# Not enough smoke flavor using my Camp Chef pellet grill.



## forktender

Even on the high smoke setting with a Amazing smoke tube with hickory Cook'in pellets and a full Amazing Smoke Maze using dust made from Old Cook'in pellets that got damp.
Coming from a stick burner to the pellet grill has been a disappointment as far as smoke flavor goes.
I think these forced air grills just move too much air to get a good smokey flavor. I even use  homemade smoked salt and  smoked paprika in my rubs.
Am I missing something or doing something wrong?
Thank you for any help you can provide me with, I'm about ready to give up on this damn convection oven and go back to the stick burner or the barrel.

Dan


----------



## radio

forktender said:


> Even on the high smoke setting with a Amazing smoke tube with hickory Cook'in pellets and a full Amazing Smoke Maze using dust made from Old Cook'in pellets that got damp.
> Coming from a stick burner to the pellet grill has been a disappointed as far as smoke flavor goes.
> I think these forced air grills just move too much air to get a good smokey flavor. I even use smoked salt and  smoked paprika in my rubs.
> Am I missing something or doing something wrong?
> Thank you for any help you can provide me with, I'm about ready to give up on this damn convection oven and go back to the stick burner or the barrel.
> 
> Dan




I'm there with you!
After several attempts to ramp up the flavor on my Green Mtn, I now start things in my stick burner, then move to the pellet grill to finish.  I use heating pellets in it now as the meats are put in there foiled at the stall and smoke or ash never touches the meat, so no use burning expensive flavored pellets.


----------



## forktender

That is exactly what I plan on doing tomorrow when I cook up a Butt.
I'll toss it in the drum around 275*
For the first basket of coals which is only about 6 hours with the small basket that I have too use.
Instead of refilling the basket I will finish it off in the pellet oven.
I don't know anything about heating pellets so I'll stick with the cheapest pellets I have laying around  Are you sure that it's OK to use heating pellets for cooking?
I'd air on the safe side and buy some cheap'o pellets when they go on sale at Lowe's or Home Depot.
If I figure these pellet poopers out I will post it up, please do the same.

Thanks brother.
Dan


----------



## oldsmokerdude

I have a pellet smoker myself and am going through the same process of trying to get the deep smoke flavor I'm used to. I read lots of articles, posts, etc about pellet smokers not generating enough of a smoke flavor. On the other hand, there are quite of few competition teams using pellet smokers and winning major events so it must be possible to achieve the flavor we're looking for.

For my latest trial I tried this:

Initial cook at about 175 for a couple hours with AMZNPS. I am using bbqers delight pellets of 100% hickory in this the AMZN.
Using LumberJack pellets in the pellet hopper (only because bbqer delight pellets are a bit pricey).
After two hours bump the temperature up to about 275 to 300 for the rest of the cook.
This has given me a lot more smoke flavor than anything else I've tried, though admittedly still not quite there. Many of the competition teams are using something called MojoBricks and I may give that a try, but I currently don't see how that would be any better than the AMZN tray I use.

I'll keep you posted.


----------



## radio

forktender said:


> That is exactly what I plan on doing tomorrow when I cook up a Butt.
> I'll toss it in the drum around 275*
> For the first basket of coals which is only about 6 hours with the small basket that I have too use.
> Instead of refilling the basket I will finish it off in the pellet oven.
> I don't know anything about heating pellets so I'll stick with the cheapest pellets I have laying around  Are you sure that it's OK to use heating pellets for cooking?
> I'd air on the safe side and buy some cheap'o pellets when they go on sale at Lowe's or Home Depot.
> If I figure these pellet poopers out I will post it up, please do the same.
> 
> Thanks brother.
> Dan


I have heated the house with a pellet stove for the last 10 years and have narrowed it down the very best 100% hardwood pellets for best heat and little ash, so these are what I use in the GMG.  I live in the heart of the Ozarks and we have several pellet mills here.  This area has almost all oak timber and various charcoal manufacturers are located here also including Royal Oak and Kingsford.   
I only put the meat in the pellet grill after it is tightly covered, or foiled so no smoke or ash hits the meat.  I could use the oven, but in the summer time, why add heat to the house and make the air conditioner work harder?
By starting on the stick burner I get awesome flavor and smoke ring and finish in the pellet grill so I don't have to babysit the smoker except the first few hours of the cook.

Good luck on the cook and let us know the results.  Don't forget the Q view!


----------



## forktender

Thanks for the intro and info.
I'm going to have to Google search those mojo bricks. I have never heard of them before.
Thanks for that. And for sure keep me posted if you find anything that helps out your cooks, I'll do the same.
Dan


----------



## ross77

If you’re using 100% hickory pellets and an additional smoking device I just think a pellet smoker isn’t for you. I’d hate to have to fire up two cookers. 

Some people prefer a heavy smoke flavor. I would get heavy flavor from my Masterbuilt electric but it was acrid and I didn’t like it. Pellet smokers are definitely cleaner burning. 

I’ve never used a camp chef but I get good smoke flavor from my Rec Tec using 100% hickory pellets. I get quite a bit of smoke output at temps below 250. 

Does the Camp Chef pulse the fan?  The Rec Tec controller will pulse at lower temps to allow the pellets to smolder.


----------



## forktender

Pretty much what I'm thinking as well. I've never heard the fan pulse even on the high smoke setting, but I normally have the tunes cranked up so I don't have to listen to the fan.


----------



## tallbm

I'm not a pellet smoker user BUT I can tell you that if you are buying just any old plain pellets from the store that you are likely not getting over 30-35% of the pellet "flavor" listed on the bag!

I bet that if you put 100% hickory in your pellet tube, and the AMNPS tray, and burn 2 rows of the AMNPS tray at one time you would probably get TOO much smoke flavor.

I buy Lumberjack pellets because they easily identify if the pellets you are buying are 100% of the wood listed or if they are blending the wood.  Most other pellet brands (Traeger, Pit Boss, Camp Chef, Louisiana Grills, Pacific Pellet, etc. etc.) give you 20-35% of the pellet on the label :(((

Making sure you are using a 100% pellet in your tube and tray would be a good place to start trying to boost smoke flavor if you haven't already done this.  BTW, I believe Cabela's brand pellet is just rebranded Lumberjack and is 100% of the wood listed.  Also Perfect Pellet is a brand that does 100% Hickory in addition to Lumberjack.

Best of luck trying some things! :)


----------



## forktender

My go to pellets are Cook'in and Lumberjack brand which are 100% flavor wood no fillers.
I use them in the hopper and in the tube and dust made from them in the maze.
I take the dome damper off the stack when I run the tube and maze together so the cooker doesn't creosote over. I love the ease of the pellet oven but so far I'm not impressed with it as a smoker.
Don't get me wrong the food that comes off of it is good but it's lacking the old school BBQ flavor that most of us are looking to reproduce. Maybe they just aren't for me!


----------



## gmc2003

Dust will give you a cleaner, but lighter smoke. Use pellets in your tray and light both ends. When I use dust in my tray for smoking cheese it takes twice as long to get the flavor profile I'm looking for, but I can basically eat it straight from the smoker w/o the wait.

Chris


----------



## bangstick

As a Camp Chef Woodwind owner, I was always under the impression that, as a general rule, pellet smokers produce less "smoke flavor" than stick burners. That said, I've had mine just over a year and off all of the items I've smoked on my Woodwind, I can't say any of them were missing smoke flavor. Granted, I prefer the smoke to be a part of the flavor profile and not the majority of the flavor profile. Granted, everyone's tastes are different, I'm sure.


----------



## megabrisket

bangstick said:


> As a Camp Chef Woodwind owner, I was always under the impression that, as a general rule, pellet smokers produce less "smoke flavor" than stick burners. That said, I've had mine just over a year and off all of the items I've smoked on my Woodwind, I can't say any of them were missing smoke flavor. Granted, I prefer the smoke to be a part of the flavor profile and not the majority of the flavor profile. Granted, everyone's tastes are different, I'm sure.


I think that's why I'm in the market for a pellet smoker. I used to smoke on my gas grill. I set it up in sort of an offset fashion and put a smoker box full of chips or chunks over the flames on one end and meat on the other. It always produced a nice smoke flavor and smoke ring. I wanted something more set and forget so I got an MES 30 on sale for $100. I have to say nearly every cook on it has been sub-par. Most of the time the smoke is too heavy and doesn't burn clean/blue. If I do get TBS, it's only for a couple of minutes. I bought an AMNPS tray but the darn thing just won't stay going good enough, even set on the bottom with the chip loader removed. It just doesn't seem to get enough air flow. Long story short (too late for that), that's why I'm thinking a pellet smoker is right up my alley. More set it and forget than most but still and nice smoke flavor profile and smoke ring.


----------



## ross77

I had a MES 30 and hated the smoke flavor.  I bought the cold smoker attachment but that made it even worse.  I also read about the AMNPS tray but decided to pass as I read that people were having issues keeping it lit.  I like the cleaner smoke flavor of my pellet smoker.  It's got plenty of smoke for me.


----------



## johnmeyer

To me, a pellet smoker is almost exactly like those relatively new "instant pots" which combine the functions of a pressure cooker and a slow cooker into one device. Compared to a dedicated slow cooker, they lack features, size, and other functions. Compared to a pressure cooker, they are slow, don't do as good a job browning items before pressure cooking, and so on.

The pellet grill has always seemed to me to be a way to combine a traditional grill with a smoker. However, it doesn't get as hot as a traditional grill, and therefore doesn't do a very good job of searing, and when it comes to smoking, everything I've ever been served from a Trager pellet grill barely has any smoke taste.

As for adding more smoke via an AMNPS or tube, you run into the same problem that you have with a gas grill: too much air movement, which is required for the combustion. This means that you have to generate a HUGE amount of smoke to get any effect. 

So, if your goal is big-time smoke, lots of bark, and real BBQ flavor, you may be SOL with a pellet grill.


----------



## ross77

Sounds like you don't own a pellet smoker and therefore don't have much experience with one.  I get excellent bark on my briskets and pork shoulders.  As for 'real BBQ flavor' I'm not sure what that means.  For reference, I've owned a charcoal smoker and a MES.  Not sure what Traeger you were served food from but there are many more choices these days.  Including brands/models that can get to 500+ and offer direct flame searing.

The main downside is temps over 250.  I don't get much smoke flavor at temps over 250.  The pellets simply burn too efficiently at higher temps.


----------



## johnmeyer

I was served food on a Traeger during an event they hosted at the local ACE hardware store. I assumed he knew how to operate the equipment, so I based some of my statements on that experience. I then had to fix a neighbor's Traeger and to do that, had to "reverse engineer" it (i.e., figure out how it worked). I have a pretty good idea of how it works, and the main problem is exactly what you describe: the heat and smoke are NOT independent of each other. My MES, without the AMNPS or external smoking device, has the same problem, because at lower temps it doesn't produce much smoke (somewhat the opposite of the Traeger). However, the MES is easy to mod to overcome its deficiencies. By contrast, the OP did a really good job explaining the shortcomings of his pellet smoker. 

I'm not trying to rag on pellet smokers because every design has its shortcomings and strengths. However, if the goal is "authentic" smoke flavor, I don't think a pellet smoker/grill would be my first choice.


----------



## bangstick

My Woodwind gets up to 500 degrees. If you're grilling and need hotter than that, well, with the Woodwind you're in luck because it has a sear box that reaches a legit 900 degrees. If you need hotter than that, well, you don't need anything hotter than that.
My woodwind puts out awesome reverse steaks and thick cut chops. Low and slow on the smoker and then finish them on the sear box (at 900 degrees) and they turn out great.
I've done pork butts on my Woodwind that have had a tremendous bark on them.
I had a BGE but it didn't do anything as good as or better than my Woodwind so I sold it.
As far as "authentic smoke flavor," everyone that has eaten anything from my Woodwind has been pleased with what I'm assuming you'd consider fake smoke flavor? I mean, burnt wood pellets put out smoke. I don't know how much more "authentic" smoke gets. I can appreciate a pellet smoker/grill not being someone's first choice but they should at least get an honest assessment of facts and not just someone's opinion.


----------



## ross77

4 of my friends bought pellet cookers after eating many meals from my pellet cooker. I must be doing something right. 

As for the comment about no bark, well that is just wrong.


----------



## bregent

johnmeyer said:


> I'm not trying to rag on pellet smokers because every design has its shortcomings and strengths. However, if the goal is "authentic" smoke flavor, I don't think a pellet smoker/grill would be my first choice.



I guess it depends on what you define as "authentic" smoke flavor. On recent trips to Memphis and KC, I tried several popular BBQ joints and found the smoke profile to be right on par with what I get from my pellet grill. However, it is less than the smoke flavor I typically get from backyard smokers like my GOSM and WSM.


----------



## bregent

johnmeyer said:


> To me, a pellet smoker is almost exactly like those relatively new "instant pots" which combine the functions of a pressure cooker and a slow cooker into one device. Compared to a dedicated slow cooker, they lack features, size, and other functions. Compared to a pressure cooker, they are slow, don't do as good a job browning items before pressure cooking, and so on.



We're drifting off topic here, but I've owned pressure cookers for 40 years and bought a new stainless 6qt a few years ago. But I haven't touched it since my son brought home an Instant Pot. It's true that it doesn't reach as a high a pressure as a stove top PC (newer model IP now do reach 15PSI), but that only means about 10% in cook time. But it's easier to use due to the built in timer so I get more consistent results.  And it browns just as well as my stove top PC. I don't use it much for slow cooking, but it has MORE features than my dedicated slow cooker. 



johnmeyer said:


> So, if your goal is big-time smoke, lots of bark, and real BBQ flavor, you may be SOL with a pellet grill.



Pellet grills do not produce an up front, in your face, smoke profile. They do produce real BBQ flavor and lots of bark.


----------



## forktender

After spending the summer trying different things to get more of a smoke flavor on my food I have come to the conclusion that pellet ovens are just not for me. 
The only reason I will continue to use it is it was a birthday present from my wife.
On long smokes I will start things on my UDS with a small basket of charcoal and wood. Once I burn through the small fuel load I will transfer the food over to the pellet oven to keep me and my little lady happy. 

If any of you have found a way to get a stronger smoke flavor and a heavy bark-
(without using a ton of sugar) Burnt sugar flavor isn't what I would consider a good bark.
Please let me know how you are doing so, you just might save my marriage......LOL
A P/M would be great, because I still haven't figured out how to follow a thread on this new site.
Thank you.
Dan


----------



## RCAlan

forktender said:


> If any of you have found a way to get a stronger smoke flavor and a heavy bark-
> (without using a ton of sugar) Burnt sugar flavor isn't what I would consider a good bark.
> Please let me know how you are doing so, you just might save my marriage......LOL



If you’re looking to add some true wood smoke flavor to your pellet grill, you might want to give this a look... 
https://smokedaddyinc.com/product/the-heavy-d-stick-burning-heat-diffuser/
I haven’t tried it yet, just doing my research as well... There’s a video of it in the link as well...   If anyone has any real info on this upgrade and not just empty opinions, please share... 

PB Austin XL in SoCal and always...  Semper Fi


----------



## Herbert Miller

oldsmokerdude said:


> I have a pellet smoker myself and am going through the same process of trying to get the deep smoke flavor I'm used to. I read lots of articles, posts, etc about pellet smokers not generating enough of a smoke flavor. On the other hand, there are quite of few competition teams using pellet smokers and winning major events so it must be possible to achieve the flavor we're looking for.
> 
> For my latest trial I tried this:
> 
> Initial cook at about 175 for a couple hours with AMZNPS. I am using bbqers delight pellets of 100% hickory in this the AMZN.
> Using LumberJack pellets in the pellet hopper (only because bbqer delight pellets are a bit pricey).
> After two hours bump the temperature up to about 275 to 300 for the rest of the cook.
> This has given me a lot more smoke flavor than anything else I've tried, though admittedly still not quite there. Many of the competition teams are using something called MojoBricks and I may give that a try, but I currently don't see how that would be any better than the AMZN tray I use.
> 
> I'll keep you posted.


 I am very dissatisfied with the amount of smoke I'm getting from my pellet grill and have tried the a-maze-n smoke maze.  I have always had a problem keeping it lit!!! Anybody have any secrets?


----------



## bregent

Herbert Miller said:


> I am very dissatisfied with the amount of smoke I'm getting from my pellet grill and have tried the a-maze-n smoke maze.  I have always had a problem keeping it lit!!! Anybody have any secrets?



Depending on your pellet grill, mazes can be very hard to keep lit because the flame in the firepot consumes some of the oxygen. Try a tube instead - they require less O2 to stay lit.


----------



## Jabiru

I put my meat straight in from the fridge, keep grill low 160f for an hour or so Then put to the cooking temp I want. 

The smoke profile etc etc are perfect to us. The flavour is like cooked over a super clean camping fire to everyone who has tasted our food.

Got a charcoal smoker, gasser and charcoal spit. All have a different taste.


----------



## texomakid

I too own a pellet grill/smoker/cooker and I can tell you my humble opinion it's probably the best cooking device I've ever owned so far.

IT WILL NOT MATCH SMOKING WITH A STICK BURNER OR A CHARCOAL SMOKER FOR THAT HEAVY SMOKE FLAVOR.

I can't speak for any other pellet cooker other than mine. There's smoke and it does produce smoke flavor. I actually enjoy the amount of smoke it puts out and I enjoy moving from one type of wood pellet to the next so I can experience those flavors and aromas.  It's just not overpowering like you will get out of a Lang loaded with hickory or Pecan or a WSM with charcoal and wood chunks. If you're looking for a pellet cooker to reproduce that same "smoke" of the more traditional forms of smoke cookers then you will be disappointed. That's why so many folks own more than one type of cooker. After all, isn't cooking with various forms of smoke half the fun?


----------



## dubob

texomakid said:


> After all, isn't cooking with various forms of smoke half the fun?


Not for some of us!


----------



## SlowmotionQue

texomakid said:


> I too own a pellet grill/smoker/cooker and I can tell you my humble opinion it's probably the best cooking device I've ever owned so far.
> 
> IT WILL NOT MATCH SMOKING WITH A STICK BURNER OR A CHARCOAL SMOKER FOR THAT HEAVY SMOKE FLAVOR.
> 
> I can't speak for any other pellet cooker other than mine. There's smoke and it does produce smoke flavor. I actually enjoy the amount of smoke it puts out and I enjoy moving from one type of wood pellet to the next so I can experience those flavors and aromas.  It's just not overpowering like you will get out of a Lang loaded with hickory or Pecan or a WSM with charcoal and wood chunks. If you're looking for a pellet cooker to reproduce that same "smoke" of the more traditional forms of smoke cookers then you will be disappointed. That's why so many folks own more than one type of cooker. After all, isn't cooking with various forms of smoke half the fun?



Certainly for me it is.


----------



## Shootr

I use a tube, and had to experiment a bit to find a spot that it liked and would stay lit - on my Camp Chef DLX it's on the top rack all the way against the back wall.  As long as I don't load it the night before and let the pellets sponge up the overnight humidity (ugh, ask me how I know :-)  ) it stays lit every time and gives me a good few hours of TBS.


----------



## thesmokist

I'd try some different pellets and pellet cookers put out less smoke at higher temps.


----------

