# First attempt at corned beef & pastrami!



## GrumpyGriller (Jan 30, 2022)

Ok, so I've done pretty good with brisket, burnt ends, pulled pork, ribs, etc., but decided to give it a shot. 

I made the brine according to wait, with a mix of kosher salt (1.5 cups), brown sugar (0.5 cups),  32 oz. Apple juice, 3 qts water, 3.5 TBS pickling spice, 3.2 tsp #1 Prague for a ~6 lb flat I separated from a full packer. 

I plan to make burnt ends from the point, so nothing's wasted . 

I have wet cured pork belly and had it sit for 12-14 days, but any thoughts on how long for corned beef/pastrami?  Is there a too-long time?

Thanks!!!


----------



## SmokinEdge (Jan 30, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Ok, so I've done pretty good with brisket, burnt ends, pulled pork, ribs, etc., but decided to give it a shot.
> 
> I made the brine according to wait, with a mix of kosher salt (1.5 cups), brown sugar (0.5 cups),  32 oz. Apple juice, 3 qts water, 3.5 TBS pickling spice, 3.2 tsp #1 Prague for a ~6 lb flat I separated from a full packer.
> 
> ...


1.5 cups salt to a quart of water and 6# meat is going to be pretty salty. Hope it works out. 1/4” per day per side is about what cure travel is, with the salt you have in there, I’d pull it at about 7 days, no longer. Belly is a bit different because of the fat content. Fat contains only about 10% water so cure travels much slower through fat veins. The brisket flat is muscle with no fat marble or vein, so the cure will drive nicely and that heavy salt will speed the process up.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Jan 30, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> 1.5 cups salt to a quart of water and 6# meat is going to be pretty salty. Hope it works out. 1/4” per day per side is about what cure travel is, with the salt you have in there, I’d pull it at about 7 days, no longer. Belly is a bit different because of the fat content. Fat contains only about 10% water so cure travels much slower through fat veins. The brisket flat is muscle with no fat marble or vein, so the cure will drive nicely and that heavy salt will speed the process up.



Maybe I didn't write it up clearly - it's 3 qts water total plus 1 qt apple juice  with a total of 1.5 cups salt.


----------



## SmokinEdge (Jan 30, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Maybe I didn't write it up clearly - it's 3 qts water total plus 1 qt apple juice  with a total of 1.5 cups salt.


Oh I got ya. So yeah, with a gallon of liquid that sounds much better. Depending on what type salt you used (big difference in volume between granulated salt and kosher salt) with granulated salt you have about a 25* SAL brine. If you used kosher salt it will be closer to a 20* SAL brine (weaker).
This is why I apply salt by percentage to meat weight. Matters not the type of salt used because it’s by weight, volumes ma change but sodium content will be same by weights.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Jan 30, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Oh I got ya. So yeah, with a gallon of liquid that sounds much better. Depending on what type salt you used (big difference in volume between granulated salt and kosher salt) with granulated salt you have about a 25* SAL brine. If you used kosher salt it will be closer to a 20* SAL brine (weaker).
> This is why I apply salt by percentage to meat weight. Matters not the type of salt used because it’s by weight, volumes ma change but sodium content will be same by weights.


Whew.... it was kosher salt.  Would you still suggest 7 days?


----------



## SmokinEdge (Jan 30, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Whew.... it was kosher salt.  Would you still suggest 7 days?


Was it diamond crystal, or Morton?


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Jan 30, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Was it diamond crystal, or Morton?


BJs warehouse kosher salt


----------



## SmokinEdge (Jan 30, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> BJs warehouse kosher salt


Not familiar with that brand, but here is something to consider when using salt by volume and not by weight..
1 cup of Morton kosher salt is equal to about 3/4 granulated salt (sea salt, pickling canning type)

1 cup of Diamond Crystal kosher is equal to about 1/2 cup granulated salt.

See where this is going? Volume measurements of salt and even sugar is just a no go for me.

So I will assume your salt is probably closer to Morton kosher, that said, I’d go 10 days maybe 12 days in brine. You can go as long as 30 days if you are not over 35* in refrigeration. The sugars in the brine will cause the brine to get ropey given enough time and temps closer to 40*.

10 to 14 days would be where I would pull it. Day 12 being the day, but you have a range to work with, that’s convenient for sure.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Jan 30, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Not familiar with that brand, but here is something to consider when using salt by volume and not by weight..
> 1 cup of Morton kosher salt is equal to about 3/4 granulated salt (sea salt, pickling canning type)
> 
> 1 cup of Diamond Crystal kosher is equal to about 1/2 cup granulated salt.
> ...


Yep... Similar to Morton.   Fridge is at 35, so I'll plan for 12 or 13. 

Thanks again - very much appreciated!


----------



## SmokinEdge (Jan 30, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Yep... Similar to Morton.   Fridge is at 35, so I'll plan for 12 or 13.
> 
> Thanks again - very much appreciated!


Always.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 3, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Always.


Post-cure seasoning and smoke questions  
I am planning to use this (or a slight variation) for my rub for smoking next weekend - I remember seeing a post that didn't use mustard seed, but Montreal Steak seasoning, so curious to get thoughts on that or other variations...and I am going to smoke it at 225 probably.


2 Tablespoons black peppercorns (fresh ground)
2 Tablespoons coriander seeds(fresh ground)
1 Tablespoon whole mustard seeds (fresh ground)
2 Tablespoons coarse kosher or sea salt
2 Tablespoons smoked paprika
2 Tablespoons brown sugar
1 Tablespoon garlic powder


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 3, 2022)

Looks fine to me but I would delete the salt.



TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Post-cure seasoning and smoke questions
> I am planning to use this (or a slight variation) for my rub for smoking next weekend - I remember seeing a post that didn't use mustard seed, but Montreal Steak seasoning, so curious to get thoughts on that or other variations...and I am going to smoke it at 225 probably.
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 3, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Looks fine to me but I would delete the salt.


Thanks - I wasn't sure about that....don't want to eat pastrami salt :)


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 3, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Thanks - I wasn't sure about that....don't want to eat pastrami salt :)


I’m not sure about the Montreal seasoning idea. I don’t add salt to corned beef or pastrami. 
I just use black pepper, coriander, garlic powder and sometimes onion powder. But this can be a bit to our own taste buds. The mix you posted is a pretty solid pastrami. Try that and make notes for deletion or additions. If sliced thin I find the rub is not a big player in overall taste. The cured beef and smoke are upfront and the rub is in the back end.


----------



## jcam222 (Feb 3, 2022)

In to see the finish. I love me a pastrami, fried cabbage and dill havarti sandwich.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 3, 2022)

jcam222 said:


> In to see the finish. I love me a pastrami, fried cabbage and dill havarti sandwich.


Thanks - I'll probably pull it on Friday, season it, wrap it and let it sit for 1-2 days and then smoke, hopefully on Sunday :)


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 3, 2022)

Ok….timing quandry 

I started the cure on 1/25, and I want to apply the rub and let it sit in the fridge for a couple of days, wrapped up before I smoke it. If I take or of the cure Friday (10 days) and have it sit with the rub for 2, that would mean smoking on Monday which isn't practical with work.

If I pull Friday night (10 day cure) and put the rub on, is smoking it on Sunday reasonable?  Thoughts as always are greatly appreciated!


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 3, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Ok….timing quandry
> 
> I started the cure on 1/25, and I want to apply the rub and let it sit in the fridge for a couple of days, wrapped up before I smoke it. If I take or of the cure Friday (10 days) and have it sit with the rub for 2, that would mean smoking on Monday which isn't practical with work.
> 
> If I pull Friday night (10 day cure) and put the rub on, is smoking it on Sunday reasonable?  Thoughts as always are greatly appreciated!


The rub sitting for time (days) is not required. Pull on Friday, rub and smoke on Saturday or Sunday. No worries.


----------



## DougE (Feb 4, 2022)

The rub isn't going to go much beyond the surface, so leaving it sit for any period of time really won't gain you anything


----------



## MJB05615 (Feb 4, 2022)

In for the finish too.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 4, 2022)

I feel like Lt. Columbo with "just one more thing"....

I have Pit Boss Pecan, Classic, Competition, Mesquite, Hickory, and Fruitwood blends to choose from for the smoke.  In figuring that there's plenty of flavor in the corning and then rub/smoking process, I'd probably use Pecan and/or the Classic/Competition blend pellets.

Thoughts...please   ?


----------



## DougE (Feb 4, 2022)

Pecan, or maybe pecan/cherry blend.


----------



## Steve H (Feb 4, 2022)

I've always used a comp blend. In regard to wrapping and letting it sit in the fridge. I wouldn't wrap it prior to smoking. Let the pellicle form.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 4, 2022)

Steve H said:


> I've always used a comp blend. In regard to wrapping and letting it sit in the fridge. I wouldn't wrap it prior to smoking. Let the pellicle form.


Steve - Are you suggesting that I pull it, apply the rub and then let it sit overnight, or apply the rub _after it sits overnight?_


----------



## Steve H (Feb 4, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Steve - Are you suggesting that I pull it, apply the rub and then let it sit overnight, or apply the rub _after it sits overnight?_



I add the rub the night before. It'll stick well then. I just use freshly ground pepper and coriander. I like a course grind. But that's me.  Give it a good layer of it. Then smoke at 225- 250 until it probes tender. Usually around 203-205 IT


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 9, 2022)

Just an update....

I realized I put it in the  brine on 1/30, so today (2/9) would be 10 days, but I am thinking that I'll let it stay in until Friday, rub it down and smoke it on Saturday.  Does that seem reasonable?

And taking cues from a from a few recipes, here's my planned rub mix:
I plan to toast the peppercorns, coriander, and mustard seeds, then fresh grind them

4 TBS Ground Black Pepper
1 tsp Ground Coriander
1 TBS Ground Mustard Seeds
2 tsp Paprika
2 TBS Brown Sugar
1 TBS Garlic Powder
2 tsp Montreal Steak Seasoning
1 tsp Onion Powder


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 11, 2022)

Opening Pandora's box now :)

I searched SMF for thoughts on IT for the pastrami I am smoking tomorrow, and saw everything from 150 to 205 - that's quite a range!!!

Status as of 2/11 - wet cure for 10 days, will remove tonight and apply the rub (previous post) and let it sit and form the pellicle before tomorrow's smoke.

While it may not be needed for this, I do have a slicer, so I wouldn't want it to fall apart, so I was thinking maybe going to 175?


----------



## Fueling Around (Feb 11, 2022)

Sorry to add my 2 cents this late.
I make pastrami ocassionally.
My favorite rub is closer to your first post in #11 except I omit the salt and sugar. I like the flavor and aroma of coriander
I lightly pan roast whole mustard and coriander seeds and then coarse grind it.
edit: forgot to include coriander seeds in the pan roast.  Tried pan roasting peppercorns and they got harsh to my taste.


TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Steve - Are you suggesting that I pull it, apply the rub and then let it sit overnight, or apply the rub _after it sits overnight?_


After the brine, I always wipe the meat dry and put in the fridge on a rack uncovered for 1-2 days. The surface gets a nice stickiness (pellicle) as Steve noted.
I add the rub immediately before going in the smoker.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 11, 2022)

Fueling Around said:


> Sorry to add my 2 cents this late.
> I make pastrami ocassionally.
> My favorite rub is closer to your first post in #11 except I omit the salt and sugar. I like the flavor and aroma of coriander
> I lightly pan roast whole mustard seed and then coarse grind it.
> ...


Thanks for the input - any thoughts on final IT?


----------



## MJB05615 (Feb 11, 2022)

The few times I've made Pastrami, I smoke to an IT of 175-185.  When it's pretty tender, but not too tender that it falls apart.  We let it cool for a few hours, then slice as thin as possible with electric slicer.
Then we steam portions at a time to serve hot via steaming.  The steaming keeps it moist and very tender from the thin slicing.  I did the best one ever after 6 attempts over 3 years recently and I'll be posting it this weekend.  Make sure you post up some pics of yours.


----------



## Fueling Around (Feb 11, 2022)

Sorry, I forgot to finish



 MJB05615
 has you covered


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 11, 2022)

Out of the brine and in fridge to form the pellicle


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 11, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> View attachment 525523
> View attachment 525524
> 
> Out of the brine and in fridge to form the pellicle


Looks great.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 11, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> Looks great.


Whew...was concerned the couple of red spots meant I goofed


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 11, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Whew...was concerned the couple of red spots meant I goofed


Nope. Those spots are where the meat was touching meat or was touching plastic. No oxygen was present and no oxidation occurred in those spots. It’s normal.


----------



## Sven Svensson (Feb 11, 2022)

MJB05615 said:


> The few times I've made Pastrami, I smoke to an IT of 175-185.  When it's pretty tender, but not too tender that it falls apart.  We let it cool for a few hours, then slice as thin as possible with electric slicer.
> Then we steam portions at a time to serve hot via steaming.  The steaming keeps it moist and very tender from the thin slicing.  I did the best one ever after 6 attempts over 3 years recently and I'll be posting it this weekend.  Make sure you post up some pics of yours.


I agree on the temps. I’ve done too many that end up as hash, which isn’t bad, but when you’re going for slices it doesn’t work.

I look forward to seeing your post on how you do it. I’m interested in the steaming.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 13, 2022)

Wohoo…smoked and sliced!   It did come out quite tasty  Tudor all the help!

I did steam to reheat on he stove, wrapped in aluminum foil on a rack with water underneath for about 5 minutes.


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 13, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Wohoo…smoked and sliced!   It did come out quite tasty  Tudor all the help!
> 
> View attachment 525646
> View attachment 525647
> View attachment 525648


That looks fantastic! Nice work for sure.


----------



## MJB05615 (Feb 13, 2022)

Looks excellent!  Great work.


----------



## jaxgatorz (Feb 13, 2022)

Beautiful pastrami  !!


----------



## TNJAKE (Feb 13, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> Wohoo…smoked and sliced!   It did come out quite tasty  Tudor all the help!
> 
> I did steam to reheat on he stove, wrapped in aluminum foil on a rack with water underneath for about 5 minutes.
> 
> ...


Nailed it


----------



## ab canuck (Feb 13, 2022)

I am in for this one as well, That has been on my list for a few yrs, It seems like the list never gets shorter, just longer between working away from home and the little time I do get at home there are multiple lists......


----------



## ab canuck (Feb 13, 2022)

Looks Fantabulous, Great job. I am going to do this soon


----------



## Fueling Around (Feb 13, 2022)

Outstanding
What's next on the list?


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 13, 2022)

Fueling Around said:


> Outstanding
> What's next on the list?


. Tacos/Chicken El Pastor (sp?) maybe…I have the vertical rod for it but haven’t attempted yet.


----------



## SmokinEdge (Feb 13, 2022)

TheGrumpyGriller said:


> . Tacos/Chicken El Pastor (sp?) maybe…I have the vertical rod for it but haven’t attempted yet.









Thats Al pastor with the pineapple top. Delicious.


----------



## GrumpyGriller (Feb 13, 2022)

SmokinEdge said:


> View attachment 525724
> 
> Thats Al pastor with the pineapple top. Delicious.


That’s a heck of a spread!!!


----------

