# smoke is underwhelming



## scottlindner (May 26, 2009)

The past couple of smokes I have done have been extremely underwhelming.  I don't know what's wrong.  Yesterday I smoked a chicken, corn on the cob and almonds.  The only thing that really came out good was the corn.  The almonds were in for 4 hours and almost seem raw and there's practically no smoke on them at all.  You can smell it, but certainly cannot taste it.  The chicken was so so, but the smoke did not come through like I had expected.  The chicken was in for about 3.5 hours.  My temps were between 250 and 300F.  Hard to tell where it really was on average.  I didn't get the chicken in time to brine it so I made an injection with butter, water, and some blackened seasoning.  I injected about 30 times.. until the chicken wouldn't hold anymore and kept squirting it out back at me.  I soaked the almonds in a salt water solution for about 6 hours.  The corn on the cob I pulled back the husk, removed the hair, slathered on olive oil and salted, and pulled the husks back over the corn.

The almonds went on first for a total of 4 hours.  Then the chicken for 3.5 hours.  Corn on the cob was on for about 1.5 to 2 hours.  I targeted 275F.  I have done almonds before using nearly the identical method and the last time they were awesome.  This time you'd swear they were just picked from a tree and someone down the block had a camp fire the day you picked them.  You can just barely smell smoke on them, can't test it at all.  I left the skin on the chicken.  The chicken was certainly moist and the injection tasted great, but other than the skin smelling great, zero smoke was imparted into the chicken.  The corn was great, no complaints there.

I added hickory four times throughout this smoke to keep the smoke rolling.

This is the third time in a row I have had an underwhelming smoke.  I don't know what I'm doing wrong, and it's starting to get me upset because I know I should be making outstanding food in the smoker and it just ain't happening.

Anyone have any tips to reset me back on the path to truly awesome smoked foods?

Cheers,
Scott


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## pops6927 (May 26, 2009)

Have you changed damper settings?  Is it a new bag of hickory? Try another wood like Mesquite, that should give you about the strongest smoke flavor.  Are you using chips or chunks? Chunks give better smoke.  Possibly add some lump to it too.


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## scottlindner (May 26, 2009)

There is no damper in this unit, or if there is, I have no clue where it is located.

As for the wood.  It is not new and is the same bag of hickory I have used for very good smokes.

Your comment about chunks is interesting.  I have recently switched to using a mix of chips and chunks and may have erred on the side of too many chips.  The problem I had that led me to switch is that my chunks would smoke for about 30 minutes and then stop smoking entirely.  I will go back to large chunks and see what happens.  Now that I think about it, the good smokes have been chunks and on very cold days where i had to really crank up the propane to keep the heat, which also helped burn the chunks.  Now that it's warming up outside the propane is much lower and my chunks are having a hard time producing smoke.  At least that's my theory.

I'll try chunks again and see where that takes me.

Cheers,
Scott


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## werdwolf (May 26, 2009)

Are you sure the thermometer your using is still accurate for your smoke temps?


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## scottlindner (May 26, 2009)

No, not at all.  I'm using the built in that came with the GOSM.  I do use a probe in the meat so I do know when it's done.  I know the GOSM thermometers are supposed to suck, but I don't have a good alternative at the moment.  Does the temp matter?  People cold smoke, so in my little understanding of the world of smoking the temp only affects the duration of the cook, or is that not accurate?

Cheers,
Scott


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## mgnorcal (May 27, 2009)

I don't have an answer, but some thoughts:

If the flame is lower, less smoke will be generated from the same wood.  Moving to a thinner pan or placing the pan closer to the flame might help give you more smoke with this lower flame.  Adding a few lump charcoal to the pan will help keep a burn going better too, while arguably adding to the good flavor.

I've never been much impressed with the smoke flavor on my gasser compared to my WSM.  But then I've never loaded a ton of chips in the gasser at once due to neighbor issues with too much smoke.  
One idea I've had is to do a pre-smoke at a low temp and no water for a while and really sock it to the meat with smoke (like with the soldering iron + soup can smoke generator) before raising the cooker temp and adding water.  Of course that's added time and trouble, so I haven't done it yet.


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## travcoman45 (May 27, 2009)

Warmer weather an lower flame be part a yer situation.  I'd use a 9x9 cake pan ( are ya usin the cast iron pan that came with it?), add a mix a chips an chunks.  That should last ya 2 ta 2 1/2 hours.  Now on occasion shake that pan so the wood makes better contact with it, try not foilin the pan an see ifin ya gets a heavier smoke.

Yup, smokin be bout temp control, fer hot smokin the general temp range be 225° ta 250°.  Somethins take hotter temp like turkey, I do them at bout 325° an some thins less, my hams I do as low as I can.

Get yerself a digi thermo fer grate temps, drop the probe in boilin water an dependin on yer altitude should read 210° ta 212°.

Just be carefull ya don't get white billowin smoke, cause they yer food gonna taste like a railroad tie!


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## pineywoods (May 27, 2009)

Temp affects many things including whether the chips or chunks will get hot enough to smoke. If you only have one thermometer put it in the smoker and get it up to 225-235 and see what the stock thermo is showing. This may not be the best method but it will get you close at least you'll know where the stock thermo should be for the temps your looking for.


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## davenh (May 27, 2009)

You can also dump some lit charcoals in your wood pan to help keep the wood smoking.


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## richoso1 (May 27, 2009)

What Jerry said. You might want to think about replacing that GOSM therm, save yourself some frustration. Good luck my friend. And you don't want rolling smoke coming out of your smoker, just a thin blue smoke will do. Too much smoke at a given time can be a health issue, bitter tasing food is an indication, along with numbness of the mouth/lips.If you can't see the smoke, but you can smell it, you're ok.


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## scottlindner (May 28, 2009)

Sounds like I'll try the following:
1. bigger wood box, I'm using the tiny thing that came with the GOSM
2. lower to the flame, should I cut the thing that holds the box, or is there another way?
3. a second probe thermometer for measuring the box temp
4. add some lump (can I add charred but not burned wood from a previous smoke?)

and at my altitude, the boiling point ain't even close to 212ºF, it's 196ºF.

Thanks for the help everyone.  I'll let you know how the next smoke goes.

Cheers,
Scott


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## brokesmoke (Jun 23, 2009)

I wanted to chime in on this particular thread with a few dumb, newb questions pertaining to the smoke box. I own the vertical BBQ Grillware unit. Seems like every time i soak the chips/chunks and add them they never get fully used up. I want to be able to at least utilize and not waste wood if i can. Now dont get me wrong it does smoke and gets a good ring on the meat, but it seems like the smoke process only goes on for a about 15-30 minutes then i have to regulate back down to cooking temps. Of course the higher the temp, the more smoke. But thats not the key to a good meal. 

Do i need to soak? 

Should i fill the box full?

At 230-240 it should produce and work right? 

Will small chips be the best for my application?

Thanks to all!!!


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## scottlindner (Jun 23, 2009)

I have smoked a couple of times since my last post.  When I use chips I get a fast burst of smoke and then nothing.  When I use very large chunks and no chips, I get great smoke but massive fires that raise the temp too high.  If I use chips and soak, same as if I use chips and don't soak, but if I use large chunks and soak, perfection every time.

Scott


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## tasunkawitko (Jun 23, 2009)

i've got a suggestion, but i will qualify it by advising you to try a few different things and do what works best for you in the end.

if using chips, wrap them in a foil log or pouch - as an alternative, you can also put them in a clean tuna can or soup can, put foil over the top of that and punch a small hole in it. a lot of smoke is going to come out and last a long time, because the chips can't burn away (the pouch or can is full of smoke and there's no oxygen to let it burn fast). i've found this to be much more effective than just soaking chips, although i do sometimes soak them in foil logs.

as for chunks, i soak them sometimes and don't soak them sometimes and haven't noticed much difference either way. ships are built out of wood and they soak for years, yet the only way water gets in is through a crack or a hole, know what i mean? i've soaked large chunks for several hours and have sawn them in half to reveal no appreciable penetration of water. what this tells me is that soaking doesn't do much except right at first when the chunk is put on. to keep them from flaring up, i usually simply keep the lid closed on the firebox and/or turn the inlet damper down a bit. sooner or later, the flame will use up its oxygen and die off into smoke. 

another thing to keep in mind that the smoke itself isn't necessarily the goal; rather, it is the essence that provides the smell and the taste that we crave. i was camping over the last weekend and brought a big pile of firewood down to burning coals (this was mostly aspen and maybe some willow). anyway, there were no flames at all, just glowing coals, but the smell coming up was smoky and sweet - and the foods we were cooking took a lot of this on. now, if it did this with relatively unknown smoking woods such as aspen and willow, think of what it can do with hickory, apple, cherry etc.

my point here is that even when your chunks (or your chips, for that matter), have turned to carbonized charcoal, they are putting out a lot of good, sweet essecnce that soaks into your meat. this is another reason why lump charcoal is preferred by many rather than charcoal briquettes. a lot of times, my hickory chunks will be blackened and glowing with no visible smoke, but boy, i can sure smell it, and in the end the tastes are great every time - never over-smoked and certainly never bitter with creosote.


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## rivet (Jun 23, 2009)

Taz~ is correct. Soaking, although much talked about does much of nothing other than prolong getting to the the sweet scent you're looking for. 

Let your chunks burn if you have to, and then control the heat they produce, to get the smoke flavor you want. If you want a rich, heavy smoke taste, then go for it. If you want a milder touch of smoke, then reduce the chunks. 

It's all in what you want, and I'm under the impression you want a stronger smoke flavor. Am I correct?

If so, put a couple chunks (or a handful of chips) directly over the coals and let it rip. Make sure your exhaust vent is fully open.

Let them burn down. Even after you can't see anything coming out of the chimney, you are still smoking and the flavor is still permeating the meat.

When you check your coals, if there is nothing (no black pieces, no lumps) if you want more flavor do this again. You may have to do this many times for long smokes like a brisket or a pork butt.

You will get plenty of smoke flavor. After a few smokes you should know how much smoke you like and how much wood to add.


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## dmack (Jun 24, 2009)

Having used a gas smoker for the last year I have always been concerned over the amount of smoke was getting. I only soaked once, my first smoke. It did nothing for my smoke and that's one less variable to deal with. I watch my ash production vigilantly. If my smoke slows, the first thing I check is my pan. I shake it. Usually that will get things smoking again. I also have emptied my pan on many smokes just to get rid of ash. I think using good lump charcoal with a couple chunks has produced nice results for me. 

dmack


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## brokesmoke (Jun 24, 2009)

I guess i just got the impression of if i dont see ANY smoke then she aint producing. I am prolly wrong though. 

So i will not soak next time, put them in the "hot spot" of the vault, and just empty and add as needed to reach a desired result. 

I was always reluctant to open the door thinking I was doing harm, but i see now its all part of the maintenence required in the process.

Thanks for the help guys!


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## scottlindner (Jun 28, 2009)

Wow.. I just tried the suggestion to not soak and to use large chunks and wrap with foil with a few holes.  What a bad idea that was.  I had a fracken bonfire for 30 minutes, scortched my chickens, wrecked my temp probe, and for the last two hours ZERO smoke.  Not even a hint of smoke aroma.

I don't know how you guys get it to work, but I am going back to soaking large chunks.  That seems to be the only way my smoker will not turn into an inferno with no smoke production.

Anyone else have similar flames belching out the seems experience I do with unsoaked large chunks in a propane smoker?

Scott


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## mikey (Jun 28, 2009)

I have seen some other gasser users put a cast iron fry pan over the burner with their unsoaked chunks in the pan. Didn't hear any complaints about that set up. Give it a shot, there's nothing to lose.


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## scottlindner (Jun 28, 2009)

If I understand right, you're saying to put the wood chunks out in the open with just a skillet underneath them?


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## mikey (Jun 28, 2009)

Yes, that would be correct.


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## scottlindner (Jun 28, 2009)

Wouldn't that cause even more of an open flame problem?

There must be something I'm doing wrong to get such massive flare ups.  I clean out the grease every couple of smokes so I am fairly confident it isn't a grease fire.  It looks like it's coming directly from the wood.

Could it be how arid it is here and there is less of a flare up problem in areas that are more humid?

Scott


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## rickw (Jun 28, 2009)

When I had a gasser I normally used soaked chunks without the foil. Mind you it does not take much to produce a lot of smoke. Just one chunk every so often.


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## justpassingthru (Jun 29, 2009)

I have GOSM Big Block, when I first started to smoke in it I had the same problems you are having, at first I filled the wood box full and it would catch on fire and I would have to remove it from the smoker.

I now use 3-4 golf ball sized chunks of lump and 2 golf ball sized pieces of wood, I don't soak it and I use the wood tray and cover that came with the unit.

I cooked alot of chicken and started out with 1 piece of lump and 1 piece of smoke wood, increasing the amount of lump and wood until I arrived at this amount.

Last weekend I smoked a leg of lamb for 6 hours at 230°, it had a 1/4" smoke ring, the smoke flavor was almost equal with what I can produce with my WSM and I still had wood and lump left in the tray.

I guess what I'm trying to say is you need to experiment with your smoker to find out what works for you with the conditions where you live, my smoker came with gaps in the joints that I sealed with hi temp silicone sealer, my door leaks a little and I have ordered some gasket rope to seal it, I figure that I want to be able to control the cooking environment and that wasn't possible with the leaks.

You might want to try some short cooks using the original wood tray and just a little lump and wood and increase it until you find what you like.  Try to elimanite any varibles that might exist so that you can control the smoker and then dial it in to you liking.

I hope this helps a little, Gene


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## scottlindner (Jun 29, 2009)

That does help a lot.  Especially since you confirmed that the situation I am experiencing is normal.  That's at least half of it.

I will start trying some lump.  I would think that would take away from the good smoky flavor, but I will trust the smoke goods on this forum.  Out of curiosity, do you use the charcoal lump that is very common, or do you use the high quality oak lump?

Scott


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## justpassingthru (Jun 29, 2009)

Scott,

I don't know what kind of a wood tray you have, mine is a heavy cast iron one that heats up very quickly, maybe yours is different, that is why I said you need to find out what works for you.

My lump is..., see where I live, we don't have those kinds, what I use is a locally produced lump and I don't have the slightest idea what kind of wood they use, that being said, lump is wood that has been turned into charcoal, so burning lump _will_ give you a smoke flavor, I started smoking with my WSM using just lump and had a smoky flavor, it wasn't until a couple of months later that I found a dead mango tree and started to use it.

This is just a suggestion, but why don't you just try using lump to begin with until you learn how much to use and the taste that particular lump imparts, after you are comfortable with that then add some other wood to augment the flavor of the lump, by then you should be able to taste the difference, then change to a different wood and see what that does.

As it has already been stated you don't need alot of lump or wood in the tray to have a smoke taste and if I understand it correctly it's a chemical reaction from the wood or lump burning that imparts the smoke flavor, if I'm wrong I hope someone will correct me.

This is what I did, maybe it will work for you, I smoked 1 chicken breast at 325° with the wood box loaded to the gills, I had white smoke pouring out of the exhaust, took it to 167°.  Let it rest and took a bite, I new it wouldn't be edible, but I wanted to have the information of what too much smoke, the bitter, numbness of the lips, tasted like, it was for a point of reference, that is how I have arrived at how much to fill my wood tray, if I put too much I knew immediately what the slight bitter taste was, like I said I cooked alot of chicken and it took some time, but now I know what works in my smoker.

Smoking is an art and it takes time to learn what works, but ahhh..., the rewards are worth it.

Glad to be of service, Gene


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## justpassingthru (Jun 29, 2009)

Scott,

  Here are a couple of pics from today’s smoke, leg of lamb, temp of 235° for 6 hours, wood tray filled like I said.

  Smoke ring.


Here is what’s left of the lump and guava, guava in upper left corner, the other piece burned up and the last of the 4 pieces of lump.


I hope this helps too.

Gene.


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## hoser (Jun 29, 2009)

Scott...I also have the GOSM big block, and I guess we have just about all experienced these little glitches. There are some good threads around about installing modifications to get it just the way you want it. With mine, the main problem was keeping temps low enough for some smokes. I installed a $5 needle valve to keep the gas flow low enough and that worked just fine, but now the heat wasn't enough to produce the nice smoke I wanted.
The solution wound up being a "Smoke Daddy" installation which has worked out just great for me. 4 hours uninterrupted smoke, and regulated just the way you want it.

http://www.porkypas.com/smokers.htm


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## scottlindner (Jun 29, 2009)

Gene,

Is that the original wood box that came with it or is it something larger you installed?  Did you have to lower the stand it sits on?

Scott


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## tasunkawitko (Jun 29, 2009)

scott - i do apologize - the suggestion i made for you was based on my ASSumption that you ahd a charcoal smoker - i missed the fact that it was a gasser. this might be part of the problem. 

the only other thing i can think of is that it is important, if using foil pouch, to only poke one or two very small holes. you'd be surprised how much smoke will come out, but because of the very small holes, the smoke builds up too fast for oxygen to be present and ignite the fire. also, when the actual "smokey" smoke is gone, a person can then open up the pouch a bit and let the now-charcolaed chunks burn clean and hot with wonderful aroma and flavor imparting. this works on a charcoal smoker this way and might be worth a try in combination with the cast-iron surface recommended above. 

in any case, my apologies again for the incorrect assumption!


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## scottlindner (Jun 29, 2009)

I lost sleep over this and you carelessly post charcoal solutions in the propane group?!  I will never forgive you!

Was that at all believable?  
	

	
	
		
		



		
			






Thanks for the help.  You gave me a tip I hadn't heard before.  1 to 2 tiny holes.  I didn't exactly follow that very well.  May have been my problem.  From talking to another smoker at work, I think I used way too much wood which may have also contributed to my inferno.

Cheers,
Scott


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## rickw (Jun 29, 2009)

Most likely the case, as I remember it takes only a bit of wood to achieve a decent amount of smoke. When I first started I used WAY to much wood in my gas unit. After getting used to it I would only through in a chunk or three for the entire cook.


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## scottlindner (Jun 29, 2009)

I mean.. I think I really used way too much wood.  Another very good tip!

Cheers,
Scott


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## justpassingthru (Jun 29, 2009)

Scott,

That is the wood box that came with the smoker sitting on the rack it came with, it has a lid that is not shown, I haven't made any modifications to it.
Do you have the small or the large smoker? I'm not certain if they are the same.

What I've been picking up from reading here is there is a difference between the older units made by GOSM, who went out of business, and the smokers the company that took over is selling.

I'm not certain, but it seems that the early model had alot of problems producing smoke, I read all the posts here and when I bought the smoker I filled the wood box full, after about 15 minutes it was smoking so bad that I removed the box from the smoker.  The next smoke I filled it 3/4 full of smoke wood and had the same problem, that is when I started reading and learned about using a mixture of lump and smoke wood, I learned to use more lump than smoke wood and that has been satisfactory, now my smoker will have the thin blue for maybe the first hour and then after that you can't see any smoke, but you can sure smell it.

What everone is tell you about not needing much wood is right on, that is how I learned, by smoking alot of chicken, it's a quick cook and you can do 3-4 smokes in a day adjusting the amount of lump and wood you use each time until you find what works.

Gene


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