burning fat and meat juices taste good but burning sugar, not so much...JJ


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## jtrainor56 (Aug 3, 2017)

I run my Yoder at 250* to 275* for everything I smoke and never have seen that problem. I do not foil my deflector plate, never foil ribs and may foil a whole brisket or boston butts is the stall is taking long or just want to get done. Someone did a test on all of the common pellets on the market and found that BBQ Delight produced the least amount of ash and Lumberjack the most. In over three years I have only used BBQ Delight, never empty the hopper and my smoker sits out on an uncovered deck 24/7 365 days a year. It's covered when not used and never had a problem with pellets. Living in SE PA the summers are humid.

I think that with the burn pot in the middle the deflector plate is going to run hotter, the Yoder has the fire grate on the left side with the hopper and there is an adjustable damper on the right that lets me control the temps under the deflector. I think you may want to drop the temps down to 230* and see how your next smoke goes. I am of the belief that the meat will be done when it is done and never plan on a specific time, If I have to start early I can always keep the food warm but using the FTC method.


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