# Cure and IT in Sausage



## slevin (Apr 27, 2020)

Sorry if this a still a silly question but can someone  explain this to me.

My question is, if you are using a cure in sausage, why does everyone insist that you smoke it to an IT of 150*? Isn't it safe to eat at a much lower IT, seeing as the cure would have killed all the bacteria?

Thanks for helping a beginner.


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## chef jimmyj (Apr 27, 2020)

Cure does not totally Kill any bacteria. It  does kill some but its job is to Inhibit the growth of Clostridium Botulinum, causes Botulism, Listeria and Salmonella until you cook it. Other Pathogens like Staphylococcus Aureus, is has little effect on. So you have to Cook the sausage to kill those active bacteria. 150°F is just a temp that gives a good texture and juiciness. You can go lower following the Pasteurization Times and Temps for the meat used...JJ









						2015-12-20 NON INTACT pasteurization table 001.jpg
					






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## slevin (Apr 27, 2020)

chef jimmyj said:


> Cure does not totally Kill any bacteria. It  does kill some but its job is to Inhibit the growth of Clostridium Botulinum, causes Botulism, Listeria and Salmonella until you cook it. Other Pathogens like Staphylococcus Aureus, is has little effect on. So you have to Cook the sausage to kill those active bacteria. 150°F is just a temp that gives a good texture and juiciness. You can go lower following the Pasteurization Times and Temps for the meat used...JJ
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank. I thought it killed everything. Thanks for the help.


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## chef jimmyj (Apr 28, 2020)

What were you thinking of doing or what temp would you like to take sausage to?
For instance, a Med/Rare, 125-130°, Beef Sausage would be no different than a Med/Rare Burger. However, a Med/Rare Kielbasa or Chicken Brat don't sound good to me...JJ


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## slevin (Apr 29, 2020)

No plans to be honest, I just know my MES struggles with hot spots. I've had sausages where one end is 152 but the other end is like 138. I try and do my best at flipping  them but there is always places that never get over 150. Just want to make sure I am being safe.


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## chef jimmyj (Apr 29, 2020)

There is always a 165°F Water Bath to bring them to temp. Cooks, plumps and rehydrates the casing to make the Smoked Sausage pretty...JJ


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## slevin (Apr 30, 2020)

Unfortunately I do not have a sous vide cooker. Is it a good investment for making sausages? How long would you still keep the sausages in smoke?


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## chef jimmyj (Apr 30, 2020)

You don't need SV to get a 165 water bath. Many stoves on low will do it. Electric Skillets and Roasters are popular with the sausage guys. A little monitoring of a large volume of water, 8 qt+, will do the job.  It does not take long for direct contact with water to get the sausage up to 150...JJ


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## dr k (May 1, 2020)

Hmm different agencies for intact beef, lamb and pork vs non intact.
Table above for non intact meat for a 5D reduction for Salmonella = reducing 100,000 to 1 is by  FSIS 2009.

Table for intact meat for a 6.5D reduction for Salmonella =reducing  3.1 million to 1 is by FDA 2009.

Table for chicken and turkey intact or non intact for a 7D reduction for Salmonella =reducing 10 million to 1 is by FSIS 2005.

The confusion is with the top two beef, lamb and pork tables since ground meat is the most extreme form of non intact meat I wonder why  it's 5D instead of a bigger reduction like 6.5D for intact meat?  Whereby the bacteria is only on the outside with intact meat.


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