Tang

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

This thread has got the rusty wheels turning. http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/116780/unusual-brine-recipes

I know many of us use ECA, fermento, cultured buttermilk (or powder), etc to add some tang to some of our smoked sausages like summer sausage. I am wondering if using sauerkraut juice might not be a better option? Has anyone here tried it?

When a sausage is being fermented it is undergoing the same exact process as sauerkraut using much the same ingredients. And I have read of people using sauerkraut brine for their starter culture. It would stand to reason, at least in my head, that using sauerkraut brine in lieu of water to mix the meat that it might just work. I think I am going to try it once my first batch of kraut is done and see how the tang compares to using other products.

Dutch · Jan 23, 2012

I've wondered the same thing solar- several years ago, I heard someone talking about making homemade sauerkraut vs. the commercial stuff. She said that the commercial stuff was fermented, drained; packed into jars and then filled with a pickle type brine. I'm not sure as to how much, if any of the original juices from the fermented liquid is packed into the commercial 'kraut.

The one recipe I have calls for coarse sea salt. The cabbage is massaged with the salt until the volume of cabbage is reduced by half and the liquid from the cabbage, the desolved salt and the cabbage is then packed into a canning jar and left out at room temp to ferment for 3-4 days. Once the flavor is where you like it, you store it in the fridge to slow the fermentaion process.

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

Take a look at the labels. The last two times I bought kraut both brands had just salt, water and cabbage as the ingredients. If it had been packed in a vinegar brine, vinegar would have to be listed on the label wouldn't it?

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

Here are the ingredients from the last two brands I purchased. There are some preservatives in the first one but the main ingredients are salt, water, and cabbage for both. Although I see in the jarred versions in the second link they use the same preservatives. Must be due to exposure to light?

http://www.kraftrecipes.com/products/productinfodisplay.aspx?siteid=1&product=4470009215

http://www.glkfoods.com/SilverFloss.html

alblancher · Jan 23, 2012

Joel

I'm going to ask you the same question I would ask any other less experienced member. Have you seen that technique in a recipe somewhere? Do you think the bacteria fermenting cabbage is similar to the bacteria that would ferment meat? Sounds like two completely different environments. May be a great idea but I would sure like to see it detailed somewhere.

BGKYSmoker · Jan 23, 2012

I made some kraut fresh sausage that was pretty good.

I might have to try it.

Dutch · Jan 23, 2012

It's a combination of the high acidity and the fermentation that does the preserving.

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

alblancher said:
Joel

I'm going to ask you the same question I would ask any other less experienced member. Have you seen that technique in a recipe somewhere? Do you think the bacteria fermenting cabbage is similar to the bacteria that would ferment meat? Sounds like two completely different environments. May be a great idea but I would sure like to see it detailed somewhere.

I can't say that I have seen it in a recipe per se Al although I have seen it mentioned many times as a starter culture for meat fermentation along with yogurt, kefir, and other fermented products. The bacteria being the same I cannot speak to as I don't have a lab nor the education to conduct such an experiment. However, both are lactic fermentations.

Keep in mind, this thread is not about fermenting sausage with sauerkraut juice, it is about using sauerkraut juice to attempt to add the tang of a fermented sausage without going through the entire fermentation process.

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

Dutch said:
It's a combination of the high acidity and the fermentation that does the preserving. I can PM you a link if you're interested.

I understand how it works but I would love to see the link just the same Dutch.

alblancher · Jan 23, 2012

Good point Joel.

I see no reason you couldn't use the kraut juice to replace the water you would add to a batch of sausage? It might be an idea to run some of the kraut through a food processor and add to the mixture. What have you got to lose? Except maybe everbody seeing what you are doing and have multiple Sauerkraut sausage recipes in the next sausage throwdown!

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

nepas said:
I made some kraut fresh sausage that was pretty good.

I might have to try it.

Please do. I am thinking about making a 5lbs batch of summer sausage and will use a cup of kraut juice to mix the meat and spices and then let it sit for a day or two in the fridge before stuffing and smoking.

alblancher said:
Good point Joel.

I see no reason you couldn't use the kraut juice to replace the water you would add to a batch of sausage? It might be an idea to run some of the kraut through a food processor and add to the mixture. What have you got to lose? Except maybe everbody seeing what you are doing and have multiple Sauerkraut sausage recipes in the next sausage throwdown!

Nothing to lose except a few pounds of meat and some time.

Dutch · Jan 23, 2012

Here you go Joel~How to make Sauerkraut. Also at the bottom of that page is a how-to video.

sausageboy · Jan 23, 2012

Lactobacillus plantarum is the desired bacterium for fermenting sauerkraut.......it can also be used to ferment meats,
but because LP is fast acting and can make sausages too sour special attention must be paid to the amount of sugar used.

:sausage:

Dutch · Jan 23, 2012

L.plantarum is also one of several Lactobacillus found in starter cultures used to make dry, fermented sausages.

alblancher · Jan 23, 2012

Now we're learnen somethin thanks for the education guys

solaryellow · Jan 23, 2012

I have been doing some research as well since I got off of work and found some interesting info. Looks like your type of reading Al.

http://ddr.nal.usda.gov/bitstream/10113/15889/1/IND43655692.pdf

http://www.fao.org/docrep/x0560e/x0560e10.htm

Which I cross referenced with http://www.wedlinydomowe.com/sausage-types/fermented-sausage/cultures

Dutch · Jan 23, 2012

Thanks Joel, There you have it folks ~ some reading that you can really sink your teeth into! (bad pun, I know but I couldn't help myself)

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