# Smoked sausage not taking smoke



## beardawg (May 3, 2017)

The last 2 batches of pork smoked sausage I made has not been taking on the smoke color on the casing. Can't figure it out. This batch, I let it dry in refrigerator for 2 days, let it warm to room temp and dried it at 100° in a MB electric smoker for 2 hours before I decided they were dry enough to start smoke on them. Stuffed in hog casings. Checked it into the smoke process, temp was @ 135° and I saw the casings were sweating like crazy. Where am I messing up? My first 8 or 10 batches did fine and we're pretty colored and tasty. These are tasty enough, just ugly. Help. Why are the sausages sweating after drying that much?


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## uzikaduzi (May 4, 2017)

is your smoke source solely the materbuilt or are you augmenting with something else... they can really only generate smoke when the element is heating to control the temperature and i bet it's not working too hard at maintaining 135 (although sweating like crazy makes me wonder if your temps are accurate). you can also dry out the surface too much which will inhibit smoke penetration.

I would get a maze smoker like the AMPS to use with your masterbuilt and check the temps in it compared to what it's set at.


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## beardawg (May 4, 2017)

I use MB cold smoke attachment for smoke. Also have verified temps. I used 2 different digital thermometers to CK IT and two dial thermometers to CK temps inside smoker. I seem for some reason to be getting a lot of moisture later in the smoke. How long do y'all dry the sausages in the smoker before you start actual smoking and cooking?


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## uzikaduzi (May 4, 2017)

personally i don't dry mine in the smoker at all... i leave them in the ridge over night and out in the kitchen for an hour before smoking; however, i don't cook and smoke simultaneously, i cold smoke, then transfer to my oven to cook.

it seems most people dry for an hour or 2 in the smoker with no smoke at 100f from what I've seen around here... sweating could be fat out or condensation. if you're sausage was too cold compared to your smoker temp (which seems very unlikely given your description) that would cause condensation. 135 is on the cool side for fat out, but maybe if you didn't get good binding that could exacerbate the issue?

i'm not sure what to suggest... hopefully someone else will have some insight


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## BGKYSmoker (May 4, 2017)

Bring your sausage to room temp before putting in smoker. then heat at 130 for and hour bumping 10* every 2 hrs or so with a final IT smoker of 165-170*

Your results may vary from mine.


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## crankybuzzard (May 4, 2017)

Putting your links into a warm pit while still cold can cause condensation.  I like to get them into the pit without smoke at a low temp to basically preheat and not have as much potential to condensate before I add smoke.


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## BGKYSmoker (May 4, 2017)

CrankyBuzzard said:


> Putting your links into a warm pit while still cold can cause condensation. I like to get them into the pit without smoke at a low temp to basically preheat and not have as much potential to condensate before I add smoke.


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## smokeymose (May 4, 2017)

Try to time it to smoke the same day you stuff. It shouldn't have to dry for 2 days. Usually just a couple hours hanging at room temp works for me. When it feels "tacky" but not wet, it's ready for smoke.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

SmokeyMose said:


> Try to time it to smoke the same day you stuff. It shouldn't have to dry for 2 days. Usually just a couple hours hanging at room temp works for me. When it feels "tacky" but not wet, it's ready for smoke.


I would disagree here. When using a cure in the sausage, it is best to allow the sausages to sit for a minimum of 24 hours to let the cure distribute evenly throughout the meat mixture. Also, allowing the sausages to sit in the fridge gives you a great bind in the final product.

Your mileage may vary.


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## wild west (May 5, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> I would disagree here. When using a cure in the sausage, it is best to allow the sausages to sit for a minimum of 24 hours to let the cure distribute evenly throughout the meat mixture. Also, allowing the sausages to sit in the fridge gives you a great bind in the final product.
> 
> Your mileage may vary.


I'm not sure where your information comes from. When useing cure#1 most small to medium diameter sausage recipes from respected sausage makers recomend smoking as soon as the caseings are dry. Exceptions are when you add a product like fermento or bactoferm to give a tang to the sausage. Larger diameter sausage are generally hung to dry a little longer (3 to 24hrs). After mixing the meat turns grey in a matter of minutes meaning the nitrite is already doing it's job. No need to wait.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

wild west said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > I would disagree here. When using a cure in the sausage, it is best to allow the sausages to sit for a minimum of 24 hours to let the cure distribute evenly throughout the meat mixture. Also, allowing the sausages to sit in the fridge gives you a great bind in the final product.
> ...


http://www.lpoli.50webs.com/page0001.htm


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

Another:


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

It is a practice we have always done, whether making andouille with 1/2~3/4 course grind pulled through 2" beef middles, or basic smoke sausages with the 6mm plate and regular pork casings. IMO, it's worth waiting 24 hours just for the binding, allowing gels to fill the voids in the meat which can retain moisture.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

One distinction I will make here is this:

If you are using a store bought sausage seasoning mix pack, most come with cure accelerators such as GDL, erythorbate or ascorbate. I do not use store bought mixes and prefer to mix my own and I do not use cure accelerators.


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## shyzabrau (May 5, 2017)

How about mixing it and letting it sit a day (in the fridge) before stuffing and then smoking an hour two after stuffing? That has been my method.


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## pc farmer (May 5, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> It is a practice we have always done, whether making andouille with 1/2~3/4 course grind pulled through 2" beef middles, or basic smoke sausages with the 6mm plate and regular pork casings. IMO, it's worth waiting 24 hours just for the binding, allowing gels to fill the voids in the meat which can retain moisture.



So you wait 24 hours after stuffing?  I do it before stuffing.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

c farmer said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > It is a practice we have always done, whether making andouille with 1/2~3/4 course grind pulled through 2" beef middles, or basic smoke sausages with the 6mm plate and regular pork casings. IMO, it's worth waiting 24 hours just for the binding, allowing gels to fill the voids in the meat which can retain moisture.
> ...


If you wait 24 hours before stuffing, some of the binding of the meat is broken during the stuffing process.

I do not use cure accelerators in my family recipes so waiting a day for the cure to equalize makes a better product.
Yes, stuff one day, smoke the next.

Also, when using dry milk powder as a binder, allowing the sausages to sit in the frig. for a day gives the milk powder time to form gels between the voids in the sausages to retain moisture.


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## shyzabrau (May 5, 2017)

Okay. You've convinced me. Imma change my ways!


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## pc farmer (May 5, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> If you wait 24 hours before stuffing, some of the binding of the meat is broken during the stuffing process.
> 
> I do not use cure accelerators in my family recipes so waiting a day for the cure to equalize makes a better product.
> Yes, stuff one day, smoke the next.
> ...


You cover the stuffed sausage while in the fridge?


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## smokeymose (May 5, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> c farmer said:
> 
> 
> > u:sausage:
> ...


As the Mrs says, "We'll have to agree to disagree".


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

c farmer said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > If you wait 24 hours before stuffing, some of the binding of the meat is broken during the stuffing process.
> ...


Yes, I put them in a 25# plastic meat tote, but do not stack them higher than 7~8" or the weight (pressure) will affect equalization of the cure. Dry them on the smoker.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

SmokeyMose said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > c farmer said:
> ...


I am fine with that. It's hot and humid down here in south Louisiana and I will do everything I can to ensure even distribution of nitrite to prevent botulism.


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## pc farmer (May 5, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> Yes, I put them in a 25# plastic meat tote, but do not stack them higher than 7~8" or the weight (pressure) will affect equalization of the cure. Dry them on the smoker.


Might try this next time.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

c farmer said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, I put them in a 25# plastic meat tote, but do not stack them higher than 7~8" or the weight (pressure) will affect equalization of the cure. Dry them on the smoker.
> ...


I am certainly not trying to step on anyone's toes, just posting how I do it and why. I've always been interested in the science behind it. The ipoli site is a great read for those interested in the science of meat and charcuterie.


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

Shyzabrau said:


> Okay. You've convinced me. Imma change my ways!


Trust me, it is so much easier to stuff before it starts to bind. You will get a whole lot fewer air pockets and the meat flows to fill the casing evenly. Also, for sausages I smoke, I always add 1 cup water per 5 lbs. of meat. You are going to loose some water while smoking due to dehydration/evaporation so adding additional water counter-acts this and the gels from the milk powder help hold on to the water.

The water also makes the grind much easier to stuff.


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## smokeymose (May 5, 2017)

[quote name="Indaswamp" url=[QUOTE][/QUOTE]"/t/262078/smoked-sausage-not-taking-smoke/20#post_1701254"]





c farmer said:


> Indaswamp said:
> 
> 
> > Yes, I put them in a 25# plastic meat tote, but do not stack them higher than 7~8" or the weight (pressure) will affect equalization of the cure. Dry them on the smoker.
> ...


I am certainly not trying to step on anyone's toes, just posting how I do it and why. I've always been interested in the science behind it. The ipoli site is a great read for those interested in the science of meat and charcuterie.
[/quote]
No toe stepping felt here. Just because I don't readily agree doesn't mean I don't take you seriously. That's what this forum is all about. We're all learning from each other.
Your experienced input is appreciated!

Dan


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

SmokeyMose said:


> > Originally Posted by *Indaswamp*
> >
> >
> >
> ...


Cool beans Dan. And because I am curious, could you post your reasoning for your why you do it differently? Do you use prepackaged mixes exclusively or do you mix up your own sausage seasonings?


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## indaswamp (May 5, 2017)

Shyzabrau said:


> How about mixing it and letting it sit a day (in the fridge) before stuffing and then smoking an hour two after stuffing? That has been my method.


I found this for you..


> It is best to begin stuffing the meat immediately after mixing.  Some people believe that the meat should be allowed to sit so that the spices can be absorbed by the meat, but the salt, soy protein concentrate, and other ingredients will make the meat set like cement, which will make stuffing much more difficult.


Took me a while to find the link I had saved on my old computer. I really need to transfer those links to my new computer.


> Put water on the stuffing horn before applying the casing.


I mentioned this tip in the sticky, but for me it is much easier just to put about 1 tsp. in the casing and slide the casing on keeping the water near the end of the horn.

http://greerranch.com/jeff/sausage/


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## shyzabrau (May 6, 2017)

I also typically keep a bit of water in the casing when I'm putting it on the tube to lubricate the process. In my last batch using sheep casings, that wasn't enough so I ran a small amount (1 tsp?) of olive oil through the length of the casing and it absolutely glided on to the tube.


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## indaswamp (May 6, 2017)

Shyzabrau said:


> I also typically keep a bit of water in the casing when I'm putting it on the tube to lubricate the process. In my last batch using sheep casings, that wasn't enough so I ran a small amount (1 tsp?) of olive oil through the length of the casing and it absolutely glided on to the tube.


I don't use a lot of sheep casing to make sausages, I have used the smallest dia. stuffer tube I have to make 3" links of breakfast sausages. I just use a butter knife and cut them off the end of the stuffer tube. These can either be lightly smoked of froze immediately on wax paper. After frozen, I just vacuum seal them and they will retain their shape.


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## indaswamp (May 6, 2017)

One more point of note here:

If you are making a test batch, it is preferable to leave the grind uncased overnight. This allows the seasoning to deepen the flavor and you can check the seasoning in the mix and adjust it before stuffing. But doing this will make stuffing the sausages harder after it has already formed the bind.


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## indaswamp (May 6, 2017)

From Wedliny Domowe....


> After the meat is ground and mixed it has to be stuffed into a casing, preferably as soon as possible. Allowing the meat to sit overnight causes it to set up and absorb all this moisture that we have added during mixing and stuffing.


http://www.meatsandsausages.com/sausage-making/stuffing/sausages

This is why I stuff immediately and let it sit for 24 hours. Let it bind in the casing, cure to equalize, and form gels to absorb the water. Better product.


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## smokeymose (May 6, 2017)

Indaswamp said:


> SmokeyMose said:
> 
> 
> > [QUOTE name="Indaswamp" url="%5BQUOTE%5D%5B/QUOTE%5D"]
> ...




Cool beans Dan. And because I am curious, could you post your reasoning for your why you do it differently? Do you use prepackaged mixes exclusively or do you mix up your own sausage seasonings?
[/quote]
I only do 5# batches. I grind & mix & let sit overnight in the fridge in the bowl. This gives the cure plenty of time to do its thing. I don't add water or binder until ready to stuff next day.  Just before stuffing, I mix some water & SPC into the mix. I think adding the binder the night before just makes it too "thick" and harder to run through the tube. The binder can do its thing while hanging before smoking IMO. Letting it hang for 2 or 3 hours room temp has been enough to lose the wetness & get that tacky feel, which I believe makes it ready for smoke.
I'm not crazy about the ice bath thing. Cold water works for me. I let it rest overnight in the fridge at that point and package next day.
I've only done a couple of "pre mixed". Boykjo sent me a sample of his Kielbasa once, and I used a package mix for Sopressata recently because it came with the CMAi kit. I like to mix my own, because that's the fun of this whole thing, right?
All that being said, I'm no expert by any means. I've only been making sausage for a couple of years, but I've made quite a bit.....

Dan


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## myownidaho (May 6, 2017)

Thanks for the back and forth gentleman, this is very informative. It looks like I come down somewhere in the middle. I cube the meat and fat, mix with cure, salt and dry ingredients and let that sit overnight. Both grinds and stuffing take place on the same day and drying time could be a couple of hours with a fan to overnight depending on time of the year. Reading conversations like this have resulted in some definite improvements.

Jim


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## smokeymose (May 6, 2017)

MyOwnIdaho said:


> Thanks for the back and forth gentleman, this is very informative. It looks like I come down somewhere in the middle. I cube the meat and fat, mix with cure, salt and dry ingredients and let that sit overnight. Both grinds and stuffing take place on the same day and drying time could be a couple of hours with a fan to overnight depending on time of the year. Reading conversations like this have resulted in some definite improvements.
> 
> Jim


Sounds like an Andouille method.


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## beardawg (May 6, 2017)

uzikaduzi said:


> personally i don't dry mine in the smoker at all... i leave them in the ridge over night and out in the kitchen for an hour before smoking; however, i don't cook and smoke simultaneously, i cold smoke, then transfer to my oven to cook.
> 
> it seems most people dry for an hour or 2 in the smoker with no smoke at 100f from what I've seen around here... sweating could be fat out or condensation. if you're sausage was too cold compared to your smoker temp (which seems very unlikely given your description) that would cause condensation. 135 is on the cool side for fat out, but maybe if you didn't get good binding that could exacerbate the issue?
> 
> i'm not sure what to suggest... hopefully someone else will have some insight






CrankyBuzzard said:


> Putting your links into a warm pit while still cold can cause condensation.  I like to get them into the pit without smoke at a low temp to basically preheat and not have as much potential to condensate before I add smoke.





uzikaduzi said:


> personally i don't dry mine in the smoker at all... i leave them in the ridge over night and out in the kitchen for an hour before smoking; however, i don't cook and smoke simultaneously, i cold smoke, then transfer to my oven to cook.
> 
> it seems most people dry for an hour or 2 in the smoker with no smoke at 100f from what I've seen around here... sweating could be fat out or condensation. if you're sausage was too cold compared to your smoker temp (which seems very unlikely given your description) that would cause condensation. 135 is on the cool side for fat out, but maybe if you didn't get good binding that could exacerbate the issue?
> 
> i'm not sure what to suggest... hopefully someone else will have some insight


Thanks for all the suggestions.


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