# To water pan or not to water pan?



## smokiedoug (Nov 28, 2012)

Just wondering peoples thoughts on water pans, do you use them or not? Give me your thoughts.My big smoker is 400 gallons and a rotisserie so I just fill the bottom with water, the placement of my burners assist in steaming it up. I've cooked with and without water and can see the difference. It only gets used when over 100lbs of meat is needed, she has been lonely lately:(


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## s2k9k (Nov 28, 2012)

Well I just use a small GOSM propane smoker and have pretty much ditched the water. I have my water pan filled with sand and get much better temp control. After reading Eric's threads on "Dry Smoke Chambers" and trying his methods I am a believer:

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/...t-dry-smoke-chamber-q-view-method#post_830635

I might use water for the first couple of hours then it's gone. I also might just use a little to catch drippings so they don't burn.

So what differences have you seen? I am very interested in the wet or dry chamber and how it works and what results others get from the different ways.


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## smokiedoug (Nov 28, 2012)

I do both wet and dry because for me each has its advantages. When I do use the wet smoker I see better temperature control for one thing. I know we all have different smokers and everybody's are going to cook different. Mine are homemade and so are my burners. I think you get a better smoke flavor with the wet smoker and of course moisture. Moisture = not enough bark, everybody has an opinion on " bark " and here's where my dry smoker comes into play. That's about the only reason ill use it.


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## roadkill cafe (Nov 28, 2012)

I have a gasser & MES 40 and like Dave, use sand in both. I also will add a little H2O in a disposable drip pan.


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## s2k9k (Nov 29, 2012)

smokiedoug said:


> I do both wet and dry because for me each has its advantages. When I do use the wet smoker I see better temperature control for one thing. I know we all have different smokers and everybody's are going to cook different. Mine are homemade and so are my burners.* I think you get a better smoke flavor with the wet smoker and of course moisture*. Moisture = not enough bark, everybody has an opinion on " bark " and here's where my dry smoker comes into play. That's about the only reason ill use it.


That's what Eric thinks and posted in his thread. Humidity helps smoke penetration. That's why I put water in for the first few hours and then pull it out for the dry air to form a good bark.


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## chef jimmyj (Nov 29, 2012)

I have actually been running my MES without the water pan in place and have been seeing dialed in temps matching the MAV732 readings more closely. I have been using a Drip pan with 1-2 cups of water for a Rib or Butt smoke then when it goes dry I don't add any more. I have been getting a good mix of Smokey flavor, Juicy meat and good Bark...JJ


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

Chef JimmyJ said:


> I have actually been running my MES without the water pan in place and have been seeing dialed in temps matching the MAV732 readings more closely. I have been using a Drip pan with 1-2 cups of water for a Rib or Butt smoke then when it goes dry I don't add any more. I have been getting a good mix of Smokey flavor, Juicy meat and good Bark...JJ



Sounds like you got it going on:)


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

S2K9K said:


> That's what Eric thinks and posted in his thread. Humidity helps smoke penetration. That's why I put water in for the first few hours and then pull it out for the dry air to form a good bark.


Does it work out to be a half with water and half without water cook time?


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## s2k9k (Nov 29, 2012)

smokiedoug said:


> Does it work out to be a half with water and half without water cook time?


No because I've been doing it with butts so it's about 3 hours of water in a 15-20 hour smoke.


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## kryinggame (Nov 29, 2012)

Depends on what I'm smoking and which smoker.  If I'm doing low & slow using my WSM, I'll use water because that helps keep the temp down.  If I'm doing poultery in my WSM, I don't use water because I want the temp to be in the 300's. 

It's all personal preference.


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## ravenclan (Nov 29, 2012)

I use a water pan in my masterbuilt electric but in my masterbuilt stick burner i do not use a water pan.............the electric i use water because it helps keep the meat moist and also i noticed that the temps are more stable plus the meat is real moist but i also place a can of beer and a can of soda in the bottom by the burner.

my wood burning smoker i dont use one but i also did a bunch of MOD'S to this smoker , thanks to Rivet and the Forum , so my temp stays on point and i get a real good product from the smoker

But there again as it was said .......................It's all personal preference ...........


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

S2K9K said:


> No because I've been doing it with butts so it's about 3 hours of water in a 15-20 hour smoke.



Do you think the 3 hours help with that long of a smoke? This leads to another question but I think ill start another thread on that.


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

kryinggame said:


> Depends on what I'm smoking and which smoker.  If I'm doing low & slow using my WSM, I'll use water because that helps keep the temp down.  If I'm doing poultery in my WSM, I don't use water because I want the temp to be in the 300's.
> 
> 
> It's all personal preference.



I agree on the chicken and yes its all personal preference.


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## humdinger (Nov 29, 2012)

S2K9K said:


> That's what Eric thinks and posted in his thread. Humidity helps smoke penetration. That's why I put water in for the first few hours and then pull it out for the dry air to form a good bark.


That's a good idea Dave. I've been a staunch water user from the beginning, but mostly b/c I am too afraid to go without and have the meat dry out. However I have been curious for some time about changing it up and trying it without water, but progress has been slow (think of a little kid nervously inching his way out to the edge of a high-diving board!!!) 
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Your method (or Eric's for that matter) seems to have a little science and sense behind it; use steam to help the smoke penetrate, then use dry air to help in crust creation! I'm doing that this Sunday for sure. Thanks!


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## s2k9k (Nov 29, 2012)

smokiedoug said:


> Do you think the 3 hours help with that long of a smoke? This leads to another question but I think ill start another thread on that.


Yes I think the humidity for the first 3-4 hours really helps with smoke penetration. After that time the meat has already begun to skin over and the smoke penetration is going to slow down. 

I believe that meat is juicy because of the moisture in the meat and that it doesn't get juicier from humidity or adding more liquid to the outside. It just seems to me that humidity, spritzing or mopping just puts moisture on the outside of the meat and then evaporates off. I don't see how it can penetrate deep into a large piece of meat that has formed a skin on the outside.

I have used water and spritzed and I have found I have gotten much juicer meat when I used a dry smoke chamber. I really believe when a dry skin forms on the outside it helps lock in the natural juices of the meat. I smoked a standing rib roast on T-Day in a dry smoke chamber with no water at all and I had placed a pan under it to catch drippings and after 5 hours there were only 4 or 5 drops in the pan but when I sliced it juice ran all over my cutting board.

This is all my opinion from things I have read and the little experimenting I have done with the dry smoke chamber so please don't flame me I'm just throwing out my observations, I'm not saying this is the best way or that everyone will get the same results, just saying I like doing it this way. I'm sure as time goes on I will read of other methods and I will try those too, I am always wanting to try something new!


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

Well explained sir and I will say I agree with what you said. I'm up for learning something new anytime too. You said you smoked a rib roast, have you ever dry aged one before cooking it?


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## s2k9k (Nov 29, 2012)

smokiedoug said:


> Well explained sir and I will say I agree with what you said. I'm up for learning something new anytime too. You said you smoked a rib roast, have you ever dry aged one before cooking it?


I have not got into dry aging "yet" but it's something I'm very interested in trying. One of these days, one of these days!


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## smokiedoug (Nov 29, 2012)

S2K9K said:


> I have not got into dry aging "yet" but it's something I'm very interested in trying. One of these days, one of these days!



WARNING: Women don't like the fact of a hunk of meat hanging out in the fridge for a week.


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## tjohnson (Nov 29, 2012)

Too much moisture, and you get "Black Rain" dripping inside your smoker

If you can't exhaust the moisture fast enough, it builds up on the inside walls

I used water in the water pan of my MES (1) time, and that was enough for me.  Black water dripped out the door and onto my concrete.  It's really bad in cooler weather.  The surface area of the water in the water pan is too large for the size of the smoker

I tell guys who insist on using water, to pick up a small disposable water pan from the dollar store and fill it about 1/2 full of water.

No water for me!

Todd


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## sparkypyro (Nov 29, 2012)

For my Thanksgiving turkey smoke I removed my water pan completely and replaced with 6 new foil covered bricks. Skin came out crispy and the brined bird came out juicy. Temps were MUCH more stable and after opening the door numerous times because everyone wanted to see the temps rose back to original temp much faster than when I use the water pan. I put the bird in at 10am and it hit 175 in the drumsticks at 2 pm exactly. I did have a small dry foil pan to collect the drippings(awesome by the way) that was the only source if moisture aside from the bird itself. Smoker temp was a solid 225 the entire time. This was in a gasser double door Master Forge. Turkey weighed 11 lbs.


Sent from my iPhone using smoke signals.


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## sparkypyro (Nov 29, 2012)

Want to add that after shutting the smoker down, removing the bird and chip tray and closing the doors the smoker was still holding at 200 a little over a half hour after the heat was shut off. Outside temps that day were around 67 degrees. Very surprised at how long the bricks held the heat.


Sent from my iPhone using smoke signals.


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## hoity toit (Dec 1, 2012)

how about a tad bit of water whenyou are smoking sausage????? Just askin//. I have always done it dry without water......


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## hoity toit (Dec 13, 2012)

S2K9K said:


> Yes I think the humidity for the first 3-4 hours really helps with smoke penetration. After that time the meat has already begun to skin over and the smoke penetration is going to slow down.
> 
> I believe that meat is juicy because of the moisture in the meat and that it doesn't get juicier from humidity or adding more liquid to the outside. It just seems to me that humidity, spritzing or mopping just puts moisture on the outside of the meat and then evaporates off. I don't see how it can penetrate deep into a large piece of meat that has formed a skin on the outside.
> 
> ...


I am with you on that. Once the outside skins over its locked in. Seems like you get too much smudge if it is too wet inside., especially with sausage if the casing isnt completely dry. Youcan open the door and my glasses steam up., drip pan is a good idea for "natural juices that may or may not drip" with the grease.


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## pyre (Dec 13, 2012)

Anymore I only use water (in my WSM) when I'm cooking ribs.


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## bismarckdon (Mar 27, 2013)

I had a similar problem with my 40" MES last year. I used water in the tray and was amazed at the amount of black condensation was in the smoker and dripped off the door when the door was opened. A filthy mess to clean up! Eventually, the heating element quit working so I returned the unit to SAM'S where I purchased it. I just bought a 30" MES and will be smoking without water in order to avoid the mess. Haven't tried it yet (we still have snow on the deck, so maybe in a few weeks with warmer temperatures). Any thoughts?


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## roadkill cafe (Mar 27, 2013)

I never use water. Actually, I put playground sand in the water pan for thermal mass. Never have an issue with meats drying out and no black rain.


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## flash (Mar 27, 2013)

Depends on the ambient temperatures on what I use. Got a GOSM charcoal to propane conversion. In the warmer months, I will use water, but when colder out I tend to stick with sand......which I dampen some for each smoke until I just can't use it anymore.


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## smokinclt (Mar 27, 2013)

I never use any water in my Lang. I have not found a need. That said I do spray but that is because the temp recovers in a couple of minutes so i can open it. That way I keep the moisture but I get an amazing bark. 

Doug


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