# Foiling--The Texas Crutch



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

Meathead Goldwyn doesn't believe in the 3-2-1 method for barbecuing pork ribs and cites reasons why he thinks it should only be used with beef brisket? What's the consensus of opinion here?

http://amazingribs.com/tips_and_technique/texas_crutch.html


----------



## dannylang (Dec 29, 2014)

I HAVE SMOKED RIBS USING THE 321 METHOD, AND I HAVE SMOKED THEM WITHOUT USING THAT METHOD, IT SEEMS JUST WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU, THATS WHAT YOU SHOULD DO. I KNOW THAT THE 321 METHOD, WILL MAKE YOUR RIBS MORE TENDER IF YOU COOK THEM A LITTLE LONGER, BUT SO WILL, IF YOU DO NOT. JUST A MATTER OF PREFERANCE.


----------



## boykjo (Dec 29, 2014)

I believe its a good starting point for everyone to follow as a beginner. As you get to know your smoker and become more experienced you can change your methods. I moved to a 2-1-1 with great results. I cant say my ribs were ruined when I did the 3-2-1.... They were just fall off the bone which my spouse likes better anyway...

just a lot of hoopla..............

Joe

hoop-lah]

noun, Informal.

1. 
bustling excitement or activity; commotion; hullabaloo; to-do.

2. 
sensational publicity; ballyhoo.

3. 
speech or writing intended to mislead or to obscure an issue.


----------



## sqwib (Dec 29, 2014)

OK ill give my *opinion* and this is my opinion based on cooking for friends and family, I don't want to hear, "well that wont fly at a competition"... so what... I don't care lol. 







I foil butts and picnics to get past the stall, I think the foiling does not have any adverse affect on the meat and the statements that the bark is not adequate is nonsense and if someone wants to foil and have a thick bark, they can remove the foil after the stall. I don't always foil but most of the time I do because there is nothing negative, just saving time.

.

Ribs, I loosely foil on the "2" but for less time... I don't prefer the ribs foiled as I believe it changes the texture to more mush like that some will confuse with fall off the bone tender. To elaborate on that, I prefer my ribs cooked high heat as they are more "steak like" in texture, I do however also like them straight up 5- 6 hours no foil on the pit. 

I done a bunch of Ribs on Manday and most of the guys preferred the Pit Ribs 5 hours at 250°, I like the ones grilled over direct heat better.

How do I cook my Ribs? 3-2-1 why? because my family likes them that way, as well as most folks, the only time I cook ribs no foil is on Manday

Foiling ribs does change the integrity of the meat, but that's what a lot of folks prefer.

So it all depends on what you want as the desired outcome.

It's like saying to someone that likes their meat well done that its not the right way and it has gotta be rare.

If they like it like a charcoal briquet, cook it to death for them because that's what they want.

I never, ever add liquid to a Texas crutch, it does nothing at all. I am of the minority on this as well.

He states that crutching for too long will result in a loss of flavor, I call BS on this unless you are running the temps so high that the meat constricts and forces out the moisture, but not on a 250° cook.

_On the downside, wrapping in foil can seriously damage the bark, the crispy exterior made of dehydrated mea_t

This can be avoided by removing the butt or picnic from the foil after the temp starts rising again, this is also a good way to control how thick you want your bark.

He also says that _*For ribs. *I don't crutch ribs. The quality increase is small_.

Its not a matter of quality increase, it comes down to changing the integrity of the meat. The word "Quality" here is subjective

This I totally agree with.

_I strongly disagree with the two hours in the crutch. Go much beyond 30 minutes and you risk overcooking the meat and turning it mushy._

This is why I loosely foil my ribs its sort of a tradeoff, the family likes em and I can tolerate them.

_*After the crutch.* Some cooks put the meat in an insulated box, a faux cambro, to rest and further soften connective tissues. I think this is important for brisket. Less so for other meats. When you open the package be extremely careful to avoid the hot steamy air that will escape. Then remove the meat and cook at 225°F for about 30 minutes or so to dry the surface and firm up the bark_

I agree and disagree, the idea of foiling and resting after the cook is to reabsorb as much into the meat as possible and it is also important for Picnics and Butts to keep breaking down and reabsorbing the connective tissue, does it have to be done...NO, but the results are worth it especially when you start pulling and see that most of the connective tissue is gone and reabsorbed into the meat.

I do like his website and there is a boatload of useful information.

Find what works best for who you cook for and tweak from there.


----------



## dannylang (Dec 29, 2014)

very good! boykjo   very well said


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

SQWIB said:


> OK ill give my *opinion* and this is my opinion based on cooking for friends and family, I don't want to hear, "well that wont fly at a competition"... so what... I don't care lol.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is a great response! I'm going to experiment more with the foiling/unfoiling. For ribs, since most times I miss the time to foil ribs, it's been more like 3-1.5-.5. So many knowledgeable and experienced guys swear by foiling and adding juice and flavorings to the foil that I think they know what they're talking about so I've been doing it. But next time I do ribs I'm going to try one rack with the 3-2-1 (or a variation of it) and one not crutched at all. I'm going to try the same thing with briskets.

My family prefers a wet sauced, steak-like texture to ribs, not the hard barky stuff.

I think it's an interesting idea that someone posted another page where I started this same thread about foiling meat to help get it past the stall point. I may try that.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

boykjo said:


> I believe its a good starting point for everyone to follow as a beginner. As you get to know your smoker and become more experienced you can change your methods. I moved to a 2-1-1 with great results. I cant say my ribs were ruined when I did the 3-2-1.... They were just fall off the bone which my spouse likes better anyway...
> 
> just a lot of hoopla..............
> 
> ...


[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:OfficeDocumentSettings>  <o:AllowPNG/> </o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]

I love the words hoopla, hullabaloo and ballyhoo. To those I will add another of my favorite words: brouhaha.

[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument>  <w:View>Normal</w:View>  <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom>  <w:TrackMoves/>  <w:TrackFormatting/>  <w:PunctuationKerning/>  <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/>  <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>  <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent>  <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>  <w:DoNotPromoteQF/>  <w:LidThemeOther>EN-US</w:LidThemeOther>  <w:LidThemeAsian>X-NONE</w:LidThemeAsian>  <w:LidThemeComplexScript>X-NONE</w:LidThemeComplexScript>  <w:Compatibility>   <w:BreakWrappedTables/>   <w:SnapToGridInCell/>   <w:WrapTextWithPunct/>   <w:UseAsianBreakRules/>   <w:DontGrowAutofit/>   <w:SplitPgBreakAndParaMark/>   <w:EnableOpenTypeKerning/>   <w:DontFlipMirrorIndents/>   <w:OverrideTableStyleHps/>  </w:Compatibility>  <m:mathPr>   <m:mathFont m:val="Cambria Math"/>   <m:brkBin m:val="before"/>   <m:brkBinSub m:val="--"/>   <m:smallFrac m:val="off"/>   <m:dispDef/>   <m:lMargin m:val="0"/>   <m:rMargin m:val="0"/>   <m:defJc m:val="centerGroup"/>   <m:wrapIndent m:val="1440"/>   <m:intLim m:val="subSup"/>   <m:naryLim m:val="undOvr"/>  </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument></xml><![endif][if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" DefUnhideWhenUsed="true"  DefSemiHidden="true" DefQFormat="false" DefPriority="99"  LatentStyleCount="267">  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="0" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Normal"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="heading 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 7"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 8"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="9" QFormat="true" Name="heading 9"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 7"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 8"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" Name="toc 9"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="35" QFormat="true" Name="caption"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="10" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Title"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="1" Name="Default Paragraph Font"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="11" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Subtitle"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="22" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Strong"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="20" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Emphasis"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="59" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Table Grid"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Placeholder Text"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="1" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="No Spacing"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Revision"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="34" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="List Paragraph"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="29" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Quote"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="30" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Quote"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 1"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 2"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 3"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 4"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 5"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="60" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Shading Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="61" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light List Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="62" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Light Grid Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="63" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 1 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="64" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Shading 2 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="65" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 1 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="66" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium List 2 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="67" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 1 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="68" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 2 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="69" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Medium Grid 3 Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="70" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Dark List Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="71" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Shading Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="72" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful List Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="73" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" Name="Colorful Grid Accent 6"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="19" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Subtle Emphasis"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="21" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Emphasis"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="31" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Subtle Reference"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="32" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Intense Reference"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="33" SemiHidden="false"   UnhideWhenUsed="false" QFormat="true" Name="Book Title"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="37" Name="Bibliography"/>  <w:LsdException Locked="false" Priority="39" QFormat="true" Name="TOC Heading"/> </w:LatentStyles></xml><![endif][if gte mso 10]><style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable{mso-style-name:"Table Normal";mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;mso-style-noshow:yes;mso-style-priority:99;mso-style-parent:"";mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;mso-para-margin-top:0in;mso-para-margin-right:0in;mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt;mso-para-margin-left:0in;line-height:115%;mso-pagination:widow-orphan;font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-ascii-theme-font:minor-latin;mso-hansi-font-family:Calibri;mso-hansi-theme-font:minor-latin;}</style><![endif]


----------



## dirtworldmike (Dec 29, 2014)

I tend to agree  as far as ribs go.  I find myself foiling ribs less and less each year and just doing 3hrs on smoke then 2 or 3 hrs indirect. If I'm doing ribs to freeze for use at a latter date. I'll foil 3-2 let cool then  vac  seal and freeze. They seem to tighten back up when frozen if they were foiled too long.

  To me the only failed rids are the ones  that the  meat will not hold to the bone when picked up or cutting with a knife or when bitten into and ribs that are drowned in store bought BBQ sauce loaded with liquid smoke.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

dirtworldmike said:


> I tend to agree  as far as ribs go.  I find myself foiling ribs less and less each year and just doing 3hrs on smoke then 2 or 3 hrs indirect. If I'm doing ribs to freeze for use at a latter date. I'll foil 3-2 let cool then  vac  seal and freeze. They seem to tighten back up when frozen if they were foiled too long.
> 
> To me the only failed rids are the ones  that the  meat will not hold to the bone when picked up or cutting with a knife or when bitten into and ribs that are drowned in store bought BBQ sauce loaded with liquid smoke.


What do you cook your ribs in? Do you grill them and place them off the coals or away from away from the propane burners for cooking by indirect heat?


----------



## bama bbq (Dec 29, 2014)

I quit foiling ribs yrs ago. I smoke Babybacks at 350*F for 3 hrs spritzing/mopping after each hr and saucing at 2.5 hrs. Basta.


----------



## sqwib (Dec 29, 2014)

dirtworldmike said:


> To me the only failed rids are the ones  that the  meat will not hold to the bone when picked up or cutting with a knife or when bitten into and ribs that are drowned in store bought BBQ sauce loaded with liquid smoke.


----------



## sqwib (Dec 29, 2014)

daRicksta said:


> This is a great response! I'm going to experiment more with the foiling/unfoiling. For ribs, since most times I miss the time to foil ribs, it's been more like 3-1.5-.5. So many knowledgeable and experienced guys swear by foiling and adding juice and flavorings to the foil that I think they know what they're talking about so I've been doing it. But next time I do ribs I'm going to try one rack with the 3-2-1 (or a variation of it) and one not crutched at all. I'm going to try the same thing with briskets.
> 
> My family prefers a wet sauced, steak-like texture to ribs, not the hard barky stuff.
> 
> I think it's an interesting idea that someone posted another page where I started this same thread about foiling meat to help get it past the stall point. I may try that.


Thin Bark, glaze build up last hour or so, not fall off the bone.













20121214219.JPG



__ sqwib
__ Dec 29, 2014






No foil, built up glaze, thin bark, Steak like texture.













20120908279.JPG



__ sqwib
__ Dec 29, 2014


















20120908318.JPG



__ sqwib
__ Dec 29, 2014






I have been trying them without foil every so often to see if the family complains... Ha Ha, I'm basically weening them from 3-2-1.

But as pointed out earlier in this thread by Boykjo, it is the best starting point for most folks but beware, a trimmed rack will cook differently than an untrimmed rack.

I have also had really thick racks from the same cryovac and they take longer as well.


----------



## noboundaries (Dec 29, 2014)

I don't like my SLC ribs foiled.  I prefer the bark and the bite.  My family and non-smoking friends always get foiled ribs.  To them FOTB is a perfect rib.  Tastes like mush to me.

I always foil BB's with a 2.5-1.0-.5 to FOTH because I do them for my wife, kids, and friends.  I don't care for BB's.

Butts, chuckies, and briskets I like to take deep into the stall before I wrap them.  By 170-180 IT, the bark is set.  I wrap it and finish fast with a chamber temp of 300+. That way I still get juices I can use for jus AND a firm bark.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

SQWIB said:


> Thin Bark, glaze build up last hour or so, not fall off the bone.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


What you've shown here is exactly the way my family likes ribs.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

Noboundaries said:


> I don't like my SLC ribs foiled. I prefer the bark and the bite. My family and non-smoking friends always get foiled ribs. To them FOTB is a perfect rib. Tastes like mush to me.
> 
> I always foil BB's with a 2.5-1.0-.5 to FOTH because I do them for my wife, kids, and friends. I don't care for BB's.
> 
> Butts, chuckies, and briskets I like to take deep into the stall before I wrap them. By 170-180 IT, the bark is set. I wrap it and finish fast with a chamber temp of 300+. That way I still get juices I can use for jus AND a firm bark.


I prefer to cook SLC ribs but the store where I usually buy them only carries baby backs, telling me SLC ribs weren't that popular. I've seen them at Costco under the Swift Premium brand but the major brands all add saline solution to their pork products so I choose not to buy those if I can avoid it.

Also, being a lazy guy, I prefer to start and finish the ribs in my smoker.


----------



## dirtworldmike (Dec 29, 2014)

daRicksta said:


> What do you cook your ribs in? Do you grill them and place them off the coals or away from away from the propane burners for cooking by indirect heat?


I cook them in the smoker. But when I'm reheating them from frozen, once thawed , I'll put them on the propane grill away from the burners(indirect) till their up to temp.Then I'll put them over the burners just long enough to glaze and tack up.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 29, 2014)

dirtworldmike said:


> I cook them in the smoker. But when I'm reheating them from frozen, once thawed , I'll put them on the propane grill away from the burners(indirect) till their up to temp.Then I'll put them over the burners just long enough to glaze and tack up.


That sounds great. For me, I just like to have one thing going at a time. Last year I experimented with cooking baby backs and SL ribs on a my Weber charcoal kettle grill (on a rib rack) and in my MES 30 smoker. All the ribs turned out great but it sure was a lot of work.


----------



## boykjo (Dec 29, 2014)

Since were showing some Q-view ....Well here's a 2-1-1 method running the smoker around 250













ribs.jpeg



__ boykjo
__ Dec 29, 2014


----------



## dirtsailor2003 (Dec 29, 2014)

My two cents for what its worth. I prefer my ribs smoked without any foil. Always have always will. With that said I think that beef ribs benefit from the braising phase so I will foil those. I usually have time to kill when smoking so I don't use foil to get me past the stall. Once again just my preference. I think it really comes down to how you like your smoke and using a method that works for you.

If I had my way all my meals would be cooked like this:













8384516419_56d89f8516_h.jpg



__ dirtsailor2003
__ Dec 29, 2014


















8384518297_9186fdbe88_h.jpg



__ dirtsailor2003
__ Dec 29, 2014


















8385603668_1821c89fee_h.jpg



__ dirtsailor2003
__ Dec 29, 2014


----------



## kc5tpy (Dec 29, 2014)

WELL ARGUED  SQWIB!!  I don't care for the mush " fall off the bone" steamed ribs.  Need some tug and some chew on those ribs.  I actually never foil anything.  I think proper temp control does away with the need to foil.  Just my opinion.  Keep Smokin!

Danny


----------



## b-one (Dec 29, 2014)

I prefer no foil the guests are eating for free they get them my way.


----------



## crazymoon (Dec 29, 2014)

It's your meat play with it anyway you want ! It's all  good !


----------



## daricksta (Dec 30, 2014)

dirtsailor2003 said:


> My two cents for what its worth. I prefer my ribs smoked without any foil. Always have always will. With that said I think that beef ribs benefit from the braising phase so I will foil those. I usually have time to kill when smoking so I don't use foil to get me past the stall. Once again just my preference. I think it really comes down to how you like your smoke and using a method that works for you.
> 
> If I had my way all my meals would be cooked like this:
> 
> ...


What a great setup you have! Of course this is different from using an electric smoker, which is what I own. But I'm definitely going to try smoking ribs both foiled and not foiled because I love conducting those kind of set-by-side tests.


----------



## daricksta (Dec 30, 2014)

boykjo said:


> Since were showing some Q-view ....Well here's a 2-1-1 method running the smoker around 250
> 
> 
> 
> ...


When I and my family picture the idea pork rib--this is what it looks like. Simply amazing-looking and I bet the taste matches.


----------



## bdskelly (Dec 30, 2014)

*3* hours at 225. *2* hours in foil at 225. *Final *hour out of foil at 275.  Tender but with a good bite and pull off the bone. 













PA120002.JPG



__ bdskelly
__ Oct 12, 2014






Typically I'll glaze the rack during the final hour. These I left dry because I was trying out a new sauce. 













PA120001.JPG



__ bdskelly
__ Oct 12, 2014






b


----------



## daricksta (Dec 31, 2014)

BDSkelly said:


> *3* hours at 225. *2* hours in foil at 225. *Final *hour out of foil at 275.  Tender but with a good bite and pull off the bone.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is what I love about smoking. You cook foiled at 225° and then unfoiled at 275. Another guy likes to cook in the 240s; me, I go for around 235--foiled and unfoiled--and keep it there. Everyone has their own preferences and their own style. I plan to start experimenting a bit around 250 and without foiling at all. If it doesn't work out I'll try the lower temp and foiling again. But to me the fun is in getting smoking tips from others, and in the experimenting to find out what works and what doesn't for me.


----------



## brooksy (Dec 31, 2014)

I have never foiled ribs! I don't plan on doing it either. The only thing I've ever foiled is my chuckies. I think the braising helps with beef.


----------



## bear55 (Dec 31, 2014)

I, like SQWIB, foil my butts and briskets at 165 to completion.  A thick bark is not desired by me or the family.  I also foil my ribs, beef and pork using the 3-2-1 or 2-2-1 method.  My family enjoys them fixed this way and after all we cook to please our families.


----------



## jarjarchef (Dec 31, 2014)

Bear55 said:


> I, like SQWIB, foil my butts and briskets at 165 to completion.  A thick bark is not desired by me or the family.  I also foil my ribs, beef and pork using the 3-2-1 or 2-2-1 method.  My family enjoys them fixed this way and after all we cook to please our families.


I agree. I do an adjusted 3-2-1, but same principle.

I do find it funny when you get someone set on cooking the entire way without foiling, then wrap and place into a cooler to allow to rest. What do you think is going to happen to the bark when you wrap and hold in a closed environment... 
	

	
	
		
		



		
		
	


	





I like picking the bits and pieces off my bark before wrapping. Then mixing everything together soft bark and all when I pull my PP. Don't do brisket much, but wrap it as well, but will do as mentioned earlier. I will place it back on smoker to dry the bark a little while I make a dipping sauce from the foil drippings.


----------



## medic92 (Dec 31, 2014)

The last ribs I did on the smoker were baby backs.  I gave them about five hours with no foil and got a nice bark on them.  They were still tender, moist and delicious.

Is it just me or does "moist" sound slightly dirty?













IMG_20140816_160139.jpg



__ medic92
__ Dec 31, 2014


















IMG_20140816_162629.jpg



__ medic92
__ Dec 31, 2014


----------



## retfr8flyr (Dec 31, 2014)

I prefer baby back to full ribs and I also prefer them not wrapped. I cook mine at 225° until done without every wrapping them. I don't like the fall off the bone mushy type, I like a more steak like bite it from the bone rib. I do foil my brisket's though, I think it makes them more tender. I don't really foil anything else, I prefer my butt's done without foil also.


----------



## sqwib (Dec 31, 2014)

Medic92 said:


> The last ribs I did on the smoker were baby backs.  I gave them about five hours with no foil and got a nice bark on them.  They were still tender, moist and delicious.
> 
> Is it just me or does "moist" sound slightly dirty?
> 
> ...


LOL...It all depends on how it is used in context

My ribs are moist

my chicken is moist

my steak is moist

..... here's where it gets a bit hairy

My loins are moist

My butt is moist.

My thighs are moist


----------



## noboundaries (Dec 31, 2014)

OMG SQWIB, I can't stop laughing!


----------



## medic92 (Dec 31, 2014)

SQWIB said:


> LOL...It all depends on how it is used in context
> 
> My ribs are moist
> 
> ...


I think you've nailed it SQWIB!


----------



## daricksta (Dec 31, 2014)

SQWIB said:


> LOL...It all depends on how it is used in context
> 
> My ribs are moist
> 
> ...


Somehow you just turned me into a vegetarian...


----------

