Selling cooked meat to a vendor??

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by heyer5, Feb 24, 2014.

  1. heyer5

    heyer5 Meat Mopper

    Hey SMF Crew

    I'm looking for something to do that is going to take up some of my extra time!  I've had great luck in the past catering events ranging from 30 people up to 150+ (which was a LOT to do on my WSM!).  I'm curious if anyone has any idea about selling a finished product to a bar or local store that also sells noon meals? 

    Let's say that there aren't many options for lunch in this town, actually, just two.  One being a bar that has 2 people, on a good day, that come to it, and then the local store where most of the locals go to eat.  They have burgers, brats, sausage, and pizza, oh, and a salad bar. 

    I haven't talked to either place yet, just feeling things out.  Thoughts?
  2. I'm sure your local Health Department would be all over you unless you had a properly certified 'commercial' kitchen. My partner used to work in a bookstore/coffee shop and would proof then bake frozen croissants at home that would then be sold at the store. Well, that did fly for very long!
  3. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    It is likely to be different to your rules in the US but here in the UK we can sell at different levels. Both require that we inform the Food Standards Agency that we are selling food items to the public and both open up our kitchens to random on-the-spot inspections. Both require that we keep detailed records of ingredient sources, detailed preparation procedures for individual batches that can be inspected at any time.

    For low risk foods like jams ("jellies" to you in the US) and pickles/chutneys etc. that is all you have to do however for higher risk foods like cured meats or fish and cheeses etc. that are not expected to be eaten immediately we are also expected to have lab shelf life testing carried out. 

    If we are selling directly to the public (e.g. through a market stall or direct sales) then we will be expected to have at least a basic certificate in food safety.

    If we are selling high risk foods through a retail shop or to restaurants then the risk to health is perceived to be greater and we are required to have an additional license from the FSA. This opens you up to much more rigorous inspection and our local FSA recommends that we also have a higher food safety supervision certificate.

    If you are used to working with food and have the right approach to safe food handling then getting started here is not a problem. You do need to fully understand the paperwork requirements to enable batch traceability and you do need to accept that you will be personally liable to heavy fines and/or imprisonment if you are found to be the source of an outbreak of food poisoning through negligence.

    Talk to your local health agency. They are usually there to help people like yourself to start up. They do like you to involve them BEFORE you start trading and they should point you in the direction of all of the resources that you need to make it a success. Go ask the questions. You have nothing to lose and it will help you decide if this is a direction that you want to pursue further.
  4. jsdspif

    jsdspif Meat Mopper

    In Kalamazoo , MI there is , I don't know what to call it , a commercial kitchen . It's a place where people that want to prepare food items to sell can make their stuff . That way people just getting started or don't want to invest in their own place to prepare their items make what ever there . Every now and then I'll see an article in the newspaper that mentions the person / people use the facility . The most recent was a lady that started making salsa to sell to the general public , after making it and giving it to friends and family as a gift . Maybe there is something like that in your area , so at least that part of the equation would be taken care of . I'm often curious about what sort of legal stuff there is to take care of . It seems in this day and age there's always some one that wants to sue for this or that . ( I heard one the other day that I had heard years ago , a lady got a cup of coffee from a fast food drive thru and she claimed the lid wasn't on and some spilled and burnt her legs ) .
  5. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Yes I think this was McDonalds. If I recall correctly she spilled it on her leg in her car and successfully sued on the basis that she was not warned that the contents were hot. Now all disposable hot drink cups from fast food outlets have a warning on the outside stating that the contents may be hot!

    I also had to laugh the other day when I read the back of a packet of dry roasted peanuts where it prominently told me "WARNING this product product may contain nuts" !
  6. heyer5

    heyer5 Meat Mopper

    I have already spoken with the heath department and it would cost me $40 to get a license that would cover my sales up to 10k.  They would have the ability to come and check conditions whenever, which I'm not concerned about.  Good input though!
  7. heyer5

    heyer5 Meat Mopper


    I think you need to do some research on the McDonald's case.  The coffee was served at like 180 degrees, which is waay hotter than it is supposed to be served.  She also spilled the coffee on on her crotch and had to receive skin graphs for the burns.  I'll see if I can find a link to the case...

    Edit to add:

    The trial took place from August 8–17, 1994, before New Mexico District Court Judge Robert H. Scott.[13] During the case, Liebeck's attorneys discovered that McDonald's required franchisees to hold coffee at 180–190 °F (82–88 °C). At 190 °F (88 °C), the coffee would cause a third-degree burn in two to seven seconds. Liebeck's attorney argued that coffee should never be served hotter than 140 °F (60 °C), and that a number of other establishments served coffee at a substantially lower temperature than McDonald's. Liebeck's lawyers presented the jury with evidence that 180 °F (82 °C) coffee like that McDonald’s served may produce third-degree burns (where skin grafting is necessary) in about 12 to 15 seconds. Lowering the temperature to 160 °F (71 °C) would increase the time for the coffee to produce such a burn to 20 seconds. Liebeck's attorneys argued that these extra seconds could provide adequate time to remove the coffee from exposed skin, thereby preventing many burns. McDonald's claimed that the reason for serving such hot coffee in its drive-through windows was that those who purchased the coffee typically were commuters who wanted to drive a distance with the coffee; the high initial temperature would keep the coffee hot during the trip.[2] However, the company's own research showed that some customers intend to consume the coffee immediately while driving.[3]

    Other documents obtained from McDonald's showed that from 1982 to 1992 the company had received more than 700 reports of people burned by McDonald's coffee to varying degrees of severity, and had settled claims arising from scalding injuries for more than $500,000.[2] McDonald's quality control manager, Christopher Appleton, testified that this number of injuries was insufficient to cause the company to evaluate its practices. He argued that all foods hotter than 130 °F (54 °C) constituted a burn hazard, and that restaurants had more pressing dangers to warn about. The plaintiffs argued that Appleton conceded that McDonald's coffee would burn the mouth and throat if consumed when served.[14]

    A twelve-person jury reached its verdict on August 18, 1994.[13] Applying the principles of comparative negligence, the jury found that McDonald's was 80% responsible for the incident and Liebeck was 20% at fault. Though there was a warning on the coffee cup, the jury decided that the warning was neither large enough nor sufficient. They awarded Liebeck US$200,000 in compensatory damages, which was then reduced by 20% to $160,000. In addition, they awarded her $2.7 million in punitive damages. The jurors apparently arrived at this figure from Morgan's suggestion to penalize McDonald's for one or two days' worth of coffee revenues, which were about $1.35 million per day.[2] The judge reduced punitive damages to $480,000, three times the compensatory amount, for a total of $640,000. The decision was appealed by both McDonald's and Liebeck in December 1994, but the parties settled out of court for an undisclosed amount less than $600,000.[15]'s_Restaurants
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2014
  8. wade

    wade Master of the Pit OTBS Member SMF Premier Member

    Thanks heyer5. Yes I was just recalling what was reported by the media here at  the time. I am not surprised that it was not the whole story. Thanks for the link - it makes very interesting reading indeed.
  9. jsdspif

    jsdspif Meat Mopper

    Yeah , I knew of that one but the one I'm thinking of now was recently , maybe in the last 2 or 3 months . I thought it was an elderly lady and she claimed the lid was not secure . I know when ever I handle hot stuff I try to be very careful .

       On a side note , I worked at Mcd's for a couple years and the 2 items that they really cared about having freshly made ( as opposed to burger patties that they'd leave in the heater cabinets for 8 hours or so ) was the coffee and fries . Coffee wasn't really a problem to have freshly made because they sold so much of it , same with the fries . Occasionally though they would throw away fries if they had been sitting there a while . Any other food though usually stayed in their tray in the heater cabinet until they were sold . I think burger patties were only supposed to be kept for 20 minutes . This was about 10 years ago so maybe things have changed .
  10. bigwheel

    bigwheel Smoking Fanatic

    Hard way to make a buck there Brother. Best of fortunes.
  11. hambone1950

    hambone1950 Master of the Pit Group Lead

    WHAT !!?? There's nuts in my peanuts? ! Holy crap! Who knew?
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2014

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