# No more 225˚. I'm a convert.



## mdboatbum (Jun 16, 2012)

I'd been wanting to try doing ribs at a higher temperature. Finally got around to it this week. 275˚ for a little over 2 hours, then foiled for an hour or so, then another 45 minutes or so without foil. BOOM, nailed it!! No fatty taste, moist and juicy with just the right tug. Plenty of smoke flavor as well. Granted, I was using Hickory chunks, so I'm not sure if a milder wood would be the same, but I think it would probably be ok.

So it takes less time and renders the fat much better. I'm extremely pleased with the results. Sorry no pics, but we were with friends and I didn't have a chance to take any.


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## chef jimmyj (Jun 16, 2012)

Your plan sounds interesting. I have not gone above 250*...JJ


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## kryinggame (Jun 16, 2012)

What type of ribs did you use?

What equipment did you use? Grill or Smoker.

Which rib did you use?


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## mdboatbum (Jun 16, 2012)

Sorry, forgot to mention they were St. Louis Spares. All natural, not enhanced. I applied a basic rub (spog, paprika and cumin plus a couple other things, can't remember exactly) the day before. Smoked on my mini WSM.


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## kryinggame (Jun 16, 2012)

I'm going to give this a try in my MES. I usually smoke btwn 225 - 230. To be honest, I've never been thrilled with the outcome but friends love it.  I usually use Jeff's rub but the last time, I added to much cumin and it my opinion, it ruined the ribs. It has a thick grainy taste.e

Thanks for the post!


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## mdboatbum (Jun 16, 2012)

The one thing that was bugging me about my ribs was the fat. It seemed no matter what I did, at lower temps I just wasn't getting it to render out. If I went longer, it'd break down the meat too much. I was getting the overall texture I wanted, but there was still just too much fat. I, like many of you on here I suspect, was afraid to deviate too much from the old stand by 225˚ Now I will say one thing. I did 3 racks. 2 were dead on perfect, but the 3rd one, which was maybe 20% less meaty, was a little over done for my taste. Pretty much "fall off the bone". So there is still no substitute for watching VERY carefully during the last cooking phase.


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## alblancher (Jun 16, 2012)

I know a lot of the competition people cook at the higher temp.  Normally I cook ribs with the butts and brisket I have going on so I use the lower temps but when doing ribs by themselves I'll try the 275 - 280 temps

thanks for the post


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## kryinggame (Jun 16, 2012)

Mdboatbum said:


> The one thing that was bugging me about my ribs was the fat. It seemed no matter what I did, at lower temps I just wasn't getting it to render out. If I went longer, it'd break down the meat too much. I was getting the overall texture I wanted, but there was still just too much fat. I, like many of you on here I suspect, was afraid to deviate too much from the old stand by 225˚ Now I will say one thing. I did 3 racks. 2 were dead on perfect, but the 3rd one, which was maybe 20% less meaty, was a little over done for my taste. Pretty much "fall off the bone". So there is still no substitute for watching VERY carefully during the last cooking phase.


Now that I've had my coffee and I'm now fully awake, I read your posting again. The problem that I always have with ribs is fat. I hate biting into ribs and tasting the fat. I think you nailed it. You're not gonna get rid of the fat at low and slow. I just took a rack out of the freezer. Tomorrow, I'm going to put your theory to the test. Since I have an MES smoker and it will only go to 275, I'm going to smoke the rack at 275 to test it.

I do a lot of ribs but I'm never 100% satisfied and I think this is the reason why. 

Thanks for the education!


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## mdboatbum (Jun 16, 2012)

kryinggame said:


> Now that I've had my coffee and I'm now fully awake, I read your posting again. The problem that I always have with ribs is fat. I hate biting into ribs and tasting the fat. I think you nailed it. You're not gonna get rid of the fat at low and slow. I just took a rack out of the freezer. Tomorrow, I'm going to put your theory to the test. Since I have an MES smoker and it will only go to 275, I'm going to smoke the rack at 275 to test it.
> 
> I do a lot of ribs but I'm never 100% satisfied and I think this is the reason why.
> 
> Thanks for the education!


Haha, not so sure I'd call it education. I hope it works out for you. I have only one example so far, but the ribs did seem as fatty before smoking as the others I've been getting lately. I'm going to try again this weekend if my wife will let me back in the meat dept. at Costco:) She's been a trooper, but we've been having a lot of ribs and chicken lately. Let me know how yours goes!


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## danbono (Jun 16, 2012)

HI All I had the same problem with ribs being fatty/greasy both with Back Backs and St Louis ribs. Last time I smoked BB's at higher temps above 250,with apple wood chunks, DIDN'T foil.

Cooked for 6 hrs after 3 hrs I sprized with apple cider vinegar & apple juice every 1/2 hour. Came out much better my previous attempts. I have a Master Forge Electric vertical smoker the cheap kind.

I have 2 racks of St Louis I'm going to try next using the same method.

          http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/122484/ribs-n-butt

Dan


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## s2k9k (Jun 16, 2012)

I agree with the fattyness (is that even a word), I love ribs but I hate all the fat. I'm going to try the higher temp next time, Thanks for letting me know about this!


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## rabbithutch (Jun 16, 2012)

You guys kill me!

I've been struggling trying to learn how to manage the temp in my mini-WSM.  I haven't been able to keep it under 350* . . .  until yesterday, that is!  I changed out the pie pan heat sink for a 12" flower pot saucer filled with water.  I also started with about 10 lit coals and about 15 unlit around them and 4 or 5 chunks of hickory.  I put the ET-73 smoker probe through a piece of poplar and sync'd the XMIT/REC.  The Maverick went up to 215* and hung there for quite a bit but the thermometer I put through the side of my tamale pot showed a touch over 300*.  The 2 units have never been calibrated and were about 4" apart vertically.  After about an hour, I put in about 10 more unlit briquettes and noticed that the water was disappearing.  I think the stall was all about converting the heat to steam because as the water converted the temps rose.

I smoked at 200-225* for about 2.5 hours then foiled with apple juice and capful of apple cider vinegar and left them on for another 1-1.5 hours and let the temp drop back down.  I then unwrapped and put them on the grate with the temp about 100* for another 1/2 hour.  The couple of bits I tasted were good.  We will eat them tonight along with a rack I did last Wednesday at about 300* because I couldn't control the heat with that pie pan.

I'll report back if I can tell any difference in the 2 racks.


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## mdboatbum (Jun 16, 2012)

The flower pot saucer with no water really does make it dig right in at 225˚. Which Smokey Joe do you have, the Gold or Silver?


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## ecto1 (Jun 16, 2012)

I never had trouble with fat and I cook mine at 225.  Now I do trim as much fat off as I can before I cook them. There is more than one way to skin this cat so what works for you is what is best for you.  I know I will never cook a chicken under 350 again.


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## supercenterchef (Jun 17, 2012)

This seems in line with what the local BBQ joint guys are doing...they also seem to have good success without the foiling (I guess when you're doing that many, it becomes impractical) if you wanna experiment... ;)


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## kryinggame (Jun 17, 2012)

hey all,
I followed the advice and cooked a rack of st. louis ribs in my MES today but I cooked/smoked it at 275 degrees. What a difference it made--I to am now a convert.  I'll confess, I did overcook them a bit but theyre not bad. I put them in a bit after 11:30 this morning and then went to services.  At 4 hours, I sprayed with apple juice (I don't know why I didnt do th bend test). Then I checked it at the 5th hour and it broke in half.  I know this is a debated issue but at 225 degrees, I never got pull-back and was never impressed with the flavor.  Again, I use an electric smoker (perhaps its different on a grill). But at 275, I think the meat comes out nearly perfect--at least what I consider good ribs. 

Next week, I'm going to experiment again but since I'm smoking at a higher temperature, I'm going to start watching it closely after th 3rd hour.

Thanks all!


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## danbono (Jun 18, 2012)

HI All Smoked 2 racks of St Louis ribs yesterday. Used the higher temps were not as good as my 1st try at higher temps 250/280.

The ribs were fall off the bone , but on the dry side..Either I cooked them too long about 7 hrs, or tried this time with sand in the water pan. I foiled 1 rack for 2 1/2 hrs still both were on the dry side.

Next time back to the water pan for moisture, other  wise a good tasting rib. I use cherry wood this time.

Dan


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## mdboatbum (Jun 18, 2012)

DanBono said:


> HI All Smoked 2 racks of St Louis ribs yesterday. Used the higher temps were not as good as my 1st try at higher temps 250/280.
> 
> The ribs were fall off the bone , but on the dry side..Either I cooked them too long about 7 hrs, or tried this time with sand in the water pan. I foiled 1 rack for 2 1/2 hrs still both were on the dry side.
> 
> ...


I'd say you definitely overcooked them. At 275˚ mine are done in under 4 hours. Water in the pan makes very little difference in the overall moisture of your food. It's there as a heat sink. The sand will work as well or better in that regard.


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## j-dub 7 (Jun 18, 2012)

I was nervous because when I tested my new smoker, I just couldn't get it down anywhere near the 225 that is usually suggested. After reading your thread I just went ahead and did my first pork butt at around the 270-280 range, and it turned out incredible. I am a newbie, but I will definitely go this route again in the future.


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## jds22 (Jun 19, 2012)

Newbie question. I see that you used St. Louis spare ribs. If I was going to use baby backs, should I still shoot for a temp of 275? How long would you suggest I cook them?

I'm going to attempt ribs for my first time this Saturday so I'm trying to gather as much info as possible.

Thanks


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## mdboatbum (Jun 19, 2012)

jds22 said:


> Newbie question. I see that you used St. Louis spare ribs. If I was going to use baby backs, should I still shoot for a temp of 275? How long would you suggest I cook them?
> 
> I'm going to attempt ribs for my first time this Saturday so I'm trying to gather as much info as possible.
> 
> Thanks


Sorry to say it, but that all depends. It depends on the meatiness of your ribs, the humidity, the phase of the moon, they way you want your meat to be when it's finished etc.... For me, given the way I like ribs, I'd *start* with an hour and a half in the smoke, an hour in foil and then maybe 30-40 minutes back on the grate without foil. Just keep an eye on them. There are so many variables it's impossible to give an exact time. Since this is your first attempt, I'd suggest sticking to 225˚ and the 2-2-1 method. The reason being, it's been thoroughly researched and it works. Plus, at the lower temp, it'll give you more leeway. I'm not saying this stuff is difficult, but it does take a good bit of trial and error. I'm hoping you're not doing these ribs Saturday for a huge family gathering or something. If so, I'd get to the store now, stock up on ribs and start doing trial runs!! Also, read through the posts here on baby backs. There's a lot of fantastic information here, much better than any advice you'll get from me. Good luck and let us know how it goes.


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## jds22 (Jun 19, 2012)

Mdboatbum said:


> Sorry to say it, but that all depends. It depends on the meatiness of your ribs, the humidity, the phase of the moon, they way you want your meat to be when it's finished etc.... For me, given the way I like ribs, I'd *start* with an hour and a half in the smoke, an hour in foil and then maybe 30-40 minutes back on the grate without foil. Just keep an eye on them. There are so many variables it's impossible to give an exact time. Since this is your first attempt, I'd suggest sticking to 225˚ and the 2-2-1 method. The reason being, it's been thoroughly researched and it works. Plus, at the lower temp, it'll give you more leeway. I'm not saying this stuff is difficult, but it does take a good bit of trial and error. I'm hoping you're not doing these ribs Saturday for a huge family gathering or something. If so, I'd get to the store now, stock up on ribs and start doing trial runs!! Also, read through the posts here on baby backs. There's a lot of fantastic information here, much better than any advice you'll get from me. Good luck and let us know how it goes.


Thanks for the reply and great info. First of all, I am not feeding these to anybody but my wife and kids and there is a Pizza Hut close by for backup. I'm definitely trying out a few things first before inviting any friends over. I may take them some leftovers if it works out well or just keep them for myself. 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






I think I will go ahead with the 225 - 2-2-1 method as that is what I have read most about and was prepared to try before I read your post.  Hopefully it'll work out well and then I can experiment with different temps and such. It should be a good learning experience regardless of how they come out.

Thanks again,

Jerry


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## kryinggame (Jun 19, 2012)

275 will cook faster. Traditionally, folks follows the 3-2-1 method for spare ribs; thus about 6 hours or 2-2-1 for baby back; thuse 5 hours.  This is done at 225 degrees. I did st. louis ribs at 275 and by the 5th hour, it was more than done. 

To answer your question, after the 3rd hour and every preceeding hour at 275, I would check the doneness by using the bending method.  It's really difficult to say when they're done, other than saying, they're done when they're done.


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## testar77 (Jun 19, 2012)

I cooked my first ribs on Father's Day.  My smoker won't cook below 240-250.  I cooked Pork Spares and used the 3-2-1 method at 245-250 (mostly 250) and they came out VERY good.  Some of the best ribs I have had.  I think there must be a huge amount of leeway when cooking spares.  I was concerned about the higher temps but just kept an eye on them.  I didn't have any issues with fat at all.  They were extremely juicy and tender, but still had texture.

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/123410/finally-my-first-rib-smoke-qview-updated-w-finished-qview


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## kryinggame (Jul 7, 2012)

DANG IT, THESE RIBS ARE GREAT!!!

I used Jeff's rub last night on some baby back. Today, I smoked it at 275 degrees. 3 hours later, ABSOLUTELY PERFECT!!!

225 is dead.  275 degrees is on!!!


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## i bleed blue (Jul 8, 2012)

kryinggame said:


> DANG IT, THESE RIBS ARE GREAT!!!
> 
> I used Jeff's rub last night on some baby back. Today, I smoked it at 275 degrees. 3 hours later, ABSOLUTELY PERFECT!!!
> 
> 225 is dead.  275 degrees is on!!!


Was this done on your MES or you're GOSM. I am getting an AMNPS and my abandon my Electric Brinkmann for a MES or GOSM


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## smokinhusker (Jul 8, 2012)

I'd love to try them but my MES set at 275* still only gives me a 250-260* cabinet temp. Kryinggame, what is the actual cabinet temp of your MES with a set temp of 275*.


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## kryinggame (Jul 8, 2012)

I used my MES and loaded a tray of Pitmasters pellets into my Amnps.
 I just set the MES to 275 and allow it to do its magic. I don't know if the internal is actually 275. Personally I don't care. All I care about is the final product which in my opinion taste better than low and slow 225 degrees. Next weekend I may do some st. Louis ribs. If so, I'll post some pics.


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## smokinhusker (Jul 8, 2012)

Thanks for the reply. I usually do my ribs at 250*, that's the actual cabinet temp and my set temp is 275*...they come out perfect for us.


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## mabrandt (Jul 19, 2012)

kryinggame said:


> DANG IT, THESE RIBS ARE GREAT!!!
> 
> I used Jeff's rub last night on some baby back. Today, I smoked it at 275 degrees. 3 hours later, ABSOLUTELY PERFECT!!!
> 
> 225 is dead.  275 degrees is on!!!


Did you foil or was it just a straight 3 hrs and done? Was going to do 2 racks of St. Louis style  on Saturday and was going to try the higher temps. Was thinking 4 and done.


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## kryinggame (Jul 19, 2012)

I never foil my ribs. I just smoke them at 275 degrees. But I previously posted about the Johnny Trigg method and Good Ol' Smoking Husker gave me the following information, which I plan on using on Saturday:

Keep in mind he doesn't like his ribs...too much like candy. I make mine similar to this but cut back on the brown sugar and softened clarified butter.

Johnny Trigg uses well marbled ribs, trimmed to 3.5 inches with excess meat and membrane removed. He uses Rib Tickler Rub and black pepper. Let's rest 45 minutes before putting on the smoker. I've read he sprays/spritzes with apple juice hourly but I've never seen him do it. He smokes them meat side up with pecan and cherry at a temp of 275* for approx. 2.5 hrs. Uses Squeeze Parkey in a wave pattern on the aluminum foil, handful of brown sugar, 3-4 runs clover honey and a 1/2" wide stripe of Tiger Sauce, then places the ribs meat side down on the wrap mixture and repeats the process on the bone side and adds 1/4 cup apple juice, closes the foil up tightly, wraps with another layer of foil and returns to the smoker for another 1.5 hrs or so. He unwraps and glazes them with a sauce made of tomato sauce, molasses and corn syrup and in the smoker for 1 hr. Re-glazes after he removes from smoker and slices with an electric knife.

Here's a list of ingredients:

His Rub: Salt, Paprika, Sugar, Garlic, Black Pepper, Red Pepper, Brown Sugar and Onion Flakes; 

Foil Wrap: Squeeze Margarine, Brown Sugar, Clover Honey, and Tiger Sauce;

Sauce/Glaze: Tomato Sauce, Molasses and Corn Syrup

He uses Lawry's Season Salt on his pork butt. 

Here's a link I found for Myron's pork butt: http://www.epicurious.com/articlesg...cipes/recipes/food/views/Pork-Shoulder-365431

his ribs http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/recipe?id=13800607

his cupcake chicken: http://www.oprah.com/food/Myron-Mixons-World-Famous-Cupcake-Chicken


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## oldschoolbbq (Jul 19, 2012)

Strange,cause I do all my Ribs at 225° and unwrapped for appox. 5.5hrs., check for bend and hit it every time :













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__ oldschoolbbq
__ Jul 19, 2012






Of course I'm cooking on a little bit bigger Smoker too :













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__ oldschoolbbq
__ Jul 19, 2012






have fun and...


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## kryinggame (Jul 19, 2012)

SHOW OFF.  LOL


oldschoolbbq said:


> Strange,cause I do all my Ribs at 225° and unwrapped for appox. 5.5hrs., check for bend and hit it every time :
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## ribwizzard (Aug 2, 2012)

I possition my rib smoker thermometers ( all 4)  with 300 pointed straight up, and that where I look for the red pointer to be.  I know everyones smoker will read different, but the rule of thumb down here in Florida is do them on Oak and keep them between above 275 and below 325.


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## bama bbq (Aug 2, 2012)

Harry Soo mentioned he does his at 275* and I tried it.  I liked the outcome and have been going 275* ever since.


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## cesarschoice (Aug 2, 2012)

I have also done baby back ribs (last batch was 6 slabs at the same time) using the 2-2-0.5 method with the MES40 set at 275°F and the ribs turned out great! The meat had great pullback with just the right amount of crisp on the outside that I like with the white meat showing off its moisture on the inside!

2-2-0.5 method

2 Hours using AMNPS (http://www.amazenproducts.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=12) Pitmasters Choice (filled only one row of the AMNPS with the pellets). Ribs are bone side down.

2 Hours in aluminum foil with a 1/4 of Apple Juice (at start of 2 hours in foil) completely sealed. Ribs are bone side down.

0.5 Hours bare back (NO FOIL) rib side down for the crispiness on the outside.

All who ate raved on how good they came out. 

Sorry I do not have pictures to show. On my next smoke I will get a friend to document all with pictures!


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## arkashby (Aug 2, 2012)

Wooa! I just setup for another Boston Butt and found out my wife bought a fresh ham by accident. I think this will be a little longer smoke than I expected.


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## kryinggame (Aug 2, 2012)

.


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## jds22 (Aug 4, 2012)

Ok, I'm going to give this a try tomorrow. 3 racks of St. Louis style @ 275. I was thinking of 2-1-1, does that sound about right?


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## bryce (Aug 4, 2012)

jds22 said:


> Ok, I'm going to give this a try tomorrow. 3 racks of St. Louis style @ 275. I was thinking of 2-1-1, does that sound about right?


 I went 2.5/1.5/1 today but i couldnt keep 275 for the whole time. Anyhow, worked out well at an average of 255/260 but i probably should have gone 2.5/2/1 for perfection.


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## bswim (Aug 5, 2012)

As far as the fattiness, I haven't done alot of ribs but the ones I did from Safeway were almost all fat, the ones from Winco have had very little on them......... I've looked at Safeway ribs many times since and looking at the ends of the ribs they've been almost all fat everytime I've looked.


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## jds22 (Aug 5, 2012)

One other question. I read on another board that at this temp the sugar in rubs or sprays can burn. Is this something I need to be concerned with? I was going to use quite a bit of brown sugar in my rub and apple juice when I foil.

Edit to add, I just did a search on this forum and it seems that turbinado sugar may be a better choice as it won't burn as quickly as brown sugar. Am I understanding that correctly?


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## kryinggame (Aug 5, 2012)

jds22 said:


> One other question. I read on another board that at this temp the sugar in rubs or sprays can burn. Is this something I need to be concerned with? I was going to use quite a bit of brown sugar in my rub and apple juice when I foil.
> 
> Edit to add, I just did a search on this forum and it seems that turbinado sugar may be a better choice as it won't burn as quickly as brown sugar. Am I understanding that correctly?


youre correct


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## worktogthr (May 9, 2014)

Wish I would have found this earlier....did 2 racks of untrimmed  spares today at 275.  No foiling, just letting it ride until they past the bend/toothpick test.  After three hours I did spray them with an apple juice and maple bourbon concoction every 20 minutes or so.    Put them on around 4:15 and didn't think to check for doneness until about 8:30.   The thinner hallves of the racks are a touch overcooked but still good.  Not ideal though because I have to reheat them on the grill tomorrow for a family party.  They are too fall off the bone for me.  My family will probably love them because they all think fall off the bone is the best kind of rib.  The thicker halves are perfect.  I will save some of those for me haha.  I do feel that my rub/ spritz burned more at this temp which makes the bark not as tasty.  If I have the time, I think I would got back to the 225-250 range or experiment with foiling or a less sugary rub.


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## BBQBakas (Oct 23, 2020)

Trying this today today at 275°. I usually spritz every hour. Maybe waiting 4 hours before spritzing contributed?



kryinggame said:


> hey all,
> I followed the advice and cooked a rack of st. louis ribs in my MES today but I cooked/smoked it at 275 degrees. What a difference it made--I to am now a convert.  I'll confess, I did overcook them a bit but theyre not bad. I put them in a bit after 11:30 this morning and then went to services.  At 4 hours, I sprayed with apple juice (I don't know why I didnt do th bend test). Then I checked it at the 5th hour and it broke in half.  I know this is a debated issue but at 225 degrees, I never got pull-back and was never impressed with the flavor.  Again, I use an electric smoker (perhaps its different on a grill). But at 275, I think the meat comes out nearly perfect--at least what I consider good ribs.
> 
> Next week, I'm going to experiment again but since I'm smoking at a higher temperature, I'm going to start watching it closely after th 3rd hour.
> ...


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