# UMAI Soppressata



## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

I have made around 20 lbs of Soppressata in UMAI casing so far and it always comes out great.

My question is that since this is dried at fridge temperatures, except for the first 48 hrs. is cure #2 really necessary? Wouldn't cure #1 be more suitable?













20161116_073041.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


















20161210_141644.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


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## smokeymose (Dec 29, 2016)

I've done Pancetta and Capicola with the UMAi bags and wondered the same thing. I used the kits which came with #2 so I let it go.
I plan to do Soppressata next. Yours look fantastic!


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## pc farmer (Dec 29, 2016)

How long was it in the fridge?

Cure #2 is for long dry times.


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## smokeymose (Dec 29, 2016)

Usually 6 to 8 weeks, farmer.


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## pc farmer (Dec 29, 2016)

SmokeyMose said:


> Usually 6 to 8 weeks, farmer.


​That's why #2 is used is my guess.

8 weeks with #1 would seem to long to me.

Maybe someone with more knowledge than I will show up.


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## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

Its in the fridge for about 7 weeks to reach 40% weight loss.

I am thinking the ph drop from the fermentation and cure #1 should take care of any nasties but I'm not sure?


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## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

SmokeyMose said:


> I've done Pancetta and Capicola with the UMAi bags and wondered the same thing. I used the kits which came with #2 so I let it go.
> I plan to do Soppressata next. Yours look fantastic!


Thanks! I use a modified version of the UMAI recipe and it's easily the best dried sausage I have tasted.


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## redheelerdog (Dec 29, 2016)

That looks mighty tasty.

I have some 32mm Umai bags coming in the mail, I might have to try that.

Nice job!













20161210_141644.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


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## SmokinAl (Dec 30, 2016)

Don't know about the cure question.

I think NEPAS could answer it for you.

If he doesn't see this, then just PM him.

BTW your sausage looks fantastic!

Al


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## dirtsailor2003 (Dec 30, 2016)

Looks tasty! 

Keep in mind that cure #1 is used in foods that get cooked before consumption.  Cure #2 is used in foods that aren't cooked prior to consumption. 

I suppose if you'd like to cook your Sopprossetta prior to eating it...


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## daveomak (Dec 30, 2016)

8x57 said:


> I have made around 20 lbs of Soppressata in UMAI casing so far and it always comes out great.
> 
> My question is that since this is dried at fridge temperatures, except for the first 48 hrs. is cure #2 really necessary? Wouldn't cure #1 be more suitable?


Cure #2 is necessary due to the LONG duration of the curing process...   Some say cure #1, and the nitrite in it, are good for 2+ weeks.. which I don't understand because the USDA has recipes for curing that include waiting a month or longer...     ANYWAY, if the meat you are curing takes up to 8-12 weeks or longer, the nitrite "MAY" be used up.....  In the event bacteria begins to grow in the meat, the nitrate in cure #2 will be converted to nitrite and then continue keeping the meat safe to consume for the duration of your aging/drying process.....

When a recipe calls for CURE #2....  USE IT...   I know I'm not smarter than the food scientists that developed these methods/recipes.......    so, you will not get me to say "It's OK to switch cures ".....

Now don't get excited...  I'm just emphatically trying to make a point...  Not singling you out....  making a point for those that will read this thread....

Dave


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## atomicsmoke (Dec 30, 2016)

'ssata looks great.

Conversion of nitrate to nitrite is not well documented and hit or miss for the "home curer". You need certain bacteria and temps for that to happen. The fact that almost everyone uses cure#2 does not mean is working better than cure#1. I would be curious to see an analysis of the nitrate in the final product. 

In your case ( In my opinion) the conversion is hard to achieve at fridge temps, so the nitrate is useless....Just stays there.


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## 8x57 (Dec 30, 2016)

DaveOmak said:


> Cure #2 is necessary due to the LONG duration of the curing process...   Some say cure #1, and the nitrite in it, are good for 2+ weeks.. which I don't understand because the USDA has recipes for curing that include waiting a month or longer...     ANYWAY, if the meat you are curing takes up to 8-12 weeks or longer, the nitrite "MAY" be used up.....  In the event bacteria begins to grow in the meat, the nitrate in cure #2 will be converted to nitrite and then continue keeping the meat safe to consume for the duration of your aging/drying process.....
> 
> When a recipe calls for CURE #2....  USE IT...   I know I'm not smarter than the food scientists that developed these methods/recipes.......    so, you will not get me to say "It's OK to switch cures ".....
> 
> ...


I get what you are saying but I am also thinking that the recipe was not developed for a plastic membrane drying at 35 degrees, it was for meat stuffed in pig intestines drying in a damp basement


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## 8x57 (Dec 30, 2016)

atomicsmoke said:


> 'ssata looks great.
> 
> Conversion of nitrate to nitrite is not well documented and hit or miss for the "home curer". You need certain bacteria and temps for that to happen. The fact that almost everyone uses cure#2 does not mean is working better than cure#1. I would be curious to see an analysis of the nitrate in the final product.
> 
> In your case ( In my opinion) the conversion is hard to achieve at fridge temps, so the nitrate is useless....Just stays there.


This is exactly what I was thinking but I wanted to ask and see if someone knew for sure. If there was an affordable way to have the finished product tested i would be willing to give it a try, it would be interesting to know for sure.


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## BGKYSmoker (Dec 30, 2016)

Cure info and use.

CURES - Cures are used in sausage products for color and flavor development as well as retarding the development of bacteria in the low temperature environment of smoked meats.

Salt and sugar both cure meat by osmosis. In addition to drawing the water from the food, they dehydrate and kill the bacteria that make food spoil. In general, though, use of the word "cure" refers to processing the meat with either sodium nitrite or sodium nitrate.

The primary and most important reason to use cures is to prevent BOTULISM POISONING (Food poisoning). It is very important that any kind of meat or sausage that will be cooked and smoked at low temperature be cured. To trigger botulism poisoning, the requirements are quite simple - lack of oxygen, the presence of moisture, and temperatures in range of 40-140° F. When smoking meats, the heat and smoke eliminates the oxygen. The meats have moisture and are traditionally smoked and cooked in the low ranges of 90 to 185° F. As you can see, these are ideal conditions for food poisoning if you don't use cures. There are two types of commercially used cures.

Prague Powder #1

Also called Insta-Cure and Modern Cure. Cures are used to prevent meats from spoiling when being cooked or smoked at low temperatures (under 200 degrees F). This cure is 1 part sodium nitrite (6.25%) and 16 parts salt (93.75%) and are combined and crystallized to assure even distribution. As the meat temperate rises during processing, the sodium nitrite changes to nitric oxide and starts to ‘gas out’ at about 130 degrees F. After the smoking /cooking process is complete only about 10-20% of the original nitrite remains. As the product is stored and later reheated for consumption, the decline of nitrite continues. 4 ounces of Prague powder #1 is required to cure 100 lbs of meat. A more typical measurement for home use is 1 level tsp per 5 lbs of meat. Mix with cold water, then mix into meat like you would mix seasonings into meat.

Prague Powder #2

Used to dry-cure products. Prague powder #2 is a mixture of 1 part sodium nitrite, .64 parts sodium nitrate and 16 parts salt. (1 oz. of sodium nitrite with .64 oz. of sodium nitrate to each lb. of salt.) It is primarily used in dry-curing Use with products that do not require cooking, smoking, or refrigeration. This cure, which is sodium nitrate, acts like a time release, slowly breaking down into sodium nitrite, then into nitric oxide. This allows you to dry cure products that take much longer to cure. A cure with sodium nitrite would dissipate too quickly. Use 1 oz. of cure for 25 lbs. of meat or 1 level teaspoon of cure for 5 lbs. of meat when mixing with meat. When using a cure in a brine solution, follow a recip


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## BGKYSmoker (Dec 30, 2016)

Cure #2 works great in the UMAi bags, synthetic, fibrous and protein lined fibrous.


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## daveomak (Dec 30, 2016)

The difference between cure #1 and cure #2













Cure #1.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Dec 30, 2016


















Cure2.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Dec 30, 2016






So, below is the recipe from UMAI....  and you are thinking of changing it.....    ??????????

How about the Bactoferm T-SPX starter culture...   You changing that also..     ??????????

*For 5 lb recipes.* UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] Soppressatta blend has nice heat from the red pepper combined with mace which is from the nutmeg family that nicely bless the flavors together. Formulated by the Sausage Master at Spark Spices, this is a traditional blend of spices that creates the flavor of soppressata.

Ingredients: Dextrose, Spices, Black Pepper, Red Pepper, Flavorings, Garlic, Mace

This blend does not contain: Salt, Instacure #2 or Starter Culture which are necessary for making dry sausage.

Usage: After mixing in Salt and Instacure #2, add the contents of the package to 5 lbs of sausage meat mix.

+++++++++++++++

UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] spice blends eliminate the need to mix individual spices and are a convenient way to formulate your dry sausage. *Each packet contains enough spice for 5 lbs of dry sausage*. Simply mix the contents of the UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] Spice Packet into chilled, freshly ground meat, along with correct proportions of kosher salt, Instacure #2 and Bactoferm T-SPX Starter Culture

EDIT to add...

Bactoferm T-SPX (Pediococcus pentosaceus & Staphylococcus xylosus)

*Due to the limited shelf life outside of a freezer, we can not ship this outside of North America.*

For slow/mild acidification. Less acidity and no sour flavor; enhances the aromatic flavor and appearance of fermented meats. *Also assists in moisture removal and the breaking down of Nitrate into Nitrite for more efficient curing.* If using T-SPX for traditional method of drying this culture will not provide food safety through lowering pH level but, it will help lower aW. Use for products needing at least one month's time for drying and do not ferment with this product over 75°F.

• Net Weight: 25g(per packet)
• Usage: 25g for 200kg(440 lbs)
• Instructions for making 10 lb. increments included.
• Storage: In Freezer (<2°F)
• Freeze Dried Culture


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## 8x57 (Dec 31, 2016)

DaveOmak said:


> Cure #1.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes i changed the culture to Safe Pro B-LC-007. It seems superior to T-SPX in many ways.

Here is the recipe I use:

For 1000g of pork shoulder

Salt 20g
Cure #2 2.5g
Dextrose 12g
Black pepper 2g
Red Pepper flakes 1.2g
White pepper corns 1.2g
Ancho Chili powder 1.2g
Garlic powder 1.2g 
Red Wine 1.5 Tbs

SafePro B-LC-007 0.25g + 6ml Water


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## daveomak (Dec 31, 2016)

Staphylococcus carnosus - develops flavor, improves color stability, proteolytic, lipolytic, tests positive for nitrate reductase activity

Excellent choice.....


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## hoity toit (Jan 9, 2017)

8x57 said:


> Thanks! I use a modified version of the UMAI recipe and it's easily the best dried sausage I have tasted.


Care to share your recipe ? oops never mind , I see you posted it above in # 18

HT


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## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

I have made around 20 lbs of Soppressata in UMAI casing so far and it always comes out great.

My question is that since this is dried at fridge temperatures, except for the first 48 hrs. is cure #2 really necessary? Wouldn't cure #1 be more suitable?













20161116_073041.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


















20161210_141644.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


----------



## smokeymose (Dec 29, 2016)

I've done Pancetta and Capicola with the UMAi bags and wondered the same thing. I used the kits which came with #2 so I let it go.
I plan to do Soppressata next. Yours look fantastic!


----------



## pc farmer (Dec 29, 2016)

How long was it in the fridge?

Cure #2 is for long dry times.


----------



## smokeymose (Dec 29, 2016)

Usually 6 to 8 weeks, farmer.


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## pc farmer (Dec 29, 2016)

SmokeyMose said:


> Usually 6 to 8 weeks, farmer.


​That's why #2 is used is my guess.

8 weeks with #1 would seem to long to me.

Maybe someone with more knowledge than I will show up.


----------



## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

Its in the fridge for about 7 weeks to reach 40% weight loss.

I am thinking the ph drop from the fermentation and cure #1 should take care of any nasties but I'm not sure?


----------



## 8x57 (Dec 29, 2016)

SmokeyMose said:


> I've done Pancetta and Capicola with the UMAi bags and wondered the same thing. I used the kits which came with #2 so I let it go.
> I plan to do Soppressata next. Yours look fantastic!


Thanks! I use a modified version of the UMAI recipe and it's easily the best dried sausage I have tasted.


----------



## redheelerdog (Dec 29, 2016)

That looks mighty tasty.

I have some 32mm Umai bags coming in the mail, I might have to try that.

Nice job!













20161210_141644.jpg



__ 8x57
__ Dec 29, 2016


----------



## SmokinAl (Dec 30, 2016)

Don't know about the cure question.

I think NEPAS could answer it for you.

If he doesn't see this, then just PM him.

BTW your sausage looks fantastic!

Al


----------



## dirtsailor2003 (Dec 30, 2016)

Looks tasty! 

Keep in mind that cure #1 is used in foods that get cooked before consumption.  Cure #2 is used in foods that aren't cooked prior to consumption. 

I suppose if you'd like to cook your Sopprossetta prior to eating it...


----------



## daveomak (Dec 30, 2016)

8x57 said:


> I have made around 20 lbs of Soppressata in UMAI casing so far and it always comes out great.
> 
> My question is that since this is dried at fridge temperatures, except for the first 48 hrs. is cure #2 really necessary? Wouldn't cure #1 be more suitable?


Cure #2 is necessary due to the LONG duration of the curing process...   Some say cure #1, and the nitrite in it, are good for 2+ weeks.. which I don't understand because the USDA has recipes for curing that include waiting a month or longer...     ANYWAY, if the meat you are curing takes up to 8-12 weeks or longer, the nitrite "MAY" be used up.....  In the event bacteria begins to grow in the meat, the nitrate in cure #2 will be converted to nitrite and then continue keeping the meat safe to consume for the duration of your aging/drying process.....

When a recipe calls for CURE #2....  USE IT...   I know I'm not smarter than the food scientists that developed these methods/recipes.......    so, you will not get me to say "It's OK to switch cures ".....

Now don't get excited...  I'm just emphatically trying to make a point...  Not singling you out....  making a point for those that will read this thread....

Dave


----------



## atomicsmoke (Dec 30, 2016)

'ssata looks great.

Conversion of nitrate to nitrite is not well documented and hit or miss for the "home curer". You need certain bacteria and temps for that to happen. The fact that almost everyone uses cure#2 does not mean is working better than cure#1. I would be curious to see an analysis of the nitrate in the final product. 

In your case ( In my opinion) the conversion is hard to achieve at fridge temps, so the nitrate is useless....Just stays there.


----------



## 8x57 (Dec 30, 2016)

DaveOmak said:


> Cure #2 is necessary due to the LONG duration of the curing process...   Some say cure #1, and the nitrite in it, are good for 2+ weeks.. which I don't understand because the USDA has recipes for curing that include waiting a month or longer...     ANYWAY, if the meat you are curing takes up to 8-12 weeks or longer, the nitrite "MAY" be used up.....  In the event bacteria begins to grow in the meat, the nitrate in cure #2 will be converted to nitrite and then continue keeping the meat safe to consume for the duration of your aging/drying process.....
> 
> When a recipe calls for CURE #2....  USE IT...   I know I'm not smarter than the food scientists that developed these methods/recipes.......    so, you will not get me to say "It's OK to switch cures ".....
> 
> ...


I get what you are saying but I am also thinking that the recipe was not developed for a plastic membrane drying at 35 degrees, it was for meat stuffed in pig intestines drying in a damp basement


----------



## 8x57 (Dec 30, 2016)

atomicsmoke said:


> 'ssata looks great.
> 
> Conversion of nitrate to nitrite is not well documented and hit or miss for the "home curer". You need certain bacteria and temps for that to happen. The fact that almost everyone uses cure#2 does not mean is working better than cure#1. I would be curious to see an analysis of the nitrate in the final product.
> 
> In your case ( In my opinion) the conversion is hard to achieve at fridge temps, so the nitrate is useless....Just stays there.


This is exactly what I was thinking but I wanted to ask and see if someone knew for sure. If there was an affordable way to have the finished product tested i would be willing to give it a try, it would be interesting to know for sure.


----------



## BGKYSmoker (Dec 30, 2016)

Cure info and use.

CURES - Cures are used in sausage products for color and flavor development as well as retarding the development of bacteria in the low temperature environment of smoked meats.

Salt and sugar both cure meat by osmosis. In addition to drawing the water from the food, they dehydrate and kill the bacteria that make food spoil. In general, though, use of the word "cure" refers to processing the meat with either sodium nitrite or sodium nitrate.

The primary and most important reason to use cures is to prevent BOTULISM POISONING (Food poisoning). It is very important that any kind of meat or sausage that will be cooked and smoked at low temperature be cured. To trigger botulism poisoning, the requirements are quite simple - lack of oxygen, the presence of moisture, and temperatures in range of 40-140° F. When smoking meats, the heat and smoke eliminates the oxygen. The meats have moisture and are traditionally smoked and cooked in the low ranges of 90 to 185° F. As you can see, these are ideal conditions for food poisoning if you don't use cures. There are two types of commercially used cures.

Prague Powder #1

Also called Insta-Cure and Modern Cure. Cures are used to prevent meats from spoiling when being cooked or smoked at low temperatures (under 200 degrees F). This cure is 1 part sodium nitrite (6.25%) and 16 parts salt (93.75%) and are combined and crystallized to assure even distribution. As the meat temperate rises during processing, the sodium nitrite changes to nitric oxide and starts to ‘gas out’ at about 130 degrees F. After the smoking /cooking process is complete only about 10-20% of the original nitrite remains. As the product is stored and later reheated for consumption, the decline of nitrite continues. 4 ounces of Prague powder #1 is required to cure 100 lbs of meat. A more typical measurement for home use is 1 level tsp per 5 lbs of meat. Mix with cold water, then mix into meat like you would mix seasonings into meat.

Prague Powder #2

Used to dry-cure products. Prague powder #2 is a mixture of 1 part sodium nitrite, .64 parts sodium nitrate and 16 parts salt. (1 oz. of sodium nitrite with .64 oz. of sodium nitrate to each lb. of salt.) It is primarily used in dry-curing Use with products that do not require cooking, smoking, or refrigeration. This cure, which is sodium nitrate, acts like a time release, slowly breaking down into sodium nitrite, then into nitric oxide. This allows you to dry cure products that take much longer to cure. A cure with sodium nitrite would dissipate too quickly. Use 1 oz. of cure for 25 lbs. of meat or 1 level teaspoon of cure for 5 lbs. of meat when mixing with meat. When using a cure in a brine solution, follow a recip


----------



## BGKYSmoker (Dec 30, 2016)

Cure #2 works great in the UMAi bags, synthetic, fibrous and protein lined fibrous.


----------



## daveomak (Dec 30, 2016)

The difference between cure #1 and cure #2













Cure #1.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Dec 30, 2016


















Cure2.jpg



__ daveomak
__ Dec 30, 2016






So, below is the recipe from UMAI....  and you are thinking of changing it.....    ??????????

How about the Bactoferm T-SPX starter culture...   You changing that also..     ??????????

*For 5 lb recipes.* UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] Soppressatta blend has nice heat from the red pepper combined with mace which is from the nutmeg family that nicely bless the flavors together. Formulated by the Sausage Master at Spark Spices, this is a traditional blend of spices that creates the flavor of soppressata.

Ingredients: Dextrose, Spices, Black Pepper, Red Pepper, Flavorings, Garlic, Mace

This blend does not contain: Salt, Instacure #2 or Starter Culture which are necessary for making dry sausage.

Usage: After mixing in Salt and Instacure #2, add the contents of the package to 5 lbs of sausage meat mix.

+++++++++++++++

UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] spice blends eliminate the need to mix individual spices and are a convenient way to formulate your dry sausage. *Each packet contains enough spice for 5 lbs of dry sausage*. Simply mix the contents of the UMAi Dry[emoji]174[/emoji] Spice Packet into chilled, freshly ground meat, along with correct proportions of kosher salt, Instacure #2 and Bactoferm T-SPX Starter Culture

EDIT to add...

Bactoferm T-SPX (Pediococcus pentosaceus & Staphylococcus xylosus)

*Due to the limited shelf life outside of a freezer, we can not ship this outside of North America.*

For slow/mild acidification. Less acidity and no sour flavor; enhances the aromatic flavor and appearance of fermented meats. *Also assists in moisture removal and the breaking down of Nitrate into Nitrite for more efficient curing.* If using T-SPX for traditional method of drying this culture will not provide food safety through lowering pH level but, it will help lower aW. Use for products needing at least one month's time for drying and do not ferment with this product over 75°F.

• Net Weight: 25g(per packet)
• Usage: 25g for 200kg(440 lbs)
• Instructions for making 10 lb. increments included.
• Storage: In Freezer (<2°F)
• Freeze Dried Culture


----------



## 8x57 (Dec 31, 2016)

DaveOmak said:


> Cure #1.jpg
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes i changed the culture to Safe Pro B-LC-007. It seems superior to T-SPX in many ways.

Here is the recipe I use:

For 1000g of pork shoulder

Salt 20g
Cure #2 2.5g
Dextrose 12g
Black pepper 2g
Red Pepper flakes 1.2g
White pepper corns 1.2g
Ancho Chili powder 1.2g
Garlic powder 1.2g 
Red Wine 1.5 Tbs

SafePro B-LC-007 0.25g + 6ml Water


----------



## daveomak (Dec 31, 2016)

Staphylococcus carnosus - develops flavor, improves color stability, proteolytic, lipolytic, tests positive for nitrate reductase activity

Excellent choice.....


----------



## hoity toit (Jan 9, 2017)

8x57 said:


> Thanks! I use a modified version of the UMAI recipe and it's easily the best dried sausage I have tasted.


Care to share your recipe ? oops never mind , I see you posted it above in # 18

HT


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