# Formulating a pineapple smoke sausage recipe....



## indaswamp (Jan 22, 2019)

I have been asked to come up with a pineapple sausage recipe. Friends and family enjoy my smoke sausage recipe and say it is very close to the base seasoning used by the Lil' Butcher Shoppe in Hattisburg Mississippi in their pineapple sausage recipe. Might have a go at a batch with some of the extra pork left over from processing day. I've always wanted to make a batch. Here is what I have so far:

Pineapple
25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1/2c. Dark Brown sugar
2c. crushed canned pineapple (MUST BE CANNED!)
1/4c. soy sauce
1 1/2TBSP. granulated garlic
1 tsp. powdered ginger
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder

8 ounces NFDM powder


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## indaswamp (Jan 22, 2019)

Any tweaks recommended?

Chef jj (and everyone else)- more or less soy sauce? sugar? pineapple?

More or less ginger? cardamom??

Any spice profile I am missing??? I thought the piri-piri spice profile would compliment the soy and pineapple with the sugar.....


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## indaswamp (Jan 22, 2019)

Thanks in advance...


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

Everything below the MSG looks like proportions for 5 Lbs not 25, unless you usually make a very mildly spiced sausage.
Piri Piri usually has Cinnamon at the same proportion as the Cardamom. And Oregano at the Garlic proportion. I would go light, 1 or 2 teaspoons, Oregano, with those proportions...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> Everything below the MSG looks like proportions for 5 Lbs not 25, unless you usually make a very mildly spiced sausage.
> Piri Piri usually has Cinnamon at the same proportion as the Cardamom. And Oregano at the Garlic proportion. I would go light, 1 or 2 teaspoons, Oregano, with those proportions...JJ



2.5cups of sugar seems high to me for 25# of meat....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

Depends on how sweet you want it. Filipino Longganisa uses 1/2C to 3 lbs pork and is noticeably sweet. Chinese Lap Chong uses 1/4C to 3 lbs pork. It is mildly sweet.
So 1 1/4C in 25 lbs would be a good place to start. Will be a noticeable sweetness but not to heavy. Add more if needed...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> Depends on how sweet you want it. Filipino Longanisa uses 1/2C to 3 lbs pork and is noticeably sweet.


Gotcha...
I'm going for an appetizer style sausage to serve at parties and such as finger food. I do want it sweet to highlight the pineapple, I just figured the pineapple would bring some natural sweetness to the sausage.

And the spice profile I want as an accent, not a main player. I want the pineapple to be the highlight of the link.

Maybe 3/4c. sugar
2.5lbs. crushed pineapple with juice (say 5 cups?)


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> So 1 1/4C in 25 lbs would be a good place to start. Will be a noticeable sweetness but not to heavy. Add more if needed...JJ


Thanks jj...will do. I will mix up the piri piri separately then add in as needed to bump up the flavor doing fry testing after mixing.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Now that you mention it, I use 1 1/4 cup cane syrup per 25# of meat when I make my bulk breakfast sausage. 

Good call...That should work.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

3/4C will likely be only slightly sweet. I would double it. 1C Canned Crushed Pineapple yields 2/3C Drained Crushed Pineapple. So 7C Drained Crushed Pineapple is 8oz per each 5 pounds sausage. A good start but have extra pineapple on hand...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> 3/4C will likely be only slightly sweet. I would double it. 1C Canned Crushed Pineapple yields 2/3C Drained Crushed Pineapple. So 7C Drained Crushed Pineapple is 8oz per each 5 pounds sausage. A good start but have extra pineapple on hand...JJ


Would you add just the crushed pineapple or crushed pineapple and the juice? Adding the juice would no doubt add sweetness.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Edit #1:

Pineapple
25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 1/4c. Dark Brown sugar
1 1/2 TBSPS. Paprika
7c. crushed canned pineapple (MUST BE CANNED!)
1/4c. soy sauce
1 1/2TBSP. granulated garlic
1 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. powdered ginger
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. nutmeg

8 ounces NFDM


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

5 to 10% liquid per 5 pounds meat is common. So 1/2 to 1C liquid. 1/4C Soy and 1/4C Pineapple juice per 5 pounds would work...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> 5 to 10% liquid per 5 pounds meat is common. So 1/2 to 1C liquid. 1/4C Soy and 1/4C Pineapple juice per 5 pounds would work...JJ


Thanks...I'll start on the low end because the pineapple will still be very wet and will add moisture.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Edit #2:


Pineapple
25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 1/4c. Dark Brown sugar
1 1/2 TBSPS. Paprika
7c. crushed canned pineapple drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
1 1/2TBSP. granulated garlic
1/2 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. powdered ginger
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. nutmeg

1 1/4 c. soy sauce
1 1/4 c. pineapple juice
8 ounces NFDM


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

I'm curious now...

I'm going in the kitchen and mix up the above piri piri spice blend to taste it....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

That amount of salt and soy sauce ( about 15% Salt by weight) is about 1.2%. I think that will be good...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> That amount of salt and soy sauce ( about 15% Salt by weight) is about 1.2%. I think that will be good...JJ


plus the ~27g. of salt in the cure....


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

1.56% salt with the cure by my calculations.....which the sugar should help balance nicely...


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

OK, I mixed up the spice profile in the spice grinder, sampled it on the tongue, then put a pinch of brown sugar on my tongue and sampled it again....I think it's a good starting point.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

BTW, fun fact for you Chef jj since it's Mardi Gras season. Cardamom is the secret ingredient in real deal king cake dough. It's not a lot, just enough that if you think about the flavor while taking a bite of king cake-you can tell it is there.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

The oregano, is that 1 or 2 tsps. ground or leaves?


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

Yes, leaves, rubbed. You can grind if you wish.Taste and see. Oregano is common in N.African Piri Piri but not sure how well it will work with pineapple...JJ


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## crazymoon (Jan 23, 2019)

IDS, I'm in spectate mode for this one !


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## DanMcG (Jan 23, 2019)

here's a recipe from Len poli's site, but at this point I don't think ya need it. Sounding good IDS!
http://lpoli.50webs.com/index_files/Hawaiian.pdf


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

crazymoon said:


> IDS, I'm in spectate mode for this one !



I'll be sure and post some pictures when I make it...



danmcg said:


> here's a recipe from Len poli's site, but at this point I don't think ya need it. Sounding good IDS!
> http://lpoli.50webs.com/index_files/Hawaiian.pdf



Thanks dan, I did look over Len's recipe for ideas...chose the piri piri spice profile over the anise used in his recipe though...


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

I love holiday hams...you know, the ones with pineapple,cherries and cloves stuck all over with tooth picks. I'm hoping this recipe resembles the holiday ham at least slightly. I may swap clove for the nutmeg....


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

I'm leaning towards cherry and hickory for the smoke on this one.....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

The Anise in Len's recipe would give it more of an Asian flair. Like sausage commonly made with 5 Spice like Lap Cheong. Clove would work but you easy. Gets over powering real quick...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> The Anise in Len's recipe would give it more of an Asian flair. Like sausage commonly made with 5 Spice like Lap Cheong. Clove would work but you easy. Gets over powering real quick...JJ


Yea, clove is a strong spice, like cardamom; which is why I want to start low. I can work my way up with fry test...


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

OK. I stopped by the store on the way home and looked at canned dole pineapple packaged in 100% pineapple juice for the sugar content. 15g per 1/2 cup. 4.5 servings per container. So 75g sugar per can, Little less than 1 cup of juice and about 1.6667 cups of crushed pineapple.

Also noticed that citric acid is added for canning, presumably to drop the pH for canning. 







Should this be a concern with the cure #1? How much citric acid would you say is added to the juice? Should I use raw pineapple and blanch it to @190* to destroy the bromelain enzyme which would not have the citric acid?


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## DanMcG (Jan 23, 2019)

Any thoughts on adding baking soda to lower the ph of the pineapple?


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

The can in the pic is pineapple in water and sugar. The pH is going to be around 4 no matter what pineapple you use. The Acid will accelerate the cure and has some additional antibacterial properties...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

My bad, I picked up the can that is packed in heavy syrup for the picture...


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> The Acid will accelerate the cure and has some additional antibacterial properties...JJ


Figured the citric acid would act as a cure accelerator, just did not know of the concentration or if it would be too much.


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## Hawging It (Jan 23, 2019)

I love the Lil' Butcher Shoppe. Glad it's only a 10 minute drive away. Been shopping there since they opened the doors many years ago. They built a much larger store next to the old store. Really nice. I love all of their sausage flavors.Pineapple is my favorite. The best (center cut) fillets you can buy anywhere. I'm in their place almost every week. Their shrimp stuffed and crawfish stuffed twice baked potatoes are great as well. Hell it's all good!!!


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## zwiller (Jan 23, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> I love holiday hams...you know, the ones with pineapple,cherries and cloves stuck all over with tooth picks. I'm hoping this recipe resembles the holiday ham at least slightly. I may swap clove for the nutmeg....



LOL.  Was gonna post this exact thing.  CLOVE.  I would spring for fresh ginger or at least the stuff in the tube when I use it.  I'd also be doing smaller batches but I am sausage noob compared to you man.


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Hawging It said:


> I love the Lil' Butcher Shoppe. Glad it's only a 10 minute drive away. Been shopping there since they opened the doors many years ago. They built a much larger store next to the old store. Really nice. I love all of their sausage flavors.Pineapple is my favorite. The best (center cut) fillets you can buy anywhere. I'm in their place almost every week. Their shrimp stuffed and crawfish stuffed twice baked potatoes are great as well. Hell it's all good!!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's the stuff... I'll see how close I can hit it with a clone...


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

You going to add Maple Flavoring?...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> You going to add Maple Flavoring?...JJ


Just noticed the ingredients list. I have real maple syrup I can use. What ratio maple syrup:brown sugar would you recommend?


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 23, 2019)

I have used a 1/2C per 5 pounds Breakfast Sausage. Was not excessively sweet.
Maybe 2Cup Maple Syrup and reduce the Brown Sugar to 3/4Cup. You can always add more...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Will do, thanks...


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## indaswamp (Jan 23, 2019)

Edit #3:

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 TBSP. Paprika
1 TBSP. granulated garlic
3/4c. Dark Brown sugar

                               Accent Spice blend:
1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1/2 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. powdered ginger
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. clove

7c. crushed canned pineapple drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
2 c. Maple syrup
1 1/4 c. soy sauce
1 1/4 c. pineapple juice
8 ounces NFDM


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

I mixed up the spice mix with clove in place of nutmeg. Did a taste test again with a pinch of sugar dissolved on the tongue. I like the change much, much better. 

I have a feeling this one is going to be good....


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## worktogthr (Jan 24, 2019)

I am going to be watching this one.  Sounds delicious and also watching closely because I haven't had much luck adding acidic ingredients to the sausage.  Always seems to hurt the bind.  However most I have tried have been more than the 4 tablespoons poli put in that sample recipe.


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## fajitapot (Jan 24, 2019)

worktogthr said:


> I haven't had much luck adding acidic ingredients to the sausage.  Always seems to hurt the bind.



I've had the same experience, so I'm curious as well. I've spent many hours and pounds trying to create an Al Pastor sausage, which also uses pineapple, with limited success.


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## zwiller (Jan 24, 2019)

You guys beat me to it.  Acid...  My gut is telling to mix everything BUT the pineapple and cure/rest overnight then add pineapple right before stuffing.  That said, I don't necessarily believe acid hurts curing and acts as was said as accelerator but there is conflicting info.  They could also be drying the pineapple a bit which might minimize problems.


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 24, 2019)

Pineapple Juice is the same or even more acidic than the fruit...JJ


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## zwiller (Jan 24, 2019)

Based on my interpretation of the label of the real stuff there is no juice being used.  I guess I am looking at it as "how are those guys doing it?".


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

The soy sauce is slightly acidic as well... around pH 5 or so...

Too much acid?

I have successfully made smoke sausage using 2.5 cups red wine with around a pH 5 though. No problems with the bind, but I did use NFDM powder to help the bind.


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

zwiller said:


> You guys beat me to it.  Acid...  My gut is telling to mix everything BUT the pineapple and cure/rest overnight then add pineapple right before stuffing.  That said, I don't necessarily believe acid hurts curing and acts as was said as accelerator but there is conflicting info.  They could also be drying the pineapple a bit which might minimize problems.


small amount of acid, no problem; it will act as a cure accelerator. There is a limit as to how much you can add, I do not know where that limit is though, thus the quandary.


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

Maybe use pineapple flavoring in place of the juice????


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

zwiller said:


> You guys beat me to it. Acid... My gut is telling to mix everything BUT the pineapple and cure/rest overnight then add pineapple right before stuffing. That said, I don't necessarily believe acid hurts curing and acts as was said as accelerator but there is conflicting info. They could also be drying the pineapple a bit which might minimize problems.


I plan on pressing the pineapple in a colander to get it as dry as I can prior to adding to the meat paste. 
I may bump the NFDM powder up to the max. of 0.75#, or 12 ounces for the bind. If that does not work, I may also add 5 egg whites....It WILL bind!!!! LOL!!!


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## zwiller (Jan 24, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Maybe use pineapple flavoring in place of the juice????



Not what those guys are doing but wife LOVES pineapple jelly...


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 24, 2019)

The recipe has a lot going on. Good flavors. With the addition of the liquid from the maple syrup, I don't think you will need the pineapple juice. Much of the Acid will be bound in the fruit and will not likely be an issue. Skip the juice...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> The recipe has a lot going on. Good flavors. With the addition of the liquid from the maple syrup, I don't think you will need the pineapple juice. Much of the Acid will be bound in the fruit and will not likely be an issue. Skip the juice...JJ


Will do...
BTW, I did find this pineapple flavoring oil:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Pineapple-LorAnn-Hard-Candy-Flavoring-Oil-1-oz/789988314


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

Edit #4:

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 TBSP. Paprika
1 TBSP. granulated garlic
3/4c. Dark Brown sugar

Accent Spice blend:
1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1/2 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. powdered ginger
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. clove powder

7c. crushed canned pineapple drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
2 c. Maple syrup (very cold)
1 1/4 c. soy sauce (very cold)
8~12 ounces NFDM


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

Last night, I mixed up 2X the accent spice blend then weighed it on my spice scale.








So I have the total. I will add, a little at a time, the spice blend to the meat paste, sampling as I go with a fry test, to dial the spice blend in where I want it. I will weigh the remaining unused spice blend then subtract that from the total so I know how much I used. From there, I can get the ratio and multiply that by the weight of each spice, then I know how much of each spice I used in grams.
This is a little trick I learned from my uncle when making a new sausage recipe. Get the spice profile where you want it first, then figure out how much of that spice profile you will add to the meat.....


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

I also found that clove is added @ 0.3~0.5g per kilo when used to spice liverwurst and blood sausages. It makes sense to add that much to stand up to the strong taste of the blood and/or liver. I don't need nor want that much overpowering clove. My starting point is 1/4 tsp. which is 0.6g per 25# meat paste. I just want a hint of clove in the background.


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

Question for you Chef jj,

I buy what they call pork 'cracklin fat'. It is strips of pork skin and back fat. I filet the skin off and it runs about 1/8" thick..






I use that to make boudin...

Now, what is left, there is some hard back fat and I use that in making sausage, but the entire trim piece is not hard back fat...it is some kind of connective tissue... (dermis maybe?) between the fat and the outer skin layer.

I assume it would be high in collagen as well. I have roughly 7# of this in the freezer. How much would you suggest I add to increase the available protein for binding in the pineapple sausage? 

I would grind this through the smallest plate I have (4.5mm I think) and then mix it in....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 24, 2019)

Sorry, I have no idea how you would use it or the result. Salt and meat protein, we'll mixed then mixed some more, is plenty of binding...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

Alright...there is another meat sale coming up Jan. 31st so I can buy more pork butts cheap for processing day. The pork I have bought already, I am going to make a batch of this sausage sometime next week...the suspense is killing me! I want to start mixing and tweaking the recipe!! LOL!


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## KrisUpInSmoke (Jan 24, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> I plan on pressing the pineapple in a colander to get it as dry as I can prior to adding to the meat paste.
> I may bump the NFDM powder up to the max. of 0.75#, or 12 ounces for the bind. If that does not work, I may also add 5 egg whites....It WILL bind!!!! LOL!!!


I was thinking maybe you could partially dehydrate the pineapple in a low heat oven, which would not only dry it out but concentrate the flavor! Then the other liquid and fat would come in.


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## indaswamp (Jan 24, 2019)

KrisUpInSmoke said:


> I was thinking maybe you could partially dehydrate the pineapple in a low heat oven, which would not only dry it out but concentrate the flavor! Then the other liquid and fat would come in.


Don't think it will be necessary, I believe using a lot of pineapple juice in the sausage is the culprit of bad bind.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

Is it just me or does the label say "sodium nitr*a*te"??







Typo maybe? Wonder why they used nitrate instead of nitrite?


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

zwiller said:


> They could also be drying the pineapple a bit which might minimize problems.


Looking around a little more on google and the recipes I have seen where they use dehydrated pineapple, they reconstitute in water prior to mixing into the meat paste.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

fajitapot said:


> I've had the same experience, so I'm curious as well. I've spent many hours and pounds trying to create an Al Pastor sausage, which also uses pineapple, with limited success.


Did you use pineapple juice or just the fruit? What did you use for liquid and how much did you add? Did you use a binder?


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## DanMcG (Jan 25, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Is it just me or does the label say "sodium nitr*a*te"??
> Typo maybe? Wonder why they used nitrate instead of nitrite?



Food labels are gov. approved so I doubt it's a typo, but then again why would they use nitrate?


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

I think I will call the Lil Butcher Shoppe and ask....


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

I found this:
"
The pungency and flavor of dried ground ginger differ from those of fresh ginger root. Even though you can substitute one for the other in a pinch, they each tend to work better in different types of dishes. Ground ginger is preferred for baked goods and spiced drinks, while fresh ginger is used in savory dishes, especially in Asian cuisine.

You may need to experiment to find just the right amount to use in your dish. The Cook's Thesaurus reports that 1 tablespoon of fresh ginger root is equal to 1/4 teaspoon of ground ginger. At Food.com the recommended equivalent is 1 tablespoon of fresh ginger for 1/8 teaspoon of ground ginger."

https://www.livestrong.com/article/...valent-of-fresh-ginger-root-vs-ground-ginger/

I do prefer the taste of fresh ginger. I just did not know the ratio of powdered to fresh. The 4~5 TBSPS. just looked like a lot to me. I don't cook with fresh ginger enough to intuitively know how much to add. The guide above helps out a lot. I am now leaning toward fresh Ginger root. I just want it as an accent flavor, not so much as to overpower the pineapple. Might cut it back to 2 TBSPS. initial mix, I can always add more....


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## DanMcG (Jan 25, 2019)

Any chance that's some sort of dry cured product? The reason I ask is, besides brown sugar it has dextrose which doesn't make sense to me. Does the sausage have a tang to it?


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## fajitapot (Jan 25, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Did you use pineapple juice or just the fruit? What did you use for liquid and how much did you add? Did you use a binder?



Just the fruit. Canned, fresh, dried. We've tried no binder, phosphates, NFDMP, ice water, and even pineapple juice... Never satisfied with the results.


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## tallbm (Jan 25, 2019)

I know I'm late to the party but I recall a while back a guy trying to make Pineapple snack sticks and they tore apart or disintegrated on him during the hanging and cooking process because the acidity and enzymes in the pineapple just mushed up the meat AND ate up the casings to where they would come apart lol.

I believe his lesson learned was to maybe use dehydrated pineapple in some form or fashion.

I don't have anymore info but you can read his thread here:
https://www.smokingmeatforums.com/threads/hawaiian-snack-stick-fail.240579/#post-1508958

There may be some more research needed on how to avoid the pineapple destroying the sausage making process due to it's hardcore meat tenderizing properties :)

I hope this info helps!


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## fajitapot (Jan 25, 2019)

I believe it's the bromelain that breaks down the proteins, which is why it's effective as a marinade. So I'm curious to see what happens here.


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## Hawging It (Jan 25, 2019)

I'm just sayin! It is going to be near impossible to duplicate the LIL' Butcher Shoppe recipe. I hope you pull it off for sure!


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## Hawging It (Jan 25, 2019)

I'm heading over the the LIL' Butcher Shoppe later today to pick up stuff. You want me to ask them for the recipe? I think that would go over like a fart in church. I hope you duplicate the recipe.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

Hawging It said:


> I'm heading over the the LIL' Butcher Shoppe later today to pick up stuff. You want me to ask them for the recipe? I think that would go over like a fart in church. I hope you duplicate the recipe.


Ask one of the owners if the nitrate is a typo. Or if it is suppose to be nitrite...No need to ask for the recipe. Might ask if what form of pineapple they use though, that might help.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

fajitapot said:


> I believe it's the bromelain that breaks down the proteins, which is why it's effective as a marinade. So I'm curious to see what happens here.


Yes, it's the bromelain enzyme that turns meat to mush, which the heat from the canning process destroys. 

Too much acid in the fluid used can hurt the bind though. 

I am going to focus on achieving a great bind by using an extremely small amount of fluid to dissolve the cure, and mix the salt and seasoning in dry to extract the maximum amount of protein. I am going to order Ames Phos too, I have read that is is an excellent protein extractor as well. Hopefully, I will have so much available protein for a bind that what little acid is left in the pineapple will not affect the bind all that much.....fingers crossed..


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## Hawging It (Jan 25, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Ask one of the owners it the nitrate is a typo. Or if it is suppose to bu nitrite...No need to ask for the recipe. Might ask if what form of pineapple they use though, that might help.


Ain't asking nuttin. They would be suspicious of me from now on.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

LOL!


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

danmcg said:


> Any chance that's some sort of dry cured product? The reason I ask is, besides brown sugar it has dextrose which doesn't make sense to me. Does the sausage have a tang to it?


I've seen a lot of sausages use dextrose, both fresh and smoked. It's definitely not a dry cured product, it's juicy, juicy. Though I've had it, I can't remember a noticeable tang to the bite.


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## zwiller (Jan 25, 2019)

Is this stuff REALLY that good?!  LOL.  That said, I enjoy learning what makes something tick and I usually learn new stuff in the process.  

FWIW Went looking at other pineapple sausages and they spec dried pineapple.  Also, dried pineapple is usually sweetened with...  

wait for it...  

dextrose.


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

Probably easier for a commercial processor to handle dried pineapple. The drying process should destroy the bromelian just like canning. No doubt dried pineapple will be sweeter though.

The one reason I can see with using dried pineapple is that fluid will be flowing IN to the pineapple as it re-hydrates, pulling the acid inward away from the meat paste.....


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## Hawging It (Jan 25, 2019)

zwiller said:


> Is this stuff REALLY that good?!  LOL.  That said, I enjoy learning what makes something tick and I usually learn new stuff in the process.
> 
> FWIW Went looking at other pineapple sausages and they spec dried pineapple.  Also, dried pineapple is usually sweetened with...
> 
> ...


It is really that good.


----------



## Hawging It (Jan 25, 2019)

If he can duplicate it exactly, he will have many many friends. It's that good!


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## indaswamp (Jan 25, 2019)

Hawging It said:


> I'm just sayin! It is going to be near impossible to duplicate the LIL' Butcher Shoppe recipe. I hope you pull it off for sure!



Not a brag, just biological fact...I am what biologists refer to as a 'super taster'.

 When I was in college, I was walking on campus one day and a group of biology students were taking tongue imprints with some kind of a blue blue dye to count taste buds. Not exactly sure how they did this though. Anyways, I volunteered. They called me and asked if they could interview me. Turns out, I was in the top 3 percentile with the number of taste buds on my tongue.

It is both a blessing and a curse.

It is one of the reasons I learned to cook. I have been cooking since I was 5 years old standing on a chair in front of the stove. There are very, very few meals that I can actually enjoy while eating out in a restaurant. Very few restaurants actually COOK the food from scratch, unless you go to a 3 star or higher end establishment. The window for spice tolerance is very narrow for me.

Anyways, my friends and family are hoping I can duplicate it....we'll see.....I'm spot on with the base though.

For those interested in the science...
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/super-tasting-science-find-out-if-youre-a-supertaster/


----------



## tallbm (Jan 26, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Not a brag, just biological fact...I am what biologists refer to as a 'super taster'.
> 
> When I was in college, I was walking on campus one day and a group of biology students were taking tongue imprints with some kind of a blue blue dye to count taste buds. Not exactly sure how they did this though. Anyways, I volunteered. They called me and asked if they could interview me. Turns out, I was in the top 3 percentile with the number of taste buds on my tongue.
> 
> ...



Well if you ever feel interested in trying to duplicate Rudy's BBQ Sause let me know, I would gladly send a bottle of it and my attempted replication notes if it meant we could work out close copy recipe of it I could make at home


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

Chef jj...which would give a better bind in your opinion-crushed or diced (about 3/8~1/2") pineapple?


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

tallbm said:


> Well if you ever feel interested in trying to duplicate Rudy's BBQ Sause let me know, I would gladly send a bottle of it and my attempted replication notes if it meant we could work out close copy recipe of it I could make at home



LOL! This is how it got started with the pineapple sausage!!!!! LOL!


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 27, 2019)

I think the crushed would mix in and be more uniformly distibuted. What size pineapple is in the original?...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

I believe it is diced. I'm thinking less surface area for less acid contact with the meat...


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

fajitapot said:


> Just the fruit. Canned, fresh, dried. We've tried no binder, phosphates, NFDMP, ice water, and even pineapple juice... Never satisfied with the results.


Did you mix up your own seasoning or use a seasoning pack you bought? Packs can contain sodium erythorbate and or sodium acetate which you would not need with the acid from the pineapple.


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## zwiller (Jan 27, 2019)

Here's my take on this, and it is by weight, starting with water.  10% water is pretty standard so there is at least or more than 10% pineapple.  I would try 20%.  2% salt is standard and so is .5% MSG.  I would love ChefJJ's take on using ingredients IE garlic is not a spice.  https://www.astaspice.org/governmen...ying-with-u-s-policy-regulations/definitions/
If what I posted is true, there is no garlic in the recipe.  Lastly, I find when homebrewers are trying "clone" their favorite beers they get way too busy with ingredients.  These days I am a true believer that simpler is better.  That said, Holy Moly, Rudy's sause is BUSY!

I'd try canned pineapple tidbits, drain, and dry them to the touch.  When I get a stuffer I will try some of this, starting to sound less weird and more tasty.  I assume from the ingredients posted it is sorta spicy or hot.  Kid friendly or adult only?


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 27, 2019)

I guess what the FDA defines for labeling purposes, is not what is necessarily taught. The definition also may be fairly new 2013 code revision.  I got a couple of college level text books, 1990's,  including from the CIA, that lists Herbs as edible Leaves and Flowers. Spices are Seeds, Stems, Roots, Berries or Buds.
Lumping all together sure simplifies things. Although I have to disagree on Garlic. Garlic is used fare more as a flavoring than as a Food source. We eat Garlic Confit (roasted garlic on bread) once or twice a year. I add fresh minced or Granulated Garlic to flavor some dish, every day.

Indaswamp, I can see your point on Chunks, go for it...JJ


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## fajitapot (Jan 27, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Did you mix up your own seasoning or use a seasoning pack you bought? Packs can contain sodium erythorbate and or sodium acetate which you would not need with the acid from the pineapple.



We've always mixed our own.


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

Edit #5: swapping powdered ginger for fresh; swapping crushed pineapple to tidbits or small chunks.

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 TBSP. Paprika
1 TBSP. granulated garlic
3/4c. Dark Brown sugar

Accent Spice blend:
1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1/2 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. clove powder

7c. canned pineapple tidbits drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
4 TBSPS. fine grated ginger
2 c. Maple syrup (very cold)
1 1/4 c. soy sauce (very cold)
8~12 ounces NFDM


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## DanMcG (Jan 27, 2019)

Are you taste testing in between versions?


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

danmcg said:


> Are you taste testing in between versions?


Not sure what you are asking.


----------



## DanMcG (Jan 27, 2019)

By posting Edit #5, I assumed (I know, I know) you're reformulating the mix and was wondering if you are sampling it and changing it up after each version?


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

No, I have not made the first batch yet...still formulating. I do hope to make a batch this week though.


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

zwiller said:


> I assume from the ingredients posted it is sorta spicy or hot. Kid friendly or adult only?


I've only ever had the pineapple sausage from The Lil' Butcher Shoppe once. It was not all that hot, though it did have a touch of heat. The kids at the party loved it so.....


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

I am willing to bet that if the pineapple pieces are coated with NFDM or egg white powder, then gently folded into the meat paste just prior to stuffing, that this would help the bind. The pineapple would have a sacrificial protein shell the acid would attack buffering the meat paste bind from the acid.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

tallbm said:


> Well if you ever feel interested in trying to duplicate Rudy's BBQ Sause let me know, I would gladly send a bottle of it and my attempted replication notes if it meant we could work out close copy recipe of it I could make at home


This it?
https://bethsfavoriterecipes.blogspot.com/2010/06/rudys-bbq-sauce-clone.html


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## tallbm (Jan 27, 2019)

zwiller said:


> That said, Holy Moly, Rudy's sause is BUSY!



Yeah there is a lot going on with that ingredient list lol.  It is my favorite bbq sauce though.  I think I got to iteration 4 of attempting it. I was making a good sauce but not a copy of theirs.


----------



## tallbm (Jan 27, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> This it?
> https://bethsfavoriterecipes.blogspot.com/2010/06/rudys-bbq-sauce-clone.html



I've tried that, it is waaaaaaaay off.  So far off that when looking at the ingredients list on the bottle clearly showed to me that the clone recipe was nonsense hahaha.  So I started working at it but didn't get too far.  The results I got to by iteration 4 were pretty good  though :)


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## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

Alright, I bought 4 cans of dole pineapple tidbits in 100% pineapple juice. Tonight, I drained all 4 cans in a colander. Almost 4 cups of juice in the cans so roughly 1.667 cups of pineapple per can just like Chef jj estimated. I have almost 7 cups of pineapple tidbits.

After draining, I soaked them in just enough water to cover the fruit for about 10 minutes three times to remove as much citric acid from the canning process as possible. Third time, I added 2 tsps. of pineapple extract to kick up the pineapple flavor. I drained the pineapple pieces and now have them spread out on paper towel covered newspaper with a box fan turned on high to dry the chunks some before I dust them with NFDM powder and put them in a dehydrator @100 for a couple hours to get the NFDM to stick pretty good to the chunks. The pineapple should be prepped for the sausage.

I've taken every precaution I can think of to avoid the known issues with pineapple in meat paste....fingers crossed.....


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 27, 2019)

Oh- and I plan on putting the pineapple in the freezer prior to mixing in the meat paste to firm it up real good so it will not get bruised/crushed when I gently fold it in. I will stuff immediately.


----------



## zwiller (Jan 28, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Oh- and I plan on putting the pineapple in the freezer prior to mixing in the meat paste to firm it up real good so it will not get bruised/crushed when I gently fold it in. I will stuff immediately.


 Good idea on the freeze


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## tallbm (Jan 28, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Alright, I bought 4 cans of dole pineapple tidbits in 100% pineapple juice. Tonight, I drained all 4 cans in a colander. Almost 4 cups of juice in the cans so roughly 1.667 cups of pineapple per can just like Chef jj estimated. I have almost 7 cups of pineapple tidbits.
> 
> After draining, I soaked them in just enough water to cover the fruit for about 10 minutes three times to remove as much citric acid from the canning process as possible. Third time, I added 2 tsps. of pineapple extract to kick up the pineapple flavor. I drained the pineapple pieces and now have them spread out on paper towel covered newspaper with a box fan turned on high to dry the chunks some before I dust them with NFDM powder and put them in a dehydrator @100 for a couple hours to get the NFDM to stick pretty good to the chunks. The pineapple should be prepped for the sausage.
> 
> I've taken every precaution I can think of to avoid the known issues with pineapple in meat paste....fingers crossed.....



I'm assuming you saved the juice?
If so I have a totally awesome and simple fajita marinade recipe for you.

-3-4 pounds of Fajita meat
-2 cups Pinapple Juice (NOT from concentrate)
-1 cup Soy Sauce (use regular or light)
-Your favorite Fajita dry seasoning but NO SALT,  (this works well Pepper, Onion, Garlic, a little Cumin, and a little Chili Powder)

-If your Fajita meat isn't already cut into "steaks" then do so, 1-inch will work.  I often do Venison fajitas out of the top and bottom round roasts but will also do fajitas out of cheap beef steak cuts from the store.  I rarely find flank or skirt steak at a decent price and sometimes the quality is horrible on those to begin with.  Flank and skirt usually don't need to be cut into steaks.

-Season the meat with the NO-SALT seasoning.  You can go a little heavy if you like
-Throw the seasoned meat into a bowl or a gallon zip bag
-Pour in Soy Sauce and Pineapple juice
-Mix around so everything is mixed well
-Marinate for 24 hours or longer
-Grill on hot grill like you would a steak
-Brush on excess marinade while grilling, you can't put too much
-Pull at medium rare or whatever you like for your fajitas
-Eat like a king!

I hope this gives you some ideas if you haven't already done this with pineapple juice :)


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## indaswamp (Jan 28, 2019)

zwiller said:


> Here's my take on this, and it is by weight, starting with water.  10% water is pretty standard so there is at least or more than 10% pineapple.  I would try 20%.  2% salt is standard and so is .5% MSG.  I would love ChefJJ's take on using ingredients IE garlic is not a spice.  https://www.astaspice.org/governmen...ying-with-u-s-policy-regulations/definitions/
> If what I posted is true, there is no garlic in the recipe.  Lastly, I find when homebrewers are trying "clone" their favorite beers they get way too busy with ingredients.  These days I am a true believer that simpler is better.  That said, Holy Moly, Rudy's sause is BUSY!
> 
> I'd try canned pineapple tidbits, drain, and dry them to the touch.  When I get a stuffer I will try some of this, starting to sound less weird and more tasty.  I assume from the ingredients posted it is sorta spicy or hot.  Kid friendly or adult only?



The Hawaiian pineapple sausages on the main island in Hawaii are an island version of Portuguese Linguica with pineapple added. Some have more heat than others. The spice blend used in most I have seen contain the spices in my spice profile...with the exception of cinnamon and bay leaf. Both are used in a portuguese spice blend consisting of cinnamon, garlic, paprika, bay leaf, corriander, cardamom, and clove. Garlic is a prominent spice/seasoning in Portuguese sausages.


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## indaswamp (Jan 28, 2019)

Thanks tallbm, I might give that a go one night....


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## indaswamp (Jan 28, 2019)

If I'm reading this right, finished maple syrup has a 66% sugar content. So 1 cup of maple syrup contains 0.33% water, or 1/3 cup. So adding 2 cups of maple syrup I will be adding 1 1/3 cups maple sugar and 2/3 cups water.

http://www.mnmaplesyrup.com/LearnBoiling.aspx

Of course, maple syrups vary a little, some more sugar, some less...but this is approximate correct?


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

fajitapot said:


> We've always mixed our own.


Did you freeze the pineapple prior to mixing and stuffing? I am going to do this and believe it will help to keep the fruit from becoming crushed which would release acid into the meat paste.


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## fajitapot (Jan 29, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Did you freeze the pineapple prior to mixing and stuffing? I am going to do this and believe it will help to keep the fruit from becoming crushed which would release acid into the meat paste.



No, but you may want to consider blanching it first. I've always done this with cubed fat back for mortadella before coating in NFDM and chilling. It seems to help it remain bound to the farce when slicing. I also found this, for what it's worth: https://www.ajol.info/index.php/njbas/article/viewFile/89668/79395


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

fajitapot said:


> No, but you may want to consider blanching it first. I've always done this with cubed fat back for mortadella before coating in NFDM and chilling. It seems to help it remain bound to the farce when slicing. I also found this, for what it's worth: https://www.ajol.info/index.php/njbas/article/viewFile/89668/79395


Thanks for posting....
The canning process heats the pineapple to kill any pathogens in the can. I would not think I would need to heat it again. But fresh pineapple would need to be heated to destroy the bromelain. 

I learned of that blanching of the fat after I made some goose mortadella. I will try that with the next batch I make, I left the fat out becasue the recipe did not call for it. I plan on adding it next batch along with pistachios and whole peppercorns.


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## fajitapot (Jan 29, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Thanks for posting....
> The canning process heats the pineapple to kill any pathogens in the can. I would not think I would need to heat it again. But fresh pineapple would need to be heated to destroy the bromelain.



I'd consider blanching the pineapple not because of the bromelain but for the improvements it has on drying. I believe you said you were going to dry the pineapple first, but maybe I misread that. It's my understanding that most commercially dried fruit is blanched before drying.


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Ah...Ok.


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Found this:
"The enzymes are neutralized by heat of about 158 degrees Fahrenheit (70 degrees Celsius), so they stop working once cooked."
https://science.howstuffworks.com/i...vations/pineapple-enzyme-tenderize-steak1.htm


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

danmcg said:


> Any thoughts on adding baking soda to lower the ph of the pineapple?


Dan, you may be on to something here. Coating the pineapple with milk powder was a complete failure. Moisture started leaving the pineapple and the milk powder soaked it up, making a gooey mess in my dehydrator with milk dripping everywhere. I was leaning towards egg white powder, then remembered you mentioning baking soda to neutralize the acid on the pineapple surface.

If the pineapple tidbits surface is neutralized, bingo-acid problem solved. Then, if I freeze the fruit, it will not get crushed so no more acid contacting the meat paste.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Question is, pH 6 or pH 7?

I will be adding 1.25 cups of soy sauce which is around pH 5 so if I take the pineapple to pH7, it should balance out the acid from the soy sauce.

Chef jj, Any suggestions on final pH of the pineapple? PH 6 or 7?

Any ideas on how much baking soda to add to 2.5lbs. of pineapple tidbits to raise the pH to 6 or 7? I need to get some pH strips......


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Found this:
https://meatsci.osu.edu/node/130

"A 7 percent brine solution is ideal for solubilization of myosin. Using meat which contains 65 percent moisture, one would want 4.5 percent salt in contact with the meat for maximum extraction of proteins. This can be accomplished during chopping by adding the salt initially with the meat but with no additional water. This extraction is also enhanced by using ice instead of water to reduce the emulsion temperature to 28 to 30F. Once these proteins are extracted, they remain soluble with the addition of water."


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

After thinking on this a little more... I bet this is the route to go, baking soda soak for the pineapple. I'm willing to bet that ECA (encapsulated citric acid) could be used to bring back the 'bite' from the pineapple after the meat paste bind is set from cooking. Gotta love chemistry! LOL! I do not have any ECA on hand so this batch will be made without it. I will need to order some.


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## DanMcG (Jan 29, 2019)

A knowledgeable friend told me to adjust it to pH 6 for maximum water holding.  I just ordered an inexpensive ph meter to play around with.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Dan is this adjusting the pH of the meat paste to pH6 or just the pineapple?


----------



## DanMcG (Jan 29, 2019)

I assumed it to mean adjust the acidity of the pineapple, since that's what the conversation was about. I'll have to ask again.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Thanks Dan.


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## zwiller (Jan 29, 2019)

Remind me to ask you guys to help me a hungarian hot dog recipe I want to make.

Been thinking that if you took some of that drained pineapple and coat/dust it with dextrose it would seal up quite well kinda like candied pineapple and proceed to freezer?  

Going back to the USDA stuff.  If they are using freeze dried pineapple they have to list it as such and not just pineapple?  Also, using baking soda would require them to list it as well right?


----------



## DanMcG (Jan 29, 2019)

Don't really know the answer but technically the baking soda isn't in the sausage, it was just used to soak the pineapple before the sausage was made. I really don't know.


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Well, thanks for asking Dan. That is what I will probably do. I did buy some pH strips and will check the pH of the meat through the process just for the heck of it. If it looks too low, I will add some baking soda to the meat paste and check the bind with a fry test. As long as it's above 5.4, bind should be good with 6.3 being optimum.

I put the meat in cold water overnight to thaw. Doing first grind then protein extraction and cure tonight, I will mix in the soy, maple syrup, and pineapple tomorrow afternoon and stuff into casing. Hope to smoke Thursday.


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Sure wish I had some ECA on hand, Would help give a more true 'pineapple' bite.. Will try on next batch. I expect this one to have good pineapple flavor, but the taste will be flat. If you have ECA Dan and want to give a test batch a go, report your results....


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

zwiller said:


> Remind me to ask you guys to help me a hungarian hot dog recipe I want to make.
> 
> Been thinking that if you took some of that drained pineapple and coat/dust it with dextrose it would seal up quite well kinda like candied pineapple and proceed to freezer?
> 
> Going back to the USDA stuff.  If they are using freeze dried pineapple they have to list it as such and not just pineapple?  *Also, using baking soda would require them to list it as well right?*



Not sure if the soda is just a soak and rinse of the pineapple that it would need to be on the ingredient list. Large processors may be buying neutralized pineapple for sausage making from a distributor.


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Found this..
http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/ai407e/AI407E24.htm

pretty interesting...


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 29, 2019)

Baking Soda + Cellulose = Mush. This is why Boston Baked Beans have Baking Soda added to the initial cooking water to make the skins tender. It also turns Red veggies a nasty blue/green color. Not important here but a cool fact. Simmer some Red Cabbage with Baking Soda and tell the kids it's Magic! The pineapple acid may offset the effect so run a test.
Way back when we were working on the recipe, I took the maple water volume into consideration when a I determined the Soy and Pineapple Juice volumes to add. I'm finding mix pH values for Canned Pineapple of 3.5 to 5.5. Go figure. Soy Sauce is 4.4 to 5.4. If your pH is above 5, I don't think there will be bind issuses. I have eaten pounds of Longanisa and Lap Cheong with soy sauce and vinegar, they hold together fine...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Thanks for the insight jj....
noted-do not use too much baking soda!


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

I will test the drained pineapple with a pH strip. Then I will soak the pineapple in water only, drain, and test again to see where I'm at. That should determine how much baking soda is necessary...if any at all...


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

jj- I will test the pH of the soy I bought as well....


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 29, 2019)

I looked around, one Longanisa recipe had 1Tbs Soy and 3Tbs Vinegar in 21oz of pork. Another had Vinegar, Soy and Pineapple Juice in a SKINLESS sausage that looked perfect. I think you are worrying a lot about nothing...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Took 4 cans dole pineapple tidbits and drained them in a colander. I checked the pH of the pineapple  (pineapple) with a pH strip and it was off the chart provided with the strips (see pic. below) probably in the 3.5~4 range.








First water soak (1) and rinse and the pH did not change much, maybe 4.5.

Second water soak (2) and rinse and the pH came up to around 5.3ish.

I then prepared my slightly basic solution using 4 qts. of water and 1/4tsp. of baking soda. This solution (soda) registered a pH of about 7.5~8 (the strip got darker upon sitting. The instructions say to read the immediate color change).

I did the third and final soak (soak) in the basic solution, the pH was around pH 6.5~7. Perfect. I drained the pineapple for about 20 minutes.

I then mixed 1/2 TBSP. Pineapple extract with 1/8 cup of water and poured this over the pineapple in a gallon ziplock bag.






The pineapple upon tasting, after rinsing and basic solution, is flat like I expected. Adding the pineapple extract should bring back some flavor. I will get the sweet with the sugar in the meat paste. I put the bag in the refrigerator for about 30 minutes to allow the extract time to soak in. I have the pineapple tidbits on the dehydrator to dry them some to lock in the extract and help prevent acid from inside the pineapple pieces from leaking out upon mixing into the meat paste. I'm not drying to rock hard, just semi-soft. I will freeze the pineapple prior to mixing into the meat paste.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Soy sauce I am using is pH5....


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

FWIW, 1/8 tsp. sodium bicarbonate will raise the pH of 1/2 cup dole canned pineapple juice (preserved with citric acid) from pH3.3~3.5 to pH 6.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 29, 2019)

Ok folks, pineapple is in the freezer and first grind through 10mm plate is complete. Mixed the base dry seasoning with salt in for about 2 minutes, then mixed in the cure water. Inda frig, until tomorrow morning for protein extraction. I'll add the maple syrup, soy sauce, fresh minced ginger, NFDM powder, and some of the accent spice base, mix that in good. Then I will fry test to check for sugar, soy, and the spice base. Dial that in, then fold in the pineapple, adjust the pH of the meat paste, and stuff.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 30, 2019)

I am switching from NFDM powder to egg whites as a binder. Egg whites are naturally basic with a pH of 8~9 on the high end. Adding slightly basic egg whites will help counter act the acidic ingredients in the sausage, keeping the meat paste pH from falling too low and affecting the bind. Eggs also have a high amount of salt soluble proteins and are an excellent meat binder.  1 egg white weighs roughly 40g so 10 egg whites is 400g, almost a pound. Should provide a lot of buffering of acid ingredients.


----------



## indaswamp (Jan 30, 2019)

Edit #6 Switching binders from NFDM to egg whites.

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 TBSP. Paprika
1 TBSP. granulated garlic
3/4c. Dark Brown sugar

Accent Spice blend:
1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1/2 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. ground coriander
1/2 tsp. cardamom powder
1/4tsp. clove powder

7c. canned pineapple tidbits drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
4 TBSPS. fine grated ginger
2 c. Maple syrup (very cold)
1 1/4 c. soy sauce (very cold)
10~12 egg whites; 3~3.2% (from my research, upper limit of 18 per 25# meat paste recommended)


----------



## DanMcG (Jan 30, 2019)

chef jimmyj said:


> I looked around, one Longanisa recipe had 1Tbs Soy and 3Tbs Vinegar in 21oz of pork. Another had Vinegar, Soy and Pineapple Juice in a SKINLESS sausage that looked perfect. I think you are worrying a lot about nothing...JJ



Any chance you could share those recipes JJ?


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## chef jimmyj (Jan 30, 2019)

In casing. This version has an Anise flavor from the wine. A pinch of ground Anise Seed or Five Spice will get you there...

https://www.kawalingpinoy.com/longganisa/

Skinless Longanisa...

https://www.kawalingpinoy.com/skinless-longganisa/

Len Poli has a version that is less sweet and has added heat from ground Chiles or Red pepper.

I could not find the one with Pineapple Juice but it was basically the same with added juice...JJ


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## indaswamp (Jan 30, 2019)

I did the second grind and stuffed today. First I measured out the Maple syrup and added that to the meat paste. Then I measured out the soy Sauce and added that to the meat paste. Measured out the fresh minced ginger and added that to the meat paste. I added 5.25g of the accent spice blend. I mixed this up good...








Then made a sample test patty.






I separated 12 eggs whites into a bowl. Added 6g of salt, and scrambled the egg whites with a blender and whisk attachment about 2 minutes to denature the egg protein. Put that in the fridge.
 I adjusted the sugar up to a total of 1 cup, added and additional 2g of the spice blend. I added the egg whites and mixed them in well. 
Did another fry test..






I checked the pH with a pH strip. It was between pH6.5 and 7. (threw it in the trash, forgot to take a pic. of it)I mixed 1/2 TBSP. pineapple extract into 1/2 cup pineapple juice and mixed that in. I could tell that the meat paste bind got better. I rechecked the pH of the meat paste and it was about pH6






Perfect!

I then stuffed the sausage into casing and  put them in the refrigerator. I will roll smoke to them tomorrow. Cherry and hickory.


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## DanMcG (Jan 30, 2019)

Cool, Looking forward to what you think of it.


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## Hawging It (Jan 30, 2019)

Well, I been watching all this. You have worked your butt off trying to duplicate the recipe. It is apparent you are a very smart person and will develop a "very good" pork pineapple sausage. However, the LIL' Butcher Shoppe makes that and other flavors and it will never be duplicated exactly. That's why they are worth a ton of cash! They are self made folks.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

I don't expect to hit the bullseye with the first try. One change I will make on the next batch is to back way off on the soy sauce. It is too noticeable...The savory notes in the maple sugar are enough to balance the sweet from the sugar. I will be able to use more pineapple juice too with less soy sauce. That will bump up the natural pineapple flavor.
I'll see how the smoke affects the flavors and modify from there. Main thing though is the bind is a success. I do not anticipate any issues upon smoking. I think the slight drying of the pineapple helped a lot.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

I may increase the maple syrup or add some maple sugar. on the next batch....


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Would be nice if someone could make encapsulated pineapple juice powder for pineapple sausage. Would definitely make this process a whole lot easier!!! LOL!!!


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## tallbm (Jan 31, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> I did the second grind and stuffed today. First I measured out the Maple syrup and added that to the meat paste. Then I measured out the soy Sauce and added that to the meat paste. Measured out the fresh minced ginger and added that to the meat paste. I added 5.25g of the accent spice blend. I mixed this up good...
> View attachment 386853
> 
> 
> ...



I love the way you are researching, organizing, and executing this whole process!!!  It is a perfect example of how to get something done with accuracy, precision, and high quality!  Once you get through the research and discovery phase you will have all of the process and info figured out to a point that you can crank this sausage out in a standard reliable way!

Whether it is sausage, smoking something, building something with a hammer and nails, or writing some software, this kind of practice get's the job done and done well!!!  Bravo!!!


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

tallbm said:


> I love the way you are researching, organizing, and executing this whole process!!!  It is a perfect example of how to get something done with accuracy, precision, and high quality!  Once you get through the research and discovery phase you will have all of the process and info figured out to a point that you can crank this sausage out in a standard reliable way!
> 
> Whether it is sausage, smoking something, building something with a hammer and nails, or writing some software, this kind of practice get's the job done and done well!!!  Bravo!!!


Thanks tallbm... I hope to dial the process in so the recipe is repeatable Once I get it where I want it.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Lookin good....






INT is @ 118*, Should be done in about 2~2.5 hours or so....you can see the pineapple; good distribution through the links...


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

OK SMF,

Moment of truth!
They are done!


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

I showered the links with cold water until the INT fell below 100*. I pulled a link off one of the rods and set it aside to sample. The rest are blooming on two chairs.

Up close:





It was windy today, little bit of ash got airborne in the smokehouse and landed on the links. Nothing a little water won't rinse off....


LETS CUT INTO THE SUCKER!!!






Perfect bind. Nice densely packed links. Very nice snap to the casing. and JUICY, JUICY, JUICY!!! The egg whites really made the difference I think!






All that sugar and egg really help hold onto the water!

Here is a lengthwise cut...







Overall, I'll take it as a success for my first pineapple sausage. Now for the flavor profile...

The heat was a little more pronounced than I expected, probably due to the amount of sugar which enhanced the heat taste. Ginger was spot on @ 1/4 cup. Just a hint to let you know it is there. Compliments the pineapple well. The soy actually mellowed upon smoking. The Maple is very faint (or overpowered by the soy sauce). I will more than likely need real maple extract or maple sugar to kick it up on par with the lil butcher shoppe sausage. Now for the spice blend...The clove is spot on, just a hint and not over powering. The cardomom is good, not overpowering. The oregano, might could use a touch more.

Garlic is good. Paprika, might could go a little more.

Sugar-it is a sweet sausage, but could go more to match the sweetness of what the lil butcher shoppe makes.

So, changes for the next batch are:
Dial back the pepper
use maple extract or maple sugar
dial back the soy and replace with pineapple juice
little bit larger pineapple chunks (more on this later)

I'm happy. I know what direction I need to go with the next batch, but the recipe as is will make a good sausage.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Much appreciation to Chef jj and everyone else that helped out with this endeavor. Probably saved me at least a couple trial batches or more....


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## DanMcG (Jan 31, 2019)

Congrats IDS, it looks awesome!!!


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

OK, about the pineapple...My thoughts on the next batch:

The fruit was flat. No bite of acid at all. The 3 rinses flushed out a lot of flavor as I knew it would. I want to use larger chunks next go around and my reasoning is that I can dry the pineapple after just draining the fruit. Get it semi- dry; still wet on the inside, but a dry shell; and then rinse it to wash the acid off the surface yet keep the acidic juice full of flavor inside untouched. Larger chunks will deliver more pineapple flavor with undiluted juice within the semi-dry fruit.

Also, I will reduce the soy significantly and replace with pineapple juice. I will also look into pineapple powders and maple extracts.

I will use some ECA in the next batch to bring back the pineapple bite from the acid after the meat bind has set from cooking.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Thanks Danmcg and zwiller...


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Edit #7:

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
1 oz. cure #1
108g salt
20g Black Pepper
24g cayenne powder
30g MSG
1 1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1 1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1 tsp. ground coriander
1c. Dark Brown sugar

***Accent Spice blend:
1 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. cardamom powder
1/2 tsp. clove powder

7c. canned pineapple tidbits drained (MUST BE CANNED!)
4 TBSPS. fine grated ginger
2 c. Maple syrup (very cold)
3/4 c. soy sauce (very cold)
1/2 c. pineapple juice and 1 TBSP. pineapple extract
10~12 egg whites; 3~3.2% (from my research, upper limit of 18 per 25# meat paste recommended) add 6g salt. Beat egg whites with whisk attachment on blender on high for 2 minutes.

*** Mix up spice blend and weigh out 7.5g on a spice scale. That is how much I used.


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

I added 400g of egg whites to the meat paste. I should probably add this to the weight when figuring the cure...Correct?


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## indaswamp (Jan 31, 2019)

Proposed changes for next batch....

*Pineapple Smoke Sausage*

25# 75/25 pork butt
29.5g  cure #1
108g salt
30g MSG
15g Black Pepper
17.5g cayenne powder
2 1/2 TBSP. Paprika
1 1/2 TBSP. granulated garlic
1 tsp. ground coriander
2.5c. Dark Brown sugar

***Accent Spice blend:
1 TBSP. oregano
1 tsp. cardamom powder
1/2 tsp. clove powder

****40g. encapsulated citric acid powder

9c. canned pineapple chunks drained (MUST BE CANNED!), dried, and rinsed, then frozen
4 TBSPS. fine grated ginger
1 c. Maple syrup and 1/4 c. maple extract(very cold)
1 c. pineapple juice and 2 TBSPS. real pineapple extract (very cold)
1/4 c. soy sauce (very cold)
12 egg whites; 3~3.2% (from my research, upper limit of 18 per 25# meat paste recommended) add 6g salt. Beat egg whites with whisk attachment on blender on high for 2 minutes.

*** Mix up spice blend and weigh out 7.5g on a spice scale. That is how much I used.

****Add to meat paste and gently fold in right before stuffing into casing. Do not refrigerate, smoke with in a couple hours of stuffing.


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## chef jimmyj (Feb 1, 2019)

Glad to help and the result looks great...JJ


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## rjob (Feb 5, 2019)

IDS
Pineapple and maple products
https://www.americanspice.com/search-results/
Do a search for the maple
Might be of interest.


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## indaswamp (Feb 5, 2019)

Thanks for posting rjob.. maple oil just might be the ticket...
https://www.americanspice.com/maple-oil


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## rjob (Feb 5, 2019)

indaswamp said:


> Thanks for posting rjob.. maple oil just might be the ticket...
> https://www.americanspice.com/maple-oil


You are welcome. Great to be able to share information. Your posts have greatly increased my knowledge.


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## indaswamp (Feb 8, 2019)

One thing I have learned is that you must achieve a VERY GOOD primary bind after first grind by proper protein extraction with dry salt which will maximize the amount of salt soluble proteins for the bind. This must be done because of the highly acidic pineapple juice being used which will attack some of the binding proteins. The additional egg whites supplements this loss of protein binding.

The primary bind (and secondary bind after second grind) must be achieved prior to the addition of the acidic liquids to the meat paste....


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## unclejhim (Mar 16, 2019)

WOW!! That was a great read. Congrats on the end product it looked fantastic. I hope to try this.


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## indaswamp (Mar 16, 2019)

unclejhim said:


> WOW!! That was a great read. Congrats on the end product it looked fantastic. I hope to try this.


Thanks...they sure are good on the grill as an appetizer.


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## tlly1667 (Jan 5, 2021)

indaswamp said:


> I have been asked to come up with a pineapple sausage recipe. Friends and family enjoy my smoke sausage recipe and say it is very close to the base seasoning used by the Lil' Butcher Shoppe in Hattisburg Mississippi in their pineapple sausage recipe. Might have a go at a batch with some of the extra pork left over from processing day. I've always wanted to make a batch. Here is what I have so far:
> 
> Pineapple
> 25# 75/25 pork butt
> ...


New to the site how was the pineapple sausage?


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## indaswamp (Jan 5, 2021)

It was great!


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## indaswamp (Jan 7, 2021)

Now that I have a pH meter, I really need to give this sausage another go....


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## Cajuneric (Jul 26, 2021)

Indiaswamp, I have to say that this was one of the neatest recipes I've made in a while.  The end result was spectacular!!!  Smoking it makes a huge difference!!!  I did make a few tweaks here and there based off of what I had available to me and the overall consensus was that this would be a great sausage to feature on this years Celebrate Sausage Series!!!

We ended up grilling some fresh pineapple for the recipe and what was left over use we juiced.  We neutralized the acidity by adding a little baking soda to the pineapple juice which brought it up from a 3.8ph to a 6.8ph and I was ok with that.  I also ended up using fresh habanero at 1% instead of cayenne.

We did go with a .5% phosphate addition (SHMP) and the bind was perfect.  Great texture, very juicy, super flavorful!!!  Thanks for the recipe!!!

If you want to see the entire version I ended up going with I can post it here if not I'll end up having it on my site in a few months..


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## indaswamp (Jul 26, 2021)

Wow. That's a high honor Eric. Thanks for giving it a go. I'll be looking forward to how you tweaked the recipe. No need to post it here, I can wait. Did you end up using ECA to drop the acid back down for the tang?


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## Cajuneric (Jul 26, 2021)

indaswamp said:


> Did you end up using ECA to drop the acid back down for the tang?



I did use the ECA  (at 1%) and it gave the finished product a perfect tang.  Really made the pineapple pop.  I'm not usually a sweet sausage kind of guy but this was really nice!!!  It was very well balanced with flavors that helps to accent each other and allow the pork to shine!!  The ginger was a nice subtle touch.   Thanks again for sharing!!


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## DanMcG (Jul 27, 2021)

Dang now I got to try this sausage, and I'm not really a fan of pineapple.


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## indaswamp (Oct 2, 2021)

I'll post this here:
https://twoguysandacooler.com/grilled-pineapple-smoked-sausage/

cajuneric 's take on the pineapple sausage.  Looks like he dialed it in to perfection. Can't wait to make it!


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## Cajuneric (Oct 2, 2021)

I can't wait for you to see the video.  The process was incredible!!!  It airs on my youtube channel October 10th.  It will be on the website as well on that date..


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## indaswamp (Oct 10, 2021)

Posted today...


I like the changes eric made with the grilled pineapple...the hobanero peppers definitely kick up the heat...and the coconut liquor brings a more tropical flair. What a melody of flavors!


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## navigator (Oct 10, 2021)

That was  a another great episode and Eric did your recipe proud. Congrats to being on celebrate sausage season 2!


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## Sowsage (Oct 10, 2021)

I have to give this a go... I love watching Eric do his videos and ive done a few recipes from his channel. .. Glad to see one of your recipes made it to the show man! Thats awesome!!


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## checkdude (Oct 13, 2021)

Congratulations Inda. Saw the video and am making this for sure. Getting supllies together and can't wait.  Am in awe that you can do such a thing.


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## indaswamp (Oct 14, 2021)

checkdude said:


> Congratulations Inda. Saw the video and am making this for sure. Getting supllies together and can't wait.  Am in awe that you can do such a thing.


Thanks checkdude.
Post your results and how you liked the sausage once made.


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## TNJAKE (Oct 14, 2021)

indaswamp said:


> Posted today...
> 
> 
> I like the changes eric made with the grilled pineapple...the hobanero peppers definitely kick up the heat...and the coconut liquor brings a more tropical flair. What a melody of flavors!



Damn that sausage looked delicious. Nice video and congrats on the shout-out in the video 

 indaswamp


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## chopsaw (Oct 15, 2021)

Congrats on that for sure . 
He does a great video . I can identify with his reaction at the end . My Son brought home a store made pineapple teriyaki sausage , which I thought would be weird . 
First bite , I reacted just like Eric does in the video . Each bite got better . 
I'll have to try a small batch of this . 
Nice work .


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## zwiller (Oct 15, 2021)

Gonna check out the video when I can,  THANKS for posting.  Congrats 

 indaswamp
!  



 chopsaw
 Rich, I want to use the spices of this recipe as a basis to make a version that sausage you made with pork or ham cubes.  Some type of mortadella.  I forget what you call it.


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## chopsaw (Oct 15, 2021)

zwiller said:


> Rich, I want to use the spices of this recipe as a basis to make a version that sausage you made with pork or ham cubes. Some type of mortadella. I forget what you call it.


That was a spiced ham roll . Uses all whole muscle chunks ( cured ) and I used powdered gelatin to hold it together . Might be better to use chunks and a meat paste for this .


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## indaswamp (Oct 19, 2021)

I've got ECA on order. Another batch of pineapple sausage on deck when it arrives. Gonna use some of Cajuneric's ideas....


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## smoker808 (Nov 2, 2021)

Man I've been away from this forum for wayyy too long. Congrats Indaswamp that's some amazing recipe building right there.  I'm sure it doesn't hurt to be a super taster as well lol.  Looking forward to another edit with Eric's touchups added. I live on the north shore of Oahu so l have literally thousands of pineapples right up the road lol.  This is definitely on my to do list when l have some free time.  Thanks again to you all who make this forum such an amazing place.  







	

		
			
		

		
	
Made some kielbasa from all the wild pork we been catching. Looks like we're gonna have to try this recipe someday


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## indaswamp (Nov 2, 2021)

Nice batch of sausage. I was given two wild hogs saturday...plan on making some sausage with them.


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## smoker808 (Nov 2, 2021)

Aloha indaswamp

,  


indaswamp said:


> Nice batch of sausage. I was given two wild hogs saturday...plan on making some sausage with them.


Nice!!  So was this sausage as good as the sausage you were trying to replicate?


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## indaswamp (Nov 3, 2021)

smoker808 said:


> Aloha indaswamp
> 
> ,
> 
> Nice!!  So was this sausage as good as the sausage you were trying to replicate?


Thanks smoker808. The pineapple sausage is very good, but cajuneric made it better. It is not close yet to what I was aiming for, but a delicious sausage nonetheless! Still zeroing in on the lil' Butcher shop recipe.


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## smoker808 (Nov 3, 2021)

indaswamp said:


> Thanks smoker808. The pineapple sausage is very good, but cajuneric made it better. It is not close yet to what I was aiming for, but a delicious sausage nonetheless! Still zeroing in on the lil' Butcher shop recipe.


Awesome!  I noticed he made a smaller batch. But didn't include the recipe, mainly measurements/weights he used per ingredient.  Is there a way to get that?

I would love to try to do this sausage. But need a recipe.  Idk if he's posted somewhere. I guess l could ask him lol.  I noticed your last edit still included canned pineapple but cheferic used fresh n grilled. If there ain't any other changes then l guess I could follow yours and jus grill fresh pineapple?

Thanks so much greatly appreciate your time and help

Dom


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## indaswamp (Nov 3, 2021)

If you go to youtube and find that episode, scroll down and there is a link to the recipe on his 2 guys and a cooler website.

canned or fresh grilled....either will work. Fresh will give better flavor, but either way the pineapple must be heat treated to above 158*F to denature the bromelain enzyme.


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## smoker808 (Nov 3, 2021)

Thanks brother!!

Yes thanks for mentioning that l remember reading bout that in your thread. Awesome stuff!

Aloha


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## welch (Feb 23, 2022)

indaswamp said:


> I have been asked to come up with a pineapple sausage recipe. Friends and family enjoy my smoke sausage recipe and say it is very close to the base seasoning used by the Lil' Butcher Shoppe in Hattisburg Mississippi in their pineapple sausage recipe. Might have a go at a batch with some of the extra pork left over from processing day. I've always wanted to make a batch. Here is what I have so far:
> 
> Pineapple
> 25# 75/25 pork butt
> ...


Than


indaswamp said:


> OK, I mixed up the spice profile in the spice grinder, sampled it on the tongue, then put a pinch of brown sugar on my tongue and sampled it again....I think it's a good starting point.


Ok thanks for the advice but would u grind the pineapple with Meat or just mix and stuff


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## indaswamp (Feb 23, 2022)

Nefarious said:


> That's if I'm making sausage links?  That project is next.  I'll add some because I used to use store bought sausage which is one of the reasons for doing this, and it had too much.  I don't think zero is the correct amount.  Plus I can make it taste how I want.





welch said:


> Ok thanks for the advice but would u grind the pineapple with Meat or just mix and stuff


I do not recommend grinding the pineapple with the meat because that will release too much acid within the pineapple.


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## welch (Feb 23, 2022)

indaswamp said:


> I do not recommend grinding the pineapple with the meat because that will release too much acid within the pineapple.


Ok I’m try another 25 lbs this weekend is the baking soda required for the ph in the juice if I’m using Canned pineapple


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## indaswamp (Feb 23, 2022)

welch said:


> Ok I’m try another 25 lbs this weekend is the baking soda required for the ph in the juice if I’m using Canned pineapple


Depends on how much juice you add...there is a limit as pineapple juice is very acidic and will affect the bind. No way to know without checking the pH with a pH meter.


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## Sven Svensson (Feb 23, 2022)

I cannot tell you how happy I am that this thread was brought back to life. I am absolutely going to make these on my next round of sausage making. Thanks 

 indaswamp
 for all of this. This is incredible.

My favorite breakfast of all time is a sausage like this accompanied by coconut & macadamia pancakes with coconut syrup. It’s such a crazy amazing combo. Good lord I’ll be dreaming about this tonight.


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## Nefarious (Feb 23, 2022)

Sven Svensson said:


> Good lord I’ll be dreaming about this tonight.


Really!


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## indaswamp (Feb 24, 2022)

Sven-use the encapsulated citric acid. The sausage will come out much better and will have a bite. Otherwise the pineapple taste will be flat.


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